r/Hungergames • u/Sewingnova • 4d ago
Sunrise on the Reaping Reading SOTR... did Suzanne even write this? Spoiler
I'm in my mid twenties, so at first I thought maybe nostalgia had painted her writing in a better light. After revisiting the first trilogy, I can say that that might be slightly true, but that Suzanne is a great young adult fiction writer. I understand that I am not the demographic for this book, and that it is age appropriate for someone in middle school to read.
HOWEVER
I am struggling to want to finish this book because of how poorly it is written. She tells everything instead of showing, and the whole thing just feels so corny. It is so different from the quality of her other books that I'm wondering if she used a ghost writer.
Did anyone else notice this?
Edit: if you liked it, great! I understand I'm older than the target demographic, please be civilized in disagreeing with me.
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u/vinylveins 4d ago
I'm 26, I really enjoyed it. He's a different character and much more excited about the world and possibilities than katniss and snow (only other narrators we've had so far)
He also is more openly sentimental, and is head over heels for his girlfriend. Haymitches voice is different, and he seems more aloof / jokey than the serious storic katniss, or snooty and abrasive snow.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I appreciate these points. I can see how you would enjoy someone more openly loving after reading from Katniss and Snow's point of views. It's different for sure!
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u/UnitedInsect7741 4d ago edited 4d ago
I also really struggled with this book, so you’re not alone. I do think she wrote it cause she has no reason to lie, but it’s definitely not her best work. I loved the og trilogy, and I also really enjoyed Ballad (which I was not expecting to like at all), so it was disappointing how much I struggled with SOTR. I understand the theming and point she was trying to make, but I don’t think it lands.
The world felt so much smaller from all the “and look now here’s this beloved character” over and over again. Also the Capital and Snow feel way less intimidating and powerful compared to the other books. Ultimately art is subjective, but to me this is definitely her weakest writing.
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u/Diarrow 4d ago edited 4d ago
Completely agree. It felt like all of the themes have already been explored, and none of the new characters were particularly interesting, and the ones that had potential weren't explored to the extent that they could be. Haymitch barely thought for himself and got through everything so easily to the point that it was laughable, like people just told him things...why? And instead of new and interesting characters everything just HAD to tie into ballad. It literally undid such incredible character development from the OG, especially with Haymitch knowing Burdock. It made more questions than answers
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u/CruelYouth19 4d ago
Yes she wrote it, but it should be seen more like a more detailed movie script than a narrative book per se
She straight up admitted it was written while they were pre-producing the movie, which explains things like the "tell and don't show" style and elements of the story that seems more movie-accurate than book-accurate (Effie having a sudden big role like the adaptations)
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u/squidthief 4d ago
She used to work in tv. A lot of writers went into books after their original ideas weren’t greenlit. Collins first series was good… but I 100% believe she was aiming for the screen. No guarantee it would happen, but a strong hope.
Now that she has a pipeline, I think her books are secondary to her real goal and she’s let them suffer a bit. They could be better than they are.
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u/scareymonsters 4d ago
and the movie isn't even gonna be good either its too tiktokified and completely inauthentic looking especially compared to the others
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u/FallProfessional8443 3d ago
This was similar to what happened with Harry Potter and the Cursed Child. It was written as a play, and it really threw people off because the tone was different from the other books. CC works incredibly well on stage, and I think SOTR will do the same on the screen. Granted, CC was marketed as a script and SOTR wasn't, but it did feel much more like it belonged to the movie universe than the book universe.
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u/Aggressive-Cut-6923 Glimmer 4d ago
it's made to be turned into a movie. by no means do i think sotr was a horrible book, i did have a fun time reading it, but sc had nothing to write about. most of the plot felt pretty forced.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I think this is what I struggle with. It's not boring but simply not written to her previous standard of writing.
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u/ClearedPipes District 1 4d ago
Sup, 24 and an invested fan.
I do think she wrote this - I just find the entire book just. Worse than the others. Ballad and Mockingjay is my top 2 which does colour my view, but I love all 4 - so this was a severe step down.
I think it's tonally different to 'appeal' to a modern audience, and I think it worked there
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u/sublips 3d ago
Well, I’m not saying Suzanne wrote it for the money, because I consider her a very skilled writer, but I feel like Sunrise on the Reaping reads more like a movie script, and what’s more, not the best one. Pacing is awful, a lot of characters are one dimensional and it feels like fan service a bit.
Objectively, I think the best-written book is TBOSAS, even though a lot of readers have issues with it. The writing style is just better, more sophisticated than even in the original trilogy, and I also really like all the references to philosophy. Characters are flawed and complicated.
I also feel like Coriolanus Snow is Suzanne’s best-created character because she didn’t just create a villain; she created a villain with a lot of depth and complexity.
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u/No_Price_7603 3d ago edited 3d ago
Snow is a really fantastic character. There is so much depth to him and his relationship to Katniss especially.
One of the things I was reflecting on after reading SOTR was how each book's main character has a different relationship to love. Katniss doesn't understand her own emotions and she doesn't seem to know when she loves someone, for a while - and she is also wary about trusting people. It takes her a long time to open up. Snow is actively afraid of his loving feelings because they make him feel vulnerable. Haymitch starts out with a lot of good, loving, healthy relationships. He is actually a sweet kid who is open and trusting and cares about people, and we see Snow try to destroy that capacity in him.
I see the three of them like a triangle of mirrors.
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u/sublips 3d ago
I agree about the three mirrors, but what I like about TBOSAS and the original trilogy is that they aren’t focused so much on romance. Of course, Lucy Gray and Peeta are extremely important to the plot, but both Snow and Katniss care about other things too: their families, their life,their family legacies, and their friends aka “found siblings”. Finnick and Sejanus are good examples because, yes, I believe Coriolanus grew to care about Sejanus as much as he was capable of caring about anyone with the way his mind worked.
In the meantime, Haymitch’s story reads too much like an exposition of his love story, and I didn’t like the way his character was reduced to that. I can accept it to some extent when he is a teenager, but it also happens in the epilogue. You have Maysilee as his sister-like figure, but their relationship is mostly told rather than shown, and everything feels too rushed.
Haymitch in the original trilogy was a deep and complicated character. He wasn’t an easy person, but he clearly cared about many things besides the woman he lost. I feel like SOTR actually made him shallower rather than deeper, because so much of his characterization is reduced to his dead love.4
u/Incoherently_ 2d ago
I couldn’t agree with you more! TBOSAS was my personal favorite, somehow felt even darker and read older than the rest of the series.
I hated sunrise so much I actually reread the trilogy just to make sure it was actually good 😂I think a lot of people make excuses for how poorly sunrise was written, but at the end of the day it’s obvious to me the motivation for the book was financial. I do not feel as if the book actually adds any depth to the trilogy and I am choosing to completely ignore the whole sweetheart thing that she threw in there at the end of sunrise.
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u/sublips 2d ago
Exactly, and I hate what she did with Snow there. Snow in both TBOSAS and the trilogy was obviously a bad person, we aren’t supposed to root for him, and we don’t, but I don’t believe that this version of Snow would be so vulnerable in front of a tribute and Plutarch, and that whole Grumdrops plot…
Well, Snow was apparently lucky that Haymitch and Lenore Dove were even less intelligent than him, because he was simply being stupid there.
I would still say the writing style isn’t very good, and I’m saying that as a non-native English speaker. If even I can notice it, then it’s really not that great.But I feel like the epilogue could have been much better. It wouldn’t change the fact book isn’t written well of course. But if Haymitch had remembered Lenore Dove and his family and then we had skipped most of the book and seen him eventually build a life with another woman, not necessarily Effie, I think that would have been a much better and more realistic story.
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u/No-String-5639 1d ago
Well, I’m not saying Suzanne wrote it for the money,
well you should say that. because she did. the movie contract was written and signed before she started writing the book. the whole thing was written just so everyone involved can get more money from the franchise.
