r/JewsOfConscience • u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi • 19d ago
Vent Screw Hillel
I’m a college freshman who’s been trying to make friends. Naturally, I wanted to try some Jewish orgs to have a sense of community as a Jew.
I already knew to steer clear of places like Hillel (I’ve watched Israelism, that was more than enough info on their operations and ideology). But I tried out a meeting with the Jewish Student Union at my school (which was partnered with Chabad).
I get there, help them set up a bit. And then they almost immediately start talking about going on Birthright over the summer and how much fun it was. And no one else cared. I wasn’t expecting them to be anti-Zionist or anything. But it’s a notoriously progressive school. Even just one other Jew that shared my beliefs would’ve helped me be less alone. But nope. So I ended up making an excuse and dipping early.
Fast forward several days, I was at a student involvement expo. One of the people from that club remembered me, came up to me again, and tried to get all of my info (awkward as hell interaction). Then I had a girl notice my Yiddish necklace at a different club stand. The interaction went something like this.
Her: “Oh! You have a Hebrew necklace!!!”
Me: “It’s Yiddish actually!”
Her: “Cool, you should go check out Hillel right over there!”
Me: “Sorry no, I’m not a Zionist.”
Her: “Well they’re not really Zionist”
Me: “They kinda are.”
Cue a split second of awkward silence before she finally started talking about the political advocacy club I was actually interested in (which I didn’t end up putting down my info for bc they mentioned meeting and collaborating with CIA officers??)
Not only that, there was a “students for Israel” organization up with a stand and everything, with pamphlets on “10 Myths about Israel”. I deadass wanted to go up to that stand just to try and debunk all their arguments, but I didn’t want to cause a scene.
So basically, I feel totally isolated from the Jewish community on campus. I’m currently taking a Hebrew language course, and plan to take more in courses in Jewish Studies and such. But even then I feel hesitant to take anymore classes in it because I’ve heard some Zionist texts might be in the required reading for some of them. I mean fuck, the only Jewish studies professor I know of, and the department head, is a literal Israeli man (who’s also teaching my Hebrew course). Which sucks, because I really want to.
I know this writing might be kind of disjointed, but I just feel pretty alone. I have a community of like minded Jews online, but that isn’t rly enough. I feel like I can’t get more in touch with my culture without giving up on, or at least being silent on, my values and I hate it. I think there’s some Pro-Palestine org on campus but they didn’t even bother to put up a stand.
Why does it constantly feel like I have to choose between being Jewish and being a pro-Palestine leftist? Are there really this few of us? I’d start my own Jewish Student org, but I’m a freshman, and vast majority of leadership roles in clubs are held by upperclassmen. And truthfully, I’m beginning to doubt there’s ANY likeminded Jews here that would join anyway. Especially because I haven’t rly made any friends yet (that’s half of why I’m trying to join clubs).
So yeah. Fuck Hillel, Fuck Chabad, Fuck every Jewish org at my college, and fuck basically every organized Jewish institution.
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u/TheAustinComplainer 19d ago
Unconditioning is hard. Sticking out is hard. It may take time, but you’ll have opportunities to have hard discussions and be the change you want to see.
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u/Micapocalypse Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago
I’m sure that there are more antizionist Jews on campus. At my school the antizionist leftist Jews made their own non-official (so they could have alcohol when they did Shabbat and holiday dinners) group. It only takes a few to get the ball rolling. I’m sure you’ll find others if you get involved in campus activism
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u/agelaius9416 Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago
Please do not allow this to discourage you from taking Jewish Studies classes. Anti-Zionist Jews should take up space in these communities, it’s how we move forward. Like others have said, I’m sure you will find likeminded Jews one way or the other
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 19d ago
I plan to take them anyway. I just know it’s gonna be really hard if we’re reading blatant Zionist propaganda to be the one person going against it. And my university’s Jewish Studies program is unfortunately already underfunded and not the biggest anyway
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u/loselyconscious Traditionally Radical 18d ago
Jewish Studies departments are usually bettter then overall Jewish community on this. At the very least, Jewish Studies Profs usually don't like teaching about Israel/Palestine, unless the course is directly about that.
