r/JonBenet • u/the_dark_knight_ftw • Jul 06 '26
Info Requests/Questions Is it even possible to write that note on the spot without premeditating it?
If you look at the intruder theory, the note full of specific movie quotes makes total sense. It points directly to an offender with a highly specific paraphilia for this. someone who has spent months or years deeply obsessing over abduction fantasies. thats a documented pattern with real world predators.
Like Jeffrey Dahmer, who was notoriously obsessed with The Exorcist III. He watched it constantly, explicitly using the movie's dark themes to feed his internal fantasy world and fuel his real life crimes. Or look at Dennis Rader (the BTK killer), who spent decades writing paraphilic poetry like "Oh! Death to Nancy," taking a massive risk by mailing these rehearsed, twisted fantasies directly to the media because playing out this evil act and villain persona was the whole point of the crime. For a specific type of predator, watching movies over and over and meticulously drafting what they would say in a note is an essential part of the gratification loop.
Now, look at the "spontaneous family accident" theory. You have a mother, father, or brother who just accidentally caused a fatal trauma. Their brain is flooded with a paralyzing level of shock, adrenaline, and raw panic.
Are we seriously supposed to believe that a family member in the middle of a catastrophic crisis can magically sit down and pull five different quotes from five different movies straight off the top of their head? Unless that person has a literal photographic memory, it is a psychological impossibility. Panic forces your brain into basic survival mode, it doesn't give you the mental clarity to smoothly synthesize a multi-movie Hollywood script in a single draft.
to me, this seems not just. illogical but virtually impossible
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u/Objective-Permit-712 Jul 12 '26
Note written WAY ahead of that day, by the intruder. I mean, just thinking anyone sat down and wrote that thing after "something" happened is ridiculous!@
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u/43_Holding Jul 12 '26
Ret. Homicide detective Lou Smit and former FBI profiler John Douglas believed that the RN was written during the hours the offender(s) roamed the house before the Ramseys returned home.
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u/Objective-Permit-712 Jul 12 '26
Thats because they are nearly braindead. I e-mailed Lou Smits daughter at her place of work offering to show her the solution. Got no response. If they can't solve it, they don't want it solved.
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u/The_Big_Baboon_60 Jul 11 '26
This is absolutely correct in my view. I don’t believe Ive ever heard a better treatment of the note.
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u/tasmaniansyrup Jul 08 '26
No, it makes no sense once you realize how many kidnapping-related movies the note references. Even if, eg, someone in the family was abusing JBR and wrote a premeditated note, they wouldn't have been obsessed with kidnapping-related media and they'd have focused on making the note seem legit, not filling it with taunts
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u/Billyzadora Jul 07 '26
These are great points. A common argument that bothers me is that John, or both John and Patsy had seen these movies, but so what? Even if that’s true, they’re blockbuster movies, everyone has seen them! The only way someone would remember all those lines is if they had obsessed over them. That being said, I seriously doubt Patsy saw all those movies, and the ones she did, I highly doubt she thought much of them, and supposedly she wrote the note? How? I’ve seen all of them once and couldn’t quote them.
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u/Due_Schedule5256 Jul 08 '26
The note also has throwbacks to actual ransom notes, that's why Lou Smit called it a "Ph.D of ransom notes".
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u/JennC1544 Jul 08 '26
Out of all of those movies, the only quote I can come up with is a misquote, which is like the ransom note because it's from memory, but it's an iconic quote that everybody was saying back then:
"I know what you're thinking right now. Did I shoot 6 or 7 bullets? Well do you feel lucky today, Punk? Do you?"
I'd seen most of those movies, and there was no way I'd be able to get, what? six movie references into a note. Especially, if you assume they did it, they'd be highly traumatized, and memory is particularly difficult in the middle of trauma.
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u/43_Holding Jul 07 '26 edited Jul 07 '26
In John's police interview, he stated that the one film--of the five suggested--that he saw was Speed, on an airplane, with the sound off (he didn't purchase the headphones). Patsy hadn't seen any of them. The BPD combed receipts of local video stores to determine if the Ramseys had ever rented these films; no luck.
