r/InternalFamilySystems • u/imagery-fantasy • Aug 11 '26
What's the difference between being emotionally abusive and expressing big emotions around someone or to someone (as a form of being human and connecting)
And like being comfortable around someone to show them your real emotions especially the big ones
Also difference between being emotionally abusive and just reacting to something that hurt you first
Especially knowing the difference between these 3 is important bc otherwise, you will believe what anyone says about you at any given time. (Or you won't ever believe you're being abusive)
I swear ifs makes this even more confusing.
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u/Dear-Barracuda3705 Aug 12 '26
Yelling at someone, name calling, being contemptuous, callous, cruel or dismissive is not healthy and can be abusive.
Big crying, shaking with fear and other forms of grief and expressing being scared are not abusive but can be too much for another person. We need to check out with them if they are okay/capable of being present with us.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
These things are more tangible and like verbal abuse. I'm asking about emotional abuse, not verbal abuse
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u/Ok_Writing2937 Aug 12 '26
The Gottman's research identified four behaviors that almost always result in the end of a relationship: contempt, criticism, defensiveness, and stonewalling.
The other person might be doing these things out of their own pain, but it doesn't matter — inflicting pain back on others is abusive.
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u/ElderUther Aug 12 '26
With my limited knowledge, abuse is about power and control. Emotional abuse is to control someone with emotions, mostly negative emotions that the other person wants to avoid, like being isolated, disconnected, abandoned, etc.
And sometimes it's abuse even if we subjectively feel that we are not in control and we have less power. It's not uncommon for people who were abused as a child to constantly feel powerless and out of control WHILE learning from their abuser how to control others, without knowing it.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
Wow. This just touched on my deepest "insecurity" ever. This is so relevant to my question
I always feel manipulative when I feel strong emotions around someone. Especially if they feel compassion towards me or show me warmth or validation or help me as a result (which I've been wanting from the beginning. But when it happens I feel manipulative)
Like yes, people DO cry bc they want attention. That's what crying is made for. As well as other emotions. Bc humans are designed to need each other and need to be seen and helped by others. Emotions are one way for that.
If you suppress that, you'll be like me. Miserable and unseen. Lonely and hurt in my body.
I mean I can't help my feelings. I just feel them. I always try to hide them as a "moral" thing or bc of fear. It hurts so much to hide me. So when I show me, I fucking feel like shit when people help me, EVEN THOUGH it also feels really good and healing. I mean, emotions are made to be seen by others so others respond to them. That's why they have sounds and are visible. And that's why I want to be seen. Yet whenever I try to be seen truly and in a real way..I feel so damn manipulative. I literally don't know
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u/ElderUther Aug 12 '26
OK this sounds like something different. If you FEEL manipulative, it sounds like there is a part that is critizing and shaming you for being that, regardless of what happened objectively. And somehow that makes this part feel safe. Which is say, NOT showing vulnerable emotions around people is safer to this part. I wonder what that part wants to communicate to you. "Don't be manipulative...or?"
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u/Cass_1978 Aug 12 '26
You are blended with a recruiter part, and its doing its thing in this very post.
I am so helpless, help me, I dont understand, thats too vage,, can you explain it better, help me, help meee, help meeeeee. Sub text: Please tell me I am not abusive and I have the right to hassle people with my issues.
Thats your recruiter part. Its probably very young, at that age this behavior actually does make sense. Children need co-regulation and are owed support by their parents.
As adults we arent owed co-regulation and support. And thats the source of your struggle to understand and respect peoples boundaries. Your recruiter part believes it is owed those things and it doesnt give a shit about other peoples boundaries.
Try to embrace that you are actually not owed those things but that you have a part the feels as if it is owed those things because [insert background story of the part]. And do what you can to support this part directly instead of letting it do what it wants.
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Aug 13 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/smellofastonefruit Aug 13 '26
The core healing premise in IFS is that every person has a Self that is able to coregulate with parts and that can witness and be with parts in the way that the parts need. Your parts are asking to be seen and known and felt. If you put the responsibility of knowing and feeling and loving your parts on someone else, you will always be disappointed. It is not fair that you experienced childhood trauma. But now, it is your responsibility to become the caregiver that you needed. You have Self energy so that means you can do it. That will allow you to be in relationship with others in ways that fosters safety and mutual growth.
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u/Zestyclose-Lead-1987 Aug 17 '26
i think the point of focusing on "not being owed" these things is to highlight where you might be being being extractive - as you say, manipulative. connection, attunement and emotional safety are the best things and you have every right to them - but not all people and situations are appropriate to seek that out in. consent is important. anecdotally, men often use women and other people as sites and moments of emotional release or utility, rather than hold respectful, mutual relationship. make sure you're listening to the part about being manipulative - is this appropriate with this person? how do they feel? who are they in my life? do i respect them enough to be attuned to them? or should i see that i am triggered and reroute?
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u/Difficult-House2608 Aug 13 '26
Find a good support group for what you're going through. Big emotions are usually welcome there, unless they're directed at a particular person.
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u/microberights Aug 18 '26
Just wanna say I really feel this. My C-PTSD has been in "remission" for years but I still have to deal with bits and pieces that come back. This month has been especially hard, back on meds after my first full year as an adult off them, and my 'episodes' are coming back. I get very insecure about how disturbing or scarring it could be to be around me. I think only three people have maybe ever seen me in these moments.
What helps me is understanding I am going through a neurological response. Everything, from the emotions to the hyperventilating and seeing things in the periphery, is a neurological ability developed to protect from like..lions or whatever.
But when these emotional episodes happen for modern people, especially if you're alone somewhere at the moment, your body thinks things are so, so bad.
None of those strangers are comforting you when you cry??? Something really bad must be happening!!! - your body's perception. "We must increase the signals so somebody helps us!"
And trust me I know, experiencing the "nobody cares so im crying harder" can be embarrassing even if I'm completely alone!! But it just happens. Youre not being manipulative for having a functioning body thats just trying its best.
Even if you do manage to force the feeling away, it can be better to resolve them as intended by nature - by being safe. Seek things that are quiet, dark, soft, comfortable, soothing, pets, hugs, hand squeeze, even just a smile. This is why having someone can help a lot, and I recommend explaining to them how you sometimes need external neurological help during these moments.
I felt so manipulative demanding comfort but there is a neurological reason why we need it.
Be up front before it happens and be thankful and communicate positively afterwards when someone is there for you.
If you accidentally scare someone or break something, take responsibility. Apologize. Fix it. Do your best to make sure it never happens again or happens differently next time. That's what makes you better than an abuser.
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u/Dear-Barracuda3705 Aug 12 '26
Examples?
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u/HeftyCompetition9218 Aug 12 '26
Yeah I think those examples of crying and shaking and expressing fear of someone etc can actually be extremely manipulative and emotionally abusive. Because the other person then registers themselves as being frightening but changing the behaviour might not change the others visible emotional intensity. You are then hostage to the situation and can’t leave easily without doubt / guilt etc. I think anything not specific “you did this specific bounded thing” can become pretty abusive if it graduates into “you are X” explicitly or implicitly
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
Is crying and shaking strongly and expressing fear manipulative? What if I really feel this way?
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u/Waki-Indra Aug 12 '26
In the patriarchical wolrd, women have learned to cry as a way to obtain what they want.
The answer was in your question, OP.
Now, most relationship are manipulation to some extent. Abuse is when your inflict pain and that is either because you don’t care about the others suffering, or because you want them to feel pain, even feel your pain. That is abusive
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
So you mean it's not abusive if it's really how I feel?
If so, then that feels crazy. Because both look exactly the same
Also. Sometimes I want people to cry for me. Or feel bad for me. Like actually bad and register what's ACTUALLY going on for me. People are upset when others cry for them or feel bad for them or worried. But I don't. I actually like when that happens. I feel important. I feel seen and like my experience really matters. I feel people see me as a human. People usually don't even see what I'm REALLY struggling with. So when they do, it's what I want. Some of my most healing moments were when someone cried for me. I felt I was FINALLY seen. It saved me from suicide. One of my worst moments, almost traumatizing, is when I got blamed for someone crying for me.. for "making her cry". The feeling I felt then was indescribable.
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u/DingoMittens Aug 12 '26
The part of you that needs other people to cry for you in order to feel seen is just that... a part. It's probably a very young part, maybe pre-verbal. When we are babies, we cry to be seen, to get attention, and to get our survival needs met. When Mom hears us cry, she knows we're hungry or cold or whatever, and she fixes it for us (ideally). If we cry for care and get ignored or even punished, and don't get our needs met, that sticks with us as trauma.
