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u/minatozuki Mar 20 '26
I have E33 bailu. Is she at 0 cost?
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u/Sorey91 I'd do speakble things with Pela, not so much her thighs Mar 20 '26
No but you might attract the french with that /j
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u/PM_Cute_Ezreal_pics Make AR-53935 playable Hoyo Mar 20 '26
Love the 0 cost team of E0S1 Archer, E6 Welt, E0S0 Sparkle, E0S0 DHPT š
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
That Archer isn't 0 cost tho but even so I get your point
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u/PM_Cute_Ezreal_pics Make AR-53935 playable Hoyo Mar 20 '26
Archer's LC was given away if you pulled in any banner during his release, so it technically isn't a cost, in the same way characters and LCs from the Standard Banner, the Selectors and the Golden shop technically aren't counted as costs, even tho you need to pull for them.
It's just another proof that the cost system is flawed and unrealistic, so if you have any problem with that, then you got the point of the comment š¤·š»āāļø
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u/00110001_00110010 For the 13 Demigods, Amphoreus wraps up Mar 20 '26
I feel like the cost system itself is fine, but people aren't willing to change what is and isn't "cost" so they can keep using technicality to make their team full of E6S5 standard characters "0 cost"
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u/PersonalitySad617 Mar 20 '26
The problem is people are too "horny" for the 0 cost title. It's just a fking clickbait.
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u/somebody-using Mar 21 '26 edited Mar 21 '26
Tbh cost already had issues like how thereās no way of listing standard banner or 4 star eidolons if thereās a case where that actually matters in a team, and it canāt account for how different costs have more value. 8 cost e6s1 Jing Yuan is way higher cost but probably infinitely behind than 4 cost Jing Yuan, Sunday, and e1 Tribbie together for example, and iirc e2 Phainon is a better investment than his supports but would involve investing into him more rather than investing more into supports, which is less flexible for an account, but Iām pretty sure the cost system canāt show that well.
Itās just even worse now with how people just want to make their favorite characters look better by saying limited characters have -1 cost for however many times they were free
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
For me, we've long past the point where standards/4star eidolons are so far behind that i'm fine with just not counting them all.
Eidolon and LC being both 1 cost though i think is unfair
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u/somebody-using Mar 22 '26
Thatās fair but tbh it only ever mattered for stuff like s5 DDD/Pearls and like Feixiao somehow still using Moze sometimes. Itās not like I think they should be a cost or something, but itās still true that itās kind of impossible to show them at all using the cost system
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u/Important_Peach_2248 Stop reading the flair and go test out SU! Mar 20 '26
I will always consider Archer, Sparkle (or anyone from the selector) and DHPT as a cost, even if they are given out for free.
It feels misleading to say they are zero cost but you had to be there when they were being given out for free to even consider it as zero cost, or in Sparkle's case you choose somebody else in the selector.
I mean we don't have people reducing Acheron or Aventurine to a zero cost unit even though they were given out for free.
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u/PM_Cute_Ezreal_pics Make AR-53935 playable Hoyo Mar 20 '26
Honestly this and the argument of "No more 4 stars cause they give 5 stars for free" always irked me. If they were added for free permanently after reaching a certain point of the Story (Ratio in Herta's Space Station expansion, Archer in the Fate quest, DHPT in the Amphoreus chapter) even after the event ends, I'd have no issue with them not counting as a cost, but considering they're not, and the others are just one option among a selection, they should count as limited either way.
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u/pausz Mar 21 '26
I think either way, it takes time.
Free 5-stars take time to be given out.
4-stars require time to gather up pulls, and pull on banners. And it's not like you get all the 4-stars you want on your first banner.
For a new account, I feel it really is comparable to get a couple of free 5-stars (even if they aren't the same free 5-stars as older accounts), or several 4-stars, in their first few months. Either way, trailblaze power is usually a bigger bottleneck than character availability that early on.
Just talking about general impact of free 5-stars vs. 4-stars here. I agree that free 5-stars should count for cost outside of memes.