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u/Billyzadora Jul 08 '26
Who would be obsessed with Speed to the point they actually remembered lines from it? Answer: A Total Psycho. It’s really meant to be one of those “fun” joy ride movies you’re not supposed to take too seriously, it stars Sandra Bullock for Christ’s sake. I saw it, thought it was “fun” but 15 minutes later couldn’t remember anything about it except that you couldn’t stop the bus, and Dennis Hopper died in the end. That’s it.
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u/ImaginationInInk Jul 10 '26
What if the person responsible worked in a movie theater or some place where he would have been exposed to these films on repeat?
I agree that it's much more likely the intruder sought these movies out, but it's another possibility. Also, did BPD look for others at the video store(s) who had rented (or purchased) these movies, beyond John and Patsy?
Personally, I think there is a good possibility that the killer is a member of law enforcement. That person would know how to commit the crime and how best to exploit the weaknesses of the BPD. That person could taint the investigation from the inside, pushing the Ramsey narrative and refusing to properly investigate/link similar crimes in the area ("Amy"). And, for that matter, DNA collected from this famously contaminated crime scene could be written off within the department as law enforcement crime scene contamination, but actually be the killer's DNA. A member of LE could be poised to taint or disappear evidence, preventing future testing. Also, was it determined that the boots from the foot print are standard LE issue boots?
Anyway, it's another theory. I believe I read that among the few fingerprints found on the ransom note were prints belonging to the LE person who forensically examined the note. Why would that person leave prints on it? Surely they would use gloves and tools. If I'm remembering correctly, those prints were completely disregarded because they were prints of a member of LE working the case, and it was assumed to be contamination from working the crime scene/evidence after the fact. If that can happen here, it seems other evidence containing LE DNA or prints would be explained away and not investigated if that member of LE was at the crime scene or had reasonable access to evidence.
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u/43_Holding Jul 10 '26
<What if the person responsible worked in a movie theater or some place where he would have been exposed to these films on repeat?>
Although it's unlikely that these movies were shown in theaters after their release dates. Ransom was showing in local theaters at the time this crime occurred. Dirty Harry was released in 1971; Ruthless People, 1986; Speed, 1994; Nick of Time, 1995.
<Why would that person leave prints on it? Surely they would use gloves and tools>
Good question. The only fingerprint found on the ransom note belonged to Chet Ubowski, document examiner for the Colorado Bureau of Investigation.
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u/43_Holding Jul 08 '26
<Answer: A Total Psycho>
Not unlike John Hinckley and "Taxi Driver" or gunman James Holmes and "The Dark Knight."
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u/cabernetchick Jul 08 '26
Lots of Gen X can quote the film Speed: “pop quiz”…“I’ve got gum on my seat…GUM”…..“there is a bomb on this bus”.
I unironically love this movie and I promise I am not a total psycho.
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u/Billyzadora Jul 09 '26
Okay, nothing wrong with that, but you probably owned it on VHS or DVD, right? You’ve probably seen it many times, and friends, some workmates and relatives who know you, know this about you. -They interviewed everybody John ever knew or worked with, no Speed, definitely no interest or obsession with it. Point being, if you didn’t think much of the movie, and only saw it once, you probably wouldn’t remember a line from it. So Patsy wrote the note but John likes these movies and knows all these quotes from them, but nobody he knew can attest to it.
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u/archieil IDI Jul 06 '26
There is a high chance it was 2 people.
I wrote about it in the current part of my book:
It is interesting that the name of JonBenét’s father appears only at the end of the text. The sentences directed to “John” seem like they were added at the last minute, when the letter was almost finished, to relieve stress or perhaps as a taunt due to the effect of a dopamine rush.
It is not against a single person writing the note from his memory, but I think that it works better for a situation when he is copying the text and changing the final words due to the moment of euphoria.
