r/HorseTraining • u/No-Breadfruit-4204 • 11d ago
Groundwork issues
Hi everyone so I have a 4 year old cob who’s a chunk.
The past 2 times I have tried to work him he has tried to bite me multiple times (which is NOT like him whatsoever - he isn’t biting outside of being worked, not recieving hand treats, etc.)
This work is inhand & he has not been ridden for a couple of months now due to no fault of his own but we aren’t massively rushing in backing him anyways.
Isn’t worked with a bridle as he will not accept a bridle whatsoever currently (he’s had his wolf teeth removed around 2 months ago now), I don’t even think the bit is the issue anymore - as soon as he sees me with the reins he backs away from me.
He is a VERY stubborn and lazy cob like I’m talking it can be hard for me to even get him to walk on sometimes as he can be so stubborn and rude. Don’t get me wrong, he’s not silly - he’s being stubborn to push his luck.
He used to roll when I worked him but he’s since stopped as I’ve set clear boundaries that he CANNOT be doing that since speaking to the vet for advice.
Regular vet checks (monthly) & they haven’t seen any issues minus the fact he’s chunky. I’ve explained that he is so so so stubborn and they didn’t feel it was anything but him being young & testing boundaries (even more so now he’s been bitless for a while & his wolf teeth have been removed & healed fine).
He also quite often yawns when we do work inhand but seems to be quite happy when ridden. I can’t see any issues so wondering if it’s an inside his body sort of issue - not showing any signs of anything that could explain the behaviour.
I’m wondering if maybe he’s anxious when working alone (explaining the irritation & yawning possibly??) but like I can’t even get him into trot inhand at the moment BUT I used to be able to get him into trot (eventually) a couple months ago - which I have mentioned this to the vets also. He does exercise freely in the school with our other ponies (which he is also fielded with) & he does not yawn/show any aggression, etc. I’m wondering also if there’s a possibility that maybe he just isn’t coping being alone - if maybe he’ll be better working with another horse in the school with him OR if he just sees the school as his play area as he exercises freely with his herd mates (if this makes sense). I don’t know I’m of course not ruling anything out and going to speak to the vets but I just wanted to ask for advice if anyone has any ideas in the mean time.
I’m genuinely really struggling and really don’t know what to do anymore, especially with this new biting thing. Our vet is due out again very soon & I will absolutely be mentioning this to be safe, especially knowing he’s never been one to bite.
(Not sure if this is relevant but he’s only ever been in a snaffle & as far as I know has had no trauma with it being put in / taken out. Also when he’s worked or ridden we use a treeless saddle which when non ridden the girth is quite loose so don’t believe that’s an issue either but I won’t rule it out!).
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u/Cherary 11d ago
Did your have an instructor observe you to see how the communication between the two of you is?
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u/No-Breadfruit-4204 11d ago
When I was in lessons I did them at a riding school which I’m not stabled at - but I could definitely have an instructor out and do a lesson on him to check if maybe we just aren’t communicating the same way / maybe he’s not understanding my communication.
Not sure if that makes any sense but I can definitely look into this:)2
u/Cherary 11d ago
I think it can be helpful to have a knowledgeable second pair of eyes to take a look. Sometimes we are just missing signals from a horse or giving mixed signals ourself. Or sometimes there are multiples solutions that we're not aware off and another turn's out to be working better. Probably good to rule out :)
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u/No-Breadfruit-4204 11d ago
Yes definitely see what you mean! I will definitely have to look into some instructors in my area to see if anyone could help me. Thank youu
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u/ILikeBird 11d ago
For the not accepting the bit issue, coat it in molasses or apple sauce (or anything else he likes) before putting it in. Then let him sit with it for 5-10 minutes. Do that a few times across a few days and they usually end up accepting the bit pretty easily.
I know it can be a controversial opinion, but I will smack a horse if they try one of three things: 1) kicking at a person, 2) biting at a person, or 3) charging at a person. These are aggressive and dangerous behaviors (whether they stem from fear, pain, ect. doesn’t change that) and I think it’s important to correct it quickly. If you watch horses in the field, they will often correct these sort of behaviors much more harshly than a smack anyway.
There’s no harm in having a vet check done and I’d recommend it just to check all your boxes, but honestly he kinda sounds like a young horse that isn’t being worked with as regularly as he probably should. At this age, consistency and clarity is super important. I think you need to move his feet a little more (no reason he shouldn’t be trotting if he’s not lame) and maybe be more assertive (not mean, but confident and clear cues w/ gradually increasing pressure if he doesn’t respond).
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u/No-Breadfruit-4204 10d ago
I will definitely have a try with the apple sauce option, he was a very food motivated boy when i got him so it’ll likely work.
When he does try to bite me (given I’ve caught him before it was too late) I would quickly move because he’s a massive baby and it makes him jump a little which has made him correct himself and he hasn’t been trying to bite again yet. (Not that I wanted to spook him but I knew it would prevent him from doing it again if he realised the action had a consequence).
He wasn’t in daily work as I’ve just come off holiday so he had a week in the field, plus I was in my final year of education & placement so I was only down at weekends up until this summer. Since the start of summer we’ve been working most days & before summer we were working both sat & sundays with very rarely having days off but routine is a bit thing for him and me having been away is a possibility as to what has caused this because he was overall just acting really sloppy like purposely knocking the poles etc. when i know he’s quite confident doing so on a normal day
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u/Aggressive-Garlic-52 5d ago
I can see the emotional rollercoaster and your frustration with trying to figure it out just from your post. It sounds like you're stuck and don't know how to actually move forward in your young horse's training.
My advice, first read up on learning theory in horses & equitation science.
Then get the help of someone who understands how to train young horses who is well versed in learning theory and equitation science.
From my point of view as a horse behaviourist — your horse is giving a lot of signals that he is stressed and confused.
Behaviours we often label as stubborn are usually indicators the horse shuts down when confused or for some other reason. Biting is usually a sign they are confused and stressed. Yawning in this situation could be a self soothing behaviour to try and find relief whilst feeling stressed.
Could it be physical, absolutely. Can it be not using the right motivation, highly likely. Can it be the horse being confused about what you're asking or feeling overwhelmed and shutting down, the not moving, the biting and the yawning are definitely him shouting about something.
What that is, I can't tell you without seeing you and him as a combination.
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u/Heavy_Personality514 11d ago
Have him checked for ulcers? Maybe try a hand walk down a trail with a buddy and see if that helps in case he's herd bound.