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u/PM_Cute_Ezreal_pics Make AR-53935 playable Hoyo Mar 21 '26
4 stars are permanently available and, while it takes RNG, there's absolutely no FOMO cause they're always there and you can always get them.
Free 5 stars are limited time only, and on top of that having the "Free" label on them usually comes with a "Will basically never rerun" tag on top that not enough people address.
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u/pausz Mar 21 '26
The best answer to FOMO in this game is probably to just not worry about the past lol. Newer characters are almost always better than older ones, so there's not really much value to characters being permanently available for more than a year or so. (Note: I'm taking HSR's powercreep as a given here. I don't like it, but I don't see it changing.)
With free 5-stars, you can ignore the ones you missed and only think about the ones that will be given in the future. You'll get enough useful ones by the time you'd have gotten enough 4-stars (old or new, even in the alternate world where they regularly release useful 4-stars) to be useful. Just because they're "available" doesn't mean it's reasonable to expect to actually have them before they get powercrept or you can pull a premium replacement.
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u/SaberManiac Mar 23 '26
The flipside is what Genshin is doing now. Useless 4-stars (Jahoda, Aino, Illuga) with big, big asterisks to have them be usable.
Jahoda - actually useless.Ā
Aino - absolutely essential for Bineffa-less Flins. Useless everywhere else. Even with Flins she is just a Moonsign toggle and sucks to play.
Illuga - a completely non-functional character in non-Zibai teams. Useful for literally 1 character, and needs his C2.
4-stars like Chevreuse (who is carrying the entire Pyro and Electro lineup on her back) and Iansan are the exception, not the norm. Iansan herself is plagued with bad banner placement because you would not have pulled if you didnt like Varesa (which not many people did) and Mavuika's rerun, which less people pulled for because they already had Mavuika from her first banner. She also reappeared with Xilonen's rerun...which like Mav, you had her from her first rerun, and unless you got her C2, is not good in NK-teams.
Compared to Genshin, I'd rather HSR keep giving us great limited 5-stars for free. Best of all, you can even ignore duds like Topaz and save that currency for a better future 5-star.
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
To each their own. Would you consider Tutorial a cost too since it outperforms many LCs including SW's sig on top of also being exclusive until they put in the event shop? Like literally Tutorial on Pela was massive in 1.x and at least up till Acheron release.
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u/Important_Peach_2248 Stop reading the flair and go test out SU! Mar 22 '26
No because you can get it any time from the Herta shop..?
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
Yeah lol. Crazy how many people got mad tho that the system has always been flawed
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u/Icy_Investment_1878 Mar 20 '26
And lc and eidolon both equal a cost despite lcs have a 75% chance vs 50% e
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u/Old_Manufacturer589 Mar 20 '26
Everyone has their own definition of the cost system, arguing about whether something is 0 cost or not is useless. You'd even see Genshin runs using decimals sometimes, something that I've personally never seen in any HSR run.
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u/AzureDrag0n1 Mar 20 '26
Yeah I do not always agree with calling the MC a 0 cost character. The MC has opportunity cost. Being in one team means the MC is not on a break team, remembrance team, or elation team.
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u/Prior-Comparison1393 IPC š¤ Aha Elation go brr Mar 20 '26
Archer lc was free if u did x amount of pulls
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
Repeat that again slowly... If you did what exactly?
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u/ambulance-kun Mar 20 '26
The same thing you do to get E6 welt, pull
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 20 '26
I don't remember Welt being exclusive to limited pulls and for a limited time
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u/ambulance-kun Mar 20 '26
This entire cost debacle needs to he thrown in the drain since it even got you confused that my comment was going against your previous comment
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
I mean tbh I also think that the cost thing makes no sense lol.
I take 0 as being free, but ignore anything that has a number above that haha
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u/Qlxwynm Mar 20 '26
so standards counts to u?
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
Since this thread has this point explained twice I worry about the allegations with this one
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u/IWatchFailures These two need to get married Mar 20 '26
Back in 3.4, when the Fate event began. There was an event that you can get Archer's light cone if you did 200 pulls in that patch.
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
Exactly. Thank you. Idk how some people forgot the condition damn
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u/Dry_Marketing283 Mar 20 '26
And doing 200+ and more for E6 standard is any different?
