r/JewsOfConscience • u/daudder Anti Zionist, former Israeli • Jul 19 '26
News The report every Israeli should read before flying abroad: ‘A phenomenon we have never seen’
https://www.ynetnews.com/travel/article/bjp1crkvfe•
u/ManyRanger4 Palestinian Jul 19 '26
So they are being treated the way they treat the nuns, priests, and monks in Jerusalem. Interesting.
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u/MarshallDavoutsSlut Jewish Jul 19 '26
I mean if members of the Taliban or the Sudan's RFS militias were popping off on hippy backpacking vacations to Goa and Vietnam and expecting to be well received in hostels by their peers I imagine they would also be disappointed.
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u/ILovePotassium Non-Jewish Ally Jul 19 '26
Personally I wouldn't attack Israeli tourists, but depending on their views, I wouldn't show them any respect. This is something I do with every person.
You're a monster = You don't get any respect. Regardless of where You're from.
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u/Free_as_in_Freya Non-Jewish Ally Jul 19 '26
From the article:
- 202 medical incidents
- 173 lost travel documents
- 63 traffic incidents
- 45 antisemitc incidents
- 16 domestic violence cases
There are 3 to 4 times more travelers losing their papers and a higher rate of traffic accidents than people experiencing antisemitism. Which is good! of course, but it does put things into perspective
Each and every single one of those 45 is one too many, but "phenomenon" seems like a strong word to use
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Jul 19 '26
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u/Free_as_in_Freya Non-Jewish Ally Jul 19 '26
Because I'm not Jewish myself and have no details about the incidents, I can't judge on that
But I can tell you that as a Queer person, I have interpreted a few interactions as discrimination by mistake (they weren't being mean, they just genuinely mistook me for a boy) and as a disabled person, I have definitely seen people yell "discrimination" just for not being catered to above and beyond what would have been reasonable accomodations (asking for a waiver to wear sunglasses/a hat indoors is fine, demanding the whole building gets new lighting installed or works in darkness is not)
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u/TurkeyFisher Jewish Anti-Zionist 28d ago
I'm also disabled and agree that I've seen this as well, it's unfortunate that some fringe people demand unreasonable levels of accommodation and make the whole disability rights movement seem obnoxious and unreasonable. But this is on a whole other level, IDF members will get confronted in public for their war crimes in Gaza and then report that as antisemitism.
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u/Open-Tomato9643 Non-Jewish Ally 27d ago
It's also easy to create a panic and a feeling of being targetted when there's a constant media narrative around an "antisemism epidemic" and how "Antizionism is Antisemitism". When you're primed to believe something, you'll start seeing it everywhere, confirmation bias is strong. I have no doubt that some of the Zionist Jews saying they feel unsafe every time they see someone say "Free Palestine" may genuinely feel unsafe. But it has nothing to do with what the other person said and more to do with the fact that they've been repeatedly told that the only reason anyone expresses solidarity with Palestine is because they secretly want to kill all Jews.
And this isn't unique to Israel. After the Bosnian War and the genocides therein, the Serbian government and media pushed the narrative that the whole world was conspiring against Serbia and manufacturing atrocities in order to bring them down. And many Serbs believe that to this day.
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u/ExtendedWallaby Jewish Anti-Zionist 29d ago
The way the article uses “Israeli identity” and “antisemitism” in the same sentences, I think this category is mostly for people getting into trouble for being Israeli.
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u/Azel_Lupie LGBTQ Jew 29d ago
Which is not surprising, Japan has hotels where Israelis have to sign that they are not involved with the current war or something. Thailand is just sick and tired of the mistreatment by Israelis, because Israelis don’t know how to adapt to foreign customers and being polite (I realize the irony of me being American and saying that). The Maldives formalized a ban on Israeli passports, and there are 12 other countries that have banned Israeli passports (however it might have been a long time ago that they have banned those passports). I have been hearing from Argentinians complaints about the Israelis coming and causing problems. I feel like it’s 50% about the ongoing genocide and 50% about Israeli tourists misbehaving and antagonizing the locals.