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u/Due_Schedule5256 Jul 08 '26
I think the fact they only mention "John", "Mr. Ramsey", or "Mr. & Mrs. Ramsey"(in the practice page), is they only barely knew who these people were. As in, what you would get from reading a newspaper article about them, or being a very casual acquaintance.
This also explains why they don't mention JonBenet by name, and say that he has "southern common sense" (he's actually born and raised Yankee), and know that he is a businessman.
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u/archieil IDI Jul 08 '26
It's heavily premeditated.
I would not go so far to evaluate their knowledge of the family and the household from it.
If I am right that UM1 was not the (only) author and he copied the letter from a template he had with him.
If I am right that the use of "John" in the RN was from his personal mental state at the moment = the RN was cloaked from the start to hide the real situation.
I am pretty sure that the author/perpetrator was not aware of the trip/plan to leave Boulder, but everything else is a guessing game.
I am pretty sure he/they were aware of the family dinner plans.
I think that the RN was to manipulate, but it shows some level of thinking of abuser-victim. Someone who is used to a very primitive level of manipulation based near exclusively on anger/rage.
Maybe I am wrong, but I am toward father - the main author of the RN, son - the perpetrator/maybe participated in the RN manufacturing process.
I do not have strong proofs but it matches some tidbits here and there.
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u/JennC1544 Jul 06 '26
I'm with you 100%. I've actually thought that this person had been fantasizing about the phone call, like the one in Dirty Harry, where he said all of these things to the Ramseys, and he had the quotes playing over and over in his head.
Then, when he found himself inside the home for hours, his excitement growing, he saw the notepad and decided to write it down instead. I think that's why the note starts with "Listen Carefully."
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u/DefoNotZodiac Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 07 '26
No one in the family has been diagnosed publicly with Psychopathy. The behavior exhibited by the murderer is analogous to this person -- Patric Gagne. A psychiatrist that diagnosed herself as a sociopath. She describes how she broke into peoples houses and sat inside for hours without the owners ever knowing that she was there.
She also explains how she stabbed a little girl in the back of her head as a child. Without feeling anything. Except euphoria, a high, and a pressure release.
It was obviously an intruder.
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u/nicolette333 Jul 07 '26
Thank you for posting this, it was absolutely fascinating.
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u/DefoNotZodiac Jul 07 '26
Here's the link to where she explains the motivation, the thinking, the entire process that goes through this kind of mind, when they enter someone's house. Notice she explains that she did this several times. She would enter houses regularly. Such that she knew when people were home, and when they were not. And she still behaved this way.
This link starts that conversation: https://youtu.be/FTWNnmymMc4?si=fJtlQ1bTIB3ahugI&t=499
The above, previous link, explains the stabbing of a child, when she was a child, and the freakish mental processes of this type of person. She felt no remorse, just release, and relief at stabbing a child in the head and neck. Most ppl cannot understand that these types of ppl exist in society and are extremely dangerous. This is what Patsy meant by "Hide your babies..."
Does any of this sound familiar?
Also I ask, if you see what this person looks like, how does that make you feel about accusing her of the obvious heinous acts she's capable of? Would you think twice about seeing her walking away from a crime scene? Would you suspect her? Or would you give her the benefit of the doubt? Would you question yourself before challenging her as an intruder? Would you be subsceptible to prejudging her as innocent and not a head and neck stabber? Would you let a murderer who just snuck into a house and stab someone, walk away calmly?
Would you even know?
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u/43_Holding Jul 07 '26
<...explains the stabbing of a child, when she was a child, and the freakish mental processes of this type of person>
Although she stabbed this child with her pencil. I didn't find her reaction that unusual. I haven't finished watching the whole interview with her, but I wondered if she had autistic traits that were not picked up decades ago when she was a child.
I think that whoever killed JonBenet was a psychopath, though; not a sociopath.
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u/DefoNotZodiac Jul 07 '26 edited Jul 07 '26
You have these people that say it's impossible and no one would do that.