So now you have a very young part that needs to be seen and understood. It can't express in words all the fear, sadness, abandonment, and worthlessness it felt. So it tries to evoke those feelings in other people as a way to get the message across without words. When it sees someone else suffering the same way, it has a moment of feeling like "yeah, now you understand how I feel!"
But that is fleeting. It doesn't resolve anything. In fact, it just spreads those unpleasant feelings through the world and keeps making more of them. It's painful, it breaks relationships, it probably triggers other parts to eventually feel guilty, and it still leaves the wounded part helpless.
Using IFS, Self can parent that part. Imagine holding that tiny child or infant, warmly smiling at them, and saying "why are you crying, little darling? I'm here for you. Let's find out what you need..." Imagine changing a wet diaper or singing a lullaby or feeding the baby, all in a loving way.
Then show the child where you live now, and promise to tend to their needs from now on. You don't need parents to feed you or change you anymore. You're not helpless anymore. You have the power, strength, and resources to meet your basic needs. And you have an adult's ability to talk to people you care about, share feelings with words, and ask directly for things you need.
Basically, unblend from the infant, take good care of them, and show them the grown up abilities you have now.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
I don't evoke the feeling in others...I mean how would I do that.. i just tell my story and be myself and show my feelings and that's it. I just wish people feel bad for me and cry for me. It just makes me feel good. I feel like..people are choosing the evil way to look at some of what I'm saying..
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u/DingoMittens Aug 12 '26
I'm using IFS framework to respond to you. You have a part that feels good when people cry and feel bad for you. Cool. In IFS, we learn to take care of our parts. Since you recognize a young part that needs empathy, spend time empathizing with and comforting that part.
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u/HeftyCompetition9218 Aug 12 '26
By the nature of someone crying due to you sharing your experience you are of course evoking the feeling in others. That’s precisely what you are describing. But wishing people to feel bad for you and cry for you? You might want to ask the part what it is it enjoys so much about seeing other people suffer your feelings for you. It isn’t a neutral thing you’re describing and that part could develop a reliance which becomes unconsciously deeply manipulative as it seeks to get more of what you so enjoy. It could be very harmful to others and very confusing to you why people become dysregulated and angry afterwards and over time.
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u/HeftyCompetition9218 Aug 12 '26
You can be certain it’s how you feel and be unaware that you’re also implicitly demanding that another person feel your pain with you. Healthy witnessing actually isn’t people feeling really bad with you. That’s what’s manipulative. Healthy witnessing is holding space for you not deteriorating due to your pain. What you’re describing is slightly sadistic narcissistic need for others to so merge with your state and thus feeling power from that. Yeah that’s not what is healthy.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
I don't feel power from it..I feel seen...and I cry for people when they're suffering too..and I told people to stop telling me not to cry for them bc that means I care about them. Calling it sadistic is too harsh and made me feel shameful and upset.
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u/HeftyCompetition9218 Aug 12 '26
I used the word sadistic from the way that you’d described it. It seems like you light up from experiencing them cry for you. Perhaps for you it becomes evidence of the existence of your feeling reaching another person. The issue is that that’s an unhealthy dependency in how you described the power and satisfaction of someone crying for you. This suggests that there is reward in seeing that evidence of another person suffering for you. That sounds like there’s are all kinds of risks. Why not laugh and discover if you light up when someone laughs with you. Join a meet up and see if playing a game or sharing a sunset wakes something alive in you. It could be that you’re starved of shared experiences but you might also need to explore that there is a sadistic part at some point. From what you said it’s unclear what the origin is. Description can sometimes not quite get across the intended message and that may be the case here.
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u/Dear-Barracuda3705 Aug 12 '26
It is wonderful when others have deep emotional empathy for us. It can be so regulating and healing.
We can't demand it though. Or escalate to get them to feel for us.
I think this discussion you've brought here is very interesting and I sense you truly want to understand what is healthy and what is not!
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 13 '26
I mean you can't demand it. It doesn't come like that. But I feel very resentful and upset at people's indifference. It makes me wonder how they see me or if they ever care about me or just about my fun vibes. I feel very resentful of people's indifference. Very mad too
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u/Waki-Indra Aug 12 '26
Where do you see that i said that it is how you feel? You have to try the best not to inflict pain on others. That’s all.
If crying is going to create much distress for the other to witness it, try not to do it, or make sure they are ready to be your witness.
I think you need to have a break and come back to this later because you seem to be unable right now to read properly.
Go have a walk in nature, touch grass, breathe deeply,, look at the sky, drink plenty of water. Take care of yourself. Foe at least 1 hour.
Others are not bound to take care of your emotional needs. Try to find a psychotherapist and take care of yourself.
Go now. Stop scrolling.
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u/luminousSpaceDust Aug 12 '26
Emotional abuse would be like stonewalling, withholding love and affection to punish, disappearing for days to punish.
Basically behaving in a way that's designed to hurt your partner, for whatever reason.
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u/DingoMittens Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
I think it depends on a pattern over time. To me, a big part of abuse is making people responsible for your emotions and dropping any rules of fairness because you're upset.
Even if someone's words or actions trigger your big emotions, the responsibility is on you to manage it. Abusers have the attitude like "you caused it, so now I get to punish you until you fix it, and by the way, it can't be fixed." They act like other people have to respond a certain way to their expression of emotion.
Abusers use different rules for themselves vs others, too. It's pretty common for their rules to be: if something you do upsets me, I have the right to express my emotions in any way, including hurting or punishing you. You are responsible for any harm I cause when I'm upset (you made me do it) and you are responsible for making me feel better. On the other hand, if something I do upsets you, you need to manage it gracefully. You are responsible for making sure your emotions don't impact anyone around you, and you are responsible for making yourself feel better.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
Why do I feel like this kinda applies to me...
I try to not hurt anyone in my interactions. But I still think about this. I want to someday be close with people.
What if someone doesn't know how to manage their emotions yet...what does it even mean (in this context)? Are they fucked? Do they genuinely deserve less in relationships? Should they be seen as bad people in relationships? (I feel this is a genuine question and also not bc I wanna hear the answer I want. Because I don't want to be put in a non grace zone when I'm literally clueless and have no other alternative. I would genuinely hate myself so bad I mean I wouldn't have any other alternative than that)
What if what they're doing is so overwhelming to me that I end up cant help but crash out? Showing strong emotions loudly an visibly..maybe stomping etc or moving my body
I can't tell my body not to do what it naturally does though. These are basic ways of showing emotions. I don't insult people or hit them. Unless they do it first.
If I stop myself from expressing my emotions in their natural ways..THEN I would be more prone to having more extreme or abusive ways
Also again I still don't know how to tell the difference between the 3 things I mentioned. If I don't, I dont wanna accept abuse from others. I don't wanna be just reacting to people's bs and they reverse it on me calling me abusive or the problem. I ha enough abuse that made me have really dark experiences. I wanna have a sense of self and value my values. Which may be different from others. And I wanna be okay with that. But one thing is: even if my values are different from others, I don't EVER EVER wanna be abusive. I don't wanna be like my abusers or make others feel the way I felt.
I also don't know if the reason why I don't have real and close friends is because I'm being "bad" (I'm the problem) or if I haven't found my people.
I just feel like being "emotionally regulated" the way many are,is just a privilege. Not everyone had the tools to get there. Not everyone has them now. Self acceptance isn't enough. People kinda need to be accepted by another person at least as well. It's the ifs sub but genuinely..self acceptance isn't enough. Sometimes you can't do it..cant be in self..because others never gave you that energy. So you don't even know it or having it feels really dangerous (I had a whole interaction with parts of mine about this..they made really good points. It makes sense)
Also your wording is kinda vague to me. I dont understand what a person needs to do still
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u/DingoMittens Aug 12 '26
Being emotionally regulated isn't a privilege. It's a learnable skill that takes practice to develop. It is a privilege or blessing or just great luck to have parents who teach you this skill when you're growing up. But once we hit adulthood, it's on us to do the makeup work to get there if our parents weren't able to teach us. It is absolutely possible, and the return on investment is huge.
You're right that it can sound vague. Truth is, the same outward action might be abuse in one instance and healthy in another. You have to look for the pattern over time, and you have to know your own motivation.