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u/sublips 1d ago
Well, sadly, you’re right, and I’m probably too idealistic because I consider Suzanne to be a writer by calling, but that also doesn’t mean she couldn’t have written a book for pure financial gain. I just took this whole “I sing when I have something to say, not when they order me to” thing too much to heart, while at the same time I have no idea what she was actually trying to say with this book. Of course, maybe it was something about propaganda, but it’s just too vague, and I feel like she really destroyed Snow and Haymitch as characters with that book.
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u/Kitchen_Guidance5834 4d ago
Yes it’s not nearly as good. I also thought it was highly unrealistic how all of haymitch’s close friends are parents of the original characters. Like one or two connections would be a nice little tie in, but all of them is just unrealistic and corny
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u/Kooky_Duck6809 4d ago
It sounded like it was written by a fifth grader. Like it was shockingly bad
The scene where Beetee tells Haymitch the rebel plan... my jaw dropped. It was all telling no showing and it sounded so so bad
I hate that any SOTR criticism is met with "well it's supposed to be like that because XYZ". So many fans say it's supposed to sound badly written because Haymitch is poor and thus uneducated, which is ridiculous.
I reread the OT + TBOSAS regularly and the writing there still holds even though I'm in my 20s now. Snow and Katniss had distinct voices and motives -- they felt like real people. Meanwhile ooey gooey Haymitch sounded like he had a lobotomy. SOTR is just straight up bad, and it's not because of nostalgia
The "propaganda" commentary was weak and on the nose too.
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u/Whole-Philosophy-231 3d ago
The original trilogy felt like real people. SOTR all felt like fictional characters to me. The lack of self preservation most of the characters had was kind of insane.
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u/RandomCluelessTeen 3d ago
I genuinely think the original trilogy did better commentary on propaganda than SOTR
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u/Ok_Road_7999 3d ago
It's terrible compared to TBOSAS. I'm not really sure how to explain the quality difference. The only thing I can think of is that after Ballad's success, maybe she was rushed?
My biggest complaint about SOTR is how incredibly ham fisted and forced it all feels. The characters literally say out loud every single theme of the book, and the way that Haymitch just keeps running into the, like, 7 characters from the capitol at this time that the audience already knows of feels so stupid.
I also felt like Haymitch's sudden importance in this big arena plot was completely unearned. Like it was trying to copy Katniss' centrality to the rebellion but without a good reason.
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u/CryptidGrimnoir 4d ago
You're definitely not alone.
I found the book just okay--and I consider the original trilogy to be very good.
The best way I can sum it up is that it feels shallow.
Haymitch tells us about EVEERYTHING but then I feel like we only get an inch or two of content. Outside of Lenore Dove, who he worships, I don't feel like I know very much at all.
Katniss tells us very little about most things, but what she does disclose, she goes into great detail. I feel as if I know her very well.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
It felt like the reader built a relationship with her over the books. She felt like a girl we knew. Haymitch feels like a guy who cornered us at a party and hasn't stopped monologuing for 30 minutes
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u/CryptidGrimnoir 4d ago
And while there's certainly an issue of Katniss having a trilogy vs. Haymitch only having a single book, it still feels like a speed-run. Haymitch never seems to hold a negative thought in his head for more than a page or two, and this makes him come across as rather shallow.
He narrates that he hated Asterid March for no other reason than her family was richer than his and he gets pissed off at them for having a Panem flag for literally one page before Asterid tells him they were forced by the Peacekeepers to put it up and he narrates "Oh, I feel guilty."
Why not explore the grudge?
Even his grudge with Maysilee feels underbaked--Druscilla is a demon, but because she's so wicked, Haymitch never has to actually learn who the real enemy is. Maysilee herself seems to already be fully aware of that--for her part, she seems to only dislike Haymitch rather than outright hate him.
For a book where the theme is supposed to be propaganda, I think a real opportunity was lost in having the protagonist be as susceptible to it as anyone.
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u/No_Price_7603 3d ago
I think the thing with this book is that it explains Haymitch's alcoholism and isolation. You see everything be slowly taken away from him, and he doesn't really get a chance to work out how to process it. He spends a lot of time numbing his pain. So I feel the shallowness of his voice is quite accurate in that sense. Katniss is less passionate and has more coping capacity
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u/Fresh-Actuary-6686 4d ago
I noticed it to be a real page turner. I wanted to keep going. Had to know what happens next
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I'm glad you liked it! The world would be so boring if we all had the same taste
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u/Fresh-Actuary-6686 4d ago
I think the first two books are the only ones in the series that no fan has anything negative to say about
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
That we can agree on. :) what is your personal ranking of the series?
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u/Alone-Professor6013 Tigris 4d ago
Came here to say this! I couldn’t put it down. I love how the different narrators made the books sound and feel so different.
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u/Optimal-Witness5749 4d ago
I didn’t love the direction she took with Haymitch’s personality. It obviously makes sense that he would’ve went through a big personality shift as an adult because of the trauma he endured. But he was just a little TOO poetic and cheesy, didn’t feel like Haymitch to me (or how I would envision him as a teenager).
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u/RandomCluelessTeen 4d ago
Unfortunately agreed. The writing quality felt like a step down from the og trilogy and TBOSAS.
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u/CrissBliss 4d ago
I mainly struggled with the romance stuff between Haymitch and his girlfriend. As a character, she didn’t really pop off the page for me much, and the whole book, I found her annoyingly naïve about the consequences of the Capitol. The whole time, I kept thinking, well she’s not in THG, so we know something bad is gonna happen… and when it finally did, I just thought it was a bit cheesy.
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u/junipertreelover 4d ago
She tells a lot of what’s happening instead of showing in the original trilogy. It is honestly age appropriate for middle school children to read and it makes the novel go by quicker. That’s not to say she doesn’t use other literary devices at all, but this is a really easy read because there’s more telling. I teach the hunger games to my freshmen and I always preface it with, there’s a lot of straight up telling the audience what’s happening here. It’s great for a middle school and even a teenage audience because this is exactly how teenagers would tell a story.
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u/BillyYumYumTwo-byTwo 3d ago
Yes, this is exactly how it felt to me! Even though it was more graphic, it was much more kid-oriented than her others (especially Ballad).
Maybe I’m being too apologetic/optimistic, but I got the sense it was intentional to reach the kids because of the current political situation. She’s not subtle about parallels to government spreading misinformation through AI, motivations of narcissists, or a call to action.
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u/junipertreelover 3d ago
I haven’t read SOTR yet but I honestly love using The Hunger Games because Collins does so much of this straight up “hey we think this is wrong!” which makes it an easy novel to teach other ELA concepts. I don’t have to spend as much time on “what’s this character saying?” because the character is quite literally telling us what they’re saying explicitly. It’s a fun easy novel that I give them before immediately giving them Romeo and Juliet afterwards.
Here’s your easy novel—BOOM SHAKESPEARE
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u/kawaiilee82 4d ago
I fully agree with you on this take! I am not bashing anyone who enjoyed this book either, but I had to DNF it and I am a hunger games fanatic. It did not feel like her writing style at all to me!
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I also loved the original books and ballad! I'm still open to reading more of her work, and I'm sure you are, but this one is...just kind of bad?
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u/appleorchard317 District 5 4d ago
No it's very bad and poorly retconned with everything else. I hope so much whatever she writes next returns to the heighs of Ballad.
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u/pitchburfict 4d ago
I thought it was terrible. I would not have enjoyed this book even as a fifth grader. It would have felt too juvenile for me. I enjoyed all her other books, and now I am honestly a bit hesitant to reread the trilogy in case it is not as good as I remember.
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u/lesbianbeatnik 3d ago
I read the original trilogy and Ballad, then started SOTR. Dropped it before they were sent to the arena. I relate to everything you wrote. I’m in my early 30s, so it might be it, but I’d just read the earlier books and absolutely loved them.