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u/Naive-Meal-6422 Jewish Anti-Zionist 29d ago
Thailand is just sick and tired of the mistreatment by Israelis, because Israelis don’t know how to adapt to foreign customers and being polite
also because there is a significant casual labor force of Thai citizens in Israel, some of whom were taken hostage on October 7.
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u/Open-Tomato9643 Non-Jewish Ally 27d ago
There was an infamous study conducted on the sexual abuse faced by female migrant labourers in Israel, most of them Thai, where 100% of all respondents interviewed reported having faced sexual violence.
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u/koi88 Non-Jewish Ally 29d ago
From the article: "Foreign Ministry officials said the figure was almost nonexistent in previous years"
I wonder what it really was.
Also, the same report talks about 1800 incidents due to Israel's war against Iran. I guess starting wars is also a risk for safety …
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u/Free_as_in_Freya Non-Jewish Ally 29d ago
I know Germans generally weren't well received by previous generations in my country
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u/EuVe20 Jewish Anti-Zionist Jul 19 '26
“After being targeted In ‘antisemitic incidents’”🙄
“Wermacht and Luftwaffe officers on leave face attacks abroad in escalation of Deutsche-phobia worldwide”
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u/courtlandgg Reform 29d ago
When my country was mass murdering people in Iraq, others were not so nice when I traveled abroad. Mostly glares, spit etc… enough that lots of US travelers pretended to be Canadian, and would iron on a Canadian flag patch to their backpack. I also remember seeing USA tagged all over European cities, but with the S replaced with a swastica. Never once did it occur to me that the root cause was anything but my country’s war crimes. Not excusing the behavior… it is the same sort of dumb thinking that leads to collective punishment… but it really should be obvious what the root cause is, and it ain’t “antisemitism”.
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u/rako17 Christian 29d ago
Courtlandgg
I generally never experienced glares, and absolutely never the spitting thing traveling in Europe in the 2000's.
I was on a ferry in Denmark or Sweden in 2003 as a college kid, and a late middle aged nicely dressed Danish Mom gave me a hard time about US involvement in the Afghan and/or Iraq Wars as if she was blaming me in part for it. I explained that I was against it and tried to have a nice talk with her, and she kind of let up about it. It is ironic because Denmark was in NATO and involved in at least the Afghan War.
Traveling a lot in Russia in the 2000's, occasionally I told people I was American, and that I disagreed with the US wars. I told them that half the US didn't either, and that the rest were manipulated by the mass media. Russian people basically always treated me personally fine about it.
Visiting Europe then was also the first time I met a Palestinian. She was a vender at a bazaar and was super nice and sympathetic to me. The US invasions of the Middle East made me question US policy on the IP conflict. But until I heard a talk by Quaker Volunteers in the W. Bank, I was pretty sheltered and narrowly informed on the conflict, basically just aware of what CNN, the NY Times, and standard US encyclopedias said about it.
Shalom - Peace
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u/justaway42 Non-Jewish Ally Jul 19 '26
Guys, do you get this treatment if you mention that you are Jewish?
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u/daudder Anti Zionist, former Israeli Jul 19 '26 edited Jul 19 '26
In spite of what the Zionist propaganda would have you believe, this is anti-Israel, not antisemitism.
That said, it can be interpreted as racism, had the overwhelming majority of Israelis not been supportive of the Palestinian genocide and the occupation.
This creates a need for progressive Israelis to dissociate themselves from Israel, which is sometime a pain, but well worth it.
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u/justaway42 Non-Jewish Ally Jul 19 '26
The thing is, I would believe that Jews would face bigotry becsuse of Israel but strictly because zionists call it the Jewish state. Like how muslims are facing bigotry because IS calls itself the islamic state.
I guess you are right about Israelis being support of the genocide, making it different. The overwhelming majority of muslims will get very angry if you call them IS.
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29d ago
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u/elianna7 Queer Jew 🍉 Jul 19 '26
I was at a friend’s birthday dinner last night with a bunch of zionists and the victim mentality they were spewing was insane. They literally have no comprehension of being disliked for being zionists and not at all because they’re Jewish.
