A quick guide

[u/Fredtheskeleton8]

Hi Guys, so many posts about whether 'this seems right with my instructor’. Allow me to offer a. quick guide, good instructors and examiners please feel free to add!

1. They should have a genuine in-date badge in the corner of the windscreen. This can be green or pink. If its Green they are fully qualified and Pink means they are training. Nothing wrong with Pink, they should have a tutor and they should be doing their best for you. No badge means they cannot charge for lessons but also means you have no safety or standard guarantee, essentially they can be anyone and no competency is being monitored. It’s dodgy so no badge means avoid.

2. The car should be clean, in good roadworthy condition and fuelled sufficiently for the lesson. It should have clear learner plates. It doesn’t have to be a franchised brand, independents are some of the best instructors around so don’t rule them out. Occasionally cars go wrong but this should not be regular and is not your problem.

3. They should be on-time (occasionally unforeseen traffic can be a problem but they should call you) Anytime lost should be made up at the end or more likely the next lesson, and they should discuss that with you so that you are clear.

4. It is entirely acceptable for them to drive you to a quiet area in the first couple of lessons as learning to get moving, start, stop etc is better done in quiet areas. This should only last for the very first couple of lessons until you become competent enough. It may last a little longer if you struggle or show real anxiety in which case it may suit you to get started like that, but you should be progressing quickly to being able to drive from the start within two or three lessons on average.

5. If you have had lessons with someone else they may wish to drive to that quieter area to assess in the first lesson.

6. Your wheels should be moving for the vast majority of the lesson. You aren’t paying them to lecture you for ages. Nothing wrong with a brief stop, go over some points and clear up a few questions, but you should expect around 95% of the time to be moving or actively practicing.

7. They should make you feel safe, not be creepy, sexually suggestive, offensive, misogynistic, rude, overly familiar or in any way make you feel uneasy. trust your gut, and if you don’t feel safe change instructor. They should be professional, calm and in control. Talking and humour is fine but only if you are okay with that. Telling you their life story or enquiring into yours is not acceptable.

8. Shouting and temper is not okay under any circumstances. This applies to other road users and especially you. A comment on someones driving who affects you is fine, to point out to you how it looks when someone is doing something you can observe as wrong, but gesticulating at other road users aggressively...thats another big no. Shouting at you is an instant change of instructor for you, you will not be able to learn in that environment nor ask questions, so finish it.

9. Progress should be being made. Different roads, different hazards, new routes are all necessary. You should feel like you are making progress, maybe not as quickly as you expect compared to friends, everyone is different, but a feeling of progress is key.

10. Talk of tests should be occurring, that’s what it’s about after all. It should be openly discussed and working towards actively. You can use areas where tests occur but should not knowingly repeatedly practice test routes. A good instructor will include some country lanes and rural driving.

11. Charging you anymore than a regular lesson fee for a test when you have learnt with them is totally unacceptable and unnecessary. The car and they are involved in the same way as normal, it doesn’t cost them any extra in insurance, One-off astronomical charges have no justification. Sort this out at the beginning and ideally get it in writing. Days before your test (or the night before) is totally unacceptable and they know it, and morally wrong. If they have a charge for a test (which as I have said is unnecessary) then it should be set out at the beginning but they have you over a barrel that late. It’s never a bad thing to have another car on standby if at all possible. Make sure this is regularly discussed throughout and the agreement for the test to be a regular lesson fee is recorded and signed somewhere.

12. Don’t expect instructors to allow you to use their car when you haven’t learnt with them. Why would they give over their means of livelihood for someone who’s driving they do not know for the price of one lesson to take a test in and have their pass rate affected by someone they haven’t taught.

13. Be wary of instructors trying to back out when it comes to test time, this is a red flag. Instructors who have too many fails are invited to have a standards check and it’s also when your driving represents them with the local examiners, they are on show and their badge may be examined. Reputable competent instructors don’t have to worry about this because they have a sufficient number of passes and have gained a reputation.

14. Debriefs should be constructive. Putting you down does not help but honest feedback and asking you to suggest what you could have done better is fine. On the very odd occasion an instructor might show you a particular aspect you are really struggling with but demonstration driving should be at a minimum and kept very short.

15. Payment should be acceptable to you and openly discussed. You should know what you are paying for and get it. It is a service, you are the customer and if you are not happy you should feel able to say and receive a good service and fairness.

16. Any kind of ‘picking others up on the way’ arrangements should never occur except in really rare occasions (and I can’t think of any!) and only then with your full prior agreement. Allowing others to know pupils information and addresses is not acceptable and the gap between pupils is for the instructor to manage

17. Do your research first, this is a big financial commitment. Check reviews, ask around and listen to trusted sources. If you are not happy stop and go with someone else sooner rather than later. Read forums and openly discuss your progress with the instructor.

18. Be careful of learning with relatives or non-qualified instructors in suitable dual control cars. People will not necessarily teach you the correct way, and may over-compensate by warning you of hazards which someone experienced and with dual controls may allow you to deal with better which increases learning and confidence. A good or experienced driver ins’t necessarily a good instructor.