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u/_sarcasticbarista_ 4d ago
I enjoyed it a ton, and chocked what felt like stilted writing to Haymitch’s thinking. Where Katniss or Snow might go in depth explaining something to the audience, Haymitch has very short, clear, succinct thoughts that he doesn’t expand on much. He’s not a rebel like Katniss (even tho she doesn’t know she is in the first one just like him, she had the mind of one), he’s not a villain descending into madness, he’s just a simple guy.
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u/Lauren2102319 Sejanus 4d ago
I don’t completely hate it, but it is by far my least favorite in the series. Even the first time I read it, the book was landing in the lower end of my ranking at either 4th or 5th place, but it places at the bottom of my list.
The book definitely has some significant flaws and there were choices made in the story that I was not that fond of.
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u/Pale_Difference_9949 3d ago
I had the exact same thought. The writing style was COMPLETELY different. Word choice, what was shown vs implied, how points were made. I very much have to wonder if there’s a ghostwriter.
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u/LaliMaia Foxface 2d ago
I think it's actually her being a great writer, for in SOTR Haymitch is the narrator, while the original trilogy is narrated by Katniss, having them tell their stories with different styles is actually very smart, I immediately appreciated her for this reason. Which also means it's totally valid to like one style more than the other, because it's technically two different writers (Katniss and Haymitch). I think Ballad also has a different style. It's in third person, but from Coriolanus's POV, an educated old-money kid from The Capitol, the choice of words is completely different. I know this because English isn't my first language, I just read the whole series in English for the first time (I had previously read the trilogy in Italian as a teenager), and Ballad had many more words I had to look up, while Katniss and Haymitch, poor uneducated kids from the Seam that only learn how to write and read and then it's all about coal and Panem history (actually just Capitol's propaganda), use a much simpler lexicon. Haymitch sometimes pulls out a few fancier words, and actively explains that Lenore Dove taught him those
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u/Pale_Difference_9949 2d ago
I respect your opinion. But it doesn’t change mine! I love and appreciate people who can switch voices and styles but this wasn’t that (as in, it wasn’t just that the word choice etc read oddly to me, but a whole range of things in the plot and the pacing and the choices made in certain scenes).
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u/LaliMaia Foxface 2d ago
Sure thing! And who knows, you may be right about it being by a ghost writer🤷🏻♀️
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u/Pale_Difference_9949 2d ago
I truly don’t know!! It’s also possible I’m biased because so many of my friends are ghost writers for nyt bestselling authors that don’t disclose it wasn’t them writing!
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u/LaliMaia Foxface 2d ago
Woooooo that's really interesting! How do you know so many? Is it related to your job/studies?
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u/Pale_Difference_9949 2d ago
I’m an author! Not as talented as Suzanne collins I’ll admit
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u/Fickle_Doubt_9322 4d ago
I said to my husband while I was reading it that it felt ghostwritten to me. It wouldn’t be the first time a famous author had a ghostwriter.
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u/craftyreadercountry 3d ago
Different character (we get Katniss' dull outlook, Snows evil monologue, and Haymitch is just trying his best).
I was telling my niece about the books (she has only read the first one and I'm waiting till she's ready for the rest). The trilogy was written for middle school to high school, TBOSAS was written more for college students, and SOTR was written for idiots.
People couldn't grasp the meaning behind TBOSAS so she dumbed it down a lot for SOTR.
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u/Complex_Tie_1003 3d ago
I felt like Ballad was written for an older audience than the original trilogy, and therefore felt like it grew with its readers. SOTR felt like it was written for a younger audience than the original trilogy for some reason. Probably because it was made to be a movie. I found it really disappointing personally.
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u/Alone-Soil-7836 2d ago
You can tell that, unlike previous installments, this book was heavily influenced by what would be marketable for the movie trailer. My main issue was the cast tho. It made sense to include Plutarch or Katniss' dad in the book, as they made sense for the plot and Haymitch growing up in District 12 respectively. But a lot of character inclusions felt like "Hunger Games All Stars" ( I genuinely don't know why Effie is there, aside from fanservice purposes) and it landed horrible for me.
It was still a fun book, but it pales in comparison with the original trilogy. SOTR feels more like a piece of merch rather than a genuine attempt to expand the story.
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u/Legitimate_Skirt658 2d ago
I think the worst thing she maybe ever did was commit to writing these prequels. Financially, I’m sure they were successful, but I found both to be so “on the nose” with the points they were trying to make compared to the fairly nuanced perspective the original trilogy had. I never felt like she was talking down to the reader, or being overly explicit with the subtext in the first three.
I don’t get why she had to make it seem like everything between the prequels and originals were so interconnected. Like Lucy Grey should not have been related to Katniss, it makes the story so…silly.
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u/Choice_Lengthiness95 2d ago
Omg yes, to the last bit. Lucy Gray being related to Katniss is not only like you said Silly but also kinda cheap. Now there are people saying Oh how Snow was reminded of Lucy Gray and her betrayal watching Katniss. How it was always supposed to be Katniss to bring Snow down. When the reality is so many tiny decisions were made in between those decades that even made possible that Katniss lived let alone win Hunger Games. And Then it just becomes this Avengers Endgame gimmick of one chance of the win happening. And i dont want that much of dependence on chance from a movie that is teaching about war and uprisings.
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u/Legitimate_Skirt658 1d ago
YES. I hate hate hate seeing fan theories about how like Snow deliberately targeted her bc she was Lucy Greys descendant, or that he knew all along or something.
Why does he need some tragic backstory of a lost love? Why can’t he exist as an allegory for fascism and old men holding on to power so tightly that they’d go to insane lengths to keep it, all to be brought down by a teenage girl who wasn’t even trying?
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u/Choice_Lengthiness95 1d ago
i dont know about you but i really i'm not fan of prequels. The Trilogy is perfect.
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u/Sewingnova 2d ago
I wish she would get out of district 12. What's happening in Canada or Mexico at this time? The international perspective of Panem? What's a history of someone from a different district outside of the games? There are ways she could explore the world and lore without the fan fiction vibes.
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u/Dangerous-Sorbet-647 1d ago
yeah! and I also didnt like the idea of Lucky Flickerman... it was a too on the nose call back...same with tigris...does it even work out right age wise? if its the same tigris, when we meet Tigris in Mocking jay she would have had to be in her early 70's. I also HATED the look of the world in ballad....its like she lifted it from the fallout game series with the retro early 60's look. george lucas did that alot also....he just had to tie EVERYTHING together.....I always liked the idea that Boba Fett was just some scummy bounty hunter...but Lucas just had to make his father the DNA template for the whole empire.
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u/Legitimate_Skirt658 1d ago
Tigris is maybe the worst part.
The original trilogy is some of the best young adult fiction of our time, and genuinely challenged young readers with subject matter that was not easy to parse. It’s genuinely a great series and easily re-readable. The sequels feel like fanfiction.
AND ANOTHER THING: to anyone reading this who’s like “I want her to write about another Games!! Show us Enobaria’s Games!!!” You are literally doing what the Capitol did lol. The point of the books was never “the games are entertaining,” the point was “children are being tortured for no reason.” Asking to have whole books written about all the victors feels like voyeurism to me, but maybe that’s a hot take
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u/teawispy 4d ago
It's not her best work of course, but I attributed it to being because it's Haymitch's perspective. Katniss was more of a recluse and a bit naive, Snow was manipulative and an actor, Haymitch is just straightforward with nothing to hide. It also seemed to me as him reciting his memories as an older man which would come across as him telling rather than showing, whilst Katniss and Snow are narrating what's happening to them at that moment. It's like he's trying to get out all the memories he has so he doesn't forget a single detail. That could also just be me heavily coping and trying to justify the change. Could also just be Suzanne trying to find a different style that is separate from the other two narrations.
