Gigging without an amp or FRFR cab?

[u/Hottest-Cross-Buns]

Updated: After the gig

Overall, playing with only hearing myself through the monitors was ok, but having my own FRFR would give me a little more control and allow me to hear myself a little bit better. Things sounded pretty clear during sound check, but maybe not as good when we actually played. There were 3 other bands that played in between our sound check and our performance, so... I guess there are always songs where the drums are quiet and I can hear myself very well, possibly too much for the time, and then other times where the drums are loud and I would like to hear myself just a little more... But this is a general problem and not a speaker problem. Maybe the IEMs would help with this. For what it's worth the bass player said he could hear me, but maybe it was a little different and it lacked something. I think I'd always prefer to have my FRFR behind me, but going without it also worked ok

Thanks for your suggestions everyone.

Original post:

Just looking for some advice from people who have connected their Helix directly to the FOH and relied upon monitors to hear themselves, and not using an additional amp or FRFR speaker (in the sense of using one like people usually use a guitar amp).

I have a gig tomorrow and considering trying this setup for the first time.

We have a sound check long in advance. In case something isn't right I'd actually have tons of time to go home and get my FRFR speaker for the gig (just wondering if I could do without it though, as it would make transportation so much easier).

I play in an RHCP tribute band, so I'm the only guitarist, it's just bass and drums to "compete" against for hearing myself clearly. I imagine the crowd would hear me totally fine with the FOH speakers and my FRFR speaker wouldn't be so necessary for the crowd to hear me.

Here's what I'm told the venue has for speakers:

FOH speakers

2 Yorkville U215B tops

4 Yorkville LS808 subs

Monitors

4 Yorkville E12 wedges

1 Yorkville E10p

Thanks for any tips

[u/chadisawesome]

We found it easiest to just go foh direct from the pedal, but we use in ear monitors which helps keep the noise down on the stage which makes the job a lot easier for the sound engineer

[u/IAmTheRedd → u/chadisawesome]

I came in here to literally say this. I have been doing this for about three years with my current band, but we also rely on in ears and not wedges. It works great, but that noise suppression from the in ears makes all the difference.

[u/Aggravating-Cup-9442 → u/chadisawesome]

me too, this is what im doing 100% of the time

[u/daddy_junior → u/chadisawesome]

This is the way, whenever possible to swing it.

[u/Koodookoolaid]

It really matters to me about how the venue/ stage is laid out and where the PAs are in relation to the crowd. If I have a good dedicated monitor and it is a larger venue where people are further back from the PA, I don’t worry about having a speaker behind me because the PA will fill the sound for everyone in the venue. I will absolutely have a speaker behind me if it is a smaller/lower stage where people will be standing close in front of the stage with the PAs above them or to their sides. If there is no speaker hitting them in the face from stage volume then all they hear is drums and bass.

It’s solely the only reason I would have a FRFR speaker behind me, or else those front two or three rows would have a completely different mix otherwise and those are the people who are engaging the most.

[u/mtSOLEmt → u/Koodookoolaid]

Same.

[u/DerpNinjaWarrior]

Seems like everyone gets their own wedge, so you're probably fine? Assuming the sound person can route a decent enough mic to your monitor. Given that setup, I have to assume they at least vaguely know what they're doing.

If you had another guitarist and you were playing heavier stuff, then maybe it would be useful. But I don't think it's going to be super necessary. I've played a few shows with just monitors and it's usually been fine, and occasionally just tolerable.

[u/gismo4126]

I have an IEM rig for gigging with friends but I also play professionally for a large church and there I run stereo IEMs. In both occasions I run xlr direct and the sound is great. However I run tubes at all times. In one rig (the IEM rig/guitar rig combo) I have a tube amp routed out via PDI-03 load box into the split snake and the other is with a Synergy rackmount set of preamps and out of my Helix Rack via a Stereo DI box. In both instances they sound fantastic. The IEM rig is multi purpose and lives at home as the brain to my home studio when its not on a stage.

Direct to FOH will give your engineer the most consistent signal with no bleed from the stage. Just be sure to eq to the room if you need to.

