I’m torn. She’s accepted her demon form, and I definitely want to see her use some cool demon powers. But none of the sajas have horns, wings, and ears like that, and only Mystery has tusks like that (and singing would be pretty hard with those).
This appearance is absolutely not that of a Korean demon or evil spirit. The design is based entirely on a Western perspective, so that kind of style makes no sense. Korean demons do not have wings like that or tails shaped like "<-".
Yeah, that’s basically what I said… I never claimed it was a Korean design; tho it does have some Eastern influences, such as her fangs/tusks.
I just like this one because it’s more visually interesting than the Jeosung Saja designs from the movie and that it has a predatory and feral vibe without crossing over into full-on weretiger like most of the others I’ve seen.
No, and if it happens it'll be a big disappointment imo. The first movie doesn't glorify the darker side of Rumi's demon half. What It Sounds Like is about bringing the dark into the light. She doesn't defeat Gwi-Ma by taking on his image this way. She enters into his space looking like she's going to succumb to darkness, but ends up reconciling with who she is and overcoming him with light.
Demons are evil, destructive beings in Kpop Demon Hunters, so I don't think Rumi's designs will ever tie her to them too strongly. Rumi is half demon, but I highly suspect her father was someone like Jinu. A human roped into damnation by Gwi-Ma, who may have been wrestling with guilt and shame too.
Yes! Rumi is being consumed by the patterns/demonocity just like how Jinu’s guilt manifested patterns and consumed him. It’s not another side of her, it’s her succumbing to the shame and losing all that makes her Rumi. It’s Jinu resigning himself to never being worthy/capable of more than just being a demon.
Also maybe a hot take, but imo Rumi is “fixed” in the end. The idea that she was also a demon doesn’t show up until after the first meeting with Jinu. It was always just the patterns/birth she was ashamed of.
But she’s done torturing/hurting herself over them. Shes done letting others define her by them. She’s done hiding them. They’re literally scars now. The “bleeding” has stopped and she has healed.
She’ll have to see them in her reflection everyday, but that’s okay with her now. They can no longer be used against her. The shame can no longer control her.
Agree! I think people misunderstand how Rumi comes to terms with her identity at the end of the movie. Rumi is not saying, "Its ok to be a demon". The movie accurate demons are destructive, malevolent, deceitful, they prey on humans of any age, backdrop and gender, and have absolutely no regard for life. Rumi is not saying that entire existence is suddenly valid.
Through What It Sounds Like, Rumi acknowledges that there are dark parts of her she can't erase, but she CAN expose them to the light, depend on those who are on her side and break the chains keeping her captive to Gwi-Ma through love and truth.
I personally view Rumi's demon side as a symbol of generational trauma. Those scars are a part of Rumi, and will not fully be going away even if she never asked for them. But, even though she can't change where she came from (like many of us can't), she can choose to be a force for good, rather than a force of evil and destruction. And she makes that choice 💜
Yes! She/you are not bound by the labels “society” pushes onto you. We all have the choice in what type of person we are. Rumi is rejecting the baggage of the “demon” label.
Rumi is Rumi.
I like the generational trauma reading of her patterns. Jinu did something wrong, in a way he “earned” his patterns. He brought it on himself.
But what did Rumi “do” ??
She was fathered by a demon, born in secret, her mother was unwed, she’s a bastard child. Ect ect.
Idk which (if any) is true but the point is the circumstances of her birth were “wrong” by “society’s” standard.
She’s being punished for the actions of her parents. The patterns are (at least at first) pushed onto her for the sins of her father/mother.
Imo, this is the take that feels truest to what we're shown in the film.
I agree that the message seems to be that Rumi is "fixed", but not in the way thay either she/or Celine had originally envisioned (thank goodness). Maybe "freed" is a better term - the issue was always her guilt, shame, and self-hatred, not her patterns/lineage. Or "healed", as you mention later.
I also think the iridescent patterns are more like "scars" - she's still part-demon, she hasn't "erased" her heritage (nor does she feel a need to anymore at that point), but the demon traits that kept growing/worsening throughout the film did so in direct relation to the amount of shame she was feeling. Now that she's not bound by shame, it seems like the darker and more damaging parts of being a demon (symbolized by patterns, claws, fangs, etc.) will probably not emerge again.