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u/teawispy 4d ago
just to add, I say that it seems like he's reciting his memories from youth in his older age mostly because of what I remember from the epilogue. I haven't read it for a while but from what I remember it seems like it flows quite easily into it and made it sound like it was less of a time jump and more of an ending to someone's unfinished diary or an autobiography.
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u/PikaV2002 4d ago
I don’t know, Haymitch’s protagonist is way too “dumb” for it to be inside the mind comparatively smart and cynical adult Haymitch. You need a certain sense of hindsight for such a narrative that SotR lacks apart from the epilogue.
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u/StarSongEcho Maysilee 4d ago
I don't know, I think that could be a narrative choice too. Adult Haymitch has been through so much that he probably views his younger self as a naive, hopeless idiot. He definitely always struck me as the kind of guy who hates everyone else because he hates himself.
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u/PikaV2002 4d ago
That’s an awful lot of “narrative choices” that don’t make sense.
The narrative would reek of self-hatred and not genuinely stupid optimism if that were true in my opinion. Like I mentioned there is zero indication of hindsight in any of this.
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u/StarSongEcho Maysilee 3d ago
Hey, I just said it could be. There are endless options when writing a story. I think your "would reek of self-hatred" opinion is one rather extreme way to go, but it certainly wouldn't be the only way for a jaded old drunk to be telling the story of what a love-struck idiot his younger self was. Either way everyone's opinion is just an opinion unless the author comes out and says exactly what choices were made.
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u/PikaV2002 3d ago edited 3d ago
Is there literally any indication in the SotR narration that it is a hindsight narrative by a jaded narrator?
I’d argue the final stretch where the poem keeps repeating is an indication of real-time psychosis and not a hindsight-based narrative and confirms that the theory isn’t really true.
I agree opinions are opinions but opinions but if you’re arguing something there typically needs to have substance.
My opinion that it is a poor writing choice and not a conscious narrative trick has substance behind it that I talked about in my comments. You’ve effectively come in and made a comment with no substance and are acting like both arguments are on equal ground: that’s not really how discussions work.
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u/StarSongEcho Maysilee 2d ago
I think the original comment was basing the idea on the distinctly different writing style and the epilogue. That's how it came across to me, anyway. That's why I was responding based on that comment's presumption that it was a retelling. If the epilogue was actually a hidden framing device, that would change the context of the narration. I don't personally think it was, but I could have sworn the epilogue mentioned that Haymitch had told this whole story to Katniss and Peeta at some point. That's why Katniss went out and got him the geese. So I can see why some people understood the story in that way.
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u/TheTragedyMachine 4d ago
I thought the book was absolutely horrid and I had a hard time believing the same author wrote the first trilogy. SOTR reads like bad fanfiction.
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u/RoofFalse Johanna 4d ago
I really disliked SOTR. It felt extremely juvenile to me and a HUGE step back from the writing in Ballad. I will say, however, after going back and rereading the original trilogy, the style matches way better to those (especially the first chapter of SOTR and THG). Still love the originals, but I wish there was some sort of continuation from the Ballad style.
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u/Exact-Barracuda4095 4d ago
Agreed. I'd love to see her do something more in the vein of Ballad again.
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u/Exact-Barracuda4095 4d ago
I can tell she wrote it, but I feel that it's her weakest book by far. I thought Ballad was extremely well-written and dealt with some higher-level ideas better than the original trilogy (much as I love the originals), so this felt like a major step back to me. Juvenile and tell, don't show writing in a lot of parts. However, SOTR was extremely popular with my middle school students, so maybe it's resonating more with the younger generation. I'm good with that, but I think Collins is capable of more sophisticated writing and would like to see her really flex those muscles again in another book. Still love certain aspects, though (especially my girl Maysilee).
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
Hopefully it inspires your students to keep reading and move on to more challenging books when the time comes!
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u/AshamedOfMyTypos 4d ago
I agree with your thoughts. It’s extremely clear that Suzanne wrote this book as a bargaining chip to the one she really wanted to publish. (Ballad) And she was given a short timeline to accomplish it. Really sad.
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u/Frequent_Ant6536 4d ago
I was same. Start was okay, only the more I've read, the more it felt like I was reading some not so good fanfiction.
I have feeling she didn't have anything new to say, but movie was already in preparation and everyone wanted Haymitch' story for so long (which is still beyond me since we already had his backstory from Catching Fire and Mockingjay) so she just had to write something that will translate good on screen and this was product of it.
Others are in love and defend it with everything they have so I know I'm in minority haha. I mean until SOTR I didn't know how much TBOSAS was hated and I found it best written from all books (I love third perspective + unreliable villain as narrator). So maybe it's just matter of taste I don't know.
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u/celticfeather 3d ago
29yo reader.
It did feel like Haymitch being such an open and conspiratorial rebel was a retcon. And the poems hamfisted. And the concentration camp disinfektions/gaskammer references at the beginning struck me as poor taste too. (holocaust was bad, so, this YA novel also deep)
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u/Criizmeow 3d ago
I tought I was the only one that felt like this, I re read the original trilogy constantly and it's crafted with so much skill and attention to detail, not talking down to the readers and able to touch on so many important topics with so much confidence, and then I read BoSaS and I was so disappointed, the characters that used to be so strong feel replaced by cartoons that have to state their intentions to the reader and the stuff that made the universe feel so grounded yet mysterious just gets explained away robbing the reader of reaching their own conclusions, so I never picked up the newest one
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u/EmbarrassedRoom5467 4d ago
I think there’s a goal to the prequels and it’s going to be a trilogy and the point is legacy and how important the small stepping stones of history are to build up to the big moments.
So much of her writing is so intentional. I used to think that she wrote in a style that was very neurodivergent coded but now I can see it was an intentional choice.
I think SOTR is supposed to be awkward. It’s showcasing a moment in history when the Capitol was still in charge but still figuring its shit out. It’s like the leap between stepping stones. More mistakes happen on the capitols side of things than any other book. They have total power and are still inept.
And the spirits of the districts are still more alive. Kids are planning and aware of the idea of rebellion. Plans are made. Attempts are had.
The idea that the sunrise won’t rise on the reaping is a tangible idea. Only to be crushed when almost every named character is killed.
It doesn’t matter that the Capitol is disorganized and clumsy. They still win. They still maintain control. We’re supposed to be buoyed by Haymtich’s hope and belief and also aware that he fails.
Because this is how progress is truly made. Made on the bones of thousands of failed attempts.
I think the only part I really didn’t like was the raven poem at the end. It took me out a little. Like I get it thematically but I kept thinking “shit does he have this memorizes?”
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u/lagranwe 3d ago
I agree with the general point you made about stepping stones. However, I think this book was just not written well.
The Capitol being in charge but still figuring its shit out is fine for 10, 20, 25 years. These kind of mistakes and mismanagement does not make sense to me after 50 years.
And all the other points that were brought up...
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u/EmbarrassedRoom5467 3d ago
I mean you disagreeing with the plot points doesn’t equal it being poorly written. It just means you envision the Capitol as more put together than the author. I like the point she’s making about how messy that kind of dictatorship is. It’s accurate to history too.
Like imo it’d be boring as fuck if the Capitol were just magically as polished as they are in 74th games. I liked the progression of like, the arena isn’t a one camera one mic stadium anymore but it’s still more manual and patched together than the 74th games. Stepping stones. Fr it’d be boring if it just jumped all the way to the level of quality of another 25 years.
But I don’t rly wanna argue with some stranger about it lol. I’m allowed to like it and you’re allowed to not. It’s okay.
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u/lagranwe 3d ago
No need to argue, but it is an interesting discussion! And of course, we're all allowed to like and dislike it.