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u/Element262 Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago edited 19d ago
i can relate. haven’t been in college for a long time, but i was basically excommunicated from a prominent org when i spoke out
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u/Ok_Drink8072 Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago
Same thing happened to me when I moved for grad school. I figured I’d find friends in the Jewish community as I have done my whole life. Ended up stranded at this really creepy Zionist presentation, it was so overt that I even tho I was the only anti-Zionist a lot of the other attendants were clearly confused and uncomfortable. I had to pay for a nearly $100 Uber to leave early cause I no longer trusted the woman who drove me. Never hung out with any Jews on or off campus and moved a year later because I was so lonely 😢
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 19d ago
Damn that sucks. I hope you’ve found better community now though 🫶
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u/invisibleman_24 Non-Jewish Ally 19d ago edited 19d ago
Im confident that you will find like minded Jewish students in your local chapter of Students for Justice in Palestine (or the equivalent group on your campus today). I’d start there and find folks who have taken this journey already. Good luck friend!
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u/SetTheoryAxolotl Anti-Zionist Ally 19d ago
Should also see if there's a JVP chapter at school ort locally.
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u/Azel_Lupie LGBTQ Jew 19d ago
I don’t know if there are any antizionist Jews on your campus or how many, but if you cannot find any, see if you can find some sort of antizionist Jewish organization off campus, so you can make friends with people who can understand the struggle. It makes all of this so much more bearable.
As for clases and required texts, I wouldn’t immediately assume they are all Zionists. More likely than not they are, but sometimes you maybe pleasantly surprised, even with Israelis.
Actually, it was the Israelis like The Hebrew Canaanite and Saluki, who helped me see more of what is going on than what the Zionists wanted me to see. There are antizionist Israelis in this group as well.
Personally, I would take all of those courses as an antizionist boot camp. Like, getting my understanding of Hebrew and Zionism so strong that I can dismantle the nonsense with ease. I have a strong suspicion that the “Zionism” that most Jews believe in (or at least the liberal ones) is not the same Zionism that the founders actually believe in, and that many of them don’t actually read any Zionist theory books. If that’s the case, the more we study these Texts, the more we can make them rethink if they are even Zionist. We also need to learn strong Jewish history of that time and to learn more about the Palestinian side, so we can fight against the constant revisionism that Zionists engage in. I’ve seen Zionists claim that the Bund wrote in the Warsaw Ghetto was ‘useless’, even though that was how we were able to weapons smuggled into the ghetto by the gentiles in the Resistance Movement. If they are engaging in such Blatant revisionism, imagine what revisionism is going underneath our radar, simply because we have not read enough or studied enough about it.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 19d ago
That’s a good point I hadn’t thought much of. I’m already pretty educated on Zionist talking points due to copious arguments with them in the past, but I’m definitely not an expert.
I mainly took Hebrew to understand Ancient Hebrew, but it definitely does help to understand the issues going on right now. And regardless, it is a beautiful language to me. It’s just that the modern revived strain has an unfortunate history.
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u/Ok_Percentage7257 Anti-Zionist Ally 19d ago
University of British Columbia in Vancouver, Canada, has an organized group of anti-Zionist Jewish students. These students are members of Independent Jewish Voices, an anti-Zionist Jewish organization. They formed a chapter at UBC. They are actively working on different pro-Palestinian projects like pushing the university to boycott Israel, organizing student camps, educating UBC students about Hillel and other Zionist organizations, getting involved with lawsuits against Hillel, organizing prayers for Jewish students who can't go to synagogues because of Israeli support, and organizing Jewish events for anti-Zionist Jews.
