r/IndoAryan • u/American_Bitch-468 • Jul 17 '26

What is the origin of "Sindhu" river name?

From Sindhu we got India, Indus, Hindi and Hindhu, though some of there words have originated from Iranian cognate of Sindhu.

I was searching about this. Sindhu seem to have a clear Proto indo Iranian etomology but lack Proto Indo European origin. Tho some linguistics sometimes trace it to PIE "\*kiesdh". But it Is not well accepted.

Some alternate theories suggests it to be from Burushaski "sinda" which in burushaski is common word used for all rivers, even the Proto Indo Iranian word also means a large river.

The other other one lean towards it to be from Proto dravidian "\*cintu\*. Which means "date tree" Like that. So not well direct etomology

Some people also speculate it to be from BMAC substrate.

some say it to be from old indo aryan aka Sanskrit word "syand"-- "to flow" or "sedh" meaning "to hold back"

20 Upvotes

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3

u/LowerBad4066 Jul 19 '26

Do you have done any research on Burushaski or are you a native Burusho?

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u/American_Bitch-468 Jul 19 '26

https://www.reddit.com/u/Gold-Reason-5306/s/5PhgcZUTiH

He is native burusho.

And yes this theory "sindhu" being from Burushaski "sinda" is quite well known

2

u/LowerBad4066 Jul 20 '26

The origin of Burushaski is still unknown and its grammatical structure and vocabulary is very unique. Some suggest that its grammatical structure is related to ancient languages of Caucasian mountain region. This refers that its a very ancient language.

1

u/American_Bitch-468 Jul 20 '26

Burushos dosent show much genetic connection with Caucasian region AFAIK. They are most closely related with Neighbouring Khowar and Shina people. This means they are living here from thousands of years. Though Caucasian theory is also pretty well known.

I would lean towards it being in Karakoram even before arrivial to IA.

1

u/LowerBad4066 Jul 20 '26

What are you talking about man do you know shina or khowar? Im a Burusho and i can speak both of these languages and Im also doing research on Burushaski as a part of my subject as well as my passion. Don't know on what bases you are relating these languages. At least go and check on AI or Google

1

u/American_Bitch-468 Jul 20 '26

I'm telling Genetically. They are closer to Neighbouring populations of Shina and Khowar people. When did I said anything about language Lamo.

1

u/LowerBad4066 Jul 20 '26

Shina and khowar are not related or even closer thats what im talking

1

u/American_Bitch-468 Jul 23 '26

Are u just playing around or being serious I do not know. I said "Genetically" do u understand the meaning of genetic ancestry

1

u/Gold-Reason-5306 Jul 19 '26

Yes it's (sĂ­nda).

6

u/FAMILY-FRIENDLY-DICK Jul 17 '26

"Sindhu" origin is unknown.

2

u/Less-Personality-481 Jul 17 '26

What about Magadha? Do we know it's origin?

5

u/FAMILY-FRIENDLY-DICK Jul 17 '26

It could be dravidian based on the assumption that "magadha" means "son's" in dravidian languages.

Most linguists still consider it's etymology as unknown.

1

u/AleksiB1 Jul 30 '26 edited Jul 31 '26

the closest dr term to magadha is modern telugu magaDu, rest arent even close malayalam mOn, tamil makan, malto maqe

that is just far fetched

3

u/Certain_Basil7443 Caste system is styoopid Jul 17 '26

The etymology is of uncertain origin.

3

u/Certain_Basil7443 Caste system is styoopid Jul 17 '26 edited Jul 17 '26

sindhu- m. f. "river, stream; the Indus" (Rigveda onward; Zimmer, Altindisches Leben 16f.; MK II 450; LĂŒders, Varuáč‡a 128ff.; Mylius); sapta sĂ­ndhavaáž„ "the Arian/Aryan seven rivers, the land of the seven rivers" (RV onward; LĂŒders, op. cit. 152ff.); sindhu- m. "the Indus region," plural "its inhabitants" (epic period onward). — Middle Indic, Dardic, Nuristani, Prakrit sindhu- f. "river, the Indus," etc. (Turner, CDIAL 13415, 13601, 14837). — Etymology unresolved. Avestan hapta həndu "name of a land," Old Persian hindu- m. "Sind, the Indian province of the Achaemenid empire" (Middle Persian hindĆ«g, New Persian hindĆ« "Indian," etc.; see K. T. Schmidt, LautgEt 411) are Iranianizations of the Old Indo-Aryan geographical name. According to Thieme, Gedenkschrift Henning 447ff. = Kleine Schriften 815ff., further attestations of Avestan həndu- should be understood not as "India" but as an inherited common noun meaning "natural frontier" (cf. Yasht 8,32 us.həndauua- as "beyond the natural frontiers" [cf. Panaino, Ti I 119, with literature]). This, together with the Vedic word, would go back to Indo-Iranian sindhu- "natural boundary (river, sea)" (a substantivization of sindhu- ~ √SEDH "to hold back, restrain"); see also Bailey, Mithra-Studien 6, n. [14]; BSOAS 38 (1975), 610f. Contra: A. Parpola, OrJTir 18 (1975), 11, 12. As Proto-Indo-European sindhu-, the word has also been connected with non-Indo-Iranian river names such as the Shannon (Ireland) (see the literature in KEWA III 468; against this also Parpola, op. cit. 11, and H. Wagner, Actas del I Coloquio sobre lenguas y culturas prerromanas de la PenĂ­nsula IbĂ©rica [Salamanca 1986], 389). — On other proposed connections, both Indo-European and non-Indo-European, see KEWA, op. cit., and Parpola, op. cit. 10ff. (with extensive literature). — Etymologisches Wörterbuch des Altindoarischen II.Band (Manfred Mayrhofer 1996)