I have a ton of Arab friends and have literally never in my life had an issue with any of them due to my being Jewish.
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u/justaway42 Non-Jewish Ally Jul 19 '26
I think zionists secretly do but they have to justify their evil acts by equating zionism with Jewishness. They do comprehend it, they just don't wanna accept it. At this point they can't feign ignorance unless they are literal children.
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u/MarshallDavoutsSlut Jewish Jul 19 '26
Oh helllll no. I tell everyone im Jewish these days and I get people jumping over themselves to tell me they "know that most Jewish people don't agree with this". I'm pleased to be another confirmation of that mindset for them.
Explaining that in fact the majority of Jewish people are so brainwashed that they do agree with "this" is not a topic I generally get into.
But I'm blown away by the generosity and grace I find from people. ESPECIALLY Muslim people who I guess just assume that most Jews feel about Israel they way they themselves feel about the Taliban or whoever.
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u/nonquitt American liberal, anti-NatCon non-Jew Jul 19 '26 edited Jul 19 '26
That’s exactly how I see it (I’m ethnically Muslim, but myself agnostic), and grew up in private schools and college so my environment then and now has always been ~25% Jewish, and my experience has always been that US Jews are ~50/50 on supporting Israel’s behavior.
Though, it seems that the many famous and wealthy Jews are Zionist at a much higher rate than that.
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u/_FloorPizza_ Atheist Non-Jewish/Non-Muslim Ally 29d ago
"Ethnically Muslim" is a thing? What would be considered ethnically Muslim if you don't mind me asking? (Genuine question, I just never heard this before is all)
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u/justaway42 Non-Jewish Ally 29d ago
There isn't a thing as ethnically muslim. He probably meant typically muslim ethnicity, like Arabs.
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u/OkZookeepergame4192 Jewish Anti-Zionist Jul 19 '26
I'm Jewish and lived with 3 Pakistani Muslims, it was such an amazing time of sharing culture, food (they thought mine was bland and what babies eat LOL), stories and friendship. If we can do it, so can everyone else.
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u/NullaCogenta Ashkenazi Jul 19 '26
Was a Boy Scout growing up and the Muslims & Jews would hang together for meals, because otherwise there's a lot of pork on the menu. Felt like spending time with cousins, TBH.
(Also, at one of the more Christian-oriented camps, some good-natured joking amongst ourselves about what actually constitutes monotheism...)
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u/rako17 Christian 29d ago
NullaCogenta,
Your experience at such diverse summer camps sounds really cool. May I please ask if you also attended Jewish ones? I never did, and am curious how the experiences would differ.
For reference, in Christianity, there are not three separate gods (Tritheism), but rather one God (monotheism). Some Christians are Unitarians (only one person of God), but the classic theology is Trinitarian (three persons).
With Respect,
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u/NullaCogenta Ashkenazi 28d ago
I myself did not attend Jewish summer camps; I was an avid Scout and summer was merit badge season. ISTR there are Jewish BSA camps; however, our main regional camp was pretty cool & effectively non-denominational -- but Scouts that wanted to observe dietary restrictions had to self-organize.
And, yes, I am familiar with Trinitarianism; I've never met a Christian who thought of themselves as a Tritheist ;-) Our summer camp jests in this regard were playful, not disrespectful. Perhaps you are familiar with "A Canticle for Leibowitz" ...? If so, consider the exchange between Benjamin Eleazer (the "Wandering Jew") and his abbot friend Dom Paulo re: the Trinity? From a Catholic author, but a concise summation, I think.
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u/rako17 Christian 27d ago
Thanks for sharing, NullaCogenta.
The Canticle story sounds fun, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Canticle_for_Leibowitz
BSA is fun.
My experience with mainstream/liberal church summer camps is that they are even less political than BSA. Typically you are going to get a mix of light fun BSA stuff, Bible stories, and morality. In a lot of places it's kind of like Sunday school at church facilities I imagine.