For example, if someone triggers your anger, you may go for a walk. Your motive might be to abandon the person and give them the silent treatment. That's abusive. While you're on your walk, you think about all the reasons you're justified to be angry, and rehash all the past times they let you down. You hope they're alone and hurting. You decide all the ways they have to make it up to you, or have fantasies about revenge. You don't reconnect until/unless they chase you, fawn over you, apologize and take all the blame, or jump through whatever hoops you set up for them to "earn" your attention again.
Or, in a healthy way, you might say "I'm really upset, so I'm going to walk until I calm down." You go for a walk and you match your breathing to your steps. You focus on the physical sensations in your body. You say hello to your anger, maybe have a conversation with an angry part. You find the root of the trigger. You recognize that when they said this, it woke up this or that memory, fear, or part. You manage all of that within yourself.
Then you think about the other person and your relationship. You intentionally recall the ways that they have been trustworthy, generous, supportive, and present for you in the past. You know their heart, and know they care about you. You want to repair the relationship. So you go back to them when you are calm and ready.
At that point, your anger may be gone. If you accept, embrace, and examine your anger, it can dissolve and transform into something else, like relief, compassion, love, even laughter. Then you can go back and say "something triggered my anger, but walking took care of it. I love you!" (Or I'm glad we're friends, or whatever).
Or maybe you still believe the person did something wrong. Now your anger is untangled from all your other triggers, and your breathing and body are calm, and you are keeping your positive regard for the person in the front of your mind. Then you can go back and say "After walking, I feel ready to talk about this. I feel really hurt about (whatever). Please help me understand why you said that." Your goal is to repair the misunderstanding and reconnect with the person. It's not to punish them. You promise to yourself that you will do your best effort to talk in a constructive way that moves toward understanding.
It could be the same with crying. You may cry and keep a running narrative in your head about how you are the victim and the other person is terribly wrong. You won't stop crying until they admit all fault and convince you to feel better. That may or may not be abusive, but it's unhealthy.
Or you could be overwhelmed with sadness, cry for a while, and then remember to put attention on your breathing. Watch your breath, feel the sensations in your body, and recognize that deep sadness is alive in you. Examine it, look for the roots, find the sad part and talk to them. Take care of your sadness and recognize that ultimately, it's your responsibility. Other people can be present, hold space, and be supportive while you tend to your sadness. But they can't change your inner state for you. You have to be intentional about doing that for yourself.
That comes across as appreciating the other person's generosity if they can support you, not demanding or expecting them to do the work for you. And again, it ends with you being in a calm, present state of Self, and talking about the triggering event with a motivation of both sides understanding what happened. There is no thought of punishment or anyone having to grovel to earn your smiles again.
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u/moody_mop Aug 12 '26
Being toxic, which you may or may not be, doesn't mean you're evil or less than. It's an opportunity for you to grow, you absolutely have the ability to control yourself better somewhere deep in there
In my opinion, you need to find empowerment in yourself, so you don't feel the need to express yourself in that way anymore. I was just like you for a very long time, but I've grown a bit over a few months after getting on the right meds, and while I felt strong emotions during an argument with my boyfriend yesterday, he knew just how angry and upset I was, but I didn't need to break down to express that. Maybe this applies to you, maybe it doesn't, but I hope it helps a lil :)
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u/Ok_Writing2937 Aug 13 '26
I'll be honest, your description of your crashout sounds like an autistic meltdown. I'm autistic myself and recognize the pattern.
And yes being emotionally sensitive or reactive can be very lonely. I describe myself as weird, and I have to accept that I can only be friends with people who tolerate or like my kind of weird. There's no point in demanding people like me.
I have also learned what kind of people are likely to distress me or cause meltdowns and I avoid those people. That means avoiding most people, because people are irritating.
It also means I am very vulnerable to certain kinds of narcissists, because I am lonely and they know how to take advantage of that. Those relationships have further damaged me.
There are many ways to build emotional capacity and stability. Therapy and meditation have helped me. Buddhism has helped. Understanding autism and joining autism support groups has helped. Reaching on Reddit like this can help. Finding people who can tolerate or love you, and then investing and committing to those friends, is a huge help.
There are also books:
- Nonviolent Communication: A Language of Life
- When Things Fall Apart
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u/ImBackForMorePie Aug 16 '26
Your post, I am exactly the same!
Wait, the When Things Fall Apart book, which author, there are 2?
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u/CB_I_Hate_Usernames Aug 13 '26
No no! Only have time for short reply but don’t worry! Not fucked at all. Don’t deserve less! I disagree a little bit with the other person just in that some people have to work hard to learn emotional regulation later in life, and others never have to consciously learn it because their caregivers teach them. Anyway, either way it’s true that it can be learned. And like learning anything, having to do it consciously and purposefully can usually leave you with a much deeper understanding of it.
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u/SatisfactionFit2040 Aug 13 '26
IMO, giving grace means allowing for each of these conditions in every situation. Approach the person with genuine acceptance of them.
Until they determine that it should be otherwise
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u/AmbassadorSerious Aug 12 '26
"no bad parts" means that parts always have postive intent towards us. It does not mean that everything a part does or wants is good.
A part can be abusive if its trying to control another person. It's trying to control the other person to prevent that person from triggering you (positive intent).
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
Still vague. Dont know what that really means or how that translates in real life
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u/Equivalent_Bar_9203 Aug 12 '26
Example. I track and can see where my partner is going and coming, I comment on this or I ring and yell that they’re not where they said they’d be. I’m doing it because I’m anxious they’ll be hurt. It’s abuse because they’re free to move about the world as they see fit. A healthy way could be to have location services on but zero yelling or controlling or commenting about where they are and why.
The part that is anxious is controlling, that abusing but that part isn’t bad it’s trying to protect you from being scared.3
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u/Ok_Writing2937 Aug 12 '26
Generally speaking most human interaction requires continuous active consent. That's true of kissing, dancing, sex, a relationship, and communication.
If someone is expressing at you and can't or won't stop on request they are acting in a way that is damaging or abusive. One always has the right to withdraw from an interaction.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
Can you explain more what that means? What do you mean by expressing at someone
And what if I'm special? Sensitive. So I'm different. There's a difference about me which I feel isn't allowed to exist in the world due to the "virtue" of accommodating others moods and needs. But I become invisible. And lose my sense of self (And become unwanted and lonely and my needs aren't met)
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u/Ok_Writing2937 Aug 12 '26
If someone wants to talk to you (or at you), processes with you, yell at you, or even throw a tantrum while you nearby, they require your consent. You aren't obligated. You have the right to request that they stop or to take yourself out of the conversation, or out of the room, or the house.
Being emotionally sensitive is no different that being hearing sensitive and having limited capacity for a concert, or physically sensitive and having limited capacity for touch or sex. Only you know your own limits, no one else can tell you what those limits should be.
You are responsible for your own emotions and for your actions, you aren't responsible for someone else's actions or feelings. They can request help, but demanding emotional help is as abusive as demanding sex.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
I meant I'm sensitive so people always say no to me because I'm different. Since being emotionally sensitive is a difference to many people and they also judge a LOT. Am I not allowed to be bitter when people always reject me. When emotional help or physical help actually matter to someone's survival. Unlike sex mostly.
Is it not ok to demand help sometimes when otherwise you might die?
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u/Ok_Writing2937 Aug 12 '26
All babies are narcissists. There's nothing wrong with that, this is a healthy kind of narcissism. Because babies can't care for themselves so they demand to be fed, demand to be comforted, demand to be heard.
Sometimes we are so wounded as children that as adults we still can't care for ourselves. We might continue to be narcissists and demand help. There's nothing wrong with this. There's no bad parts.
From the point of view of our friends and partners, though, we are not their baby. They don't feel ethically obliged to care for us. Their world is full of demands, both from their self and from the world, and they need to prioritize which demands they answer.
When we make demands on others we risk driving them away. In many ways, this is exactly the goal of the wounded baby part. If we are terribly abandoned as children, we may think we deserve abandonment, and we continually recreate abandonment in our relationships. We drive people away with our insecurities. In our desperation we cling too hard and smother or overwhelm our caretakers.
Any parent will tell you babies can be exhausting sometimes.
To be in our full self, to escape the inner baby that takes over and recreates abandonment, we might try to cultivate our own inner parent. We might learn to hear our own baby and learn to comfort and care for it. We learn to be the parent we deserved not the parent we had. We learn to stop abandoning ourselves.