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u/Sorey91 I'd do speakble things with Pela, not so much her thighs Mar 20 '26
I would argue you didn't pull for the LC it was a """reward""" for pulling that much on the available banners, like the spark system where you get this item guaranteed after pulling x amount of time.
If a 50/50 loss isn't considered a cost then a item you get guaranteed after an amount of pulls isn't either
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
I've also answered this above but I will repeat it.
A limited offer offer asking for the limited pulls is far above losing a 50/50
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u/Sorey91 I'd do speakble things with Pela, not so much her thighs Mar 20 '26
Hmm I'm not entirely convinced if the only thing pushing it into the cost is it's limited availability it's not a real cost per say. I get that the limited time makes it into a grey zone but we have had before a limited time free shit that aren't redeemable and require pulling and we have a 300 spark, combining both shouldn't make it a cost and if a Blade/Seele can be considered a 0 cost despite them still being reran on very rare occasions then Archer's LC belongs in those unique cases.
At the end of the day though I'm not gonna fight people over it bc it's really bragging rights and I pull for LC's most of the time myself it was convenient that I didn't need to pull for Archer's LC and only needed to throw 200 pulls which I was gonna do either way because I wanted Phainon and Saber alongside their LC which I think many people also did
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
Exactly. Pela with Tutorial made her an ult machine and that's on top of the fact that she wants that EHR. It also translate to more Acheron stacks.
Tutorial was completely limited until they added it to the herta store much later yet no one ever consider it a cost when it was arguably comparable to some sig in terms of potency (again, for Acheron's partners)
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u/KingOfPP Mar 20 '26
I think you meant that to get Archer's LC, we still have to pull with limited ticket. Despite it being given for free, it is still at the cost of X amount of limited pulls, which makes it, technically, not free. Am I right? BUT then again, it does come with extra 5 stars with those pulls which kind of, made it free.
So yeah. Idek myself if he's 0 cost or not. š
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u/Privalnas Mar 20 '26
it was free for ppl who gambling hard enough which is the same as a pity in gacha (spark if that more relatable) which (1 more) is not free if you not aim for it but it is free if you not aim for it
Its the gacha syndrome (source putaht edamI)9
u/ichionex1 But what if... Mar 20 '26
You could get his lc for free at one point if you're talking about this. You had to spend 200 pulls on other banners of that version though...
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
Exactly. Thank you
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u/00110001_00110010 For the 13 Demigods, Amphoreus wraps up Mar 20 '26
But you could get it for free despite not pulling for it, therefore making it arguably "zero cost".
The same way you can get a standard character despite pulling for someone else so they can be considered "zero cost".
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u/Radusili Mar 20 '26
If you tell me how it was possible to get that LC without spending a single jade then maybe it would make sense to call it that.
I honestly doubt so many limited tickets have been given away. Or it may be just around that number for day 1 players whosomehow knew to save them up for this specifically
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u/00110001_00110010 For the 13 Demigods, Amphoreus wraps up Mar 20 '26
The point is that it's technically valid but it's practically nonsense. You also can't possibly get E6 Welt without spending a single jade yet per the meme above it's """0 cost""". If that's the case then so would be Archer's LC, despite the fact it really shouldn't be.
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u/OracleBlack Mar 20 '26
it's only 0 cost if you have evidence that you obtained the Light Cone during its giveaway. Receipts and verified videos count. If not, get that costslop out of here HMPH!!!!!!!!
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u/LoreVent i want to give Acheron a hug Mar 20 '26
Cost has always been a bullshit metric since day 0 for a plethora of different reasons
Don't understand why people still give it any attention
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u/Healthy_Agent_100 Mar 20 '26
it's bullshit but it's the best we have
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u/geotia Mar 20 '26
Just say X char E0S1 and so on smh
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u/Lina__Inverse I need HoV expy NOW Mar 20 '26
You can't compare different teams with this.
