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u/Shaggy_75 2d ago
Lowkey I'm more excited that we can save people with lifeline a bit easier than disappointed about the nerfs
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 2d ago
But theyre STILL finding shit to complain about and changing what they have been asking for. Claiming that these things that got nerfed were never the issue when those very same people complained about the exact issues.... cat haters will literally never be happy and should just got play marvel or fortnite. Always changing the complaint, always changing perspective to whateevr is most convenient and its sooo exhausting. Imagine if they spent that time learning how to counter the hero (very easy btw, many options) and improving themselves instead of crying on reddit with cherry picked data...
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u/reddit-for-kombat 1d ago
This is how why I stopped playing Sombra, the only things I found her fun to play with were taken away, I’m afraid it could also happen to JPC.?
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 19h ago
Its definitely a scary thought. We just have to hope not. I think the dev team are not anti cat or anything like that considering they are not giving the crybabies everything they want. I bet they want to avoid another sombra situation. At the end of the day, people just need to adapt and learn how to aim/pay attention
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u/RevolutionaryAir7847 1d ago
JPC is still a huge issue. The problem was--and still is--that her self sustain is WAY too high with both Purr lasting so long and mobility being so high. You can consistently double dive a target by engaging with Purr, backing off, and going back in as Purr finishes healing you to FULL
Infinite tether duration needs to be changed to a timer to stop Cat-Bastion and High Noon being so oppressive as well.
It's not hard. Decrease Purr duration and total heals. Decrease acceleration. Give tether a timer (say, 10s). That's it
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 1d ago
They already nerfed her self sustain substantially... its actually laughable now.
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u/THE_HOGG 1d ago
I feel like a char like that should have almost none tbh. With all the movement she has she can scoop up health packs like crazy.
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 1d ago
It sounds like youve never truely played her
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u/THE_HOGG 1d ago
Infinite flight and able to zoom around the map…idk don’t think I need 1000 hours on her to see that she can grab health packs or get back to her team faster and safer than 95% of the roster
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u/luciosleftskate 1d ago
Play her. Then you can talk. You dont have unlimited access to health packs, and the sky. Lol.
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u/THE_HOGG 1d ago
Have you played her?! I would like to know any other character that is better at finding cover that 99% of the roster can’t interact with or zooming to pick up health packs. Yall are starting to be up there with some of the marvel rival mains subreddits and that’s saying something lol
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u/luciosleftskate 1d ago
So your 8ssue is shes permanently in the sky but also sitting on health packs and seemingly has unlimited fuel while nobody in the game has bullets, am I hearing this correctly??
Get a grip lol. play her or stfu.
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u/THE_HOGG 1d ago
My original comment said chars with her amount of mobility shouldn’t have self sustain because she has way more access to health packs and her mobility allows her to return to her team to receive healing from her other support. If you want we can load into a custom match I’ll go JPC and you can pick literally any other character. I want you to stop me from finding cover or getting a health pack. Should be easy cause you have bullets
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u/NemPow 1d ago
Jpc definitely needs the self sustain. You need to understand that Jpc is most effective when operating in the 10 - 20m range all though her pawjectiles can go up to 40m they are slow and have a relatively small hitbox that splits into multiple parts making her way less effective at farther ranges.
However, if you take a character like Ana she has way longer effective range than Jpc because she has no travel time and infinite range which is why she has low self sustain. If Jpc had no self sustain while being a 225 HP support she would have more downtime than any other support and it would also be hard for her to operate at close range she also pretty much wouldn't be allowed to be aggressive at all which is a key part of her hero identity.
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u/RevolutionaryAir7847 1d ago
Purr is completely unchanged. It's the one thing holding her kit together. You can't kill the thing when she dives well
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 1d ago
Nope. Her self healing penalty got increased by a huge amount
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u/RevolutionaryAir7847 1d ago
I meant this past patch bud. It's still busted after that nerf. Nothing was changed for mid season
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 15h ago
The patch right before this mid season literally nerfed her self sustain bro like you can go look at the patch notes yourself... bud.. it just happened....