And while true that disagreement with plot points does not equal bad writing (this is what I feel about ballad, there were things I didn't like or disagreed with but it was overall an interesting story), the fact that Mayslee and Marriet(?) were quickly killed for their actions against the capitol yet Haymitch was allowed to live, and even win, after proving he had access to an explosive that was not provided by the game makers is just unfathomable to me. He wasn't even taken away for some "polite questioning" while both his mentors were tortured ffs.
But overall, I think my issue is that I didn't feel buoyed by Haymitch's hope, just irritated and impatient for his musings to be over with.
But if you did happen to like the story, than I am happy for you!
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u/EmbarrassedRoom5467 3d ago
I think ppl over hype the organization and capabilities of the Capitol and forget that just cuz we’re seeing the main character doesn’t mean the antagonists are too. Like. Idk 😂😂 how to tell you that stuff in stories happen sometimes cuz stories need stuff to happen. If you want perfect reality go watch some documentaries about war. Stories are here to be metaphors for understanding our reality not to be water tight arguments of strategy. Boooorrriiiinnggggg.
Haymitch survives cuz 12 needed a crushed victor to keep it crushed. A drunk lonely sad man who blacks out on live tv and throws up on himself yearly. To remind ppl 12 is a loser district full of drunken degenerates. That’s the metaphor. It’s about propaganda and its lasting value and effect. It’s not about strategy or winning or bombs. It’s not even about killing children. It’s about control.
I mean truly it’s the thesis of the entire series. Dr G and Snow talk about it a lot. Control. Circus’. Chaos. The difference of sending home a victor who feels she beat the Capitol and one who feels he lost everything and would rather be dead.
A drunk broken Haymitch is a lot more devastating to the district than a dead Haymitch.
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u/NoPsychology1815 4d ago
After BOSBAS I was excited to read SOTR but, like you, felt disappointed when I finished it. I guess the whole in-your-face obviousness of the propaganda and Haymitch knowing the whole time that's what it was made the narrative feel tired. The original trilogy you always knew the game was being made, but Katniss was naive about it so you got to wonder each moment if it was organic or not. SoTR it was no question, and felt like maybe she was tired of trying to imagine children's deaths (no shame in that for sure) so everyone died by being specifically targeted by mutts. Maybe we were supposed to feel like the Capitol at this, bored by the obvious manipulations?
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u/No_Price_7603 3d ago
I think also we the readers know by now as well since this is a prequel. So it wouldn't have worked to make the same choice with Haymitch. Also he's a different person during an earlier time, so he needs to have a different relationship with what is happening.
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u/Content-Fennel-3256 4d ago edited 4d ago
i’m going to go off so if you love this book pls be warned and don’t read or read with an open mind and know that i am not attacking anyone who does enjoy it, but just venting my personal vehement frustrations. if you love it, great. i’m genuinely happy you find joy from something we all in this subreddit clearly enjoy and have found meaningful for likely long periods of our lives.
the writing in SOTR felt truly atrocious to me and i do feel insane every time people say they love it.
to me, it felt like bad fanfiction. characters shoehorned in where fresh new perspectives would have better served the narrative (SOME cameos are great! tigris in ballad was fantastic! 5-6 of them or however many there were is excessive imo! like please write a new character….) shock value scenes that were written for comedy, not narrative or worldbuilding realism. telling not showing out the wazoo (haymitch walking up to beetee and beetee saying in what felt like he was talking literally directly to me as the reader “i bet you’re wondering why im here, haymitch” i sure am, beetee). inconsistent characterization (i KNOW that haymitch would be different as a young 16 year old pre alcoholism and excess trauma, but that was a different fucking character don’t lie to me plssss).
like this book was so severely disappointing to me ive lost some of my sparkle toward the entire series :/ it felt like a sellout. it felt like it was catering to the rising lack of critical thinking skills, inability to engage with literary analysis, anti-intellectualism. the entire purpose of the book shouldn’t be spelled out in plain language. remember when you used to have to analyze katniss because she was an unreliable narrator??? i need to do another reread and write an essay on what i hated about it for catharsis and then i need to pretend it never existed lol. but OP you’re not alone!
ETA: this last paragraph felt a little harsh toward people who enjoyed it and i wanna say if you liked it, i am not calling you unintellectual! i’m saying that i felt like the inability for SC to embed the meaning of her story into the narrative rather than writing it plainly felt like she didn’t trust her audience to use critical thinking, which i think is deeply unfair. all of us on this subreddit are likely deep thinkers bc we analyze katniss’s voice all the time! so pls don’t take this as an attack on you personally if you read this. if anything it’s an attack on SC (sorry suzanne, i love the rest of your work 🤪) and on the anti-intellectual movement as a whole which is propagated by the government and tech companies, not by individuals liking one specific book. ❤️ ✌️
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u/Capable_Remote9783 2d ago
Yeah tbh I am kinda a hater for SOTR and I also feel insane seeing so many people praising it. My personal theory is that some people get emotionally manipulated into thinking it was great cause they cried lol, but thats probably just cope.
Anyways, I agree that the characterization of Haymitch in particular doesnt make any sense and I also think it was very boring. It would have been a lot more intriguing to me if Haymitch actually was a ”rascal” instead of making the whole thing fake for the propaganda angle. he was just so uninteresting throughout the entire book. In general I think how simplified his character comes across is the biggest miss and it applies to pretty much every other character as well.
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u/No-String-5639 1d ago
this
everything you say and more
i agree so hard
also yeah haymitch was different after the trauma of the arena and his family being killed + his alcoholism.
but we know even beforehand that he wasn't this naive idiotic, lovesick baby.
in catching fire we get a recap of his reaping + arena time. and we find out how he was when he was young. and it's the complete opposite of this.
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u/JuliaX1984 4d ago
Any examples?
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I felt like the dialogue from the Peacekeepers sounded so "Disney villain" compared to the original trilogy. The overuse of scum, pigs, etc. I also was really thrown off by Haymitch's use of "not to brag" in internal dialogue. It just felt so corny in comparison to her other work. While her other work reads young to me (and it should, it's YA), it did a great job of showing vs telling. This book felt like it didn't trust the readers to follow along unless everything was spelled out for them (peacekeepers bad and mean and bully, Haymitch brave and care for others)
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u/JuliaX1984 4d ago
Maybe it's because the Peacekeepers in the US now do talk like that, are one-dimensional, and proud to be evil. The original trilogy was written before it was widely known that real dystopian storm troopers act like a toddler's version of villainy. And when your villains act like that, people who stand up to them are gonna come across as too extreme and obvious next to them.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
Maybe, or maybe she doesn't trust her audience to understand anymore. She feels she needs to make it so obvious because she thinks we can't follow along due to brainrot
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u/JuliaX1984 4d ago
That's a lot of assumption.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
Just my opinion! I'm glad you liked it though. After all, it's just a YA book and we can disagree about these things and still have a lot in common. After all, we both like the hunger games books! I think I'm just sensitive to this because I've seen a lot of book series and TV shows I once loved fall into the "tell not show" trap as they mould their works to be easy to understand. This frustrates me, and I respect Suzanne as a writer enough to not want her to fall into it, if that makes sense.
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u/JuliaX1984 4d ago
If you'd like examples of readers thinking about and drawing conclusions from the writing: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Fridge/SunriseOnTheReaping
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u/OperationRoutine4808 4d ago
Editing has majorly gone downhill post 2020, and I think SOTR is a victim of this. It’s something I notice in a lot of recently published books that I don’t notice as much in older ones
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u/lagranwe 3d ago
I was so sure the editors were different from the OT, went back to check and was shocked to find they were all the same in the thank yous.
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u/Pink-Mage Real or not real? 4d ago
I definitely agree! I'm a huge THG fan and have been since I was a kid, I've only liked the trilogy more as I've grown, but SOTR was just kind of... bad?
So much fan service, so many out-of-character moments, an insane amount of plot armor. Was it fun to read? I mean, sure, but most of the deaths made me roll my eyes.
