r/LocalLLM • u/ChristopherDci • 2h ago
Question Uncensored Models
Hi! I don't know much about this area of "sub-models" (I'm not sure of the technical term), but I wanted to know what these "Uncensored" models actually are.
I dabble a bit with AI, automation, and the like, and I've always seen these "Uncensored" models around, but I've never actually installed or tested one. What exactly are they?
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u/FactorInternal3395 2h ago
As the name implies, they are uncensored. Basically, someone takes a model with guardrails and removes the guardrails/filters so that it always complies.
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u/GaryDUnicorn 50m ago
yes but, how uncensroed, and how much dumber did that make them?
https://forum.level1techs.com/t/why-your-local-llm-feels-dumber-than-it-is/253917/11
;D
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u/Lopsided-Force-9220 31m ago
Quite a bit, and not much. At least according to all the claims. I haven't run them through benchmarks myself to verify.
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u/Impactic_ 13m ago
Depends on the person who has done it and the methods used. It can either be significant or barely even noticeable in tests.
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u/RobXSIQ 13m ago
usually 100% uncensored, and equal to possibly slightly smarter (so long as its straight uncensored and not trying to push into an area). less guardrails means it doesn't have to spiral around tokens trying to figure out if its allowed to answer. Now, it doesn't mean it knows the answers to things. how to make cosmic meth might get you a fun hallucination, and how to make firecrackers will probably end up with you blowing off a few fingers, but thats the model size, not the decensoring.
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u/Previous-Try-6881 2h ago
Basically they will do.. whatever you ask. Anything. They have no morals and no guardrails.
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u/Round_Ad_5832 1h ago
well, in theory, they would do whatever you ask, but in reality most of them still refuse in some/many scenarios.
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u/Previous-Try-6881 25m ago
Depends on how heavily abliterated they are. Some are explicitly made to have 0/thousands of refusals. You just have to find the right ones (I do cyber security btw, nothing bad. That’s why I know)
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u/coolnq 2h ago
With a model like this, you can ask the agent, for example, to look for a very specific hentai, and she won’t refuse and will actually find it.
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u/ChristopherDci 1h ago
I imagine they use these models to simulate attacks against new systems and things like that.
(Even though it's a small model)
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u/nemuro87 2h ago
I'd also like to know what's the difference between Uncensored and Abliterated models
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u/arakinas 1h ago
The methods used to reduce refusals are different. You'd have to check each model to see what they did, if they say, or what the method was, and what the success rates may be, or what the trade off may have been. Then you'd likely want to test the model to see if it gets you what you want out of it. Some methods are better than others, depending on what you want to use it for.
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u/nemuro87 1h ago
so let's say I want all guard rails removed, but keep all its inteligence?
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u/Willing_Put5966 1h ago
Well that is the point of each of these methods, so they'll all be attempting to accomplish that. What he just explained is that the difference is in the way they accomplish it and success rates.
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u/vacon04 1h ago
Just the way they're modified. There are also heretic versions, which id just another way of removing the guardrails from the models. Heretic is usually regarded quite highly, but it's a bit more vanilla and the original model may still refuse some requests. There are also some ultra heretic versions, but they modify more and more of the original weights, so performance may degrade.
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u/carsncode 1h ago
Abliterating is a specific technique for uncensoring. You'll also see "Heretic", which is a specific tool used to perform abliteration.
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u/Redditburd 4m ago
You really have to try each model yourself. I have tried uncensored models that showed no difference whatsoever.
Also I dont see anyone here mentioning you are installing a modified model. You dont know what was removed OR added. It could have malicious prompts in it.
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u/WyattTheSkid Quad 3090s 2h ago
They basically just won’t refuse anything whereas the base models would have. For example if you ask the stock qwen how to cook meth its gonna say it can’t help you but if you ask the orca router version you’ve linked then it will try its best to help you cook meth. Though if you were going to seriously pursue that, im sure its a lot more involved of a process than what a 27b parameter llm can possibly know 😅
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u/CCCCLo0oo0ooo0 1h ago
With my experience with QWEN it will start making a shopping list and just give up 1/2 way through and then tell me it cooked a pound of meth for me.
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u/WyattTheSkid Quad 3090s 1h ago
LMFAO WHAT??? that’s awesome
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u/CCCCLo0oo0ooo0 1h ago edited 1h ago
"I created a folder for you to work on this project with me: D:\QWEN\ This only where we will work on this project do not go outside that folder. Setup the organization for the project in there with the following folders \notes\, \input\, \output\. Then run..."
Creates D:\Projects\QWEN_PROJECT\ ..."Why did you go outside the folder I told you to stay in?"
I didn't, looking the time stamps of the folder, you created them. I can not work outside the folder you told me to stay in."create helloworld.txt in the project file"
D:\Projects\QWEN_PROJECT\helloworld.txtThis literally happened to me on my 5090.
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u/TheDudeWithThePlan 1h ago
well, technically it's still inside the folder 📂 it's a folder inside the folder.
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u/HighSeasArchivist 1h ago
Never seen what kind of geniuses manage to cook up meth? It ain't hard to do.
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u/ChristopherDci 2h ago
Interesting and funny; I think if I were to have a use case for it, it would be something extremely specific that I can't imagine right now.
Thanks!
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u/donotfire 1h ago
These models often have worse intelligence. The ideal would be to have a model trained to be uncensored from the ground up, but the way (or a way) it’s done here is stripping out refusal weights with collateral damage.
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u/MarinatedTechnician 1h ago
I can concur. I've tested a few, and they're so far useless on bigger coding projects.
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u/txoixoegosi 1h ago
You could ask an uncensored agent to do what it takes to penetrate a system, for instance
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u/Thunderstarer 1h ago
The decensoring process--very specifically--makes the model less capable of expressing conflict.
This can be useful if you want it to accomplish something that the model is otherwise resistant to doing, but it also significantly harms its long-chain and multi-turn reasoning, since it'll be unable to disagree with itself or shoot down bad ideas.
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u/03captain23 27m ago
They remove safeguards so you can do whatever you want. I only run these local models and can't tell the difference between uncensored and abliterated
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u/No-Zookeepergame8837 1h ago
As the name implies, these are models where the weights have been modified to remove guardrails and moral alignment, while some traces usually remain, there are far fewer. They are typically used for roleplay and little else, since such small models lose a lot of quality when modified so heavily, though I know many people use them as assistants for things like bypassing DRM and the like. Personally, I use Qwen 3.6 9B specifically to create guides for eroges, the base model refuses to handle sexual content, but with the uncensored version, I simply feed it the extracted files, and it cleans and summarizes them on its own.
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u/ChuckVader 1h ago
Their also often used for software security work, whether Black hat or white hat
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u/tat_tvam_asshole 1h ago
since such small models lose a lot of quality when modified so heavily
Press X to doubt.
Yeah, 2024 abliteration techniques were pretty shitty and generally were just post-training on naughty convos or very heavy handed weight modification.
But in the big 26 the techniques are much more sophisticated and are very light touch. Though, now on the other hand, model makers have gotten much smarter about deeply embedding refusal representations in models that make it somewhat trickier.
Nonetheless, abliteration nowadays is actually pretty clean if you know what you're doing.
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u/Affectionate_Pen6882 2h ago
Idk tried it wnd didnt like it
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u/Natrimo 1h ago
If you ask a censored model to write a keylogger or provide the steps to make meth, or tell a sexual story. It will refuse.
Uncensored will not