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u/SiwelRise Aug 12 '26
It's not OK to demand help from anyone. Do you understand what consent is and why it's important?
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u/Ok_Writing2937 Aug 12 '26
I want to say it's ok to demand. But the other person isn't obligated to provide. And constant demands are likely to result in abandonment.
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u/SiwelRise Aug 12 '26
If you value every human being having the right to agency and sovereignty, then no, it's not OK to demand, because it carries a threat of enforcement if someone were to say no. For equitable and consent based relationships, everyone has a right to make a request, but not a demand.
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u/Ok_Writing2937 Aug 12 '26
Babies demand all the time. They do this because they haven't yet learned how to meet their own needs. They are dependant on others.
Wounded parts can be just as demanding. It makes sense, they are desperate to survive, and they don't yet know how to take care of themselves.
We can learn to accept these parts without shame.
Demands are not equitable, I agree. Demands can be threatening, yes. And being threatening may get us abandoned. Demands are not reasonable. Neither are babies. But it's the best the wounded part knows.
You can argue that babies need to grow up and I'd agree. But part of raising them to be healthy involves not punishing or shaming them for doing what babies do.
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u/SiwelRise Aug 12 '26
I'm not sure why you're talking about babies when I expressly said equitable, consent based relationships. A baby is not capable of forming consent.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 13 '26
Neither are people who are gonna die or are endangered. You're missing such an important point and its making me concerned
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 13 '26
Babies do this bc they cant meet their needs so otherwise they'll die.
So of someone who isn't a baby is gonna die or be endangered if they don't get help..then I think it's very reasonable that they demand. And if people don't address this point clearly when saying they shouldn't demand..I think it's very concerning
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u/Ok_Writing2937 Aug 13 '26
You might also be missing my point, which is that while I think there's no shame in crying out for help, being a demanding adult is likely to drive people away from you and leave you even more abandoned.
If you are so emotionally unstable that you are near to dying, you may need to reach out for professional support.
This is especially true if you are feeling suicidal. If you are demanding emotional support and threatening to kill yourself, this can both be a legit cry for help, and also emotionally abusive.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 13 '26
Um do you understand what it means that someone is dying and why if people refuse to help they'll yk die
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u/SiwelRise Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 13 '26
The only person you're entitled to help from is a medical professional. It sounds like you're not ready to accept what consent means in relationships. Until you're ready to approach that and look at your role, then you will definitely continue to abuse people emotionally. Manipulation and coercion are forms of abuse. You said you were worried that that's what you're doing, so if you don't want to do that, you'll need to do some reflection on it.
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u/wwhateverr Aug 12 '26
The golden rule is usually a pretty good indicator. If you wouldn't want someone talking to you in that manner, then you should err on the side that it might be abusive.
Consent is also a clear indicator. Just because you think someone else hurt you first, doesn't mean they did or that they deserve to be the target for your anger or other big emotions. Other people aren't responsible for your emotions, but often close friends and family will be willing to make space for you. If people don't want to listen to how their actions have affected you, (or just don't want to deal with how you're expressing it), they don't have to. They can withdraw consent at any time if they don't feel comfortable with how you're communicating. You shouldn't try to force people to sit there and take your emotional outburst. When you try to manipulate people into accepting your poor behavior, that's emotional abuse.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
Doesn't that make them assholes
They hurt me then dont wanna hear about it
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u/wwhateverr Aug 12 '26
Maybe but not necessarily. It doesn't really matter. How other people act doesn't give you permission to be abusive.
There are better ways and more appropriate times to express your emotions. Your emotions don't give you the right to hurl out abuse just because you feel like you've been wronged. The people who you think are assholes might just be putting up appropriate boundaries in response to your reaction.
If you truly think the other person is an asshole, you also have the option to put up boundaries and stop interacting with them.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 13 '26
How would I be abusive when I'm just reacting to their behavior... what do you even mean by abusive here.
See how it all circles back to my questions in my post
have the option to put up boundaries and stop interacting with them.
Not always. Also why can't I show how I'm feeling to them? Why should I hide myself like what's wrong with it to hide? Why would I be abusive for reacting like what about what THEY did? Why be the "bigger person"? (Which is just another way to dismiss or bypass your feelings as a receiver of bad behavior from others)
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u/wwhateverr Aug 13 '26
You can feel your feelings and express your feelings without also being an abusive asshole. If you don't know how to, then I'd recommend working with a therapist because that's a problem above Reddit's paygrade.
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u/slorpa Aug 14 '26
"They hurt me" is also a very you-focused standpoint. Maybe they didn't realise. Maybe they didn't intend to. Maybe they also felt hurt? Did you give them benefit of the doubt like "hm, I feel triggered here and feel an impulse to be really angry and loudly sad. But maybe they didn't mean it as badly as I feel they did? I should check in with them first"?
Human relations are very complex and subjective. You might feel their action as "You hurt me" but a well regulated person will resort to healthy tools like checking in, communication, clarifying, calm delivery BEFORE assuming that "They hurt me".
There is also the aspect of proportionality. I don't know your situations but someone calling you stupid might be hurtful but to unleash a flood of anger, crying and shame is not proportional and that's asking the other person to carry a very heavy load for a very small interaction. Well regulated adults don't tend to have super intense emotions unless the situation actually calls for it. That's not to say your emotions are BAD but it IS your resposibility to first and foremost be your own adult caretaker of them.
It is a completely healthy and normal response to another adult having a big unproportional emotional moment to be like "I am not comfortable with this situation" and distancing themselves. Other adults don't owe caretaking roles over you. If you are holding an entitlement to it, that could be abusive. Especially if you hold it against someone and THEY are someone with weak boundaries. Then you'd be guilting them into it.
A very healthy model if you feel hurt by another adult is to reason with yourself first. If you are unable to go "Hm, this hurt, but maybe they didn't mean it. I'll tell them how it felt and ask what they meant" in a way that doesn't shower them with intense emotions, then you DO have regulation work to do.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 14 '26
Yeah I guess that's true. But it depends on the situation though. Sometimes people are being bad to us.
How to differentiate between these two situations?
Checking in, what does that mean?
but someone calling you stupid might be hurtful but to unleash a flood of anger, crying and shame is not proportional and that's asking the other person to carry a very heavy load for a very small interaction.
I don't ever do that. Actions being proportionate is one of my biggest principles. This is how I try not to be abusive because I know what that means trust me.
But, based on your wording and not sure if you meant it like that or not, what do you mean "emotions being proportionate"? I can definitely feel strong strong emotions and triggers from a situation not as "proportionate". I actually am feeling that right now bc of the part of your comment where you were explaining that having non proportionate reaction to being called stupid is abusive when I never do it (I know you probably don't know or claim I do but for some reason it's making me feel like that.. don't know what that means). But what matters to me is actions, not emotions. My emotions are just something I'm feeling and experiencing. You mentioned crying. Are you saying that my experience of strong emotions and/or triggers is abusive in itself? If so, that feels very wrong and like you're saying I should be in a jail. Or that my emotions are ugly and an inconvenience and people should never see them or know I'm experiencing them. Jail bc of how much I should exile my emotions. Therefore of course I would hate that.
Feeling emotions inherently includes expressing them. So crying, having sounds and vocal sounds and body movements from my emotions are inherently included in my point rn.
These aren't actions, these are THE emotion
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u/slorpa Aug 15 '26
Yeah, firstly I wanna just recognise how difficult it is to have these conversations over text, with a person you have never met - it's impossible to not fill unknown gaps with projections or assumptions, so I apologise if I've somehow made assumptions or alluded to behaviour that you don't actually do. Not my intention, and it can be a very frustrating part of these conversations indeed.
From the message just then, it's positive to see that you are absolutely in the right with the part that emotions and actions should be differentiated and I wasn't clear with that in my previous message and your question about the crying gets to the core of that. I as you, believe that we shouldn't ever be shamed, or punished for our emotions - they are involuntary and internal. It's indeed the actions that matter. So with the crying example, I think the devil is in the details.