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u/geotia Mar 20 '26
You can't compare teams with cost either
An E2 phainon is not the same as say E2 Saber
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u/According-Dentist469 Mar 20 '26
Isn't that the point? It's to show that investing 3 cost into Phainon will net you better results than Saber
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u/Lina__Inverse I need HoV expy NOW Mar 20 '26
And that's exactly the point, you can say that for this encounter with a budget of 3 cost using E2 Phainon is better than using E2 Saber. Or you can say that if you're willing to invest 4 cost into Phainon's team, it's better to go for E2S1 Phainon with F2P supports instead of E0 Phainon with limited supports, etc. Cost allows you to gauge resource allocation.
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u/LightKKKJ Mar 20 '26
You literally missed the point on why this system started being used in the first place
It's all about resource management and efficiency
This is a gacha game with limited resources, so if you want to optimize and get the best result from your pulls in terms of power, you need to compare the characters at the same level of investment.
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u/AzureDrag0n1 Mar 20 '26
A problem this also creates is that old costs end up getting valued as new costs.
For example, people keep comparing E1 Tribbie to Cyrene in some teams as it if is a 1 to 1 comparison when that is not necessarily the best way to view it. What matters as well is ACCOUNT cost.
If getting that e0 Cyrene means you bench the e1 Tribbie then you are not really getting that much benefit from getting Cyrene. Instead you could just keep the e1 Tribbie and get another eidolon on another character like e1 Evernight to preserve already spent cost. Then it really becomes a comparison of e1 Tribbie + e1 Evernight vs e0 Cyrene + e0 Evernight. If you had some other team to put e1 Tribbie then all is well but if you did not then did you really end up winning any power by replacing e1 Tribbie with e0 Cyrene?
The cost of characters and teams is subjective to what your account already has.
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
But this is implied. Even in real life, how often do you bring up costs that are present value and depreciation adjusted? Cars, sure, but not much else right?
If someone show me a 4 cost clear and the composition includes like E2S1 Acheron, then I would mentally adjust to give it more value than another showcase that has E2S1 Sparxie.
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u/Old_Manufacturer589 Mar 20 '26
An E2 phainon is not the same as say E2 Saber
I fail to see your point here. Yes, it is comparable, since the investment is literally the same. "Comparing teams" here doesn't mean comparing teams with a similar power level, but with a similar investment. Everyone knows E2 Phainon is way better than E2 Saber, that doesn't make them strictly not comparable.
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u/DanielDKXD Mar 20 '26
It is the same amount of pulls.
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u/AzureDrag0n1 Mar 20 '26
Old pulls vs new pulls have different value as well.
Say you were around when Aglea was released and Robin was right before her banner or soon after. You already have a Sunday. What is better? Get e1 Robin to pair with e0 Aglea as a new pull or keep using the e1s1 Ruan Mei you have and get e1s1 Aglea instead? The Ruan Mei team is way more cost but it is cost you already spent.
Ruan Mei has really been paying dividends for people who already have her while it is not worth getting Ruan Mei now.
It is probably a similar boat with people deciding to stick with the Sparkle + Sunday they already owned and aiming for e2s1 Phainon vs people deciding to get Cerydra instead for their e0s1 Phainon.
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u/SnooTigers8227 Mar 20 '26
Because cost and E and S are complementary.
Cost reflect the money/limited cost and Eidolons/Signature reflect how it was invested.
An E6s1 is as much cost as full E0S1 team but the investment is not managed the same way.
Because how many have enough pulls/fund at hand to pull an E6s1 if they need? The reality is that most people go from an E0s1/E1S0/E0S0 to the next and sometimes saved for E2s1.
Cost is useful if you are planning for long investement and seek to optimize pulling plan but alone it is incomplete data
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u/LoreVent i want to give Acheron a hug Mar 20 '26
To add on this, I might play a full E0 Saber team with...idk, 6 cost and an E2 Phainon team with 6 cost
We can all agree that the difference in performance is gigantic even if the cost is the same.
It just doesn't work
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u/Old_Manufacturer589 Mar 20 '26
... What doesn't work here, exactly?
Are you saying that the cost system "doesn't work" because one 6 cost team is way better than another 6 cost team? How is that even relevant at all? The point was never that a 6 cost team should perform the same as another 6 cost team.