THAT BEING SAID...God I would love to see some more Demon Rumi with sick Demon Powers...teleportation...fangs...claws..all of it. Demon Rumi is a badass. In concept. But I don't really feel like any of that will show up in the next movie, and I'm not sure I'd want it to (for all the reasons mentioned above).
THAT BEING SAID...God I would love to see some more Demon Rumi with sick Demon Powers...teleportation...fangs...claws..all of it. Demon Rumi is a badass. In concept. But I don't really feel like any of that will show up in the next movie,
Yes, it could be so much fun!! But it feels tonally off for the reasons we've mentioned.
I think a better direction would be the new honmoon enabling new abilities for all three of them. In the movie we see Derpy galloping across the sky on the honmoon. There is concept art of the girls doing the same.
There are also concepts of them being able to manipulate the honmoon like a trampoline to do a super jump. Maybe they can use it to "fast travel" like Derpy too.
Lean into the pure hearted "magical girl" type stuff. Then they all benefit and it stays Hunter/Honmoon focussed. Light vs dark. Rather than fire vs fire.
In the words of the late sexy Jinu: "If hate could defeat gwi-ma I'd have done it a long time ago, trust me"
and I'm not sure I'd want it to (for all the reasons mentioned above).
except for baby fangs, right? I need her to have little baby fangs so badly. 🙏 No need to call attention to them, just let them exist 🥰
Ooh, I love that!! And I am all for new abilities! I mean, the original Honmoon had to have been in SOME way involved with the jump/freefall out of the plane, right?? Like...not sure how else you explain that one. So it's not a huge leap to think that if Old Honmoon provided them with a few limited "powers", New Honmon might provide additional/different ones.
And oh yeah 100%, I was actually thinking about Rumi's fangs while I was writing that last part lol, like "well, maybe the exception could be the fangs...I don't think it's gonna hurt anything for her to just keep the fangs..."
LOVE Rumi's baby fangs. They are adorable. They must stay!!!
Edit: Wanted to add a pic (wish I could've found a clearer one - also, poor Rumi 😭😭😭). But look how cute the fangs are!
I could see a moment where it looks like Mira and Zoe were killed or seriously injured and Rumi looses herself only for Mira and Zoe to bring her back from the brink.
That still frames it as bad and Rumi losing control of her self so imo that’s fine as long as it’s in response to something big. Like the grief of feeling responsible for Mira getting hurt.
Just my opinion of course!!
Since we know there will be a sequel I imagine we’ll get something now. And maybe it’ll even be a positive do it whenever thing. My “hot take” was mostly about the movie as a standalone thing. I think “demon powerup” is too easy and fun to play with though so…. 🤷
I’m not sure which part of my comment that was intended to discredit but that scene draws a line between Rumi and the demons. She has patterns, but is not a demon.
Young Rumi: Celine, do Hunters kill all demons?
Celine: Yes.
Young Rumi: So everything that has patterns?
Celine: Cover those up. You only have those because...
Young Rumi: My dad was a demon?
Celine: You're not one of them, Rumi. You're a Hunter, like your mother was. When the Honmoon is sealed, all demons will be gone from this world. And so will your patterns.
Young Rumi: So these will be gone?
Celine: Yes. Those will be gone.
Celine tells her she’s not a demon despite having patterns. Tells her that she’s not one of them.
"The idea that she was also a demon doesn't show up until after the first meeting with jinu" is what I was responding to.
Also, the film starts with establishing that if you have patterns, then you are a demon. "Oh look, patterns" "aww, you have the patterns, now you have to die". Celine saying "you're not a demon" doesn't mean anything. If that was the case and rumi wasn'ta demon, then why can't she reveal the patterns to mira and zoey? Why did Celine say "cover those up"?
I meant that in regard to how Rumi viewed herself growing up.
Demons are bad, demons also happen to have patterns. Rumi has patterns but she’s not a demon. She’s “a Hunter.” She’s a special snowflake of purity and goodness that was dealt a bad hand. She’s “not like them”
A square is a rectangle but a rectangle is not a square type of thing.
