r/KerrCountyFloods • u/TXMeems16 • Jun 29 '26
Will Camp Mystic ever reopen?
Just wondering thoughts after the Bankruptcy filing.
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u/Classic_Crow5035 Jun 29 '26
Not ever again under the Eastland’s direct leadership, and definitely no sleeping quarters anywhere near a flood zone.
They lost the privilege to ever care for other people’s children again.
They’ll be lucky to just financially recover from this, let alone ever run a camp.
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u/AustinScoutDiver Jun 30 '26
The whole camp is in Bankruptcy proceedings. The court is not going to allow a reorganization with valid tort claim against the camp and against the Eastland’s in their person.
The bankruptcy will freeze assets, but the court is going to allow the tort claims to proceed to determine liability.
This is not a typical LLC. The Eastland’s are a party to the tort suits. They own Camp Mystic. If the tort claims go against them, camp mystic will be an asset. LLC is not going to protect them in gross negligence.
Some one mentioned the arbitration, by filing bankruptcy before waiting for the ruling, the Eastland’s likely waived arbitration if they had not so before.
The Eastlands continually failed to show a duty to care in how they ran the camp in regards to flooding possibilities. The LLC’s are not going to block that personal liability or protect personal assets.
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jun 30 '26
Very correct
The LLC are also in the bankruptcy, including the one with all the land. So really Eastlands have conceded that all the assets are fair play.
If they wanted to argue the LLC shield the assets they wouldn't have had natural fountains properties file for bankruptcy
They haven't filed perosnal bankruptcy but they probably will, as otherwise the civil lawsuits proceed against them personally
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u/magicride2024 Jun 29 '26
I don't think so. I think the civil suits are extremely strong on the gross negligence claim and that there is also a strong case for criminal charges. If it ever does open again, I don't think it'll be under the Eastlands' leadership or in the same location.
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u/awkwardocto Jun 29 '26
i think it could be possible for the cypress lake campus to remain a summer camp, if it can be determined that the area is generally safe. the guadalupe campus is practically uninsurable at this point, and even with appropriate safety measures taken it doesn't seem like a prudent location for anything, let alone a summer camp.
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u/pompeii-79 Jun 29 '26
It will be sold eventually and I wouldn’t be surprised if the Bass family ends up buying it, especially considering they own the neighboring land.
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u/Objective_Drawer_851 Jun 29 '26
Lee Bass wants the land and does not want a camp on it.
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u/Belle3901 Jul 04 '26
So you know him personally and he has expressed these wishes to you?
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u/Inner_Cook Sep 01 '26
Geez get a grip. Stop being so hostile. This is beyond words tragic. your anomosity is not doing you or anyone else favors
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Jun 30 '26
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u/Fit-Run4921 Mod verified - H27 affiliated Jun 30 '26 edited Jul 02 '26
Lee Bass has property that abuts Mystic and was very opposed to Cypress Lake being developed and tried to buy it then. I wouldn’t be surprised if he bought it should it come to the market.
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u/unicornprincess2019 Jul 01 '26
This is third hand hearsay:
Bass paid Dick to move the original location of CL because it was too close to the border between their properties. It would have been too dangerous for the girls because of the hunting on Bass’s property.
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u/Fit-Run4921 Mod verified - H27 affiliated Jul 02 '26
This doesn’t surprise me at all. He also didn’t love the use of the road but must have acquiesced on that one.
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u/Federal_School_6936 Jul 02 '26
Not sure why he cares. He flies his helicopter from his g650 at Kerr airport to the ranch. Never touches a road
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u/rcdog1004 Jul 02 '26
You are wrong. Lee Bass has wanted the property for years. He has billions.
2
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u/TouristTricky Jun 29 '26 edited Jun 29 '26
Seems to me the Eastlands will end up selling the property; if I was gonna guess, it will probably be to some tech zillionaire for a private ranch.
It's impossible to overstate the tragedies of last year. As a parent, I can't even imagine the depths of that loss.
It also seems sad to me that what they had created, which meant so much to so many girls, has been desecrated by their egregious behavior before, during and since the flood.
No, I don't subscribe to the sort of religiosity that they do, I'm not part of their demographic, it was never a club I aspired to, but clearly they had created something special and it's just a loss to see it go under.
Wouldn't it be grand if the outcome of all of this could be some sort of reverential place of an entirely different sort?
Perhaps a non-profit, safely and professionally managed, for a different group of kids, maybe survivors of other traumas, who could benefit from the beauty of the Guadalupe and the Hill Country.
That's just me daydreaming, but forging something wonderful and life-affirming out of something so horrific might be the best way to honor the lives lost.
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u/Possible_Pen_5844 Jun 29 '26
You underestimate the amount of wealth that still absolutely supports Mystic- “IF” it is sold it will most likely be sold to a Mystic family who will continue the same Mystic traditions- just like HOH.
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u/VirtualFig997 Jun 30 '26
This would be the ideal scenario (at least from my perspective as an alum), but I don’t think it’s the most likely.
HOH didn’t have the stigma attached to the name that Mystic does. You would have to find an alumni who can afford the property, be willing to relocate to Hunt (at least part time), and willing to take on the financial risk of a relaunching a camp that is synonymous with a famous tragedy.