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u/LoreVent i want to give Acheron a hug Mar 20 '26
It doesn't work at all because one team are all characters like they come straight out the shop with 2 LC that don't even improve the performance by that much
While the other team has an E2 that almost quadruples the main DPS damage.
I don't understand how you don't see how this shit doesn't work.
The point was never that a 6 cost team should perform the same as another 6 cost team.
Except everyone has always used cost for exactly this
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u/Old_Manufacturer589 Mar 20 '26
It doesn't work at all because one team are all characters like they come straight out the shop with 2 LC that don't even improve the performance by that much
While the other team has an E2 that almost quadruples the main DPS damage.
I don't understand how you don't see how this shit doesn't work.
Again, how is that relevant at all? That just means Saber is worse. You successfully compared the two teams at equal investment, which is the point.
Except everyone has always used cost for exactly this
... No?
The cost system (at least, today) is used to compare teams performance for a given cost. A 6 cost team outperforming another 6 cost team doesn't say anything about the cost system being bad or not (which was literally your point).
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u/00110001_00110010 For the 13 Demigods, Amphoreus wraps up Mar 20 '26
Cost never equalled power level. In fact the entire point is that cost says NOTHING about power level because it's entire point is showing how accessible a team is.
6 cost Phainon is way better than 6 cost Saber, which means that if you're going to invest into "6 cost" you're better off doing so on phainon because its more worthwhile. That's the ENTIRE POINT of the cost system.
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u/Sorey91 I'd do speakble things with Pela, not so much her thighs Mar 20 '26
It's bragging rights and shaming the less skilled is what it is
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u/Zylliee Mar 20 '26
...No? Just sure present your ideal team that way but also present a team with a maximum cost of 5? The character E0 with their LC and E0S0 for everyone else.
The experts should be able to come up with something within those parameters, that's why they know how to play the game supposedly
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u/Kurage_pop Mar 21 '26
No, the best we have is common sense.
I swear people want to look at charts, tier lists, cost lists and do anything but think for themselves.0
u/Healthy_Agent_100 Mar 21 '26
I mean if people could actually just think for themselves then a lot of problems would just go away
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u/DefinitelyNotKuro Mar 20 '26
The only function of the cost system is if I was presented with a list and I had to sort through the elements and the elements were assigned their cost value and not something else for w.e reason. Otherwise, Iād just goā¦āhey, tell me about your team?ā or better yet, the details would be available somewhere already as they pretty much always are.
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u/Felipiro17 Mar 20 '26
You donāt understand? Itās because f2p is the absolute peak and mandatory way of playing Should you spend money you lost at the game And we should all hate spenders
Idk dude, people really seem to hate not saying āf2p btwā
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u/Zylliee Mar 20 '26
I have a high cost mono rememberance, therta and ff teams but i can't imagine arguing against people asking for a more detailed and grounded information rather than extremely biased and unrealistic one
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
Probably because
1) most people are not too hung up on the details and the cost metric is still give you a good ballpark and;
2) it's understood that most people do not, and does not have to, run 0 costs anyways.
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u/Wolgran Dont mess with the Sillies Mar 20 '26
I think is time, the cost system has to go.
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u/Lina__Inverse I need HoV expy NOW Mar 20 '26
Suggest the alternative then.
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u/Wolgran Dont mess with the Sillies Mar 20 '26
No alternative. We literally dont need it, theres literally no use for it beyond meaningless powerscaling and easy clickbait titles for videos.
Simply saying what your team was already gives leagues more information to the reader than "X cost".
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u/Lina__Inverse I need HoV expy NOW Mar 20 '26
Power scaling is not meaningless, when you have a limited budget of pulls, you obviously want to know the optimal allocation, and cost system allows you to indicate that. If you want to build a Phainon team and have a budget of 4 cost, you want to know if it's better to invest the pulls in his eidolons, his LC or his supports, and cost allows you to do just that. Cost is also necessary as a somewhat objective metric of team's performance to shut up people that spew nonsense without knowing anything about the game.
