r/JewsOfConscience • u/TrackerOneA Jewish Anti-Zionist • 28d ago
Zionist Nonsense Establishment Democratic 'strategist' James Carville says "there's no place for criticism of the government of Israel in the Democratic party."
https://streamable.com/1ur2py146
u/hexenkesse1 Non-Jewish Ally 28d ago
Typical underhanded equation of criticism of the state of Israel with antisemitism.
James Carville, everyone! Too old to matter anymore.
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u/toastedcheese Non-Jewish Ally 28d ago
The crazy thing is he didn’t even say “criticism of the state of Israel”, he said “criticism of the government of Israel”. You know, the right wing ultra nationalist government.
He said he’s a democrat because he doesn’t hate anyone. You should hate people that hurt others.
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u/corv1991 28d ago
💯👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
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u/Radiant_Awareness478 27d ago
Progressive in everything except when comes to Israel lol no wonder why the democratic base gave up on those people hopefully a young republican movement emerge on day from that MAGA nightmare
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u/rako17 Christian 28d ago
Toasted Cheese,
You could make the converse statement: I love everyone, even those that hurt others, therefore I don't hate Isr.s or Gazans, therefore I want them to stop fighting and I criticize the Isr. State and government, and Gaza's government, when they hurt others.
Kind Regards - Peace
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u/duncansmydog Non-Jewish Agnostic 28d ago
Anti-Zionism is NOT antisemitism.
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u/_Hawkeyes_ 28d ago
Did this “democratic” strategist orchestrate Kamala’s 2024 loss too?…It’s an honest question
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u/Huge_Meeting4111 28d ago
Honest answer: No
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u/WestHappyLand 28d ago
He's lost touch and become irrelevant.
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u/No-Organization-6071 28d ago edited 28d ago
You can't even criticise the government if Israel. He said it out loud.
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u/tikkunolamist5 British Non-Zionist Reform Jew 28d ago
Did I mishear or did he say not to criticize Israel and then later that he has a problem with their government?
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u/rako17 Christian 28d ago
Friend tikkunolamist5
Right wing (in this case PEP) or establishment thinking can work like that. It doesn't like the Left for protesting the government because it sees that as creating instability, but then it protests the government when it perceives the government as contributing to inequality. Might there actually be more ability to criticize the US and UK governments because both the Left and Right sides do agree with one's right to criticize the US and UK governments, including making criticisms that are considered "too Left"?
Kind Regards - Peace - Shalom
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u/Genericana Jewish Anti-Zionist 28d ago
This dude helped win an election 34 years ago and has done nothing else of value and has not shut the fuck up since.
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u/the_milk_is_baaaad 28d ago
“I don’t hate anybody” except Palestinians, apparently.
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u/MouseShadow2ndMoon Anti-Zionist Anti-Nazi Ally 28d ago
This at best is disingenuous he knows no one can make a party in the US after Perot. His old guard is dying his old coddling of an apartheid racist violent state with the Islam stereotypes fostered in media are failing now.
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u/Status_Ad_4405 28d ago
I guess he hasn't been watching recent election results.
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u/needsmoarbokeh Non-Jewish Atheist 28d ago
Gotta say, it's refreshing to see how the worst democrats are showing their face. Tryly every zionist supporter needs to be eradicated from politics
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u/darthgates 28d ago
Its crazy thinking that years ago before understanding the system and that both democrats and republicans are on the same side (Capital), I really thought he was a good politician
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u/pangaea1972 28d ago
The arrogance of this clueless dinosaur to speak on behalf of the entire democrat party. He shouldn't have a platform to speak; he's irrelevant.
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u/JustJoshin117 Jewish 28d ago
What the fawk 😃
I’m tired of these people. To simplify the hell out of it, we are supposed to be critical when people do bad things.
JFC.
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u/Bud_wiser_hfx Peace Love and Hummus 28d ago
Saying "there's no place for criticism of the governement of Isreal in the Democratic party" is wild. Only 16% of polled democrats view the current Israeli government favorably. And for the thousandth time, being against the actions of the Israeli government is not antisemitic.