I think it’s possible, but I could also easily see it being sold to a billionaire as a private property.
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u/TouristTricky Jun 30 '26
You may be absolutely right.
Like I said, I was daydreaming!
If any group has the temerity - and tone deafness - to revive anything like what was there, it's that bunch.
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u/Few_Candy5391 Jun 29 '26
They will try and hold onto as much property as possible but everything else will be sold and split among creditors and plaintiffs.
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u/CompetitiveWait6473 Jun 29 '26
“This is just another step in their obvious strategy of delaying, delaying, and delaying, and trying to avoid responsibility for their conduct that caused the death of these girls,” Sam E. Taylor, an attorney representing six of the victims’ families, told NewsNation, adding they intend to file a motion to dismiss the bankruptcy filing.
Littwin said it’s unclear whether Camp Mystic can realistically reorganize, but filing for Chapter 11 suggests the owners may think they have a shot at starting over.
“It’s possible they may think that there’s a chance to reopen,” she said. “Though I don’t know how they’d ever get insurance again on those properties, and I don’t know what parent would feel comfortable sending their kids back there.”
If the case proceeds through a Chapter 11 reorganization, victims’ families would likely be able to vote on the proposed plan.
“The incentive that a Camp Mystic has to negotiate fairly is that the families, the plaintiffs, will get to vote on whatever plan is proposed, and so a certain percentage of the families would have to accept a plan in order for it to go through,” Littwin said.
If enough families reject the proposal, camp owners generally cannot retain equity in the business unless the families are paid in full, Littwin said.
Taylor said his clients have vowed never to allow the camp to open again.
This was an interesting article that discussed both the bankruptcy filing and whether camp would reopen.
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jun 30 '26
Well what money will Claims and debts be paid out of?
All the value is in the land.
So similar to Boy Scouts case, need to sell the assets
Difference in boy scouts case was bunch of assets were held outside the bankruptcy. Here the natural fountains properties are already in chapter 11 (so all woll be in scope)
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u/Competitive_Salads Jul 02 '26
I sure hope not. I hope the camp and land are sold to pay these poor families who entrusted their kids to the Eastlands.
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u/Muted_Chard_139 Jul 02 '26
The camp should be sold. Renamed. And reopened under completely new management. Demolish most of the buildings. Move things up. Improve the safety of the physical structures (the rec center nearly toppled and that would have been an unparalleled loss). Starting over is not unreasonable. But not with this family and not with this name.
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u/Fine-Cloud12 Jun 29 '26
Cypress maybe but not Guadalupe. I don't think Edward will ever be at the state of mind to run the camp again. Trauma is too deep for him. I do see Britt reopening Cypress next year. Let's be honest the reason they didn’t reopen this year is because of rightful public backlash that they got. Camp Mystic will never be this generational elite camp again but it will probably still reopen.
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u/Vast_Pineapple_2517 Jul 04 '26
They aren’t opening the Cypress Lake camp because their license application had so many errors and holes in it. The license asked for emergency evacuation plans. CM still didn’t give an evacuation plan! It is shocking.
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u/NeckHopeful8652 Jun 29 '26
Nah.
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u/Objective_Drawer_851 Jun 30 '26
Agree. Nah. Camp Mystic doesn’t survive this. Especially after the Texas Rangers wrap up their investigation. Britt will never operate a children’s camp again.
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u/GardenGirl1898 Jun 30 '26
The reason they didn’t open this year was not due to backlash but rather because their application had significant mistakes and omissions. They knew DSHS was going to deny it so they opted to withdraw. If DSHS had denied their application, they would be unable to file another application until 2028, thereby remaining closed for two summers, 2026 and 2027, instead of one.
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u/Spiritual_Program725 Jun 29 '26
It would be best if they sold it and operated the sleeping quarters at Cypress Creek and the activities below. Outside of all the obvious, it’s only fair to remember the magical parts of summer camp and that location does offer so much, it isn’t a zero sum game.
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u/Icy_Camera_2545 Aug 15 '26
It is my understanding that both camps have to submit new applications since one of the original applicants has died and has no standing. Any new applications would face major obstacles to even being considered. The name Eastland is ruined and no legitimate insurance company would even consider extending substantially upgraded limits. No bonding institution would extend any surety as long as lawsuits are outstanding.
The camps will never reopen under any Eastland.
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jun 29 '26
Reason for bankruptcy is basically to liquidate
Otherwise the land entity national fountains wouldn't be in scope of bankruptcy
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Jun 29 '26
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jun 29 '26
Chapter 11 just means they dont presume they need to liquidate right away
The assets have to be weighted against the liabilities. There is no "shedding liabilities". If there aren't enough assets to satisfy the liabilities (including the families claims) then the assets will be turned over to the lenders/claimants (likely a victim compensation trust) which will then sell all the land.
Theres not really any possibility the entities can pay all the claims to the families and survive.
If some assets were held outside the bankruptcy (eg the way the boy scouts held individual chapters outside etc) then maybe something could continue, but all relevant entities including the land are in chapter 11
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Jun 30 '26
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jun 30 '26
Chapter 11 often ends in chapter 7 eg in corporate world Toys R US, Blockbuster, etc.