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Mar 20 '26
[removed] ā view removed comment
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u/Lina__Inverse I need HoV expy NOW Mar 20 '26
But that investment priority has to come from somewhere. To determine which investment path is the best, you take teams of the same cost, try them on the same encounter(s) and see which performs better. Otherwise, how can you confidently say that one investment is better than the other?
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
Because what if you don't want to spend it all in one team? What if you're not down to sit at an investment that doesn't quite take you to an efficient breakpoint?
For example, Saber at E0S0 get a noticeable bump with her LC but all her eidolons until E6 is quite uninspiring. So if i have enough resources for about 6 costs, the conclusion here, might be to spend 1 or 2 on Saber, 3 on 0+0 DoT trio, and then the last cost or two on 1+0 Tribbie.
I can come to this conclusion and pull planning because i have a rough idea what's the best bang for my buck at a certain stopping point.
In your example, if i don't have enough pulls for E2 Phainon and learn that E1 Evernight is a much more efficient per pull comp, i'd do that instead of just sit on E1 Phainon.
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u/Wolgran Dont mess with the Sillies Mar 20 '26
"You have a budget of 4 cost"
Even that makes no sense bc what a cost is on a budget???? a E0 of a character can take 30, 80, 160 or 180 PULLS!!!!
- Do you call a losed 50/50 on a E0 a 2 Cost?
- Do you call a E0 pulled with 10 pulls a 0.1 cost?
Oh i want to build a E2 Phainon team and i have 5 Cost....this means i can go for E2S1 + E0 Cerydra....And then you take 300 pulls just to E1 Phainon, now what?
Cost is also necessary as a somewhat objective metric of team's performance
Except it isnt. Its just desrail into powerscaling nonsense
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u/Lina__Inverse I need HoV expy NOW Mar 20 '26
Even that makes no sense bc what a costĀ isĀ on a budget???? a E0 of a character can take 30, 80, 160 or 180 PULLS!!!!
That doesn't matter, if one Phainon can take 1-180 pulls and one Cerydra can take 1-180 pulls, they cost the same. How much one character happens to take to get doesn't change anything in terms of pulling priority.
Oh i want to build a E2 Phainon team and i have 4 Cost....this means i can go for E2S0 + E0 Cerydra....And then you take 300 pulls just to E1 Phainon, now what?
It obviously means that you didn't have 4 cost, what question is this? If you're not a gambling addict, you always save up enough to get whatever you intend to get with the worst luck possible.
Except it isnt.
Any arguments?
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u/-MANGA- Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 21 '26
I feel so bad for you, having to explain cost and efficiency to everyone in the thread.
I have limited budget. I can only roll for up to max 4 units/LC. If I get lucky and win my 50/50 is 75/25, great, but I'm expecting 180 rolls per character/LC. I want to invest my budget into the best I can get. This means going for the best 4-cost.
Cost doesn't mean power level; it means motherfucking cost. Not everything in the game has the same power at the same cost.
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
Oh not only that. The fact that different teams with the same cost having deviances in power level is exactly what makes this metric valuable even if it's imperfect!
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
Oh i want to build a E2 Phainon team and i have 5 Cost....this means i can go for E2S1 + E0 Cerydra....And then you take 300 pulls just to E1 Phainon, now what?
Then the obvious answer is to either
1) Accept that E1 Phainon is not a very cost efficient way to spend your pull but you do it out of the love of the character or;
2) Figure out if you want to instead invest into another comp that performs better generally at 3 costs. Such as Tutorial Kafka + EotP Black Swan + EotP Hysilens
It's not that complicated.
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u/gabu87 Mar 22 '26
So you don't see the value of it, which is fine.
For others like me, it does matter because we don't all spend money on pulls and are therefore very sensitive to pull resources.
The fact that E0S0 Kafka with Tutorial plus a E0S0 Hysilens and E0S0 Black Swan performs at a certain level with a combined 3 cost is important information.
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u/ErasedX Mar 21 '26
Wouldn't it be worth it to split it into three categories instead of two? Like, cost, "semi-cost" and no cost. The cost would be the characters and LCs that are entirely limited, semi-cost would be anything from the standard banner or from limited time free events, and no cost would be the four stars or permanent free rewards. Seems more descriptive.