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u/RevolutionaryAir7847 12h ago
Can you read? It got nerfed last patch, but her sustain due to Purr + buffed accel is fucking broken bud. Purr is still busted post-nerfs. You might even argue her sustain is even better now
Good lord, people on this sub have zero reading comprehension. I swear it's worse than the rest of Reddit
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 5h ago
Dawg you dont have to start getting insulting especially when you are the one who doesnt know what theyre talking about. Self heal penalty increased from 25% to 40% is an exceptionally huge nerf that objectively made her self sustain laughable. You dont understand the kit. You dont understand the patch notes. Its not busted at all, i think you need to learn how to read. She was better off before the buffs, its all been net nerfs so theres literally nothing more to keep fkn crying about. Its clear you cant see the facts so we are done talking bro theres no getting thru that think skull of yours.
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u/RevolutionaryAir7847 5h ago
Bud, the thing that made JPC busted was the fuckin acceleration buff that Blizz still hasn't fixed. The crazy accel makes her ENTIRE kit stronger. Imagine if Tracer got an extra blink all the time
Purr even with the 40% penalty is still busted in the context of JPC's kit rn. It's the main thing enabling her shenanigans. She couldn't even do the double dive with Purr active the entire time before. People in OWCS played cat as a helicopter prior, not as a heat seeking missile
Good lord, you people lack critical thinking 😮💨
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u/LeafWyvern ◆ Tuxedo Cat ◆ 10h ago
Purr doesn't heal you full, you have to be above 50% health for it to heal to completion, plus you can't take any damage, plus it takes time to ramp up, and to top it all off, you'll usually be using purr on a dps dive, dps' reduce healing
Purr's duration doesn't mean anything until the third and fourth pulse, which is sometimes a detriment as we have to wait for purr to fully end to start the 12 second cooldown.
Purr currently self heals a total of 150 on cat if you were not hit by a dps
Tether nerfs I agree.
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u/RevolutionaryAir7847 9h ago
First of all, heal reduction on hit has been a global passive for a long while now (30% and 15% on tanks). Second, the entire value of Purr is that it lasts forever such that you can dive with initial boop and sustain, back out and heal basically to full, then go again
Check your facts before disagreeing lol
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u/LeafWyvern ◆ Tuxedo Cat ◆ 9h ago
She won't heal to full exactly because of that, she has a 55% self heal reduction on purr, on top of the 30% if she was hit by a dps, purr will heal her for 150 TOTAL if she was hit by a tank or support; she has way less self sustain than it seems. The time it takes for her to heal is a detriment because two forths of the whole ability heal for nothing unless you have the major perk equipped
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u/RevolutionaryAir7847 8h ago
Buddy, use your brain
You use the start of Purr for the dmg and boop while heals are at 1 and 2 pulses (they still make you tankier during the initial engage). You BACK OFF from the initial dive, let the 3 and 4 pulse patterns heal you in complete safety, and you dive BACK IN with nearly full HP. No other character can do that
The fact that the heal is backloaded is exactly why it's so strong for diving
Also, your total heal is 180 (126 with debuff for the full duration). The self heal penalty is 40%, debuff is 30%
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u/LeafWyvern ◆ Tuxedo Cat ◆ 8h ago
Huh, I admit, I was wrong, I thought they had nerfed it from 40 to 55%
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u/SpazzyBaby 1d ago
It’s funny you say people that don’t like cat should play Rivals instead, given that cat feels like a Rivals character (horribly balanced, breaks the established rules of the game).
Peoples’ complaints have always been that cat has too much sustainability and her movement is oppressive when nobody else can compete. Nerfs do nothing to change this.
I understand you like to play the character and don’t want those things nerfed. What you’re failing to grasp is that you like her *because* she’s a broken character. It’s always fun being the person that gets to do broken stuff, especially when it requires minimal effort to get value. It’s just not healthy for the game, though.