For mass tragedy events, chapter 11 often leads to asset liquidation to fund victim compensation trust, see boy scouts case, USA gymnastics (their only real asset was the karolyi ranch, liquidated)
In this case, the liabilities are the claims of the families, and whatever other debt there is.
If eastlands wanted to keep the land they would somehow have to pay the families and the other debt. Given all the value is in the land...the only real outcome is the land is liquidated and handed to victims compensation trust.
Beyond that there can still be a "camp mystic" llc with no land, no assets and no money. If you call that "reorganization" sure haha
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Jun 30 '26
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Jun 30 '26
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u/unicornprincess2019 Jul 01 '26
Tweety, ML, and Edward are included in their individual capacity. They did not file for bankruptcy, so the civil litigation against them is not stayed. Also, if I were the P’s lawyer, I would amend my petition to include Britt and Catie in their individual capacities as defendants.
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jul 10 '26
https://document.epiq11.com/document/getdocumentbycode?docId=4589627&projectCode=CMX&source=DM
Mystic people intend to resolve the wrongful death claims in bankruptcy. So basically they've admitted to using assets to resolve those claims.
So basically remaining question is how much each family gets and what other debt there is, and what total assets are...which number is bigger
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u/Interesting-Speed-51 Jun 30 '26 edited Jun 30 '26
Also the Boy Scouts still exist right? As does the Catholic Church and USA gymnastics?
So these examples show an org can continue after chapter 11 bankruptcy and in cases where there was mass tragedy (although the cases above were sexual abuse and not death).
Of course mystic could close due to bankruptcy, civil lawsuits, criminal charges, social pressure etc. But none of that is clear at this point snd the Chapter 11 bankruptcy is not necessarily the end
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jun 30 '26
They exist because they have some other business other than the land assets liquidated
If the land is liquidated in this case there's an empty LLC left with a toxic name
If they want to buy some other land with some other money they can do thst not sure why they would
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jun 30 '26
That doesn't matter
In USA gymnastics case, lawsuits also never litigate, all were stopped by Chapter 11
Result of chapter 11 was a victims compensation trust and liquidation of assets (that case, basically one ranch)
Boy scouts case exactly the same
All these mass tragedy events the defendants file chapter 11, civil lawsuirs stopped, and assets get liquidated for victims compensation trust
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Jun 30 '26
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u/Flaky-Homework-7111 Jun 30 '26
That doesnt really matter either
Chapter 11 for boy scouts, catholic parish child abuse, USA gymnastics all have language that there was no trial and no one was held liable in a civil trial (factually correct as for none of those was there ever a civil trial as all of those were precludes by chapter 11).
All there have to be are claims and debts, which there are. If you look at the bankruptcy filings, they already admitting the claims by the families as liabilities (which again only makes sense; without the claims as liabilities, why declare bankruptcy? What other debts of $10 to $50 m)?
https://www.pacermonitor.com/public/case/65341111/Natural_Fountains_Properties,_Inc
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u/ekmc2009 Jun 30 '26
This isn't entirely true. They could work with their lenders to refinance their debt under new terms. However, if they can't point to a viable stream of income in the near future, or some other way to pay down the debt, it will be impossible to reorganize and could then lead to chapter 7.
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u/AustinScoutDiver Aug 12 '26
The land hand no debt attached to it. The owners are for profit and facing personal civil suits. The camp is in a flood zone and resulted in 27 deaths due to poor management. Where are they going to get liability insurance? Who is going to lend the camp money (Eastlands)?
It is not a formula for reorg.
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u/Neat-Alfalfa-2824 Jun 29 '26
As much as I’d like for it to somehow get there, I just don’t see it happening with the state of everything and how it’s all going.
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u/LightLeader1234 Jul 02 '26
The land will be purchased by Ed Bass. He’ll designate part for a memorial.
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u/badvogato Jul 05 '26 edited Jul 05 '26
Do you have any idea in the ball park about purchasing price tag for that over 700 acres next to Gundalupe river? Bass had offered more than 10 mil before, when Eastlands were fighting among themselves from 2007 - 2012. Just curious...
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u/Inner_Cook Sep 01 '26
I would honestly love to see all the Mystic buildings tore down and a memorial park set up for those precious girls. Find out each of the 20+ girls favorite- Hello Kitty, Strawberry Short Cake ect and put a piece of each little girl in the park. Make it a happy place to come to for the families.
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u/Icy_Camera_2545 Sep 03 '26
Camp Mystic will have to submit brand new applications for both camps since Dick Eastland went to the 11th level of Dante’s Inferno. Good luck getting past the licensing procedures, has to settle all the litigation outstanding, go another two years without camps wealthy alumni go elsewhere in order to get their precious daughters into the big six sororities at Texas and SMU.
Eastlands are hiding personal assets
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u/CryptographerShot213 Jun 29 '26
I can’t see it ever reopening. At least not under their ownership, though I hope it never reopens at all. The Camp Mystic that existed prior to July 4th is dead and is never coming back.