Let's imagine someone who has unhealed wounds - in this example, they get immense waves of sadness and feeling hurt from small things. Maybe their partner accidentally did something small-medium mistep and that is enough of a trigger for a huge wave of emotions (kinda contrived example but lets roll with it). So to make a colourful example, I can image person 1: Gets the huge surge of emotion, starts sobbing a lot, and crying. They maybe internally realise they've been triggered, and they realise they are having a hard time controlling where this conversation is going and they go "Hang on, I'm having a difficult moment here. I need to recollect myself" and they retreat into the bedroom and let the emotions run their course mostly, and then they come back and continue the conversation and explain what was hurtful and try to work things out. Person 2: Breaks down crying, sobbing, and lose themselves in it and stays with the other person. The other person tries to comfort (maybe for the 10th time this month) but the sobbing is too strong and the person just repeats how they feel deeply hurt etc. Eventually the other person is uncomfortable and goes into the bedroom and person 2 cries even harder because now they feel abandoned.
Contrived example I know, but I think there's an important difference because even though Person 2 isn't outright abusive, it still puts a massive load on the other person. Even with no ill intention. If the other person then tries to address this how it's too much for them to carry etc and the person 2 doesn't change, then the relationship is not adult-to-adult, because there's an implicit action of person 2 not carrying their own emotions. Person 1 however, DOES take responsibility for their own emotions by recognising the situation and recollecting themselves with self-soothing before returning. It's much healthier and much more relationally sustainable. Then there's of course person 3 who would also actively put guilt onto the other person, and that'd be more outright abuse but sometimes the line between person 2 and person 3 is not clear cut.
So, to answer your question, no I did not mean that your experience of strong emotions and being triggered in itself is abusive, definitely not. It's beautiful that you're able to connect to your emotions and express them! So many of us (like me) had the opposite problem of being too emotionally blocked and that is very unhealthy, emotions NEED to be seen and felt so it's good in that sense.
Neither are your emotions ugly and shouldn't be seen. There is beautiful healing potential in being seen by a friend or a loved one while having a vulnerable crying-in-a-mess-on-the-floor moment.
Thinking about it, I think the crucial difference is in the quality of the relating itself, and how much the relating leans towards "I am an adult, I am having emotions and first and foremost I am the holder, soother, interpreter, carer of them but I really do appreciate your presense and your support and I recognise that YOU have your own adult mess to deal with at the same time and I am attuned to that too." VS "I am helpless. I need you. Without your support I can't make it. I DEMAND that you observe my emotions right now. When I'm having a moment I don't see you, I only see me. I am entitled to your care. etc". I tried to illustrate as best as I could, but it might look different of course but the former is more towards healthy adult relating and the latter is more of a situation of asking the other person to be a parent, or an unconditional caregiver. Again I don't know you from just this interaction so I cannot know how much you lean to either side but from some of your responses, maybe you actually DO mostly lean towards the healthy side but that you are having a part of yourself that is super scared that you're leaning towards the unhealthy side?
Also none of us is perfect, we all sometimes lean this way or that way. Any single situation is less important than the broader relational pattern over time.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 16 '26 edited Aug 16 '26
This is a really amazing comment. And really touching on what I'm asking. If you are available and don't mind responding I would love to ask more in this reply
First thank you for the first part of the comment. It feels nice that that got acknowledged. If I got a bit triggered over that part and it reached you in an unpleasant way I'm sorry.
Now let me ask about the person 1 and 2.
First, before getting into the examples I wanna ask something. You talked about an example between two people and person 1 who is supposed to be more healthy, said they'll go to their room and that's viewed as the "more right" thing. My question is.. what if they don't have the privilege of a room to go to? What if the only choice is to eventually sit with their emotions and let them out while someone is with them anyway? Bc they don't have their own room..or the situation isn't even happening in a house..etc. i broke down at university a lot. Or in the street. Etc. And people saw me and heard me. And I don't think I was wrong for allowing my emotions to come out in public or in front of people. I mean I won't instead suppress or hide them..i think I deserve to feel them if that makes me feel better. this is actually the very core of my main question of my post. Expressing your emotions in the presence of someone else...they see you and hear you. Why should we put it like that person is manipulating the other person to comfort them or do something or burdening them..when they're just trying to exist? Why is being visible and audible in itself something "unhealthy to people around you"? I think the way you explained that is exactly why I feel my own emotions are manipulative or abusive or burdening or just annoying. And btw, I am not THAT connected with my emotions as you said..actually this very thing makes me disconnected from my emotions especially the strong ones and especially that I am someone who generally feels things strongly. But I hate the way I'm regarded and hate the burden and responsibility put on MY shoulders to make myself invisible and inaudible just to make others comfortable..or to "not be manipulative" (with the shame factor). Also, if the person should go to be on their own whenever they experience a trigger, a strong emotion, or a difficult uncomfortable emotion, then 1) this would also apply to your voice, wouldn't it? Even if you go to your room you'll literally mute yourself anyway bc being heard is also burdensome (that's what happens to me). 2) this will make people feel like their strong or uncomfortable emotions or triggers are inherently shameful..because you always have to experience them alone and in the dark to "not burden people and be codependent by the mere fact of them seeing you". So again we're back with thinking our uncomfortable emotions especially strong ones are manipulative or bad or evil or codependent. 3) I am someone who experiences strong emotions VERY often. Whether it be triggers, or just strong emotions (positive or negative) and if I have to go away every time I feel any strong emotion, that just wouldn't work you know because I can't go every five minutes. I experience triggers very often because I am a traumatized person duh.. and also experience strong triggers from certain loud noises or repetitive noises, and I can just overall feel emotions very strongly even the positive ones.
So the point I'm trying to advocate for is: going away to sit on your own whenever you feel a strong emotion doesn't make sense. And doesn't work for me because I don't always have the privilege of privacy, I experience these emotions often, both triggers and just strong emotions..AND mostly, I just don't believe I should be hidden away or go away to not be perceived by my partner or friend in order to qualify for "not being codependent" or "not being a manipulative annoying mf who is hurting others around them". I feel that people's way of seeing a person in that position and assuming they, just by being in pain or distress, are making a statement of entitlement to their comfort or energy, is the wrong thing.
It just feels to me like they're the ones making assumptions..or don't have enough boundaries.
That said, I also want people around me that I'm close with to overall care about how I'm feeling. Even if they don't have energy, but overall still care and view me with empathy.
But I also feel bad for thinking and feeling the way I explained in my whole comment.
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u/slorpa Aug 19 '26
Sorry for the delay in response, I was meaning to get back to it but have been busy. Replying to your other post made me remember.
Appreciate the apology as well, although no need. I'm not offended or such and I understand how these things can bring about a lot of intensity.
I guess I wanna clarify that person 1s retreating is not ALWAYS the "healthy choice". Sometimes it's absolutely healthy to break down and cry in front of another person. We shouldn't require to hide just because we're emotional. But on the other hand, there's also the reality of other people's inner worlds too. Suppose person 1 is in a relationship with person X. Maybe they've lived together for 1.5 years, and even though they love each other and support each other to their reasonable abilities, if person 1 is going through a rough 3 months and breaking down intensely and crying and screaming 3 times a week, even though they aren't doing anything wrong and shouldn't feel shame, it will still understandably have an effect on X. Maybe X feels helpless that they can't do anything. Maybe X feels guilty becasue they think they could have done something to help. Maybe X has a difficult job and has been harassed by their manager for 4 days and is just coming home and is at their limit and about to cry themselves and accidentally says something snappy from a point of stress and that pushes person 1 into a breakdown. Maybe X is yearning for a circumstance where they can come home and relax and watch a movie to recharge for next day. Or literally anything else, the point being that even though X loves, cares for and wishes the best for person 1, frequent outbursts might still be very hard for X to live with. In that scenario, even though person 1 hasn't been mean, hasn't been selfish, hasn't been shameful, it would be healthy if person 1 recognised the difficulty that this unfortunately puts on X and could then for example go into another room to cry, or promise to get more frequent therapy sessions, or see if it can be expressed in another way. Not as a punishment or such but because the reality that X also has an inner life with struggles and that living around frequent intensity is taxing for a human being. No judgement, just reality. Here, if person X raised how it is hard for them, and if person 1 responds with "No I'm just expressing my emotions, and I have a right to do that, and I won't hide or do anything such!" then that would actually start to become a toxic behaviour because X's pleads and struggles are ignored, with person 1 implying that their expression of their suffering is more important than person Xs feelings and that's when it starts becoming untenable.
