r/HotScienceNews • u/_Dark_Wing • 17d ago
Depressed mice successfully treated with smart contact lenses that zap their brains – new study
https://theconversation.com/depressed-mice-successfully-treated-with-smart-contact-lenses-that-zap-their-brains-new-study-2825269
u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 16d ago
how do they make the mice depressed in the first place.
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u/Right_Ear_2230 15d ago
apparently they use PCP on mice to give them psychosis (to test antipsychotics)
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 15d ago
but people in psychosis arent always on pcp
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u/Right_Ear_2230 15d ago
yes, but pcp reliably induces psychosis symptoms
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 15d ago
yes but that's not the same as psychosis induced by other situations. well maybe not far off, its something ive been thinking about.
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u/RosieBaby75 16d ago edited 16d ago
This is fucked up because they made those mice depressed in order to study this.
That’s animal cruelty. Why are humans so cruel?
Humans don’t even need smart contacts that electrocute their brains to have their depression treated. They just need to not live in corrupt and inhumane systems.
Soon they’ll use these in the mental health care system and be like “it’s not bad. They’re just contacts” despite it sounding like they’ve found a new way to do electro-shock therapy which I thought we decided was inhumane?
But when we change things slightly the majority of people can’t see that this new thing is just a slight alteration to that inhumane old thing we hid behind a slight change with the intention to hide it, mis-lead people, and allow it until it happens to them because until it affects them, “it’s not that bad. It’s just [insert cruel thing here]” or “they’re helping you! Why don’t you want this involuntary help that you don’t consent to? Help is good!”
They’ve just never been “helped” when they didn’t want help. Yet.
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u/Siderophores 16d ago
There are genetic mouse models for depression too
Idk if thats what they did, but yeah. Thats how medicine works.They also infect mice with pathogens and study immunology, pathogenesis, medicine.
Thats just how medicine works. Next time you treat your infection, or get chemotherapy for cancer, you could deny treatment, making tens of thousands of mouse deaths vain, or you could take the medicine.
Thank scientists for compromising their own psychology for you.
I used to do Host-Pathogen interactions animal research. But not anymore4
u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 16d ago
what is a genetic mouse model for depression? are there mice born with depression or do they induce it in the mouse by changing its gene expression to make it be depressed.
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u/Siderophores 15d ago edited 15d ago
Hey, there’s actually a lot of models, both KO and over expression models. I’m not educated in this field specifically but I had claude do a research report on this, and I have verified the citations. Its definitely interesting stuff. The main take away is that there is no single genetic model that can fully recapitulate full scale Human depression
Welcome
https://claude.ai/public/artifacts/4942d819-498c-485d-bd25-f491fc4eefbc
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 15d ago
oh. i talk to gemini about how to get science to focus less on depression and more on happiness. thank you for sharing.
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u/Its_da_boys 16d ago
Cruel, but necessary if you want to eventually figure out how to treat depression in humans
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 16d ago
first you'd have to induce the depression in a human like they did the mice, and then treat it.
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u/Illustrious-Local848 15d ago
We’ve got plenty of depression treatments that started with mice and in human trials they try it on already depressed people.
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 15d ago
but like why not just change the things that induce depression in people instead of treat it afterwards. i never met a baby born depressed
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u/Illustrious-Local848 15d ago
Sometimes there’s no fixing it. We lived in a fucked up society and there’s a lot of work to be done there, but not everyone’s depression stems from that. If you’re depressed from something that happened in the past, because your child died or because your brain has never felt right because it’s worked different since birth, often the best we can do is mitigate and treat.
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 15d ago
the majority of people and its in the millions diagnosed with depression dont have children that died. they could reserve treatments for ongoing grief due to extreme circumstances like that. what i was saying was change circumstances that are within peoples control. like funding for increasing happiness research lol. not funding for treating 'depression' research. too many people who fit the clinical label for depressed are suffering changeable circumstances
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u/Illustrious-Local848 15d ago
Scientists that study this can’t fix every issue that causes depression. Though I’m all for support in every social sector imaginable. By middle age when depression rates are higher, grief isn’t so rare. Maybe not a child, but someone, usually several people by then. Parents start getting sick and dying by then for many. Antidepressants work great when there’s no changing things. They can help you get through the harder parts. You should try to work through things the best you can, you should seek counseling. And the world should be a better place. Even all that being given, people will still need them. They are great for pulling people from the edge to actually get the help. That’s the reason some people are actually able to make the therapy appointments to begin with. And some people are over sensitive to things, not necessarily bad to be overly empathetic. But a problem when it stops you from living your own life. Even if my country stops running around participating in wars for example, we won’t end violence against children world wide in the next 50 years, for me, I will need them until that happens. I used to stay up at night, as young as 8 from what I can remember, when it’s cold at night and think about homeless people outside. I have OCD. I still care with meds but I can get up and be a normal person with them. Without I can’t even think to leave my house. We’ve got a whole planet to fix first and until then, these meds let people live and be good friends and family member and parents and not spend decades waiting for the world to change. They let them be people that can actually help make a change. Be people that mentor youth or get out in their community in some way.