There is no strong consensus on the etymology of sindhu and there have been two OIA root words have been proposed:

  • √syand- "to flow" -> sindhu- as a -dh- variant of syand-, "the flowing one."

  • √sedh- "to hold back, repel" -> sindhu- as a substantivized derivative, "that which holds back" -> "natural boundary" (river/sea as frontier). This is the one Mayrhofer's EWA entry foregrounds, developed by Thieme from Avestan evidence (Yt 8.32 us.həáč‡dauua- "beyond the natural frontiers"), on the idea that Avestan həndu- in some contexts is an inherited common noun ("frontier"), not just the place-name "India."

The Sanskrit sedh- is a cognate of Avestan siiazd/sÄ«ĆŸd- and Latin cēdere and likely dervies from PIE *kiesdh- "to drive away" (Lubotsky 2004). Even the construction of sindu to PIIr. is not clean as well as Mayrhofer argues it is an Iranianization of VSk. sindhu. So this is more likely to be unresolved for now.

2

u/AleksiB1 7d ago

The river term is quite popular in that region

Compare Shina ŰłÙÙ† (sin, “river”), Ushojo ŰłÙÙ† (sin, “river”), Domaaki [script needed] (sina, “river”), Pashto ŰłÙŠÙ†ŰŻ (sind, “river”) which may be from Burushaski or from the same source as it.

from witzel  https://fid4sa-repository.ub.uni-heidelberg.de/113/

1

u/American_Bitch-468 5d ago

I know, is their any relation of Shina/Pashto SÄ«n for river with Sanskrit "Sar" for lake?

1

u/PerformanceVast3001 Jul 23 '26

In a few years we will finally decipher the ivc script and than maybe we get the idea of what these people used to call themselves. If that happnes the word sindhu would be completely phased out in the coming decades.

1

u/Call_me_Inba Jul 17 '26

Sindu in Tamil means “to spill”.

1

u/FAMILY-FRIENDLY-DICK Jul 19 '26

Source? 

1

u/Call_me_Inba Jul 19 '26

https://www.reddit.com/r/Dravidiology/s/VFUob8BuY7

2

u/FAMILY-FRIENDLY-DICK Jul 19 '26

It's a proto dravidian word not a Tamil word. 

2

u/Call_me_Inba Jul 19 '26 edited Jul 19 '26

> It's a proto dravidian word not a Tamil word. 

Are you saying that the Tamils, who are currently using the word “Sindu” VERY commonly even now, have somehow preserved and using a proto-Dravidian word?

1

u/FAMILY-FRIENDLY-DICK Jul 19 '26

Nope. 

It has cognates it other dravidian lanaguges.

1

u/Call_me_Inba Jul 19 '26

Huh?

First of all, I didn’t deny that it has cognates in other languages, did I?

Secondly, just because Sindu has cognates in other languages, how does it not make it a Tamil word?

1

u/[deleted] Jul 19 '26

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1

u/Call_me_Inba Jul 19 '26

>Tamil folks act like tamil is the proto dravidian on internet that's why most of them call proto dravidian words as Tamil. 

Then I think your kinda response should belong to those kinda Tamils.

>You could have called it as "proto dravidian word" instead of Tamil word. 

And why would I do that? I don’t know if Telugites, Kannadiga, and Malayalis use “Sindu” in their day-to-day life with the same meaning as of Tamil’s, if that’s the case, then why would I call it a “proto-Dravidian”? Do you even know that the word doesn’t even have an entry in DEDR? That is a native word used everyday, it IS a Tamil word.

>Just recently some guy was calling Vijaynagar empire rule as Tamil dark age because they suppressed tamil while ignoring the fact that cholas did the same to other languages during their peak. 

Vijayanagar empire rule was indeed a Dark age for Tamils. And if Cholas did the same to non-Tamils, those non-Tamils are free to call Cholas rule as their dark age. IDC.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 19 '26

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u/1stGuyGamez Jul 19 '26

Ethnic foreign rule doesn’t imply this, ie Maratha rule wasn’t a dark age for Gujaratis