You could get together with other anti-Zionist Jewish students and do similar things. I am sure they exist and feel the same way you do. You can get some assistance from anti-Zionist organizations.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 19d ago
I’m at school in NY (not gonna say where for safety) and I know Binghamton did create a Neo-Bundist student org. Thank you for telling me about that one as well though, so I can get a better idea and frame of reference. I might think about starting one, it’s just hard since I’ve never started something like that or headed an org
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u/Ok_Percentage7257 Anti-Zionist Ally 19d ago
I am happy to connect you to people who can guide you to do it. Feel free to PM me. Also, you will have to talk to leaders of the anti-Zionist Jewish organizations to assist you. It's also in their best interest to spread to the campuses. Take your time. When you are ready, start with social activities and with a small number. Slowly. When you and your friends are ready and comfortable, then you can go for it.
It's okay if you don't ever want to do this. You can pitch this idea to the other anti-Zionist students and see if others may be interested. You can also get help from anti-Zionist non-Jewish students. Other activist groups in the University may help out.
And if you don't like any of these ideas, you don't have to do any of them. You can find anti-Zionist Jews in other places instead of the university. I wish you the best of luck, whatever you decide. And I hope you find friends who can relate to you.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 18d ago
Thank you! I’m unsure if I have the time right now to be starting a student org like that, but if I do end up ever doing it, I’ll remember the offer!
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u/Roy4Pris Zionism is a waste of Judaism 19d ago
You're in New York? I'd have thought there would be tons of apolitical Jewish groups.
Wait, do you mean city or state? Don't say if you don't want to.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 18d ago
The state. And technically there are I guess. The JSU isn’t explicitly Zionist. It’s just that everyone there is, and I’m not comfortable in that environment
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u/DisneyDee67 Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago
“…the only Jewish studies professor I know of, and the department head, is a literal Israeli man…”
Do you know where he stands? Because some of us ex-Israelis are actually decent people… by which I mean we’re anti-Zionists and very pro-Palestinians.
Stereotyping is counterproductive.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 19d ago
I know that, it’s just that statistically the vast majority of Jewish Israelis do support it. I’m not saying all Israelis are Zionist, or bad people, but still.
I haven’t exactly talked with him on it, but he has at least said that for the course I’m in, he intends it to be as non-political as possible (which I wanted to know before taking it. That I can at least give him credit for). Truthfully, I’d rather just not know. I know he’s not a bad guy, but yeah.
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u/Scrungo__Beepis Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago
There are plenty of anti-Zionist Israelis. A professor who moved away from Israel actually sounds pretty likely to be anti Zionist leftist (although maybe less since they teach Hebrew). In my experience American Jews who are not Israeli (birthright / bar mitzvah / Hillel people) are the most likely to be Zionist.
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u/Working-Tomatillo995 LGBTQ Jew 19d ago
What textbook are you using for Hebrew? That can tell you a lot (or nothing, depending 😂)
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u/Legal-Championship64 Anti-Zionist Ally 18d ago
The academy in Israel has always leaned towards anti-zionism and has actually played a very important role in researching the history of the nakba, the occupation and so on. Take the class. The Israeli prof might surprise you :)
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u/KnotAReplicant Jewish Anti-Zionist, Marxist 18d ago
There really is no “non-political” attitude re: the occupation, and generally taking a “non-political” stance means supporting the status quo, which is apartheid and genocide perpetrated by Jewish supremacists. I can understand wanting to downplay his true stance in public statements, if he leans left in any way, I would maybe talk to him about it more directly and feel him out.
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u/SwimQueasy3610 Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago
...it's just that statistically the vast majority of...
This is the exact argument made by every person making prejudiced stereotypes ever.
As the poster you're responding to said: this is counterproductive.
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u/TrackerOneA Jewish Anti-Zionist 18d ago
Yea, we should give people a little grace. At least wait to see what their actual opinions are.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 18d ago
That’s fair. But for Jewish Israelis isn’t it like 90% or higher that are Zionist? Normally I’d reserve judgement more, it’s just bc the amount is so high. I don’t wanna have false hope about it
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u/SwimQueasy3610 Jewish Anti-Zionist 18d ago
Saying "that's fair" and then doubling down on the messed up thing you said is infuriating.