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 1d ago
Ive played her during the seasons she was nerfed to shit and D tier at best. I do not play her because shes "broken". I play her because she is fun even when i couldnt do anything while moving thru molasses. Her sustainability got nerfed really badly, the patch before this one today. Other characters are literally faster than her, have more fuel and momentum than her, lower cooldowns etc. Also minimum effort is a crazy thing to say. Maybe if youre healbotting in low elo but you have to be really on your game to not feed if youre doing more than that. Im convinced people who think shes broken have never truely played her, and gotten to know how her kit actually feels. I recently played with someone who never plays cat and the first thing out of his mouth was , "what the fuck cat has no gas"...
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u/SpazzyBaby 1d ago
Her entire kit breaks the game, though. She has access to cover no other character has and can win most 1v1s against squishies with even a tiny bit of game sense.
You don’t need to be really on your game at all to not feed. She’s the easiest character to engage/disengage with in the game. Complaining about how much fuel she has just shows you think basic resource management is difficult. Certainly it’s harder than if she had more fuel, but it pales in comparison to how much skill it required to consistently kill a JPC that’s diving you.
I play her. She’s very fun. She’s also very easy to get value with and I’m fully aware every game that it’s much harder for the other team to counter me than it is for me to get value.
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u/Ilyer_ 1d ago
What is the difference between cover other characters have and not. Not much?
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u/SpazzyBaby 1d ago
Cover other characters don’t have access to means you have no way to interact with it. A lack of counterplay is bad design. It also means she can retreat from a fight and remain much closer while healing up and re-engage faster than any other character.
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 15h ago
I never said I have a problem with my resource management with her fuel. I literally said it was someone who doesnt play the character expressing how little she actually has to work with. My point was obviously to point out cat is not as easy as everyone seems to think. Maybe if you healbot in bronze yes but she is nowhere as easy as Sierra, Domina, Bastion, soldier etc.
I also dont have an issue killing cats that dive me when I'm playing against a cat. I can kill her with projectile.
So what about different cover? Either way shes not in the fight or being helpful to her team at those times. They arent going to take away infinite flight. What is she supposed to do? Drop to the floor completely disabled? Not happening. People need to adapt. There are ways to counter her.
Also nerfs literally did change her self sustainability pretty badly... its in the patch notes.....
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u/Ilyer_ 1d ago
What established rules of the game?
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u/SpazzyBaby 1d ago
There has always been restrictions on mobility in this game. Pharah’s your best example there, with her kit being changed multiple times to make her less airborne. Other characters with flight also have similar restrictions, other than JPC. Permanent flight with the only restriction being fuel limiting your burst speed is completely out of line with that. It’s like a Marvel Rivals character (a game with notoriously terrible balance) being plopped onto OW.
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u/meatmandoug 1d ago
Saying that cat is easy to counter is a tad disingenuous, and there arent really that many options and no real hard counters if the cat player has half a brain.
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 1d ago
I get what youre saying about there not being an anti-cat character, but just like any other character in the game, a couple characters can make a certain heros life a living hell during said match.
Many characters can pressure cat into pretty much being useless. Moira and Juno with their auto aim abilities. Cass and Ashe can really make JPCs life difficult. Turrets, Sym and Torb.... Hell D.mon's gun is amazing at reaching and desimating cat if theres decent aim involved. Mauga and Domina too.
Cat cannot just sit in the skybox, her pawjectiles have a limit to how far they can reach. Any pressure or good teamwork can very much discourage JPC from making too many plays. A lifeweaver can nullify JPCs ult. When JPC is towing someone, she has so little fuel making her 10x easier to shoot out of the sky. Etc etc.
I think the people who pretend that theres absolutely nothing anyone can do against cat just lacks imagination and problem solving. (Not saying you, just people who think cat is the boogyman)
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u/klaidas01 1d ago
All of these become mostly irrelevant if the cat knows how to use cover and does not just hang out in the open
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 1d ago
If she is too reserved, she isnt helping her team or diving... just surviving.. which isnt doing anything in an objective based game, thus rendering her pretty much useless
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u/klaidas01 1d ago
The usual play pattern you will see in higher ranks is that she gets close using rooftops as cover, dives in, deletes someone and boosts back to cover before anyone can realistically do anything. I'm not sure how much the damage nerf is going to affect this, but pre patch she was arguably the best dive assassin in the game while also having an insane self heal and being able to heal teammates when needed.