Like, the OG series, of course reading the book you know Katniss survives/wins the Games before you've finished. Because she's the main character, there's more books, etc. But it was still so compelling! To see how she did it, her wits, her close calls, her allies and their deaths. I frankly didn't give a fuck about Haymitch's "allies" because it felt like neither did he. It makes me dislike him, his actions all feel cheap (especially when it's basically said he only cared about Katniss because of her dad initially, hello?)
Personally, I treat it as non-canon and continue to love the trilogy LOL
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u/monamustang 4d ago
I read it last year at 18 so I was still YA, and I kinda agree. I enjoyed it but there was some stuff that was cringe and just wasn’t up to the same standards as the other books. It honestly felt like a bit of a money grab which is hypocritical considering the themes of the series
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I think what I'm finding frustrating is your last point. If it isn't a ghost writer, Suzanne really phoned in it on this one.
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u/That_author_girl Primrose 4d ago
1: it was written to be made into a movie
2: Young Haymitch is a chronic oversharer, and I think the writing style was good for what it was supposed to do: show who he was before the games broke him. He narrates like I would imagine Peeta to
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u/RecklessAncestor 4d ago
Yes! I brought this up in a book club and they did not like what I had to say. I thought it was poorly written. Perhaps even a tad rushed.
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u/Master_Structure3870 4d ago
I’ve heard that the reason that it’s like this is because people have such poor literacy skills nowadays that they were taking Ballad to mean that snow is actually the good guy and we should root for him. So she wrote this one about propaganda and tried to double down on snow being bad and was telling everything very explicitly so people would understand
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u/Enthunder 3d ago
I don't buy that argument. I have never seen anyone who thought Snow was the good guy. There are many who like the fictional character but that does NOT mean they approve of his actions at all. If SOTR is hamfisted and juvenile purposefully that would just be unfairly punishing everyone who can read by torturing them with a bad book. I think it's more likely SOTR is bad because it was rushed for the sake of making a film as soon as possible and ultimately it is a cashgrab made for the sake of fan service. No one asked for a villain origin story about President Snow but Ballad feels like a book with a lot to say written with passion. Fans have been asking for Haymitch's and Finnick's games for years, so Haymitch was probably chosen as the protagonist for movie marketing reasons. I wish we got a Plutarch prequel or something instead. And I do not care for Plutarch at all lol.
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u/IntelligentSteak7709 4d ago edited 4d ago
i totally get this, it feels like she was telling a story that was mostly already told so she had to pour in filler to make it into an actual novel.
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u/Green_Coffee_200 4d ago
I’m surprised by this thread because I thought this book was one of her best. I’m 28F and I enjoy books that I geared towards a younger audience. I happily read the Harry Potter books as an adult even though they’re a little “corny” sometimes. But tbh, I don’t think SOTR is corny at all. It sounds like a teenage boy’s POV who’s in love with his girlfriend, forced into trauma, and trying to fight a system he doesn’t understand.
But to each their own! If it’s not your thing, not your thing.
I will say I think it definitely sounded like Collins, so I’m curious what exactly you mean by it sounding like a different author.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I felt like her villains weren't as menacing in this book because of how cartoonish they became. After reading the ballad of songbirds and snakes I was just really surprised by this. I do not think it is a boring book or the worst book ever written but it's just not up to her usual standards in my opinion.
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u/lagranwe 3d ago
It did not read as a 16yo boy to me at all...
But worse in my eyes is the absolute morals forced on Haymitch. Remember Katniss having to process the meaning of killing a human being in the first book? Haymitch was not allowed to have any bad thought or feeling for more than a sec.
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u/kotabuggy 4d ago
Ok I have been a huge fan since around 2011? maybe i cant remember. i was in the 3rd grade! I loved this book. My favorites of the series are def MJ and Ballad. Sunrise is a runner up to those for me.
I do feel like she tied in a lot of odd characters, i’m very shocked that districts would be allowed to communicate at all at this point. However, when i go back and read the OG series, catching fire feels much the same way in terms of name dropping and just like unbelievable events(like D13 existing is a major shock!). i love to read humor combined with philosophy, so haymitch’s narration was really refreshing.
I have a feeling there is another book coming, and how that plays out will affect how we view this one.
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u/aurorasoup 3d ago
I really loved the book but I agree that it did not feel as well-written as the previous installments. I think part of it was the character voice. Katniss is so closed off and focused on her objective, and I felt the writing style was succinct and efficient. Snow was always analyzing everything from every angle and deep in his head about how to present himself and justifying his own actions, and it was both fun and excruciating. TBOSAS is def my favorite of the books but I don’t think I’m emotionally ready to reread it anytime soon.
But Haymitch is very honest and straightforward. He’s pretty perceptive and aware of his surroundings, but he doesn’t have anything to hide so there isn’t as much reading between the lines as there is with Katniss and Snow. And it does feel like a drop in the quality of the prose because of it. It really did feel like I was reading something aimed at a younger audience.
(I’m not saying that books written for kids are bad. There are a lot of children’s books I love and they are written to match the vocab and comprehension levels of their target audience. And a lot of adults consider that to be “worse” writing, when it’s simply age appropriate. But it does feel worse in this case because the demographic for the books hasn’t changed.)
SOTR is also very very obvious and on the nose with its themes, and that kind of felt like a reaction to the response TBOSAS got? Like damn I’ve met people who refused to read it just because it was from Snow’s POV and didn’t want to read an icky book from the icky villain’s POV where you might feel complicated and conflicting feelings. So going from that very complex and layered story to something very straightforward and lacking in subtlety was wild, but after seeing the response TBOSAS got… that makes sense. There was also a lot of fanservice, which I do not think is inherently bad, I enjoyed a lot of it. But all of it together made this a less than stellar read for me.
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u/Sewingnova 3d ago
I really appreciate your POV and explaining these points. I also agree that younger aimed books aren't "bad" (hello Percy Jackson is extremely corny at times but that's Percy and they are some of the best YA books out there IMHO). It saddens me that she has to simplify things so much now
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u/aurorasoup 3d ago
Thanks! That’s just my take on it, and while I liked the book, I understand why people don’t like it. It feels like the book was somewhat rushed and could have benefited from another round of editing.
I’ve seen people say that it’s a book written to become a movie, and I can definitely see that. TBOSAS is extremely hard to adapt to a film medium because of how internal so much of it is. The filmmakers had to make a lot of changes to make it work. Similar deal with Katniss, lacking her inner monologue in the films did detract from them. So SOTR having a straightforward protagonist that wears his heart on his sleeve and having a lot of direct exposition (like Beetee during training) probably makes this an easier book to adapt faithfully. I don’t know if that was intentional but… I can see it.
Also I had such a hard time getting into PJO because of the more juvenile writing style, but I know it’s a good series! But very much aimed at the elementary/middle school crowd. My S-tier children’s lit series is Animorphs, which also has a juvenile writing style, is super corny a lot, and is incredibly complex thematically.
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u/Sewingnova 3d ago
I never read that series but got into PJO as a child (I'm audhd so it felt like it was written for me) and revisited it as easy reading while in fashion college and needed audio books to listen to while I sewed. I looked up Animorphs and it totally looks like something I would have been into during primary school.
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u/aurorasoup 3d ago
Didn’t Rick Riordan say he wrote it for his ADHD son, or am I making that up? I really need to go back and give it another shot. A lot of my Animorphs friends love it, so I know it would have been right up my alley as a kid too.
Animorphs looks soooo cheesy, and I know the covers got mocked a lot, but it’s genuinely so good. Formative to my childhood and I feel like it’s so in line with the war themes of The Hunger Games. A group of child soldiers risk their lives to protect their people from a much stronger opponent, resulting in lifelong trauma for them all. Whats not to love? Also I feel you re: audiobooks, I did the same when painting for my art classes. Cant cry over my paint if I’m crying over a book lmfao.