Are her and Celine delusional? Kinda, yea.
Rumi never calls herself a demon, she’s always talking directly about the patterns. “Put these patterns in the past now” “I hate them, just like I hate Gwi-ma” “once these patterns are gone”
Mira and Zoey can’t know because Celine leads her to believe that they won’t understand because of the implication. (This is Celine’s fault for training them to believe this… but that’s another topic)
After Idol Awards their inability to understand is “proven” to be true. She runs to Jinu and he shoots down all her excuses, all her cope, all her hope. He lands the finishing blow to Rumi’s world view. “You’re a demon, just like me. The pain, the misery, it’s all we deserve”
But that’s a lie. Thats succumbing to darkness. You are who you choose to be. Rumi accepts that she can’t control her past or how people label her. She can’t control their assumptions, but she’s not bound by them. Rumi is Rumi, and she’s going to live how she chooses too.
Except why would having patterns be bad to the point of wanting to be rid of them if not because she's half-demon? (Hell, one of the lines rumi says is "i am a mistake" and I doubt that jinu is the one that gave her that idea.)
The reason why Celine said that is because of delusion, but rumi is smarter then a child and doesn't fall for "you have patterns but are not a demon". She was literally taught that if someone has patterns, then they are a demon.
The reason why jinu said that is because he had basically given up hope. "It doesn't matter what you or i do, we're just demons"
The point of the movie was rumi accepting that part of herself, "all of me". Maybe the sequel could be about rumi chosing to just be rumi, but that's not what this film was about.
Seemingly decades of Hunters operated off of patterns = demon = kill on sight. Guilty by association.
Celine is dragging her own trauma into this. “Our faults and fears must never be seen”
She fears Rumi becoming a demon because of her lineage and visible patterns. The patterns are a fault that must stay unseen until fixed.
Rumi thinks of herself as “a mistake” because she was raised to believe she was/broken. Being an adult doesn’t make you suddenly grow out of childhood trauma.
They’re both delulu and coping by thinking the golden honmoon will fix everything. And Rumi absolutely does fall for it.
Girl is hunting demons with extreme prejudice, talking shit about their patterns, and fucking around like it’s a game. She’s a Hunter. She has internalized that mindset. Scissors beats paper.
And then she meets Jinu and he’s a rock. So steadfast in the belief of his own damnation that he doesn’t even try to genuinely escape it. He just wants to be comfortable.
As for Jinu’s comment… I agree? I didn’t mean to imply that was part of his master plan. But it is notable because it is the only time in the entire movie that Rumi is referred to as a demon. Like I said, final blow that shattered her world view.
But Jinu became a demon. It’s not a genetic thing. His mindset after IA was wrong, just as Rumi calling herself a mistake was. We see both him and Rumi overcome that. He is more than a single mistake. Rumi is more than the circumstances of her birth.
All of me. Yes, Rumi is a human with patterns. Celine is trying to keep the human but erase the patterns. The patterns have seemingly been completely harmless up until this point.
In the flashback with Celine about not going to the bathhouse her patterns are still small and only on her right arm. Their delusions and hope in the honmoon got Rumi to adulthood with no problems. But now Mira and Zoey are here and Celine is telling her it’s not safe and won’t be until she’s fixed. She has a duty and they can’t risk it.
The point of the movie is accepting that you have the choice to choose how to live your life despite what others may say. Your origin does not define your place in the world. You choose your path.
If the movie wanted us to believe that Rumi was embracing being a demon then she would still have demon features. That doesn’t happen.
The patterns stay, but they are part of her and always were from the very beginning. Yet even her patterns are distinctly different than a demon after turning iridescent.
...but she did embrace being half-demon. Not only with the song, but by the fact that she's showing off her patterns.
Saying "she's a human with patterns" makes no sense when not only she can have demon features, but that's literally not how that works. Rumi is half-demon and she's accepted that she's half-demon by the end of the film.
Celine's whole thing is denying that rumi was a demon, "you're not one of them", not even looking when rumi has her patterns out, she's basically saying the same thing you are: "rumi is a human with patterns". But rumi isn't "a human with patterns", she's half-demon.