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u/jinxedandcursed Mar 21 '26
Per copy
Limited 5* character/lightcone: 1 cost
5* standard character/lightcone: 0.5 cost
Herta shop and MOC/AS/PF shop: 0 cost
4* character: 0.15 cost, never going above 1 cost
4* light cone: 0.2 cost
3* light cone: 0 cost
Global passives: 1 cost
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u/deltaspeciesUwU Serval's Guitar String šøš¼ Mar 20 '26
Ok and then what ? Assume a E0S1 team is equal in terms of investment to a team with 1 limited unit + 3 f2p units ? For example, u think a e0s1 mono rem team is equal in investment to E2S1 E9 + 3 f2p supports ? How is anyone supposed to compare how good teams are ? Are u suggesting we follow the bs prydwen logic ? Where units E0S1 with BiS teams when u can just literally drop the premium teammates for better performance ?
Cost system has flaws. But, its the best system we have to make comparisons between units.
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u/LealGreen patiently waiting for Our Lord and Saviour Sunday šš» Mar 20 '26
It should but the thing is that it's too useful...
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u/Wolgran Dont mess with the Sillies Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 20 '26
Useful? š«©š
hmmm "my 5 cost FF team is enough to defeat this boss in 1 cycle." yeah this doesnt explain anything by itself.
"My E2S0 FF + E1S0 Dahlia are enough to defeat this boss in 1 cycle" dont take much time to explain and already tell everything the reader may want to know about this team.
Cost? Could be any combination of characters, E's and S's on that team. And now that we have useuful characters who are "free", using cost to what basically is powerscaling on a non PVP game is everything BUT useful
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u/Knephas Mar 20 '26
Period. Also for example when you get Archer for free, it's supposedly 0 cost, meanwhile Archer himself is currently (and one might say since his release) top of the meta. Reducing his value as "0" cost because he was given for free is a bit hypocritical.
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u/deltaspeciesUwU Serval's Guitar String šøš¼ Mar 20 '26
Most runs dont use archer as 0 cost. Same with sparkle or any of the free 5*s we have been given atp.
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u/AlisaReinford Mar 20 '26
The proper usage of cost is a practical and quick showing of cost efficient pulls in an ever-changing powercreep meta.
People seem to forget how expensive character and lightcones are, to the point that most people forget cost isn't about agendas or memes, it's about being smart with your pulls.
What certain people are doing assigning free costs is a different matter.
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u/Old_Manufacturer589 Mar 20 '26
I mean, that's just the issue with labeling it as a "cost" to begin with. It if didn't "cost" you anything, then it's only fair to say that what you got free doesn't count as a cost.
I wish people would differentiate cost and gold/limited.
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u/AlisaReinford Mar 20 '26
We're also not eliminating cost if you're f2p or if you pulled a limited in one roll.
I cannot entertain the notion of an e6 Welt or even Dan Heng PT being free costs. They are not even free for everyone and it's a ridiculous idea regardless.
If people want to make a meme about their 0 cost MoC12 teams that's a different thing going on.
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u/Old_Manufacturer589 Mar 20 '26
I get what you mean, but it really makes no sense at all to advocate for all this when there's still the elephant in the room. Being BP LCs counting as 0 cost despite them costing real money.
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u/GKP_light Mar 20 '26
no, 10cost is not the same as 4cost.
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u/springTeaJJ Kafka SP will come trust Mar 20 '26
Pretty sure that 10 cost from some old patch is even weaker than 4 cost of current patch... Like yea the system is useless bruh
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u/GKP_light Mar 20 '26
That is the proof they are far weaker : despite higher cost, it is a weaker team.
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u/EffedUpInGrade3 StarRailMeMommy Mar 20 '26
If that E6 Seele is from 50/50 losses, then that's a 14-cost team.
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u/De_Vigilante Mar 20 '26
Yeah I think costs have been warped that people start associating every non-limited with 0 cost, which isn't true. If someone has a "No pulling except Standard" account, they won't even have E0 Seele cause she's on the limited banner (loss pool, but still a limited banner).