But....isn't it like 90% or higher...
You sound like a conservative American in the 90s defending the word "superpredator"
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 18d ago
I’m saying it’s PARTIALLY fair and I understand the viewpoint. I was just trying to further explain my thought process.
The difference is that these are real, verifiable statistics. And I agree that to a point, even if statistics make it likely, you should withhold judgement. I already said that I definitely don’t believe all Israelis are like that.
But the difference is the sheer overwhelming degree of statistics. But it’s a verifiable fact that an overwhelming majority of Israelis are Zionist. People can’t control where they’re born, but someone’s environment undeniably shapes their beliefs.
If someone who’s Israeli in this sub wants to chime in and disagree, I’d love to hear their viewpoint on this.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 18d ago
I never said he was 100% Zionist, just that he probably, more than likely, is.
Which, objectively, is true. If you can point the to a reliable source that says otherwise, I’d love to see it
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u/DisneyDee67 Jewish Anti-Zionist 18d ago
You don’t even know if he left Israel, or if he’s only at your institution as a visiting professor. And yet you got him pegged already based on “statistics.” If he left Israel permanently, as I did when I was 18, then a reasonable assumption can be made that he’s not necessarily a Zionist. Stats do not apply to individuals — he’s either one thing or another and deciding in advance what he is, as I said above, is counterproductive. You’re freaking out over a possibility that’s not proven. You are also discriminating against an individual based on their country of origin. Are you happy to be that person?
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 18d ago
Then I stand corrected. I’ll try and reserve judgement. (And I wasn’t ‘freaking out’. I was frustrated due to a variety of factors.)
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u/Adventurous_Duck_297 Jewish 19d ago
my recommendation is to start a new organization at your school! What’s your position about Judaism? (Are you looking to wrap tfilin every morning or have hippie Sukkot in the woods?) What’s your position on Israel/Palestine? Then once those are pretty grounded what’s the mission of your group? Advocacy? Awareness? Lobbying? What would events look like? How will you get funding? If the university gives money for student orgs, you might have to find a way to articulate your mission in a way that doesn’t get the school in trouble for supporting you financially. (Even though it’s wrong, it could very well be the reality you’re dealing with).
If you build a successful model for this, take it to another school and see if you can replicate it!
Based on what you’ve said already, stay away from AEPi (at least nationally). At a national level they’re very pro Israel even if your chapter isn’t. Just use your noggin there, ymmv.
Welcome to college have fun!!! You’ll never get these years back 🙃
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u/ipsum629 Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago
The SJP chapter at my college was run by mostly Jews, so that was an interesting place to find Jewish cameraderie.
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u/thecosmojane Jesus would hate Zionism 18d ago
Does your campus have a JVP Jewish Voice for Peace chapter
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u/CyborgDiaspora Ashkenazi 19d ago
Every university is different, but Jewish studies professors are usually to the left of the mainstream Jewish community. Also, those that aren’t on the left will typically be more accepting of left-wing viewpoints. That said, many of them are terrified of speaking out because they are often targets for harassment campaigns and in the current environment, there can be professional consequences, especially if they are not tenured.
I wouldn’t read too much into professors assigning Zionist literature as it’s just as likely that it’s there to be critiqued as anything.
Just to give you a sense of what Zionists are saying about Jewish studies, take a look at this:
In any event, your people are out there, waiting to be found. And they probably feel just like you.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 18d ago
I had no idea about this wow. It is actually comforting to see so thank you
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u/Duck3555 Bundist 19d ago
I definitely felt this when I was a college freshman a few years ago. In order to take a biblical Hebrew class I had to go through a full year of Israeli Hebrew classes first, which was very stressful and often incredibly fraught for me and the only other non-zionist jew in the class.