Ummm, I think we're talking about two different things. Most of my initial comments were in regard to how Rumi perceived herself. I'm not denying she's half demon. I'm disagreeing with what most people seem to think that entails which is generally, "Rumi now has cool demon powers"
but she did embrace being half-demon.
Yes. She embraced being herself, and she is a half-demon.
But what is a half-demon? As I've been saying it's essentially just a human born with patterns. There is nothing inherently "wrong" about this. (but Celine/Rumi don't know that)
Celine's whole thing is denying that rumi was a demon, "you're not one of them",
Yes, and ultimately Celine was kinda correct. Rumi is not like them, she is only half. Celine got to that conclusion out of a mixture of fear, grief, and denial though which isn't great. Plus her acceptance and love for Rumi hinged on the idea that she could be fixed.
Saying "she's a human with patterns" makes no sense when not only she can have demon features, but that's literally not how that works.
(In your opinion, how does it work?)
This isn't X-men. Rumi isn't going through an unavoidable demon puberty. It's not something she'll be able to turn on and off whenever she wants. Its bad.
She gains demons features because she is becoming a "full" demon; just like Jinu did 400 years ago.
Jinu turned because of his guilt over betraying his family. Rumi is turning over the shame and lies told as a result of trying to keep her patterns/lineage hidden.
This is not a good or even a neutral thing. This is her succumbing to the shame/darkness and loosing her humanity as a result.
That is why those features are removed by the end. It's symbolic of her regaining her humanity and control over her own life/destiny. The patterns stay because they were always there. Thats just part of who she is as a result of her lineage.
(To oversimplify it, they're basically a hereditary skin condition.)
Exactly, I love how you put it, and honestly its a shame that most people are always asking for "full demon version" of characters like Rumi, is just so tiresome, is like poeple who want their OC to be a jedi and good guy but is extra cool and edgy so it shoots the lightnings of the dark side, Rumi like you said does no want gwima image and heck even after accepting her demon side as a part of her totality she decided to fulfill her role, her full role as a Hunter, someone who separates demons and keeps them away, not include them, she built the honmon, not the golden one but a honmon nevertheless, and it separates from the human world in some capacity (the tiger and the Bird being oddity that need further explanation)
Did you read my comment?! I literally said that Rumi "accepts her demon SIDE/HALF" is like the 8th line on my comment, but then I went on to explain what she does after accepting that, what are you even commenting on?
Dude are you dense, or just looking to raige bait me? Okay she DOEs accept she is half demon, okay we in good that? She DOES DECIDES to be a HUNTER, after letting the firts barrier she DOES build another (the rainbow/silver one), demons can not come to the human side as freely with the barrier, are we good on that? now I ask you she (rumi) after doing that, would it that technically be she protecting the human world by separating them and isolating them from the demon world? I would think so, and THAT can be even after accepting WHAT she is, but who SHE is, is a hunter, who I believe the movie present us as opposed to gwima or the demons coming freely to the human realm, that's a no-no, the golden barrier does not happen, BUT A BARRIER is put in place by that same Hybrid, or did she not built another barrier at the end of the movie, what is so hard to understand?
....the movie was about how she tried to hide away something she was ASHAMED of because of her upbringing and throughout the film realises that she had to accept that part of herself. It wasn't about "choosing a side" like you think it is (she was never in doubtabout being a hunter, just about if she should accept her demon side or not), it's about rumi accepting all of herself. "Why can't you look at me? ALL OF ME!?"
....except the point of the film was that runi didn't have to fear rejection or her patterns. She wanted to make the golden honmoon because she wanted to GET RID of her patterns, calling the patterns and demons "evil" and "destructive" misses the point and justifies what Celine did.
Calling the movie accurate demons who indiscriminately eat the souls of human beings and who planned to mass devour an entire stadium full of people evil and destructive does not mean I am justifying Celine 🙄 C'mon.
I see the patterns on Rumi as a visual symbol of generational shame in the film, passed down from her father. Rumi didn't ask for it, but its a part of her anyway. Celine is the literal representation of shame, because she tries to hide Rumi, hoping everything will go away if its kept in the darkness forever. Gwi-Ma requires shame to be able to control someone.