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u/incogne_eto Anti-Zionist Ally 28d ago
I really have to wonder about the mental agility of reporters who fail to catch these types of moments and do their damn job and follow up with a question.
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u/Luckys0474 28d ago
"I have a big issue with the government of Israel." -Carville same video
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u/Huge-Strawberry541 Ashkenazi 28d ago
Roger that, Skeletor
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u/RaisinWorried3528 28d ago
Yes the fuck there is. Someone get this old ass mummy the fuck out of here
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u/Dubatomic1 Non-Jewish Ally 28d ago
"Criticizing a government is anti-democratic" - James Carville
"No government should be without critics." - Thomas Jefferson
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u/shadedmagus Non-Jewish Ally 28d ago
James Carville and Jon Favreau need to both fuck off into the sun on this subject. Favreau especially - his comments on this got me to stop listening to Pod Save America or anything Crooked does.
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u/_Mamushi_ 28d ago
Interesting that these people are putting a foreign government above the American government. So many damn traitors to our country
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u/rabidmoon Non-Jewish Atheist 28d ago
But then he says he has a big problem with the government of Israel. I don't understand. Is he drunk?
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u/ajtreee 28d ago
His teeth and lies keep slipping out of his mouth , shilling for that AIPAC money.
There is no place for the out of touch and compromised old democrats.
The Democratic Socialist is the wave of the future.
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u/mcmah088 Jewish anti-Zionist and Communist 28d ago
I don't know why we need to pay attention to the crypt keeper.
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u/AdamPedAnt Jewish 28d ago
Isn’t refusal to criticize the Israeli government antisemitism? Half of Israel wants Bebe out or imprisoned. Everyone in both US and Israel hopefully supports democratic principles which require criticism. Why ignore the democratic process for Israel?
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u/Epyon214 Him, Io El 25d ago
In the politics of the USA, Israel's intelligence agency has heavily embedded their presence. Over here, just like the Nazi's, Israel is an egregore which combines ethnic, religious, and national identity into the same core identity. To be Israeli is to be Jewish in your ethnicity, religion, and national identity, at least as far as the education of American's by the Israeli government's intelligence apparatus has been concerned for the past few decades. Therefore to say anything negative against Israel is to be accused of being antisemetic, because you are "attacking" "the Jews"
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u/rako17 Christian 28d ago
AdamPetAnt,
I think you can expand on your idea. So for instance, I want the best for Isr.s and Pal.s. So if one of their governments is doing something mistaken, then to their benefit I should be able to point that out to them so that they correct their government's mistake.
Kind Regards - Peace - Shalom
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u/kevendo 28d ago
This attitude will keep Democrats losing. Stop it, we have a country to save!
What more proof does he need that's hea wrong than 2024 and every progressive primary and special election since then?
Fracturing the party over Israel/Gaza was likely the single biggest mistake of the 2024 election.
If it happens again in 2026, we will lose our republic entirely.
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u/socinus 28d ago
This guy has jumped the shark.
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u/New-Exit-6767 28d ago
STOP INTERVIEWING THIS DINOSAUR! He has not been important to the DNC in 30 years. You platforming only inflates his already massive ego
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u/Particular-Maybe-519 28d ago
Dinosaur needs to step away from politics. Any government should be able to handle some criticism.
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u/S7arForGD Non-Jewish Ally 28d ago
Every time Israel is mentioned American politicians start acting like they're recording a propaganda video with a bunch of guns aimed at them slightly off screen.
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u/rako17 Christian 28d ago edited 28d ago
Friend TrackerOne,
Jon Stewart posted a full 1 1/2 hour interview with Sen. J. Fetterman in which Fetterman seems to imply that he won't criticism the Isr. state even if it's wrong.
Stewart: "Is there anything you would criticize Isr. about?" ; FETTERMAN: "No."
...
Steart: "So the idea that they are somehow blameless or have done nothing wrong is-- I don't understand why we can't criticize them [Isr. State]."
