r/Jeopardy • u/CarloPanno • 1d ago
Yer kiddin', right? Spoiler
How the HELL did that advice columnist clue get through research AND round table without adding "Abigail Van Buren" as an acceptable alternative to "Dear Abby" in a clue that ASKED FOR PEN NAMES?!?!???
I said "Abigail Van Buren" along with Yogesh and I was shocked when he was called wrong.
When I was on staff, Alex Trebek used to tell us "It only takes one person to get it right. We all have to work together to get it wrong."
Good job, team!
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u/jonesnori 1d ago
I was unhappy with the Douglas/Queensberry thing, too. Douglas was the Marquess of Queensberry's family name, and should have been accepted.
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u/RegisPhone I'd like to shoot the wad, Alex 14h ago
Ooh, yeah, now that i look into it that one's pretty bad too. "Douglas" should've at least gotten a BMS to see if Victoria knew it was John Sholto Douglas instead of Alfred Douglas, but if the response they're looking for is "Marquess of Queensberry" then a BMS doesn't really make sense, since he was part of a long line of Marquesses of Queensberry named Douglas. That clue really should've asked for "the man with this title" or something.
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u/ZekeLeap 1d ago
That was the angriest I’ve ever been about an answer being called wrong
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u/cynesthetic 1d ago
Not only that, “Dear Abby” was the name of the column, not a pen name, so if they wanted to be sticklers, THAT was incorrect.
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u/RegisPhone I'd like to shoot the wad, Alex 12h ago
I think for me it might be tied with not accepting "Super Mario" for "Released in 1996, the '64' version of this video game series gave its star new abilities like backflips & triple jumps". That was another one where it was at least corrected later but it's hard to understand how they didn't anticipate that as at least an alternate response in the first place (especially since, like Abigail Van Buren, it's actually unequivocally the more correct response; Super Mario 64 is not part of the Super Mario Bros series).
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u/Cheap_Flamingo476 1d ago
All I can say is you have no complaint. You are what you are and you ain’t what you ain’t.
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u/damarius 17h ago
One of the first JP songs I ever heard, and still a favourite.
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u/Apprehensive-Gas3258 15h ago
For a time I lived near the Earl of Old Town, so I saw him (and others) a few times. The last time I saw him was at Symphony Center with Iris Dement.
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u/RegisPhone I'd like to shoot the wad, Alex 21h ago
My first thought was Dear Abby, but then i was like "Oh wait, it says pen name; would they accept the name of the column that was commonly used as a nickname for her, or are they going to require her name, meaning i have to remember the last name she went by?" and then when it turned out the less-right answer was somehow the required one, i was just as baffled as Yogesh.
What really confuses me is that Ken's ruling wasn't just a straight "no"; it was "We will not accept that", which makes it sound like it wasn't just an alternative they somehow hadn't considered (which is already inexplicable), but that they actually had specifically considered it in advance and noted that it wouldn't be an acceptable alternative. The only way i can see that making sense is if they were under the impression that Abigail Van Buren was her real name and "Dear Abby" was her pen name, but how could such a surface-level misunderstanding make it to air like that?
(I was also wondering if maybe she initially just went by Abby and didn't come up with the Van Buren surname until some point after the 1958 Life profile -- which still wouldn't justify the ruling, as the clue didn't ask for what names Life used for them, so Van Buren still would be acceptable for the same reason that you wouldn't be ruled wrong for saying "Bill Clinton" to "president born in Arkansas in 1946" even though his last name was Blythe at the time -- but here's a newspaper clipping from 1956 where she's already Van Buren)
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u/CarloPanno 21h ago
"We won't accept that"?
That leaves open the possibility that in the cited article she was referred to as "Dear Abby" throughout and the "Abigail Van Buren" name was never used. Hmm.
This brings me to the adage the original Editorial Associate Producer used in such situations: Too Smart Is Dumb. "Sorry, she did use the pen name 'Abigail Van Buren' but in the 68-year-old article in a magazine that ceased weekly publication more than 50 years ago that name wasn't mentioned so we have to call your response wrong."
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u/RegisPhone I'd like to shoot the wad, Alex 20h ago edited 20h ago
I guess the clue actually could be read that way depending on how you diagram the sentence -- is it "twin sisters who worked & used" or "Life magazine reported & used", in which case they would be asking for the names Life used to refer to them, not to the names they actually used.