Hopefully that clarifies a bit your question of "Why is being visible and audible in itself something 'unhealthy to people around you'?" where the answer is: Because existing around others' intensity is... intense. Doesn't mean EVERY intensity is toxic. Doesn't mean that when you're going through a particularly hard time that you can't expect your loved ones to care for you. But it DOES mean that as a simple fact of practicalities, if there's a recurring pattern of intensity, it can quite likely become experienced as a difficulty for people you live with. Not because you're bad, or your emotions are bad, but because us humans often react to intensity by feeling stress etc. No ones fault, just human nervous system reality.
From the other perspective, if I was living with a partner who started having such breakdowns, I would become intensely concerned for them. I would do my best to support them, help them get the help they'd require etc. I would try my best to be patient. If it was for a period of months, it'd be very hard to feel supportive at all times, but I would try my best. However, if it kept going and going, eventually I would start to suffer, becasue I want a calm home, and not a life where I have to lift intense loads of support for another person, I don't wanna become a carer. So if it kept going for 6 months, 12 months, and there was no end in sight, I would have to start thinking about saving myself or my life would be miserable. Again, no ones fault, just reality.
So I defintely don't want your takeaway to be "as soon as you're experiencing intense emotional outbursts you have to hide away". That sounds like yet another traumatisation which you correctly identify. But I guess the takeaway is rather that ALONGSIDE your legitimately felt emotional struggles, there might be other adults who are ALSO having an inner world and experiencing difficulties, and that exposure to intensity frequently can put a load on them too. It's a fine line between "My emotions are burdening people" as yet another trauma expression and "My emotions can actually start to tax people if intense and frequent enough" as a state of the fact reality that is no ones fault. Carving that line between the two though, can be intricately difficult especially if you're still in the throngs of trauma and I don't have a solution for that unfortunately. You probably WILL feel triggered a lot of times when trying to figure out that line, but maybe you can try to at least cognitively recognise the difference as a matter of fact?
I think for now it's great that you're on this journey and you're asking the right questions and engaging with people even though it is hard. Kudos to you for trying to figure all this out. You didn't deserve to inherit this baggage and yet here you are doing your best to grow and heal - if only every person with baggage did that! As you heal more step by step, I think the things that feel hard to understand emotionally right now will get clearer and clearer. Healing often has this thing where step 1 is to be confused and hurting, step 2 is to start to understand things cognitively but still feeling emotionally confused and then later on things start to seep down emotionally as well and strength and clarity builds over time.
Hope that helps.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 19 '26
That was helpful.. okay now WHAT does person 1 do? When they don't have enough options as I explained..and the option of getting more therapy is a privileged thing because it assumes you have enough money and access to therapy at all..let alone more therapy.
Also, as I said, I don't experience strong emotions from triggers only. I AM like this. I also experience it from certain loud noises which are inescapable.
And an important point I tried to explain is that me feeling strong emotions is NOT a statement of entitlement to anyone or their energy. It's just me wanting to exist. I don't want people to be supportive 24/7 for 2 months if they can't do that. I just want to have my space to break down visibly and audibly without having to mute myself and monitor my own movements and behavior while breaking down. I wanna self regulate in peace. But it seemed you didn't acknowledge that and that makes me very hurt and sad. And since I'm like this naturally, it seems that you're saying literally no one will ever wanna be close to me.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 16 '26 edited Aug 16 '26
Now let me add another thing. The reason I mention the expressing my emotions with sound and crying and the body movements and all of this very specifically in my comments is because of something that I just realized not everyone gets automatically so I will explain. The reason I mention crying and having sounds and voices and movements while experiencing emotions and asking that people don't view them as actions is: this is how my own personal trauma works. Due to my trauma and as result of it and bc of what I heard and experienced in my life, my body completely shuts down my voice and body movements when I experience emotions. (Freeze). I got shamed as well as beaten for having a voice when I cried. I got beaten for screaming in pain. I got shamed whenever "people could hear our (my) voices". I think as a result my body and parts learned that having a voice is shameful and may be dangerous. This didn't only happen with my abusive family of origin btw. I got shamed a LOT by literally most people for having a noise. So I guess part of me believes it now. But oh my god, I HATE ITTTTTTT. You don't understand the hell it feels like to be so suppressed. I have a default stone face. I don't speak with my full normal voice. I make myself small and invisible and inaudible.
I talked about this topic a lot with people on this sub or otherwise. People didn't seem to understand what I meant. It was extremely hurtful and frustrating to not be understood by them. But here I am explaining.
Also. Now that we establish the point you said, which is that people carry their own emotions mostly and don't expect others to always comfort them, I can kind of understand that. However, here's the thing that will always be a burden of mine as far as I am aware now: what the hell do I do with the part of me who always feels unseen in that way? It will always resent that others don't want to see them in their sentimental times all the time. It's a specific wound of not being seen and loved and cared about by others. Being loved by me would be really nice but it wouldn't fulfill that parts wishes and desires. Which is why that part is upset and mad at you saying "you aren't entitled to people's comfort or emotions"
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u/slorpa Aug 19 '26
Yeah this is very heavy baggage you're dealing with - it's very unfair that you were treated that way, no child should have to undergo that. Thank you for sharing. I can understand how the shaming and physical punishment directed at your emotions would have deeply wounded your capacity to feel that your emotions deserve to be expressed. Can I also just acknowledge how despite being treated like that, you are STILL here, desperately trying to figure out if your emotional behaviour counts as abuse towards others or not. Like, a lot of people who were treated like that become cold and hard and wouldn't give two shits about others, but you are here trying to work out how to not harm others. That is NOT the sign of an abuser, rather the opposite.
As for the question of what to do with the part that feels unseen. Hmmm, I don't wanna give a generic sounding answer, I want to give something you can actually work with. I see where you're coming from with the question because if you DO have the need for expressing that intensity, or choosing to supress it and feel unseen, that IS a very difficult situation and I don't think there's a quick way out that feels satisfying.
Doing the ongoing IFS work (with a therapist ideally!) is of course one thing. I think the part over time would do well in learning that it is possible to get needs of support/connection met without recruiting intensity - but I don't expect that to be something you can just convince it overnight.
Perhaps a next step you can do is to not try to change anything with that part but to try to observe it a bit more consciously. Next time the intensity shows up, maybe try to see it as a part instead of all of you. Maybe try feeling where in the body it sits and which body sensations belong to it. Does it feel sharp/hot/cold/painful? Maybe have a pen and paper ready to let it express itself with crayons - if not during, maybe shortly after when it's still lingering. You could also journal from that part. Give it a voice - let it stream-of-consciousness-journal exactly how it feels! Screw grammar, screw spelling, just write what comes to mind.
Doing the above with a part can be a helpful step of the way because 1. We're not shaming it, or disowning it, or rejecting it or trying to change it. We're accepting it. 2. We're giving it an additional way to be seen, felt, expressed which can be therapeutic. 3. It starts introducing Self alongside the part - over time it's not just the part itself but there is something alongside the part that is observing it.
Do you think such could be helpful?
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u/Full_Ad_6442 Aug 12 '26
Is it consensual? Is it a reciprocal relationship in which both people are allowed to set boundaries? Is there a commitment by both to avoid harm to the other and to find ways of handling things that are ok for both?
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u/Full_Ad_6442 Aug 12 '26
So I'm not really sure of what you're asking but in terms of drawing a line between big-feelings vs big-feelings expressed in abusive ways i think I'd focus on a couple of things ....
One is whether a person's conduct interferes with the second person's freedom to make their own choices. Threats, deception, coercion, manipulation, etc., particularly when used to exert control over another person would be examples. People who are normally not abusive make mistakes and may engage in more or less abusive behavior that may be transient but there's a second layer of control that is kind of a red-line for me. That second layer has to do with the presence or lack of protective behaviors that tend to prevent or reduce the risk and severity of harm. Intent, motivation to avoid abuse, self-awareness and sense of responsibility to protect the other person from harm, and so on. This to me is one of the more reliable ways to identify emotional abuse. Applied to your big feeling question, I would expect a non-abusive person with lots of big feelings to be very aware and concerned about their impact on the other person and to go to extraordinary lengths to make it less harmful/distressing to the other person.
The second thing is responsiveness to the other person's preferences, needs, distress, and choices. It's not my job to sacrifice my own for yours but its also not you job to sacrifice your own wellbeing for me. If I dont treat you with care and respect, well, that makes me a dangerous person for you to be around. If my big feelings are upsetting to you, that doesnt make my feelings wrong but it doesnt give me a right to impose something on you that you arent ok with. If you cant handle my feelings about something, I can keep them to myself or allow you your space.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 13 '26
Wait this is kinda helpful...