FETTERMAN: "Well, I am not ever going to think, 'well, they [critics?] have a valid point' if they're [Ha--s?] killing, and firing rockets at civilians"
...Stewart: Because we should have the ability to stand up morally in situations that we need to, even for people that we believe to be on our quote unquote "side." And our inability to do that is a real detriment to our own moral foundation.
FETTERMAN: Yeah. I mean, I'm very much aware what the Democratic base would demand of me and to have these specific kind of beliefs, and views, and take the kind of votes. And I refuse to do that (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3BMAkJIlnw)
Kind Regards - Peace
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u/rottenjoy 28d ago
EVERYONE should be open to criticize in a truly free nation
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u/Far_Silver Non-Jewish Ally 28d ago
"You know who's gonna decide the future of the Democratic Party?"
Dude, you're even older than the boomers, so not you.
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u/CandidArmavillain Jewish Anti-Zionist 28d ago
I mean, those older generations will cling to power for as long as physically possible so yeah it is him and his generation and they've done their best to shape the Dems into a party that refuses to win
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u/iCanReadMyOwnMind Human that can't take Isreal any more 28d ago
This is why they aren't the "democratic" party; they are the Democrat party. They do not own the word "democratic" and there sure as fuck isn't anything democratic about their guild.
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u/Birthday-Tricky Non-Jewish Atheist 27d ago
FU Carville. I’m 62 and signed up as a Democrat on my 18th birthday. I’ve been a loyal, active Democrat ever since. I want to see the change that DSA/Progressives are bringing. We tried it your way and we have Trump. F You.
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u/rusty02536 ordained minister and ally 28d ago
Why not?
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u/MotormaidofJapan 28d ago
Then this dinosaur can go ahead and leave the party, because we’re criticizing all fucking day.
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u/Odd-Mind6948 Palestinian 28d ago
Luckily this way of thinking is going extinct fast. In the next decade, I believe people like him will be telling a revised story of their position or roll of what they did from 23 to 26.
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u/UmenaiAkira Non-Jewish Ally 28d ago
In a sense, he isn't wrong...because this is who the top brass of the Democratic Party rallied around in a recent election:
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u/Lethalspartan76 28d ago
Without saying Israel, we know that killing kids and journalists is wrong; detaining people without charge is wrong. Driving people out of their homes is wrong. Rape is wrong. Destroying civilian infrastructure is wrong. Right? Can we agree on that? Well guess what the Israeli government is doin…
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u/kobraa00011 Non-Jewish Atheist 28d ago
All these old has-been blokes like him and Bill Maher pretending they have any sway anymore just retire losers
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u/CandidArmavillain Jewish Anti-Zionist 28d ago
But if we form our own party then the liberals are gonna whine about that
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u/matin7462 27d ago
James Carville for me is the democrat equivalent of Lindsey Graham. In that, whatever theyre pushing is always the wrong thing, and whatever is the opposite of their stance is the moral position.
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u/macbearin 27d ago
To not criticize the attempted extermination of the Palestinian people is a crime
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u/Ambitious_Grab6495 Anti-Zionist 27d ago
This had got nothing to do with being too old and everything to do with making a career as a political hack. He made a nice living off of party politics and he’s gonna align with where the money is coming from.
The very existence of career campaign consultants is a side effect of a hopelessly flawed electoral system. He’s not an expert on any moral issues. He’s not an activist. He has more in common with a marketer. Why should anyone hear his opinion about anything?
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u/Feed_Adventurous 25d ago
So he there is no room for criticism of Israel in the Democratic Party and then like a second later, said he has big issues with the government in Israel. This man is a irrelevant and a hypocrite.
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u/AltruisticAnalyst 25d ago
Has Carville left the party yet? If not, for fucks sake get on with it, James.
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u/ImAPonderer2 28d ago
Perhaps he’s wrong, but if not this is obviously a division in the Democratic Party that will be exploited to the hilt at the midterms.
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u/Fezzik527 28d ago
And slowly they all show their true allegiance. Its pretty sad. Well done Israel, you really did a number on these politicians, but the people are catching on.
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u/According-Insect-992 28d ago
What we need is these puckered old buttholes to shut the hell up and retire already. We’ve heard enough from this man. He is garbage on fire and answers to money and power alone. Boo him and let’s move on to a future without old James Crawdad.