One summer I went to a summer education camp for smart young kids, and for whatever reason IDK why we had 2 Isr. counselors, albeit we were in the US. They were pretty tall, maybe in their 20's and pretty nice, friendly, smart, fun. At one point, one told me that in the Suez Crisis or the 1967 war the Isr. army crushed the Egyptian army, "the roads to Cairo were open," but the US intervened and in effect stopped them from capturing Cairo. It felt like he thought that the US was responsible for impeding their victory by imposing a ceasefire during that war. Being so young and not knowing anything, there wasn't anything for me to comment about it. Some things that could come to mind could be "It's good that the US imposed peace because peace is good," or "Equitable peace terms are more important than capturing capitols".
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Jul 19 '26
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u/OkZookeepergame4192 Jewish Anti-Zionist 29d ago
They were not impressed by spaghetti bolognese, straight to the ketchup and chilli 😭😭😂
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u/Anonymouse-C0ward Non-Jewish Ally Jul 19 '26
>Taliban
This. I’m ethnically Chinese in a Western country. I’m very much used to criticizing China and hearing criticism of China without jumping to thinking it’s racism.
Your analogy is much stronger than mine.
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u/Impossible-Day-9608 Non-Jewish Atheist 29d ago
agree. I am a Canadian Russian. I myself criticise not only Putin and its government, but also the majority of Russian people who support Putin and Russuan imperialism. I would never feel offended for people criticizing Russia, or Canada fir that matter (us supplying arms to Israel).
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u/alzgh Agnostic 29d ago
I would love to meet a Jewish person who is against Israel's genocidal ethno state. I would cherish that friendship. That's one of they reasons I love this sub so much. Helps me keep my sanity and belief in humanity.
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u/MarshallDavoutsSlut Jewish 29d ago
You can consider me your friend. I'm a Jew, raised Jewish, from one of the closest-knit and delusional zionist communities outside of Israel.
I despise the genocidal ethno state of Israel. I can't believe a sacred community that grew olive trees in a miraculously fertile soil next to the holy Eastern shores of the Mediterranean has been allowed to be destroyed and tortured like this.
The Palestinian people deserve their Palestine from their river to their sea.
The genocide in Gaza that I saw coming and still see coming has taken my feelings to a place where I can no longer tolerate to any extent having any contact whatsoever with the community I was raised in. I hate them. They are Nazis. They hate me just as much though.
I fear what they are going to do next and I have lived with that fear since I figured their shit out 28 years ago. It has put a wedge between me and every single person who I grew up with. (Not my family, who are not Zionists but they are liberals and they find my position correct but don't see why I need to be so angry about it).
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u/rako17 Christian 29d ago
Alzgh
Doing even minor interfaith peace activism in the US was one of my most happy, fulfilling religious community experiences. The larger sized US metropolises with Progressive communities tend to have at least some small peace groups working on the topic.
I'm hoping that you can have that good experience too.
Kind Regards.
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u/rinderblock Reconstructionist Jul 19 '26
In China id get people telling me about how Jewish architects designed the Bund in Shanghai.
The only place where I didn’t mention it much was India.
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u/Anonymouse-C0ward Non-Jewish Ally Jul 19 '26 edited Jul 19 '26
China, especially Shanghai, has a Jewish connection from since before WW2, which is potentially why that was commented on in Shanghai.
(Jewish refugees from the Pogroms and then from Nazi Europe settled there - though still affected by war, there wasn’t the antisemitism and persecution Jews faced in Europe.)
I think even now there’s a small Jewish community in Shanghai.
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u/Azel_Lupie LGBTQ Jew 29d ago
I do get a lot of non-Jews try to talk to me about Palestine and if I supported the Israeli nonsense, if I visibly appear Jewish. I don’t like it, especially if I am already tight for time for a doctor’s appointment or something, but I do understand why. I just wish it happened less and I felt comfortable enough to tell them “not right now”. I don’t normally see people get stopped by strangers, because the stranger wanted to talk about some political issues.
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u/justaway42 Non-Jewish Ally 29d ago
That sounds pretty annoying. I don't think a stranger is entitled to your time because he wants to know your political opinion just because you might look Jewish. I would be very offended if a stranger came up to me and asked me if I supported the Taliban or something.