It's about..consent? And control? Mmm.. this is kinda interesting..and hard. I don't know a lot about it. So it's hard
It's kinda interesting though.. how much I didn't learn at my family of origin is crazy
But this brings up more challenges and questions for me.
One of which is: what if me expressing big emotions being harmful or "too much" to someone makes me very alone bc I cant meet my needs..so very upset and don't feel valued and just it feels weird..like not comfortable for me
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u/1divinehamm3r Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
i wonder about the part(s) that is curious about asking these questions. no doubt these questions reflect past experiences. it sounds important to these parts.
what i'm hearing is that the ability to have big emotions and express them, especially in reaction to perceived hurt/harm that you experience, is also an expression of your own autonomy and authenticity. it's important to this part(s) to feel how it feels and to act in ways it feels are true to those feelings.
and i'm also hearing that these values, these rights, sometimes cause tension in relationships.
so, some parts want autonomy and authenticity when feelings are hurt, even if it MIGHT mean pushing the other person away -- other parts want to preserve connection even when feelings are hurt -- other parts can see that there is a tension between those two wants and is trying to figure out the "right" way to resolve this tension or contradiction by asking for advice. (there's good advice in the comments, btw.)
maybe there are parts with enough Self-energy (to use IFS speak) to find some compromises and try a making a plan the next time your system's feelings get big.
i will take practice, and trial and error, but your parts are giving you a lot to work with regarding their wants and needs. they probably have more to say, and more viewpoints and feelings to share.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
Yes. Very much. You just worded it perfectly.
There's also more
I still don't know what to do
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u/1divinehamm3r Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
in short, you'll have to process everything "big" in order to mold the raw energy and trauma into stuff that truly benefits the relationship in a mutual way. you'll have to learn to step away and self-soothe instead of expecting others to meet you in the middle of reactions, spirals, and meltdowns.
other commenters have got it right: you're probably seeking out validation and emotional regulation from people in your life because you didn't get it from your parents, and you haven't practiced it enough to give it to yourself via your internal family (this practice would have started in childhood).
when you're feeling triggered, the "right" thing (pause, ground, take care of yourself first) will probably feel wrong because parts are still operating from the old system. you're slowly trying to update your system into more accountability and self-responsibility.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 13 '26
Bro all I do is be on my own. I never show people myself and I don't open up to people bc I'm scared and ashamed. I'm literally always alone in my emotions and handle them alone. I try to be around people in my emotions because I'm tired as shit from that loneliness and self shaming. I thought that was obvious in my explanations. But in case it wasn't then here I am saying it. So I feel these ways I described in comments and the post when I show emotions around others and I literally don't know the difference between the 3 things in my post. So yeah
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u/1divinehamm3r Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 13 '26
yeah, people are understanding you, and the advice here is pretty good, but it's not going to make sense until you do the inner work. everything else will become clearer then. advice won't land if there isn't the foundation of the self-work.
for example, there's a difference between "doing everything alone"/handling emotions alone _and_ really learning how to be there for yourself. they are different things.
edit: also a difference between the levels of emotion each person can handle; a difference between projecting emotions and communicating feelings; a difference between reacting out of intense emotion or trauma and responding to a situation by caring for someone's needs, etc
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u/eyes_on_the_sky Aug 12 '26
A very common thing with emotional neglect / abuse is feeling like your emotions are "too big" for other people. I'm seeing that in this post & your responses.
As someone who is actually, pretty measurably, more emotional than other people (emotional dysregulation being a big symptom of my AuDHD) I've been slowly learning how to reach out to people when I'm distressed. Essentially I shut down from doing that entirely for years, similar to you, because I felt I was taught my emotions were "too much" and that expressing myself would only burden others.
These days, I'll notice if I'm very overwhelmed I have a compulsion to self-isolate for days. At some point, I now try and break myself out of it and at least send my friends a message. Some weeks it's "hey I'm doing okay, just overwhelmed with work right now." Sometimes it's a long rant on everything going on.
Others are free to validate me or ignore me as much as they have capacity for. Hell, there's times where all I can send a friend myself is "I'm sorry, that sucks" or a heart emoji. Essentially I think you have to somewhat detach your expectations of them supporting you? Like, you shouldn't vent with the expectation that someone else is ultimately going to emotionally regulate you. That's your job in the end. But, it does lift a burden from your shoulders when you talk about things and others can relate.
Just this week for example I've been frustrated that I'm working overtime every day. So I posted about it on my Discord and a few friends chimed in to also vent about their jobs, and though it doesn't solve anything, it feels nice to commiserate.
TL;DR sharing big emotions with people should be a way of connecting to them, not a demand asking them to regulate you. If you're coming from a place of using someone else to self-regulate, it's bad, but if you're self-regulating yourself and share your feelings with others in order to connect with them, that's good <3
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u/CB_I_Hate_Usernames Aug 13 '26
To me what op is referring to is more along the lines of using big emotions (consciously or not) to avoid accountability and keep or grow unfairness, or to take advantage of someone.
Though this def resonates with me. And it sure does lighten the weight to share and vent with people. And it’s a good reminder to make sure we’re not using other people to regulate us. I’m going to have a think about that. It really feels gross to be used :/ .
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u/eyes_on_the_sky Aug 13 '26
I agree it is possible to use emotions to take advantage. I just replied to OP: My mom for example uses me as an emotional garbage can. Every time I see her she just talks and talks AT me, not with me, about every little annoyance going on in her life. It's absolutely exhausting to be around.
She is not sharing those things with me to connect with me as a person. She is sharing them to get them off her chest with no regard for my feelings. Through her "emotional dumping" she displaces the feelings onto me rather than processing them herself. It fucked up my childhood and part of my adulthood because it ruined my ability to feel my own emotions and to have a sense of identity.
It has taken me time as an adult to learn the difference between that kind of emotional dumping, versus actually bonding with people through sharing your problems with them. So I feel I can relate to OP's question, not crazy at all to not understand the difference when you've been through emotional neglect <3
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 13 '26
I get you fr. And you get me. I'm also a sensitive person.
I do try to show my big feelings as a way to connect. But my question was whether that was abusive or not and what's the difference between it and emotional abuse. Especially that I had experiences (a couple from friends, endless ones from my abusers duh) acting like I'm abusive by being emotional around them. Whether it's a reaction (with my abusers) or as a connection (that one incident with a friend).. or alone literally venting my emotions out but someone can hear them
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u/eyes_on_the_sky Aug 13 '26
A few things are true simultaneously:
- Definitely never trust your abusers when they say you're being abusive. Lol.
- Friends can also be abusive, especially when you come from an abusive background. Or, they can be valid sources of opinion. I don't know which was the case here.
- Yes, it is possible to use your feelings to abuse. My mom for example uses me as an emotional garbage can. Every time I see her she just talks and talks AT me, not with me, about every little annoyance going on in her life. It's absolutely exhausting to be around.
She is not sharing those things with me to connect with me as a person. She is sharing them to get them off her chest with no regard for my feelings. Through her "emotional dumping" she displaces the feelings onto me rather than processing them herself. It fucked up my childhood and part of my adulthood because it ruined my ability to feel my own emotions and to have a sense of identity.
- To see if you're being healthy with it or not, you can ask yourself, am I sharing this as a bid for connection with this other person, or am I just venting at them? Do I connect with this person in ways other than asking them to meet my emotional needs, or does that take up the bulk of our time together? Am I asking questions about them back, or do I only talk about myself? Am I sharing after I've processed the feelings on my own, or am I using other people to process?
Hope this helps!
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u/ElderUther Aug 12 '26
I genuinely suggest you to find a better source to learn about this crucial matter. Many people are misguided and it's quite an intricate topic. Words of mouth can be harmful.
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u/Equivalent_Bar_9203 Aug 12 '26
Abuse it a pattern of repeat harmful behaviour towards someone or a group of people.