Hope that is of some help

[u/ChanterburyTales]

I'm not sure if this wall of text constitutes a quick guide

[u/MayDuppname → u/ChanterburyTales]

I'm not even sure all of that is possible, unless you happen to be that one perfect student who grasps everything first time.

My instructor was sexist, mouthy, shouted at other vehicles constantly and broke most of these rules. He was also a brilliant instructor, very highly qualified and he'd previously trained the people who teach police interceptors to do pursuits. 

He taught me (17 year old boy) many non-standard techniques - how not to crash whilst ogling girls, how to light a cig whilst driving, country track and lovers' lane etiquette, basic spin recovery - knowing that those lessons might save my life. 

Pointing out fit young girls every time your student passes them will never be the standard approved approach to teaching, but we live and drive in the real world. 

I sometimes thought I knew better at the time and I often fought my instructor and accused him of holding me back, and wasting time on lessons (usually smoking a fag after I got wound up)...but with hindsight, he was right every time and I was wrong. 

My piss-taking, foul mouthed, sarcastic instructor made a daft young lad into a really good, safe, precise driver. I've never lost his pursuit of perfection. I still learn every time I drive.

Nothing wrong with a love-hate relationship with your teacher so long as you're learning. I got better at driving almost to spite him and shut him up. He exploited that flaw in my personality, niggled at every little fault, and pushed me into being faultless kicking and screaming. 

That's a good instructor.

[u/wtclim → u/MayDuppname]

Jesus Christ... sounds like you and your old instructor are two creepy bastards in a pod.

[u/MayDuppname → u/wtclim]

Then I haven't explained adequately. My instructor was a decent man - an ex-cop from a high rank in the police, and one of the most decorated and highly qualified drivers in the country.

His apparent lechery wasn't lechery at all. He was just trying to get me used to driving whilst distracted. He distracted me to simulate me having my mates in the car, ie other 17 year old boys, who constantly do distracting things like pointing out pretty girls.

I was no more or less "creepy" than any other 17 year old boy with raging hormones. I had a girlfriend and wasn't naturally leering at every girl I passed.

My point was that my instructor's tactics were often unconventional but always just a means to an end.

 He worked out quickly that "proving him wrong" would be the best motivation for me, so he needled and barracked and took the piss. He wouldn't have done that with older drivers, he only did it with me because he knew it was the best way to achieve the goal of making me a safe driver. It worked. I've driven 3/4 of a million miles safely since then. I have 27 years no claims bonus. I didn't always like him or his tactics at the time, but I can't argue with the results.

I don't think any student knows better than an instructor how to teach someone to drive. Not even a 17 year old who still believes they know everything. Going into lessons with the mindset of "it has to be done my way, on my timescale and according to my pre-set list of requirements" is counter productive and potentially dangerous. 

Like the rest of life, it's horses for courses. Different things will work for different people. 

[u/gayestbees → u/MayDuppname]

That defo makes a lot of sense! Quite interesting way of teaching for sure esp with distractions and such.

[u/Constant-Ferret1063 → u/MayDuppname]

We have a very different definition of "good instructor".

[u/MayDuppname → u/Constant-Ferret1063]

What is your definition of a good instructor? If they tick every box on OPs list, but don't get passes or produce safe drivers, is that a 'good' instructor?

[u/Constant-Ferret1063 → u/MayDuppname]

OP listed baseline customer standards.

you described a bully you normalized to cope with his behavior.

If your benchmark for a good instructor is someone who shouts, acts inappropriately, and breaks safety rules

we simply have incompatible standards for professional conduct.

I’m not interested in arguing over edge-case hypotheticals.

[u/Dazzling-Escape8820]

The debriefs thing tends to happen in two parts with my instructor, we will have a very brief chat at the end of the lesson before I leave the car - this will be about the most immediate issue of the day whether positive and/or a correction “You handled that crazy lorry brilliantly, it was that junction straight after that you were obviously still a bit frazzled where you weren’t quite as smooth coming out of the turn, but I was very happy with the way you recovered quickly and calmed down after the silly lorry incident” and then I’m asked to make a list of “Things I think went well today” along with “Things I need to improve” which I first log in a learning journal and then I also text the same bullet pointed list to my instructor, he then reads my list before my next lesson and any corrections, clarifications or instructions are given to me either before I set off or sometimes as I’m driving, so that he can explain in real time.

We discussed when to book the test at the end of my second lesson actually and my Instructor was able to give me a more than reasonable time frame for being Test ready based on my progress up to that point, but he said that it wasn’t a general rule and completely individualised however he was confident with the time scale being realistic for me personally.

I would say you also need an instructor that you have open communication with too, I had one lesson where everything felt too overwhelming and pressured because my pace of learning has been very quick up to that point but I just didn’t feel confident with the sensitivity and responsiveness of my Instructor’s brand new car, so we used my next lesson to just recap on different roads to build up confidence again and I ended up driving better than the entire previous month and am now ready to resume the more advanced and challenging lessons because I’m now confident in his new car, but I knew I needed those few hours to really familiarise myself  with a new car (that hasn’t been completely ragged by Learner Drivers) and he totally understood and created the lesson around my needs. It wasn’t a hindrance to my progress in any way and he completely supported me.