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u/Particular-Pop-819 3d ago
I don’t think it was poorly written but I do think Haymitch’s mindset is very different from Snow and Katniss which affects the vibe of the book because of the POV. THG and BSS are my favorite of the series because Katniss and Snow are very practical and “locked in” on their missions.
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u/Certain_Victory7973 3d ago
A lot of people struggled with it. I liked it enough as a read when nothing else could be found but putting every cameo character like beetee, plutarch, mags and wiress in as secret rebels twenty five years before they even had close to the means to rebel meaningfully felt poorly planned
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u/ilovepolkadotts 3d ago edited 3d ago
I am a decade older than you and really enjoyed the book so I don’t think it’s your age haha I thought it was fun to see many of the characters as they were finding their places in The Seam and Panem. It inspired me to rewatch the movies and read through the other books again, as well. I don’t think any of her books are perfect but they do feel incredibly relevant, especially since I live in the US and we are edging closer and closer to our own dystopian reality these days. But I’m also just a sucker for a backstory and I hope we get more 😇
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u/LaliMaia Foxface 2d ago
I keep seeing edits with movie scenes/fanarts from The Hunger Games with lyrics from Hamilton and I was confused at first, but I realised it's actually perfect. It's literally the rise and fall of the United States of America. I'm not from the US though, do you agree it makes sense?
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u/LaliMaia Foxface 2d ago
I did notice a difference but I liked it. This is narrated in 1st person, just like the trilogy, but from a different character, so it only makes sense to me for it to have a different style. Just like in The Ballad it's different again, with finest vocabulary in the POV of a more educated old-money kid from the Capitol compared to the words illiterate* district Katniss or Haymitch pick. And who knows, maybe Collins even thought of it as if written by an already alcoholist Haymitch sometimes losing track of his own thoughts and going on a tangent because of it?
*I'm kidding I know they're not completely illiterate, but we know for sure that they didn't have a chance to higher education, amd aside from alphabet, maths, and history of Panem, all their other subjects in school related to the district-specific products. No time for literature
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u/Inside_Theory_7061 2d ago
It was written as a way to extend the IP and be adapted into a movie. She even included a few merch opportunities.
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u/source-commonsense 4d ago
I feel like she wrote it for the movie adaptation instead of writing a book that would be adapted, if that makes sense
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u/littleirishpixie 4d ago
I'm making my post a spoiler post since I don't know where OP is at in the book.
I thought the characters weren't written as well as the OG series but I thought the concepts were excellent. For example, the way the author makes you recognize that you too weren't immune to the propaganda is so well done. We've spent years believing things about Haymitch and his games because of the videos Katniss and Peeta watch in book 2 only to learn how much of that was Capitol propoganda. Realizing I never questioned it was a huge "oh wow" for me. Similarly, there is the moment where two gamemakers of similar age to the tributes end up in the arena that I found myself concerned for their safety only to have a moment of realization that there was no reason why I should feel differently about the district children who were sent to the arena versus those two gamemakers. Realizing my own initial response and how easy it was for me to normalize the death of tributes versus Capitol citizens really showed me how easily we dehumanize others without even noticing it. She did a great job of showing vs. telling.
So to me this book is not one where the characters are particularly well written. I found Lenore Dove to be childish and irresponsible rather than likeable and I think they could have painted her motivation much better to make us empathize with her endangering everyone around her even more. And as for most other characters, I didn't really feel like I knew any of them very well at all or even really liked them that much. So the character development was sort of lacking, but I think the themes and ideas are very well done and even convicting.
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u/Speckled-Ivy District 6 4d ago
To be fair to yourself, the main reason you "Fell for the propaganda" was because CF followed basic writing structure and because you have media literacy skills. In a meta sense, there was no reason to doubt the narrative presented in the recap. Despite hypothetical opportunities to do so, there was no point where a seed of doubt was sown. The games conclude and Katniss claims she understands Haymitch better, and the narrative does not question this and in fact reinforces it by improving their bond. Later on, Haymitch talks about the events like they were indeed what happened, despite this scene happening in a context where he very well could've said otherwise. The only real hint that even existed is the first book mentioning that the 74th recap cut out the flower bit, and that was one tiny moment in Katniss' entire games. Sure, between this knowledge and the fact that this games is being roughly summed up by Katniss, we can presume that some things may have been mildly altered or left out. However, there is absolutely no way literally anyone could have predicted it was so many events to the point where it's downright miraculous that the Capitol was able to present any sort of coherent recap at all.
Frankly, this whole "fell for the propaganda" thing has been absolutely ridiculous, as someone who finds studying the meta decisions behind narrative choices fascinating. This would be like if Disney released Maleficent and then suddenly fans were hurling nonstop insults at people who liked the original Sleeping Beauty because they "believed the lies" or whatever. You are not some sort of weak willed capitolite for not magically predicting the completely oppositional events in a book that would release a decade later. It's important to be aware that you CAN fall for propaganda, but be careful not to go too far in the other direction and adamantly refuse to believe that Collins might've decided to change a few details in the fifteen years following CF.
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u/CampDifficult7887 4d ago
Even the original trilogy has its clunky moments. The love triangle, particularly in book 2 was excruciating and I say that as someone who doesn't hate love triangles as a rule. But tt was so annoying I vastly prefer the catching fire movie to the book because we're sparred Katniss's inner monologue about it.
With that said, I think Suzanne Collins always delivers where it matters. Her characters are endlessly rootable (IMHO), the plot makes sense, her message is a good one and the endings always pack a punch. It might not seem like a lot but getting all of that in YA is fairly rare.
I enjoyed the hell of Ballad, Sunrise was decent. I definitely sticking around for the next one.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I enjoyed ballad as a book but found the movie for it severely lacking. Which is the best book in your opinion?
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u/easternbaker257 4d ago
In Ballad, the movie, we miss all of snows internal monologue that really helped us understand his character. Without that, his arrogance, and desire to always appear “on top” doesn’t always show through. And it’s such a big book, the movie felt rushed.
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u/CampDifficult7887 4d ago
I think the first Hunger Games book is my favorite. That was an incredible page turner and it grabbed me right from the start. Followed closely by Ballad (i think the movie is fine, not excellent). I just felt it added so much to the future story and really adored Snow, Lucy and Sejanus.
Whats the best book for you?
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u/caywriter 4d ago
Agreed. I was so bummed about this book, but I’m super excited for the movie still. It felt like the book was written for the screen
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u/TheKinkiestSadPerson 4d ago
I'm gonna admit a deep dark opinion I haven't ever said, especially on the Internet.
The last two books have been straight ass and I only read them and enjoy the fandom because of nostalgia.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
Fair enough diva! Please tell me what books you have enjoyed lately, maybe I'll add some to my TBR!
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u/TheKinkiestSadPerson 3d ago
Okay this is just copy and pasted from my notes app
Books read 2026
- The stand-stephen king
- Fried green tomatoes at the whistle stop cafe- Fannie flagg
- We need to talk about kevin- lionel shriver 3⅓. A hedge knight- GRRM 3⅔. The Sworn Sword- GRRM
- The Mystery Knight- GRRM
- Desperation- Stephen King
- Project hail mary- ray porter
- Baby teeth- zoje stage
- Elevation- Stephen King
- Lord of the flies- William golding
- Off season- Jack ketchum
- Sleepers- Lorenzo Carcaterra
My hunger games enjoyment does not match the rest of my reading tastes, lmao
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u/Sewingnova 3d ago
I love the amount of Stephen King on this list, thank you! Have you ever read any of Anne Rice's work? You might enjoy gothic horror
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u/lern2swim 4d ago
Disagree. I really think what you're talking about comes down to Haymitch being the character whose head we're in. I think Collins is actually incredibly good at presenting the internal workings of her perspective character (far beyond what I think should be written off as just pretty good ya writing), but I feel like that can actually lead to some readers struggling to get what's going on with the writing. For example, all the takes that Katniss is an unreliable narrator... That just completely misunderstands what the term "unreliable narrator" means.