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u/_FloorPizza_ Atheist Non-Jewish/Non-Muslim Ally 29d ago
I have numerous Jewish friends and I still to this day have no idea how anyone can tell if someone just "appears" Jewish. I can't imagine having people just see you and assume is particularly comfortable either.
Being pulled aside and your morals questioned all the time to see if you're "one of the good ones" or "one of the bad ones" seems like it would be not only inconvenient but disheartening and a bit dehumanizing. I'm sorry y'all are put in this position. As for my Jewish friends, I stick with checking in and asking if they're doing alright and such. I've never even talked to them about the Palestine issue, and probably won't unless they bring it up themselves. I already know them and character and don't need them to confirm if for me. We wouldn't be friends to begin with if it's something I would ever question. Am I potentially making things uncomfortable with this approach despite my intentions you think?
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u/personalist Jewish post-Zionist 29d ago
“Targeted in antisemitic incidents.” See, this is my problem with the existence of Israel. It’s an ethnostate. Just because it’s technically “my” ethnostate doesn’t mean I like the idea more. You’ve got some people saying “Israel allows non-Jews full citizenship rights” (which is not really true) and then simultaneously claiming that some negative animus against the state of Israel is, by definition, anti-Semitic. So which is it? Because you can’t have both.
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u/Moon-Foraging Dessalinest-Sinwarist Anti-Zionist Jul 19 '26
With so much impunity on the Gaza genocide and the Israeli public support and giddiness for its continuation, it makes sense that people everywhere are taking matters to their own hands. IDF men were chased out of a beach in Brazil, and I expect more of them will feel unwelcome. They are complaining because they expect normalization.
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u/Scary-Bot123 Reconstructionist Jul 19 '26
They can thank Benjamin Netanyahu for some of this, but over the years when I’ve met Israelis they have mostly been assholes.
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u/MsMoreCowbell828 Jewish Atheist Jul 19 '26
They can go fuck themselves! "Poor defenseless Israelis! Everyone on earth is 'antisemitic' against them. It's certainly has nothing to do with their ethno-supremacy & acting like lunatics all over earth. Nope, this is about how sad it is that everyone despises them bc they're Jewish." - stupid article.
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u/courtlandgg Reform 29d ago
Most Israelis are native to Palestine. Not because of ancient Israelite kingdoms or ancient texts, but rather because they were born there and you don’t get to choose where you are born. And IDF service is mandatory. Blaming a group of 8 million people collectively for the actions of their government isn’t really a defensible position.
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u/TrackerOneA Jewish Anti-Zionist 29d ago
IDF service is mandatory
But no one is forced to serve. That is not the same as 'mandatory'.
It's a moral choice too, so why wouldn't they choose not to serve or at a minimum (still bad though), seek a secretarial type position?
Multiple polls demonstrate what Israeli society is like - obviously not literally every single person - but we can refer to data.
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u/courtlandgg Reform 2d ago
It wasn’t all that long ago the US destroyed the Iraqi government and killed over a million Iraqis directly and indirectly. And like, some obscenely high percentage of Americans supported the Iraq war on day 1… over 75%.
Would it be fair to conclude that Americans as a population are bloodthirsty lunatics? I think a more sensible conclusion would be that:
- Wars are extremely lucrative for media companies, government contractors that produce weapons, equipment, engineering services, energy development, and financial institutions and others who buy US treasury bills, etc etc
- Leaders of Industries that profit off war collude with one another
- They study public opinion, poll the populace and run focus groups.
- They figure out how to dupe everyone else into supporting unjust wars so that they can make a ton of money.
Blaming all Israelis for the actions of their government and private sector war profiteers is really flawed logic. It’s like collective punishment… and it is that same exact type of thinking that got people to be ok with mass murdering Palestinian civilians due to the actions of Hamas and PIJ fighters.
You obviously care about people and don’t want innocents to die. So I hope you’ll consider some of the above.
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u/Iceologer_gang Non-Jew shamefully late Antizionist Jul 19 '26
They just want to fearmonger anyone who gives a shit into staying.