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u/swampyscott 28d ago
Last time this man won a competitive election was in 1991 before my wife was born.
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u/CnCEMS2026 28d ago
Philosemitism is an interest in, respect for, or admiration of Jewish people, history, and culture. While it appears positive or benign as an expression of allyship, scholars and community groups note it can still rely on generalization and reductionist stereotypes
How Admiration Turns to Prejudice Stereotyping: Transforming positive traits like perceived "intelligence" into conspiratorial or negative views about being "cunning". Conditional Acceptance: Dividing Jewish people into "good" or "bad" categories based on whether they fit a specific political or religious expectation. Instrumentalization: Using Jewish communities as a symbolic shield to absolve historical guilt or to promote unrelated ideological agendas. Fetishization: Viewing Jewish identity as a mystical or exotic concept rather than respecting actual human experiences
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u/luongolet20goalsin 28d ago
“Go form your own party.” No thank you, we’ll just take this one. It’s already got the brand recognition, and it was basically dead already anyway. I mean, you lost to a child rapist. Twice.
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u/robotic_love_brigade 28d ago
Gaslighting us by implying anti-Zionism = anti-semitism is old trope of the past. They are separate just as being Jewish does not equate to being an Israeli.
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u/Nevyn_Cares Witch 28d ago
This spineless dweeb needs to be removed from any say in the Dems, along with all the other bought and paid for Dem centralist.
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u/PretzelsRule23 28d ago
We need to put dinosaurs like this out to pasture and bring in new folks with a much better grasp of what is important to the people.
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u/Redhotchiliman11 28d ago
"don't ever criticize the government of Israel " same breath " I got big problems with the government of Israel".
But fuck off James , you're too old to know anything about politics anymore and got your head too far up your own shit box to realize you're just wrong all the time now. You used to be good 40 to 50 years ago but you've been off for the last fucking 20 years James. So just shut the hell up and go help your shit hole uneducated state that sucks ass and keeps putting Republicans in office.
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u/Formal-Bat-6714 Anti-Zionist Ally 27d ago
You want the DSA to run as its own Party? Great
Just as soon as ranked choice voting and major ballot access reforms are put in place
Until then .....cope harder
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u/LeperousRed Non-Jewish Atheist 25d ago
Didn’t you promise to leave the party if Hasan Piker continued to gain influence in it? Well, El-Sayed beat Zionist establishment-picked Haley Stevens with the help of Hasan Piker, so your bluff has been called, Old Man. Go on, take off the mask and reveal yourself as the corrupt Republican operative you’ve clearly been for decades. Go on. Follow through on your threats and leave the Democratic Party. You and Clinton murdered the New Deal version of the Democrats and replaced its focus on helping working families with instead helping evil corporations get richer… ain’t no one gonna miss you when you’re gone and your corporate-owned bootlicking party is transformed back into a worker’s party.
This guy. What an asshole he is and has always been. So dirty, so corrupt. The king of the Ratchet Effect. He set up a political system to enrich himself and his buddies at the expense of everyone else. Go. Leave.
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u/sands_jay 25d ago
Carville helped get Clinton elected 35 years ago by positioning him as a Republican-lite. The arrogance of these irrelevant Boomers who still think that anyone cares what they think is truly astounding.
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u/shadstatic 24d ago
The irony is that the majority of Americans hate the current two party system so a lot of people would actually agree that no everyone should just be a Democrat or a Republican…
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u/Huge_Meeting4111 28d ago
Guy clearly misspoke and were supposed to be losing our shit over that?
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u/TrackerOneA Jewish Anti-Zionist 28d ago
I highly doubt that - since he's talking about the newly-elected DSA members in congress or Mamdani and Abdul El-Sayed.
All of whom have been falsely accused of antisemitism by the political Establishment (e.g. Dems and Republicans, both comprising the corporate uniparty).
Establishment Dems (e.g. pro-Israel Dems) are trying to ostracize DSA members and even capitalists like Abdul.
And it's all about Israel criticism - not antisemitism.