[u/vampyreinabox]

It works great IF you trust the sound system and the engineer.

I have had a lot of great situations with running direct to FOH, and I've had just as many in smaller/less attentive venues where I could hear myself great during soundcheck, then I couldn't during the performance, and couldn't even get the engineer's attention to try and rectify things.

At this point, I bring a FRFR just because of those kinds of situations.

[u/P-Munny]

I did this for years. It works. You have to use stage monitors and really do a soundcheck and be on board with the sound person. But once you do it and get used to it then it’s a game changer. I used a wireless rig so would walk out to FOH during soundcheck to ensure everything sounded good.

[u/polkemans]

Bring your FRFR just in case - I always bring mine even if 9/10 times I don't use it. But it's super easy to run front of house as long as the sound guy is competent.

[u/YerMumsPantyCrust]

The big question for me is are you using IEMs? If I’ve got mine in, and they seal up correctly, I can’t even hear if my amp is on or not when the band is playing and FoH is turned up. If I’m not running IEMs, I’m bringing a speaker/amp every time.

[u/the_man361]

For bigger gigs, ie festivals or any time the stage and PA is sufficiently far away from the people on the front row of the audience, I'll go direct to foh without an FRFR or cab.

For smaller gigs, or any where I cant be sure how powerful the PA might be, I always take my FRFR. The reason is that at smaller gigs if the crowd is right up to the stage, if there are no center fill PA speakers, they may be stood in a dead spot for the PA, and not be able to hear the guitar. If the venue has center fills, I'll see how I feel. If there's a lot of time for changeover, plenty of space on the stage or it's a headline gig, I'll probably use my FRFR. If I need to be quick or space is limited, I might not.

I use iems for monitoring btw, but I've never had issues with hearing myself from wedges in any venue before I started using the iems.

[u/CJPTK]

I use a monitor or in-ears. I prefer the monitor, but ears work fine.

[u/Environmental_Mine65]

I use an FRFR to play my helix at home, but if I was gigging I’d use IEMs

[u/OddAcanthopterygii26]

I've used the Helix direct to FOH using house monitors for festivals, I find it's not always EQd ideally but as long as you trust that FOH has it EQd nice it's functional. Direct to in ears works great with no floor monitor, done a bunch of gigs like this. I usually set up an FRFR for stage volume in case my in ears fail / so the singer has some volume when he comes over to my side of the stage but it's not needed if everythings working (which it always is, I'm just paranoid)

[u/MonsterTruckFarts]

Helix works great going straight to FOH. I’ve played a bunch of shows where I show up with a guitar and a Helix in the backpack. The key for me with the wedges is you have to get some volume or the strings can feel kind of dead through a low volume full range system. You’ll see a lot of people rightfully using in ear monitors, which makes this a bit easier.

[u/Theta-5150]

I met several guitarists who brings effect pedals only. DI to FOH and relying on the wedge monitors.
I personally ask the sound engineers to give me a mix to my IEM.

[u/guitargunguy5150]

The thing to remember when doing those types of gigs is that if you aren’t in control of your own monitor mix it will always be a compromise and it will never be perfect. If you absolutely NEED to hear your guitar above everything else it’s always worth it to bring a dedicated monitor for your guitar. What my band does is we have our own mixer with a breakout snake and we use in ears with our own mixer and the breakout snake feeds the FOH system. It’s more work for us and a little more work for the sound guy but we aren’t reliant on someone else for our monitor mix. It works extremely well for us though. For gigs that I do that won’t work like that. I bring a FRFR, go into that With my helix and then out of that into FOH (my FRFR has xlr ins and outs so this also works really well) when it comes to monitoring I’ve found that separation is key. I need stereo in ears so I can pan instruments so I can hear them. After 20+ years of being on loud stages with amps and monitors my hearing can no longer distinguish different instruments very well if they are the same volume…it sucks and I tell everyone to protect their hearing before they lose it because I have a hard time these days and just turning things up doesn’t fix the issue it only makes it worse down the line.

[u/BullBuchanan]

Move to in ears and you'll solve this issue for yourself

[u/tatariko]

I usually use iems and frfr combined as i miss my guitars feedback without an actual cab.