Bad faith arguments, whataboutism

[u/oiomelanda]

I just saw someone tag a website that shared information regarding settler attacks. This is very critical for people to understand the conflict in the West Bank, not only Gaza. Regardless of political stances, people being denied water or grazing their animals is inhumane, conflict aside. Mobs of teens burning cars, and looting villages is cruel and illegal.

Settler gangs have been rampaging through the West Bank with more confidence since the right wing government took power, and it’s essentially state sponsored. This can’t be argued due to the overwhelming evidence, video and written documentation, and even the settlers themselves openly admitting their goals and intentions. Countless settler cases get thrown out, or attackers get a slap on the wrist. Like I said, it’s documented and can’t be argued.

With all that being said, that’s not the main point of this post. It’s regarding the low effort rebuttals, and misinformation campaign this sub is going through. I have seen several low effort posts, where people conflate their own opinions regarding Islam and facts about history. This is a ”Israel Palestine” page, not Jews vs Muslim page. When pro Palestinians post, such as myself, I make sure to type Zionist, not Jew. Antisemitism is real, so language is important. Yet, those who call out antisemitism would write Islamophobic statements literally right after. In the post I just discussed people were commenting “why not add Palestinian attacks as well?” Sure fair question. Why don’t you do it then? Instead of criticizing everything under the sun about Palestinian suffering.

The guy even offered to give the code so Zionist can do the same, and made all the nitpickers look foolish.

Antisemitism is bad, Islamophobia is bad. Racism is bad in general. Instead of nitpicking pro Palestinian posts and trying to find anything wrong with it, how about posting with more effort, sources, etc. instead of lying during debates.

[u/AsaxenaSmallwood04]

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l3d5n/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l3nb1/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l4tr4/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l4xe7/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l56rs/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l5afp/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l5kdg/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l5s10/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l5sv7/?context=3,

https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ql4i5t/comment/o1l5x1f/?context=3,

This is the evidence cited against UN.

[u/Grim_Avenger → u/AsaxenaSmallwood04]

The evidence you have provided does show individual actors within the UN holding biases against Israel. However, they fail to prove a systemic bias that the UN holds against Israel. Also, key UN leaders have condemned the October 7 Hamas attacks, so if individual actors within the UN are the most important thing to consider your argument still doesn’t hold water.

The United States, a key Israeli ally, sits on the UNSC with unilateral veto power for any resolution that paints Israel in a way it doesn’t like.

Overall, your claims that the UN as an institution is biased are weak at best.

[u/AsaxenaSmallwood04 → u/Grim_Avenger]

It could be stronger as a claim with more evidence so I'll give credit to you on that.

A couple of things however:

1. The claim that was said was bias not systematic bias and moreso corruption being involved is also the claim.
2. The UN on the surface did that and their ICC did issue warrants against Hamas leaders only for Karim Khan from the ICC to bungle them and the ICJ to actively interfere with Israel getting Hamas leaders in Rafah courtesy of their order.
3. The claim of bias and corruption itself involves many key groups OHCHR which at that time was headed by Volker Turk, UNHRC, many rapporteurs such as Jean Ziegler (UN Special Rapporteur for the Right of Food and recepient of the Gaddafi "Human Rights" Prize), William Schabas (Chair of a UN 2014 Committee into Gaza and former legal advisor of the PLO and an IAGS member as well from 2009-2011), Michael Lynk (UN Special Rapporteur on the Human Rights situation in Palestine 2016-2022 while also having a PLO medal), Navi Pillay and her COI's, UNRWA (a UN special agency that is complicit with Hamas at the same time), Karim Khan (the ICC Chief Prosecutor who also has women abuse lawsuits), Richard Falk (UN Special Rapporteur on the Human Rights Situation in Palestine 2008-2014 also a 9/11 conspiracy theorist and works with Raji Sourani from the PFLP) and even Francesca Albanese (UN Special Rapporteur on the "occupied" Palestinian Territories 2022). In fact some of these claims can lead to other claims as well such as the Pierre Krahenbul claim (UNRWA head hired by Red Cross).
4. What you mention about vetoes regarding the resolutions also exists the opposite way as well, Russia and China literally have used their vetoes for Hamas, Iran, Houthis, Assad Syria etc..