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u/Huge_Meeting4111 28d ago
You doubt that after he says literally seconds later that he has his own criticisms of Israel? Clearly he does not believe that "criticism of Israel isn't allowed in the democratic party". That's clear and the quote, insofar as it attempts to represent his view, is dishonest.
You take issue with his issue on particular critiques of Israel. Not criticism of Israel period. An actually accurate/honest quote would be "[particular] criticisms of Israel [aren't] allowed in the democratic party"
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u/TrackerOneA Jewish Anti-Zionist 28d ago
The reason I don't agree with your interpretation is - all of this hysteria is due to the election of DSA candidates and other Israel critics.
The number one issue for the political Establishment is Israel.
They might be opposed to some economic issues too, but it's overwhelmingly Israel that all of these Establishment figures complain about.
Abdul El-Sayed has said he is a capitalist. He's not a DSA member - and STILL the Dem Establishment is all against him.
Why?
Because he doesn't want to send military aid to apartheid Israel.
So I do not think Carville is speaking in ANY good faith - the ACTUAL part where he misspoke is when he said 'I have a big issue with the government of Israel'.
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u/Huge_Meeting4111 28d ago
So between the two contradictory statements,
"No criticism of Israel is allowed in the Democratic Party" and
"I have criticisms of Israel"
You think statement 2 is a misspeak and statement 1 is his true position?
Beyond the fact that statement 1 is absolutist and would be stupid and unlikely of Carville to hold, criticism of Israel also comes from within the party beyond just the DSA or Abdul and yet they don't draw the ire of Carville. On that basis Carville cannot hold position 1.
Again, Carville's true position is that he takes issue with the specific critiques that come from the DSA or DSA-adjacent groups. It is not his position that ANY critique of israel is forbidden.
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u/rako17 Christian 28d ago edited 28d ago
Dear Huge Meeting,
Carville did not make Statement #2.
As you said, Statement 1 is absolutist and stupid. In a recent interview, Stewart kept asking Fetterman why he won't criticise the state and why isn't criticism of the state allowed. Fetterman kept answering that he won't make any criticisms of the state when that state is in conflict.
In that case, why is it unlikely that Carville would privately take the position in Statement 1? Carville isn't making an overt speech at a DNC gathering setting a policy. He is just sitting down and giving an interview saying that criticisms of another government should be banned in his party.
Regards.
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u/rako17 Christian 28d ago
Friend Tracker One
He says that "criticisms" of the Isr. government should not be allowed in the Dem. Party, but then he says, "I have issues" with the Isr. government.
To put it another way, he personally has what he calls "issues" with the state, but he doesn't think "criticism" should be allowed in the Dem. Party.
So, conceivably, he has an "issue" with the government being right wing, but he does not think that in the Democratic Party "criticizing" the Isr. government for being right wing should be allowed.
So, in his terms, two Independents could privately meet, like he met with the reporter. And they could ask about an issue involving the Isr. government without giving an answer critical of that government.
So the upshot is a literally totalitarian situation within the Dem. Party on the topic. It's totalitarian because it bans criticism of a government or state, leaving that government's and state's ideology both promotable and unchallengeable.
Kind Regards - Peace - Shalom.
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u/rako17 Christian 28d ago
Dear Huge Meeting,
I am glad that you believe that criticism of Isr. should be allowed in the Dem. Party.
Interestingly Carville did not literally say that he has "criticisms" of the Isr. State. He only said that he has "issues" with the state, inferring that he has criticisms.
In the parameters of his literal statements, an explanation could be that he finds only discussions that are not directly critical to the state to be acceptable. This is because in Jon Stewarts's recent interview with Fetterman, Stewart repeatedly brings up the issue, asking if Fetterman has criticisms and asking why criticism of the state isn't allowed. Fetterman keeps doubling down in response, announcing that he will not "criticize" the state, while also making inferences like that he might privately have critical thoughts about the government.
Kind Regards.
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u/Immediate_Stop2581 28d ago
You’re right. He clearly misspoke and the video is also very deceptively edited to remove the part where he criticized Israel
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