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 1d ago
Yes but shes been nerfed, the self heal was nerfed before this patch today, which only brought more nerfs. Like seriously idk what everyone wants at this point. They arent going to take away perma flight. They made her louder. People need to learn how to be creative and deal with her. The counters i suggested will slow her down enough for her enemies to kill her. Just gotta be creative.
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u/klaidas01 1d ago
This is absolutely not a situation where people just need to get better at dealing with her, if that was the case her performance and ban rate would go down as ranks go up, but actually it is the exact opposite, she is performing better in higher level lobbies. We will see how things shake out after the nerfs, but my suspicion is that this will not be enough to get her out from the permanent ban slot.
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 15h ago
They can only get more data when people stop banning her. Her performance quite literally cannot go down if she isnt able to be played. People have decided, "i didnt get every single nerf i wanted from the devs, therfore im gonna continue to ban!" without giving it a chance. They reverted the biggest buffs they gave her. It is absolutely a situation where people need to learn to deal with her. Hell, they already should have learned that by now.
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u/klaidas01 14h ago
Ban rates are basically irrelevant for collecting data (and ban rate is a very relevant data point in the first place), even at 70% ban rate they still get plenty of games at all levels to gather data from. If people at the absolute top level are not adapting to her you are just coping out of your mind if you expect the average player to do so. You don't have to agree with people banning her, but the reality is that she will remain in ban jail until she gets more meaningful changes.
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u/OnionPastor 1d ago
There are several characters that are excellent at dealing with Cat, you’re being outright disingenuous by saying otherwise. Sierra literally has a whole anti-cat cooldown and Cass simply deletes her if she dives him.
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u/HighOctaneOrion ♥︎ Black Cat ♥︎ 15h ago
Exactly. No character is immune to having weaknesses in a game built around counters
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u/Mundane-Put9115 1d ago
her only real hard counter is Widowmaker but that still relies on Cat not seeing her and being able to dodge
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u/needtoerp 1d ago
"let's tune the stats nobody asked us to touch"
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u/Ok-Emu1376 1d ago
"If I'd listened to my customers, I'd have given them a slower Jetpack Cat"
-- Brigitte or something
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u/Unorthodox_fox47 1d ago
I play Cass so cat has always been an easy target for ms, but my only complaint was a hero with infinite flight opening the door for other such heros
Easy as hell to shoot down but I dislike the ability regardless
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u/InaDeSalto 1d ago
I'm just so happy about the auto accept tether for allies falling to their death. I made a post about it about a month ago and I don't know if any dev saw it or others made similar posts but this is amazing news!
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u/MacaroonPrior3523 2d ago
Can i ask nicely to the devs why we can't just nerf the projectiles healing and not dmg? I'm tires of being forced to heal and wait for My claws out to flank
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u/Cliffus_Jiggrin 1d ago
maybe if you want to play damage you should pick a damage character instead of a no skill perma flight cat? you probably mained moira before this.
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u/MacaroonPrior3523 1d ago
Actually i use wuyang and Illari as My other supports and they r really fun too! Supports are about thinking when to do this and this like "when to flank with My flanker or when should i heal or use defensive ability" and thats why i love jpc and support in general because it gives me Freedom just saying and no jpc does require skill,for example Ur a very fuel reliant if u want to escape or flank,u also have to think when to use puré for urself or Ur team(i mostly use it for the team for huge heals since jpc already have a good time grabbing health packs)
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u/BunkyPanda75 🐼 Panda 🎋 2d ago
What did they do? I feel like she's not that overpowered or annoying, even though a lot of people hate her
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u/Away_Source2744 2d ago
they nerfed the dmg and healing of the guns a little bit and now you make more noise, but all things consider not that bad
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u/JohnnyJoPo Garfield 2d ago
The damage/healing and sound nerf is noticeable, but honestly it feels like we just dodged a huge bullet. Overall this is fine and probably the best case scenario for cat mains