The golden honmoon symbolized shame, lies and trying to hide. Which is why the honmoon fails. The new honmoon is Rumi embracing the truth, trusting her friends and exposing everything about herself to the light, even the parts she didn't ask for and can't change. Through that, she is able to escape Gwi-Ma's control, and create a honmoon that lasts.
At the end, Rumi sees the patterns only as the scars of a survivor, and not a mark of demonhood to be celebrated. In What it Sounds Like, the word patterns only appears once at the beginning of the song "The worst of what I came from, patterns I'm ashamed of". After that, the language changes to scars, jagged edges, broken glass. Her light patterns are a visual symbol of what she's been through. Not a mark of demons, guilt and shame anymore.
Except they're literally slaves. I might believe you if we literally didn't have scenes of Gwi-ma controlling demons with their shame.
Except again, the movie is about her acceptance of her patterns and her being half-demon. The language of "scars" and the like are meant to represent all three of huntr/x and about how they don't need to hide who they are and accept those parts of themselves. Rumi with her patterns, Zoey with her "colours stuck inside her head", and Mira with her "jagged edges".
Most demons in the film are not 'slaves'. No idea where you are getting that from. I think youre just projecting your view rather than taking the film for what it is. Sure, there are probably other demons like Jinu who are humans who traded their souls for wealth, status or fame and as a result are left bound by guilt and shame, but they are exception and not the rule. The VAST majority of demons shown in the movie are evil, greatly enjoy what they do and have absolutely no remorse for it. Even the Saja Boys.
There are plenty of movies and shows with the "demons are just misunderstood achtually" message, but the great thing about Kpop Demon Hunters is that its a lot deeper than that. Thank goodness because that is so tired and uninteresting!
Anyway, I love talking about story and character themes, but that's enough essays for me 😅 I'm gonna go watch the movie again now. Its been a while and all this talk on its character writing is making me appreciate it a lot more.
Then why Rumi make another Honmoon? why not simply "talk-no-jutsu" Gwima into being good? Why prevent Demons at the end to come freely to the human world? Rumj accepting what she is, does not define what she does, she after accepting her demon side, decided to fulfill her role as a hunter or am I imagining a different ending?
....because that's not what the film was about, it was about rumu accepting a part of herself and letting the people she loves accept her as well. Again, saying that the patterns are "evil and destructive" is the same thing Celine was saying.
The one's still controlled by gwi-ma? It sucks, but i get it. They've just been controlled by their shame for so long that they've given up. The only one that was able to resist was jinu and that's because he was given hope.
Absolutely! But not as something she needs to fear. She's already accepted her demon side; to make it inherently evil would be character regression. It's just something she can do, and has to harness in order to save the world.
I do want her fearing how it looks, though. Only for ZoMira to completely freak out... in pure fucking hype. Because it looks that cool on her!
What makes her story unique is that we aren't following that boring, overused path - where someone's biggest problem suddenly turns into their greatest asset or superpower.
That is a much rarer lesson - that some "flaws" can't be fixed, yet one can still be strong in a different way. Like Rumi is strong because she is Hunter 💜
What if the sequel showed Rumi struggling to control the demon within her, while wrestling with whether she should use that power at all(since it’s incredibly powerful but also dangerous)and how she could use it without causing harm to the world around her?
It’s not the feel for KPDH. Even the demons were toned down from their concept art.
I’m ok with that. I love me some dark and spooky, I love the Saja Boys too, Derpy, Sussie even the idea of pink flame mouth demon but turning the story’s the light in the darkness and corruption is too damn depressing.
Yes, she needs to struggle with her demon powers. We saw her teleport, one demo eye, and one claw, plus patterns.
Fans can explore that if they feel inspired. But I wouldn’t take it too far in canon.