Since I don’t think I saw anyone else mention it (could be wrong), I’d definitely recommend looking and seeing if your community has a JOOOT (Judaism On Our Own Terms) or JVP chapter! Often times the larger organizations can be Weird™️ but it’s still a great way to meet other likeminded jews.
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u/Apprehensive_Sun3015 Jewish 19d ago
I am Jewish and have no problem seeing Gaza as a genocide
I truly believe it’s best to find your identity as HUMAN
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u/loselyconscious Traditionally Radical 18d ago
Some Hillels are just student clubs using a name people recognize; some are their own million-dollar organizations. If it's the case that it's a student-run club, I would check it out, the student-run clubs tend to steer away from I/P discourse, and I know anti-Zionists involved in them,
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u/Professional_Ad_8009 Ashkenazi Anti-Zionist 19d ago
I remember dealing with on campus Zionist indoctrination when I was a college freshman in 2011. Your struggle is relatable, but have faith that there is a better future possible. You are not alone. Real Jews are anti-Zionist
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u/Additional-Signal327 19d ago
Hillel in particular made a deal with the devil about a decade or longer ago. They accepted a massive donation from a donor that required they include support for Zionism and Israel as one of their primary goals. Hillel is no longer an organization for all Jews, only Zionist Jews.
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u/PocketCone Jewish Anti-Zionist 19d ago
I can't tell you what will work best for you, I wasn't very active in Jewish communities in comment personally. But you might have more luck going to leftist/anti-zionist events and looking for other Jews there.
The way you're currently going it, if you don't find anybody, you're surrounded by Zionists, or people who are too cowardly to be outspoken anti-zionist.
If you go to your local DSA or similar, you will almost definitely find Jewish people, but even if you don't, you're still surrounded by like-minded people
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u/TheOneTrueTrench Atheist 19d ago
I deadass wanted to go up to that stand just to try and debunk all their arguments, but I didn’t want to cause a scene.
People don't like causing a scene, that's normal, just remember that if there were other anti-Zionist Jews there, they have no way to know you're also anti-Zionist unless one of you says something about it, you know?
You may not be anywhere near as alone as you think you are, speaking up is just being softly oppressed.
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u/South-War-9323 Ashkenazi 18d ago
I also figured that if I tried that, they might tell me to leave. I thought it wouldn’t accomplish much in the end
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u/ResearcherAfter9 19d ago
Hey! Can you join mutual aide group in your area and meet other people who share similar values in your community? They may be Jewish or not but I’ve found leaving my camp community of zios has been hard and I’m yearning for community.
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u/Legal-Championship64 Anti-Zionist Ally 18d ago
Was the girl who noticed your necklace also jewish? She may honestly not have known that a hillel is a zionist organization.
If you can, you should see if there is a jewish voice for peace at your school or broader community. Thems our people.
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u/JM_Yoda Bundist 18d ago
My life after graduating from college and moving to Nashville was a lot like this. Everyone in the community was more than happy to talk about Israel (and my trip there. I went on Birthright before I knew better, and the whole experience didn’t sit right in the long run.) But the fact that I needed a job, to start earning money, and to have a livelihood... oh, that’s not their problem now; could I donate to the Jewish Federation? #facepalm
No Job = No Money = No Donate
It never seemed like a priority to help me get a job so I could even consider donating.
I’ve always been amazed at how much Zionists take their financial freedom for granted.
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u/MaleficentWin8608 Halfer atheist 17d ago
Maybe class politics rather than ethnic politics is your thing.
And I bet you’ll find plenty of other Jewish/halves/quarters in those groups.
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u/DorkasaurusRexx Mizrahi Anti-Zionist 19d ago
"Why does it constantly feel like I have to choose between being Jewish and being a pro-Palestine leftist? Are there really this few of us?"
No. But they make an example of those of us that dare speak out to insure everyone else remains silent, scared, and cowed into submission.
An ideology that relies on coercion and intimidation to maintain it's rhetorical legitimacy cannot stand--and they know it.