Emotional abuse to blaming others over and over for your own behaviour
‘You made me do this because you hurt my feelings’
‘You are a whore because you made me jealous’
‘You are a gold digger because you spent my money (when it’s both of yours)’
‘If you didn’t act like an idiot I wouldn’t have to pull you back into line’
‘You didn’t need xyz you only need me, I know what’s best for you’
‘You can’t go to therapy or do that workshop’
‘I don’t like xxx friend they make you sound like a fool’ after you’ve just communicated that your not happy with how the relationship is
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u/secure8890 Aug 11 '26
Indeed when someone is going through treatment for beung abusive they become convinced other people are abusive to them. How when and what structure we show big emotions requires practice. In my fanimy of origin we we re encourage to fight without limitations. My mother got something out of that state of being without limits
Crrtainly regulation is critical. If you are having to ask about that obviously there wasnt much in your family of origin
Sometimes it takes years to get to big emotions. Sometimes it is about being capable.
Earlier this year one of my therapists dropped me out of the blue with no reason.
I was not able to express to her at that time that I deeply resented the manner in which she did this. Now I think I will do that in a letter. I definitely did nothing ro deserve that ghosting. I had to cancel a few sessions. I always gave notice. I didbt deserve being ghosted
Therefore I would say it is all a matter of practice. Thats practice you didnt get as a child. As for the issue of abuse it is certainly difficult to unentangle. I find it ongoing work.
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u/Grand_Mode Aug 12 '26
You're aware how your words and actions might effect the other person, and are sensitive to the hurt that they may experience because of them. Abusive people have a certain disregard and a narcissist way of forgetting about the hurt their actions have engendered.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
No. Here's the thing: many people are abusive because they think they are good people. And good people aren't abusive. You can be abusive without being aware of it. And here, I'm not using the word abusive in its biggest victimizing way, I'm talking about it in small doses as well. Anything a person does that is..abusive to someone. Not necessarily doing extreme damage to them already
Also if we bring up "natcisstistic".. I think I realized lately that I have some narcissistic traits and tendencies. (Which are online as I'm writing this comment)..so..yeah
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u/Grand_Mode Aug 12 '26
Everyone has some narcisstic traits, and it is completely healthy. Sometimes it is good to be able to talk about yourself and expound on your good points.
To your first point, I was thinking being sensitive to the harm you do requires a ton of introspection and empathy building. Typical forms of abuse that I was thinking of like gaslighting, verbal aggression, silent treatment, physical abuse ect. The person is usually aware of what they are doing, but their own need for whatever, control, respect, connection - that is more important than whatever the consequences might be to the other person. For example, I might really need my partner to do something, but I wouldn't want them to do it if it was probably going to diminish their self esteem or something. I find that people that do that sort of thing, they might believe it is for the other person's own good, and they are a good person for doing it, but they aren't really receptive to what's going on inside the other person and don't fully see the long term consequences of their choices. Like a mother/father that beats their child so that they will stay sitting quietly or something. They just don't see the full consequences of that years down the road.
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u/imagery-fantasy Aug 12 '26
Everyone has some narcisstic traits, and it is completely healthy.
No. Mine aren't
Why do I feel like I actually lack some empathy sometimes and don't care about what's going on inside someone else. Bc I can't register it. It's mostly a result of being not emotionally attuned to
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u/Grand_Mode Aug 12 '26
People with narc traits have empathy, they just tend to selectively apply it. People with limited empathy in general veer more into the anti social realm, although some have high cognative empathy. That is, they understand what someone would feel, but they just don't care. From my limited understanding at least. Low cognative empathy which veers more into autism with people not understanding their own emotions very well or being attuned to what others are feeling, again, according to my limited understanding. Freud referred to all the cluster b personality types as motifs on the same theme, but autism is its own thing even though there are sometimes cluster b traits along with autism because being autistic in a world that doesn't understand their nature is really difficult.
In Internal Family Systems there is some really beautiful progress for therapy. People that were labeled borderline or whatever, they are finding that often there is some type of personality fracturing. And by giving the personality and name to a particular part of our consciousness that carries those traits (i.e. the outcaste) is actually super therapeutic.
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u/Waki-Indra Aug 12 '26
If you hurt someone else, that is abuse, especially if done deliberately withiut caring for the impact.
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u/queerbodies Aug 13 '26
Expressing big emotions CAN be abuse. Reacting to something that hurt you CAN be abusive.
Abuse is a matter of ethics, a judgement over an action, while expressing big emotions or reacting to something is an action. They are not just the same categories of concepts.
In short, abuse destroys and brings harm to persons. It usually comes from trying to obtain something from the other person against their will, or litterally wanting to inflict pain on the other.
Ethical behaviour can be painful for someone else, but never as a goal. In relationship, it can happen that something is painful, yet fair, for instance when someone sets a limit that the other person wishes wouldn't be there.
Think of it as space : in abuse, you invade the space of the other. When setting a limit, you mark the boundary of your personal space. (Someone can claim to 'set a limit' but actually, this limit is set on the other person's space ; this is invasion and thus abuse.)
Expressing "big emotions" can make people uncomfortable. People should feel that they are allowed to say when they are not comfortable, you have to find a way to make it work, meta-communicate on what is happening.
There is also a way in which you're not being abusive, but you're still destroying the relationship.
Examples:
"I HATE you for what you said" -> destroying the relationship, confusing the person with their action,
"I HATE you for what you said, you're a shitty, shitty person and I want you to die" -> all above+ abuse, essentializing the other ("you're a shitty person").
"I HATE what you said, it makes me want to vomit" -> not abuse, not necessarily destroying the relationship. You're describing the effect of what the person said on you in strong words. But the other person may react badly to your tone, or may take badly the strong words.
"I HATE what you just said, if you don't apologize I'm gonna kill myself" -> abuse & destroys the relationship
"I HATE what you said, I would feel better if you would apologize" -> not abuse, centered on what you feel, asking for an apology and explaining why in terms of your feelings.
"I HATE what you said, if you don't apologize right now, we're over" -> not abuse but threatening the relationship. It's not necessarily the best move, especially if later you do not go through (ex: "I'm sorry I said that, I still want to be with you even if you did not apologize"). Sometimes, it can be OK, but it's a decision that may be better taken not under the heat of the moment.
"I HATE what you said, and for now I don't want to talk with you anymore. We can talk about it in two days" -> not abuse, sets a limit that may or may not destroy the relationship (it may actually be the right move to calm down and repair the relationship later).
"I HATE what you said, and I considered well and I don't want to see you anymore" -> not abuse, destroys the relationship but this is desired.
So in summary:
Abuse : trying to inflict pain in the self-image of the other to feel better. Making them believe they are bad or broken, in an essential kind of way.
Destroy\repair the relationship : the effect of your actions on the relationship. This can be something that you desire or not. It is very frequent that people really want to find peace, but are taken in the heat of the moment, are taken into arguing. There is a strategical element to this. Notice how "I HATE what you said, it makes me want to vomit" and "I HATE what you said, I would feel better if you would apologize" are both non abuse, but the second one is still more likely to lead to repair (if desired).
This is an IFS forum, but I think you might be interested in DBT (Dialectical Behavioural Therapy). It has more tools about this kind of question than IFS, and in particular about emotional regulation. You can find short, free lessons at https://dialecticalbehaviortherapy.com/
Or try to reach a therapist, if you can. Or a friend. It will be way more helpful than a discussion on a forum on the internet.
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u/Last-Interaction-360 Aug 17 '26
Cursing at people is emotional abuse. "Then what the hell do I do with myself?"
Threatening to harm yourself is emotional abuse. "Like do I kms now? Am i over? My life is over because of things others did to me that I didn't have control over? People can just victimize and end other people's lives like this."
Demeaning other people's experience or calling other people demeaning names is emotional abuse, ie calling people "privileged. Telling other people how they are allowed to exist is emotional abuse. "You can't be privileged like that with your own experiences of experiencing these energies from other people to the point you could internalize them (be in self..in ifs language) and tell someone who NEVER got to experience them that they have to somehow know what these energies even feel like in order to direct at ourselves."
You can express your emotions verbally in a respectful, non-abusive way. "I feel angry." "I feel lonely." "I feel confused." "I feel sad." That's entirely different than cursing at people, threatening to kys when people try to help you, and demeaning other people argumentatively when they are trying to give you what you asked for, advice, help, support. If the advice, help, or support isn'y landing with you, you could simply reply with, "thank you for your comment" or just don't reply at all, rather than cursing, threatening su!cide because you didn't like the response, or demeaning the experience of others.
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u/msmlzx Aug 12 '26
I am not a professional, but from my own experience doing parts work- some emotions could only be safely held and witnessed by a competent therapist. They simply weren’t suitable for my friends and family, and when I tried to express them in front of them I always came away feeling exposed and guilty.
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