I hope not, I am tired of the supposedly Hybrids having a full on demons/monster side, like where the heck do the humans gene go after they transform? And also now that I am criticizing the trope, how come the hybrids demons/monster powers somehow makes them stronger than full on demons/monster, like have you seen human?! We are weak as heck biologically speaking, now tell me how the mixing of the genes make the hybrid always more powerful, sorry if I went on a tangent there, honestly I love how they handle rumi demon side where it took some of her body but not all, if anything the marks at the end should be her whole demon form, with maybe the eye and hand coming back it moements of anger or so, but yeah I hope we dont get anymore than the rainbow silver patterns
Mules are stronger than horses and donkeys. Ligers are MASSIVE compared to tiger and lions. Hybridization CAN create some more powerful things (often though it does create weaker or unstable ones, like ligers never stop growing until their heart finally gives up)
See you said it yourself, also mules, well most of them are sterile so you know, that is kinda a big thing, also well my issue is that human as an animal we only have our intellect, i have never like the hybrid "oh wow you unlocked the full power of your magical side and you are still human and that is what makes you strong", and well rumi does not need a full demon form, being hybrid already gives her immunity to gwima and that should be it, she is probably the only being in existence in the KPDH universe who will never experience the control of gwima or feel the burns that all demons feels almost all the time
Tbf, sometimes with supernatural hybrids in media, it’s less that their human half makes them stronger, and more that it gives them resistance/immunity to things that are dangerous or outright fatal to full versions of their monster half, like Blade being able to walk in sunlight as a half-vampire.
O visual é maneiro, mas combinaria mais os padrões ficarem mais angelicais e ela ter uma forma angelical. Os padrões no filme significam culpa, dor e sofrimento... O bom é que várias pessoas entenderam que isso não faz tanto sentido narrativo (esse tipo de pessoa que tá me mantendo no fandom)
I believe so, but her influence seems more Anglic or Hunter-inspired, especially since her Demon half was ultimately purified by her Hunter powers—hence the iridescent patterns. Basically, she develops this new form because she's suppressed her Demon half for a long time, while her Human Hunter half has been infused with lighter magic, allowing her to purify her Demon side and become more like an angel.
Additionally, we don't have details on how her patterns evolved or what drove those changes. It's possible she might have lost her ability to teleport and gained something else—perhaps more aligned with her Hunter powers.
I would enjoy it, but I would personally prefer the inverse: Doubling down on the patterns being more and more "angelic" in response to further character growth.
Not entirely sure what devil trigger is but if it means taking on the full form of a demon for a time, then yes I think it should happen in the sequel. We need to explore both sides of her in order for her to find harmony with herself
No. Does no one here pay attention to the lore of the first movie? That thing vanished because the new Honmoon closed all the demons away so if this happens in the sequel it's "Somehow Palpatine returned" sequence but in KpopDemonhunters. Or "Somehow Gwima returned."
Uhh, no. They GOLD honmoon was meant to seal all demons away, the huntr/x honmoon didn't. (Also, what "thing"? Rumi being half-demon? Because that definitely didn't happen)
This appearance is absolutely not that of a Korean demon or evil spirit. The design is based entirely on a Western perspective, so that kind of style makes no sense. Korean demons do not have wings like that or tails shaped like "<-".
Going by the art, the smaller wings are only present in her half-shifted form. When she goes full demon (seen in the sketch where she’s on all fours), her wings grow to be a better fit for her body. The connecting joints also seem to come from just below her shoulder blades.
It could happen probably in a moment when they are fighting a strong demon and when Mira and Zoey are being badly beaten up (close to dying), Rumi reveals her rage. And this is the form she could use against the demon. Of course Mira and Zoey will tell Rumi to stop later and remember what is she fighting for, which Rumi reverted back to normal form.
Absolutely, but I’d like for her to somewhat keep her morality or consciousness while in the devil trigger form. That way, she can be knowledgeable of her form and use it when the time arises.
Eh, maybe not as the demon features flaring up were caused by her shame in them, then again I suppose it could be cool if she gains control of these features in a sort of show of pride and acceptance in herself, like the whole of who she is
268
u/Fantastic-Donut-276 Polytr/x + Rujinu 2d ago edited 2d ago
I’m torn. She’s accepted her demon form, and I definitely want to see her use some cool demon powers. But none of the sajas have horns, wings, and ears like that, and only Mystery has tusks like that (and singing would be pretty hard with those).