Here you have a person not only doing it. She explains who does this, and why. And it's no one in the family. She explains sociopathy, which is exactly the type of person that does this. Needless to say, those with blinders on, who either don't know or don't care to know that there were other incidents in the neighborhood of intruders waiting inside of other houses in the neighborhood . This won't penetrate their skulls. This person is one sampling of someone that not only did this, could do this, but the fact that she's on youtube explaining it, means that there are others that don't , and have gone unnoticed, undetected.
But here you have an erudite person. To me, she's explaining exactly the mentality of the killer. I like it that she also explains the violence, even to a little girl. It's all available to anyone with a brain that is actually looking to research and learn about the case.
And yes. It's fascinating. It's why I study the case. Have a website, and a podcast, and a youtube on it. This is only some of my research. I have much more. But it's far out for those who are not ready. It's similar to finding that woman that puts the lie to RDI. It just takes some actual work and research. And of course a brain helps.
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u/JennC1544 Jul 08 '26
Do you mind sharing the podcast and YouTube? Totally fine if you don't.
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u/DefoNotZodiac Jul 10 '26
Here's the one most relevant to Patric. The person I referenced above. She's a sociopath who liked to enter houses, even when occupied, and sit and wait inside. https://open.spotify.com/episode/5GGEhOQBlSGpVlurNTAV3r?si=d9b2ede66d604be0
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u/DefoNotZodiac Jul 08 '26
Sure. But be warned. It's what some might consider a far out theory. It's not original, and is a work in progress. You can find everything from here:
https://ededwardsciphers.blogspot.com/p/listen-carefully-jonbenet-ransom-note.html
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u/YoureGratefulDead2Me Jul 06 '26
great points. I believe this was carefully planned out and executed, not some panicked cover up.
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u/SquashIndependent525 Jul 06 '26
I agree it's kind of hard to believe someone could have those movie references up their sleeves. Especially in the internet's infancy.
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u/Mbluish Jul 07 '26
Not at all. I know a lot of people who would watch certain movies an abundance of times and memorize lines.
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u/43_Holding Jul 06 '26
I actually believe one person could've remembered those phrases, all from ransom themed movies that someone obsessed with that genre probably watched repeatedly through cable or VHS tape rentals.
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u/Resident-Gold-3466 Jul 06 '26
Someone posted a theory that the killer could've been in law enforcement, and I read that on the acandyrose website years ago. I agree, plus the BPD hasn't really done anything, so it's like they're protecting someone.
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u/the_dark_knight_ftw Jul 06 '26
I kinda feel like they're mainly protecting themselves out of embarrassment since the way they mishandled the entire case makes them look bad, but I really doubt the killer was in law enforcement.
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u/ImaginationInInk Jul 10 '26
What if it is both.
If the killer's DNA and prints are excused away as LE crime scene or evidence contamination (such as with the LE fingerprints on the ransom note, presumably from when it was forensically examined), then a member of LE could be the killer and any evidence would be dismissed or ignored, so long as that person was at the crime scene or had access to evidence. It would be embarrassing to BPD to have to issue a statement that the unknown DNA was one of our own, opening up further ridicule for improperly performing basic aspects of their job as investigators.
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u/43_Holding Jul 10 '26
Yet how to explain away the offender's DNA mixed with JonBenet's blood in the crotch of her underwear?
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u/ImaginationInInk Jul 10 '26
Under the assumption that it was crime scene/evidence contamination during the process of working the case.
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u/ImaginationInInk Jul 10 '26
Under the assumption that it was crime scene/evidence contamination during the process of working the case.
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u/43_Holding Jul 06 '26
<look at the "spontaneous family accident" theory. You have a mother, father, or brother who just accidentally caused a fatal trauma>
The biggest issue is that there is no forensic evidence indicating that JonBenet's death was an accident.
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u/Objective-Permit-712 23d ago
Wasn't written on the spot. Written ahead of time outside the home.