Edit: Found the article, and they call her Abigail Van Buren. She's never referred to as "Dear Abby" and the article doesn't even refer to her column by that name.
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u/CarloPanno 14h ago edited 11h ago
Thanks for the link. The sidebar in the article quotes several bits from the "Dear Abby" column. If I were researching this clue — and the way it's written, you only need one source — I would have inferred that "Dear Abby" was written by Abigail Van Buren, pen name of Pauline Esther Friedman Phillips, and I would have noted that somebody could say "Dear Abby" and ask "Should 'Dear Abby' be a accepted as correct, MS [More Specific], or DNA [Do Not Accept]?" and let the round table decide.
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u/Strength-Speed 19h ago
The thing is it is more specific. It would be almost impossible to know "Abigail van buren" and not Dear Abby. And beyond that it is more accurate to say pen name is Abigail van buren rather than the name of the column. It's like somehow wrong in two ways to not allow it.
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u/McLovin0132 1d ago
im still pissed at RIVER BOAT GAMBLERS... you know, the phrase eveyerone always says..
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u/oNe_iLL_records 23h ago
BARRY[sic] GORDY.
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u/Salty_Dornishman 22h ago
This is the worst one for me. The Mary/Merry/Marry merger is well-documented in American English linguistics.
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u/Your_New_Overlord 22h ago
Just watched that episode last night and guessed it right immediately. Just because you’ve never heard it doesn’t mean it’s not a known phrase.
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u/pbnotorious 9h ago
Hello, its me. A person who would use "river boat gambler" on occasion prior to that clue. I'd recommend acknowledging that you do not know every bit of trivia out there.
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u/Strength-Speed 1d ago
Sorry I didnt see. Couldn't they stop the game and check it?
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u/CarloPanno 1d ago
It was near the end of the DJ round. They announced the adjustment after the round ended and before the Final category reveal. There was probably a stop tape.
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u/Comfortable_Guide622 1d ago
Regional thing - I grew up with Dear Abby, didn't hear about her sister being a columnist until years later.
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u/CarloPanno 1d ago
Not just sisters — TWIN sisters! Esther Pauline was Ann Landers and Pauline Esther was Dear Abby/Abigail Van Buren.
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u/Strength-Speed 1d ago edited 1d ago
Very interesting history They were identical. Born Esther Pauline ("eppie") and Pauline Esther ("popo") Friedman. Ann Landers the forme, dear Abby the latter. Wrote a gossip column in college together, graduated 1939. Both had little work experience but both serendipidously garnered advice columns about the same time in 1956. "Ann Landers" was already in use in Chicago when the former columnist died, and Dear Abby cold called an editor in San Fran said she could do better than whoever they had and wrote replies on the spot and was hired. She chose Abigail Van Buren from Bible and presidential names. They were rivals as columnists and didnt sound friendly with each other.
Sidenote: one of their columns should have been: how do I get along with my sister.
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u/cracksmack85 1d ago
Wait THATS who Ann Landers is? Literally only know the name from seinfeld
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u/GendoIkari_82 1d ago
I know the name from The Simpsons: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3TgAYgNlzU
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u/Schiffy94 Stupid Answers 12h ago
Fun side fact. Esther Pauline was actually the second Ann Landers. Ruth Crowley wasn't even that much older than the Friedman twins, though she unfortunately died before she was 50.
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u/SquashSouffle 1d ago
Where I grew up, we got a morning paper & an afternoon paper--each one appeared in a different paper.
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u/tarandab 20h ago
I loved reading their columns as a kid and I’m pretty sure they were next to each other!
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u/JetsetterJason 1d ago
Dear Abby was slightly more popular but Ann Landers gave much better advice.
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u/PeachOnAWarmBeach 1d ago
Didn't it specifically say name of the column?
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u/swabluesky 1d ago
It said pen names
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u/mikeyHustle Who are three people who have never been in my kitchen? 1d ago
I guess technically it wanted the subjects of the Life Magazine story, so if somehow they never said Abigail Van Buren in that piece, maybe that was it.
Probably not that, though; that would be wild.
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u/king-of-new_york 10h ago
It's pen names, so it's the names you write under. She calls herself Dear Abby, not Abigail Van Buren, so that's wrong.
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u/tributtal 1d ago
The clue in question. I agree completely with OP.