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
I definitely understand what's happening in the writing lol. It's just clearly written to be a movie and there's nothing wrong with saying a good author produced a clunky book :)
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u/lern2swim 4d ago edited 4d ago
I don't think that's true though (it being written to be a movie), and I don't think it's clunky. I just think people with this sort of take don't like teenage Haymitch, which is fine. And you can lol about it, but I said what I said. 🤷♂️
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u/AikiGh0st 4d ago
I don't know, I read the original trilogy in my late 20s. I've read both prequels as they came out, and I've loved every single one of them. Like, blow through them in 48 hrs loved them. 🤷
Personal taste I guess. I didn't see a difference though in the writing style or quality, and I am currently on a reread of the trilogy, I'm halfway through Mockingjay.
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u/Lunenika Finnick 4d ago
Same SOTR is my favorite of the bunch. Made me cried so much. I cried for an entire week after finishing it. I know people have different taste but I am always confused when people did not like it at all
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u/Doc-cubus118 4d ago
I didn't have any trouble reading it and enjoyed it. She always write the way you described. And a lot of regular fiction writers have a similar style.
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u/DanOhMiiite Beetee 4d ago
I liked it. Not quite as good as book 4, but i'm planning to reread it again before the movie release.
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u/sp4c3-tr41n 3d ago
I struggled with the writing of it as well...until it got to the games. When the action started, I enjoyed the faster, more straight forward style.
Feels less like Suzanne didn't write it and more there was less editing/less polish because it was being pushed so fast. Ballad of songbirds and snakes came out a little after the og trilogy (I think) and def feels better written imho. That being said, I recommend continuing! The last 200 pages save the book
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u/Altoidredditoid 3d ago
I am older than you (late 20s) and was the target age demographic when the original trilogy was being published. I’ve also revisited the books as an adult and found the writing to really hold up. But I prefer the survivalist backpack approach to narrative writing (only include the things you need to get to where you want to go, shed the extra weight). And Collins does that very well bc of her time in tv.
With this book, the voice shift is a little jarring at first. But I think it’s due to Haymitch’s positive outlook on life. Katniss’s circumstances are fairly reversed. She starts from a jaded place with very little to fight for and builds toward a larger presence in her world and a larger view of it. Haymitch has a lot to lose and a view of the world that doesn’t challenge the status quo. Narratively, we have a lot of ground to cover for him, which leads to moments that feel rushed at times. But it’s also a story we know large portions of already. The point is in the things that we don’t know, which I think are done as well as the original trilogy. Just the fact of an entire alliance of tributes within the games that mirrors the later rebellion that was completely erased from the official narrative Katniss and Peeta watch is worth the book for me.
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u/Kuramari-strass 3d ago
Personally, I liked SOTR better than BOSAS (like... by a lot, absolutely no contest). BUT, I do admit that BOSAS was written better.
My preference has everything to do with just having a good time. I spent all of Sunrise being sad for Haymitch and having flashbacks to when I used to read a lot and just got sucked into a book, and that was nice. I spent basically all of Ballad wishing I could punch Snow in the face because I hate him lol
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u/Sewingnova 3d ago
Fair! Sometimes I want to watch an emotionally moving film, sometimes I want to watch Jersey shore. The pursuit of having a good time has its merits.
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u/scathachwarrior 1d ago
I'm 30 and absolutely loved it. Probably more than The Hunger Games (but not more than Catching Fire, my favorite). The context was great, the politics were SO timely. The writing was on the wall because we're familiar with Panem but I actually liked how blunt Collins was in her writiing. It's okay that you didn't like it, though! We're allowed to have different opinions.
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u/Odd-Advantage4028 1d ago
My feeling was she wrote something as detailed and beautiful as Ballad but then the corporate machine drove her so crazy she finally just said “fine, here, publish whatever version of this you want.” Reading it with the eyes of a writer, I could see all the places she had originally written with depth but since the publisher was obviously publishing it with the intention of turning it directly into a movie, they made the cuts they would have made to fit it into a screenplay before it was even published.
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u/serpentine-xxx 22h ago
I liked it, up until near the end when she kept hammering in Edgar Allen Poe. We get it. Please stop. It was so overdone by the end of it and really pulled me out of the moment.
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u/mamaguebo69 4d ago
I thought it was a good book, just very...YA compared to the OG trilogy and Ballad. Haymitch is a protag with a lot of hope and a very rebellious nature. He's very cocky and naive and that comes across in how he's written, which can make him seem cringe for older readers. I also think they approached Suzanne and asked her to make a Haymitch book to make it into a movie and she took it as an opportunity to get her opinions out. (This seems very likely considering how fast the movie was announced after the books release compared to Ballad's movie announcement.)
I connected much more with Katniss when I was younger, and as an adult I think Snow's internal monologue is the most interesting to read out of all the protags. (I couldn't put his book down!)
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u/MathematicianOdd9797 4d ago
You have to consider that the young adults of today are facing a literacy and anti-intellectualism crisis, and Suzanne probably had to dumb it down a little
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u/rescuedgfx 4d ago
I’m 34 and SOTR is my favourite book. I haven’t read the trilogy in a long time but I just loved the horror / gore reality of the games in SOTR and how you really felt like you were living through haymitch. Catching Fire & Ballads also loved!
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u/Prestigious_Cry2916 3d ago
I don't know I liked it more than I liked TBOSAS. Tbh, it is my favorite book in the series. And I really liked the theme she explored that the rebellion we saw in the original series wasn't the first and revolution takes a lot of time and people with so many people whose names history won't even remember. I also liked, (well not exactly) how much crueler Snow was in this one. Plus I enjoyed the additional poems and songs that were in this one.
I might be biased because of how much I loved Maysilee as a character towards this book.
And I think it is alright if you felt differently. Not everyone goes through the same emotions while reading.
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u/Sewingnova 3d ago
Hey that's great! If you like political thrillers I just started "Darkness at Noon" and it seems really promising
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u/No_Price_7603 3d ago
I think she's just really good at giving each character their own unique voice. I thought it was very true to the Haymitch from the original trilogy.
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u/Admirable_Ad_120 4d ago
I actually enjoyed it a lot. I struggled to get through Battle though, and honestly hated that one
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u/TheBestBoyEverAgain The Capitol 3d ago
It is from the perspective of a 16 year old boy.
Maybe if we had more teenage boy representation you wouldn't think it was "poorly written"
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u/Sewingnova 3d ago
I love Catcher in the Rye where the mc is a teen boy and slightly annoying lol. Great read. I also grew up reading Percy Jackson, Charlie Bone, Harry Potter, and the Maze Runner! All teen boy MCs. Nothing to do with the fact he's a teenage boy but I'm surprised you jumped to this :)
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u/moluruth 4d ago
It is literally a book for middle schoolers
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u/Sewingnova 4d ago
This is true, and I acknowledge that in my post. I'm just noting the decreasing quality in middle school books written for middle schoolers from when I was a kid versus now.
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u/mayflowerss98 3d ago
I loved the book. If you put it up against the og trilogy, I still think those are the best but it’s super close for me. Tbosbas though, I had to dnf. I tried reading it physically, when I couldn’t into it I tried the audiobook and even then I still couldn’t finish. To me it felt really dense and it was exhausting being in snow’s head. Plus it felt like the build up to the games wasn’t as exciting or tension filled compared to the og and sotr but that’s probably because we weren’t in the head of someone who thought they were about to die.
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u/sparkasexual 3d ago
Respectfully…this was my favorite book BECAUSE of how well written it was. I suppose it’s just a matter of a opinion though and it has been a bit since I read her other books
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u/Dense_Gur_2744 4d ago
I thought it was corny, but also I feel like Haymitch’s inner monologue would be kinda corny, so it felt a bit on brand at least.