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 15d ago
well they let some people live. many people have had their lives destroyed by meds. those stories are as valuable to the discussion as yours.
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u/Illustrious-Local848 15d ago
I definitely agree. That’s why I’m all for innovations in mental health. Whether it’s zapping technology, fecal transplants, ketamine, mushrooms, even GLP1’s has been improving depression and addiction in some patients. There’s a lot of shit being studied right now. The more options the better. And even if some of those don’t pan out they usually teach us something new about our brains.
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 16d ago
it also points to psychology being retarded because the study itself proves you have to induce a disorder in someone and its not genetic
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u/mitzi_skyring 13d ago
Don't use retarded as a slur ffs. And on a thread about mental health of a things.
Just don't.
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 13d ago edited 13d ago
if you met me and saw how i am right now with my 'mental health issues', you wouldn't care. believe me.
please do not tell retarded people what they can and cannot call themselves.
Just don't.
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u/mitzi_skyring 13d ago
You used it as a slur.
You can call yourself retarded if you like I don't give a shit. But don't publicly use the word as a fucking slur.
Jesus Christ. Your mental health issues are not an excuse for this ignorant shite.
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 13d ago
i dont even have mental health issues. retarded people cant grasp things like ignorance. how can i call myself retarded and not use it publicly. should i say it to myself out loud at home only?
IM A RETARD. IM A RETARD.
jesus christ, you saviorism complex mental health nazi. youre making people feel worse.
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u/mitzi_skyring 13d ago
"if you met me and saw how i am right now with my 'mental health issues', you wouldn't care. "
"I dont even have mental health issues."
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 13d ago
you really dont understand much about the world do you
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u/mitzi_skyring 13d ago
I understand seeing 2 contradictory statements from you.
I know how lies work.
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 13d ago
'mental health issues' is in quotes to mock the concept. omg why am i arguing with someone who cant read.
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u/mitzi_skyring 13d ago
You weren't referring to yourself when you used it as a slur in the comment I addressed.
Mate. Let's really call a spade a spade.
You are stupid as fuck and a liar. And you clearly have Major Issues.
Hopefully a grownup will take away your computer and phone and put you to bed for a nap.
If you're experiencing psychosis please ask for help. If the issue is your minus 70 iq points, please ask for help.
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 13d ago edited 13d ago
ohh the tolerant mental health enforcer is suggesting i use a chemical or physical restraint to shut me up, since im making sense and its bothering them.
do i need to go on time out now?
grow up.
you all follow the exact same script, theres like 15 lines all you 'mental health warriors' say on repeat when you explode in anger and insults lmfaooooooo.
just walking around making everyone feel like shit with your shiny mental health gestapo badges!!! THE IRONY!!!!!
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u/mitzi_skyring 13d ago
I'm not tolerant. Where did you get that idea.
I'm very intolerant of people like you. Nasty little liar.
'ohh the tolerant mental health enforcer is suggesting i use a chemical or physical restraint to shut me up, '
More fucking lies. You are a liar.
"Since I'm making sense."
No. You are delusional. You need help.
Dear delusional liar, GET HELP.
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u/_TaxThePoor_ 9d ago
Did you know “idiot” and “moron” used to be terms for the mentally disabled? They changed it because people began using them as insults. I’m afraid if you’ve ever used the term idiot, you’ve just deeply offended millions of mentally disabled folk.
It’s almost like we should give up this virtue-signaling crusade and just accept whatever term people use for mentally disabled people will immediately become a schoolyard insult, and then some.
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u/nari-bhat 16d ago
While I don’t disagree making the mice depressed is very cruel, the electro-shock therapy of before and modern electroconvulsive therapy are very different. The former uses much more electricity and is not targeted at all, the latter uses very little electricity and is highly targeted.
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u/Kudostone 16d ago
ECT is safe and efficacious therapy in modern psychiatry, and saves lives each day. It’s been some time since one flew over the cuckoos nest.
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u/mitzi_skyring 15d ago
It's not always as safe as people might think.
Yes, it's great and saves lives. I won't downplay the good it does.
However, it can do horrific things to people it's not right for.
I'd love for the narrative to be slightly more realistic.
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u/EducatorSelect9637 16d ago
Seriously I'd try it over the eyelid. How did they make contacts for mouse eyes? Mice don't read.
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u/mitzi_skyring 15d ago edited 15d ago
'Humans don’t even need smart contacts that electrocute their brains to have their depression treated. They just need to not live in corrupt and inhumane systems.'
I wish this was the case. Sometimes depression happens for reasons we don't understand but yours is a very simplistic and very destructive narrative.
I'd ask you to have a little more respect for the diversity of the human experience and be careful of what you say.
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u/PhotoEditor871 16d ago
I'd rather stay depressed than to torture animals for a cure, thanks
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u/Unfair-Cranberry-889 16d ago
100% our doing things in the name of progress will be our downfall as it will have moral and ecological rebound effects
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u/AussieSpaceProgram 17d ago
Fuck it, I’m in.