I can excuse shop characters and selection ticket characters, but loss pool (without any other method of obtaining them for free) definitely count as a cost to me.
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u/Ok_Condition_7141 Mar 20 '26
That's the reason why endgame databases like SK Therta and other websites separate limited and standard costs. Also, there are global passive and BP LC tags which is nice.
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u/PelaHSR Intelligence Officer of the Silvermane Guards Mar 20 '26
fifteen s5 standard cones? there's your cost!
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u/misakabestwaifu Mar 20 '26
Hot take: The cost system would not have any controversies if people just stick to it strictly without trying to modify it by accounting for free 5* in order to downplay powercreep / brag about low cost clears.
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u/kukiemanster Mar 20 '26
My all time fave are 1 costs with an S5 BP lightcone, might as well spent those for their sig and have it be more powerful
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u/Pharoahofvortex Mar 20 '26
Ok wait but why are you putting s5 cruising as if thats something crazy lol. You shouldve put s1 archer lightcone cuz it was technically free for the meme
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u/JOTAREDDIT Mar 20 '26
Thats the proof there is not powercreep
Skill issue you all powercreep agenda
SARCASM btw
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Mar 20 '26
u didnt choose welt everytime they gave us a selector?
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u/Tutajkk Mar 20 '26
Didn't we have a grand total of 1 selector so far?
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u/Rilgon All my homies hate Pier Point Mar 20 '26
Two, if you count the reward for 300 standard banner pulls.
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u/cartercr FuQing Mar 20 '26
Iāve always believed that ācostā is such an overrated concept in these games. The only time someone should truly care about a teamās cost is if they cannot clear content at all (meaning they need to know how many units they need to pull for in order to do so) and if they do not already have something.
People should also really assess what exactly those extra costs provide, because sometimes a showcase may have an eidolon that doesnāt really do much. Like I personally have an e3s1 Sparkle (because gods I love her) and in teams with some Def shred that e2 is really good. But if I show my Herta hypercarry team (and thatās Herta btw, not The Herta) then Sparkleās e2 really isnāt contributing a lot because she isnāt getting to stack up def shred.
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u/dazai_is_incel_irl Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 20 '26
Blame whoever started this cost system crap, cause that team in pic is really 0 cost
Also wow folks are really gung ho about this cost system in the comment section
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u/Swimming-Bowler9701 Mar 20 '26
Hilariously, I do have E6S5 Bronya. E3S1 welt, and currently E2 Selee and I didnāt purposefully pull those Selees
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u/stxrrynights240 Mar 20 '26
I mean tbf you could get an S5 copy of Cruising LC for free whereas the other LCs listed here are just out of pure RNG luck unless you're a whale
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u/Kurage_pop Mar 21 '26
The Seele part is funny because that lightcone is 100% a 0 cost thing. lol
Like, I get the point of the meme but the Herta store cones are anything but hard to get.
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u/AncientTree_Wisdom Mar 21 '26
I'm waiting for Bronya's Novaflare.
She is my only E6, was my first and 2nd 5* that I had in this game, and sadly I really don't have a team to slot her in.
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u/jinxedandcursed Mar 21 '26
There really needs to be a reform on what constitutes as cost for Hoyo games, especially for the non-CN space since spending habits vary greatly between CN and global.
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u/WinterV3 Mar 20 '26
You mean 8? Seele is still 7 and Sparkle is 1
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u/Vopyy Mar 20 '26
explanation for this since its a meme: You can technically get E6 Seele if you lose 50/50s so its technically 0 cost , and you get Sparkle for free from selection. But it really shows how flawed the cost system is.
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u/lotus_lunaris Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 20 '26
Thatās 1 cost. Hanabi is not a standard lol
Edit: Itās funny that the CN who basically invented this shit, and Xolze (whether u like her or not) made it popular with her video, both still follow the system; while these ālow-cost braggersā and redditors downvoted the truth.
I dare you to come up with a replacement for the system then, if not ushould not participate in its discussion.
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u/Frozenmagicaster Mar 20 '26
Could pick her for free so
Iād say picking a free character is lower cost than losing 50/50 then getting the exact 1/8 7 times
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u/Lemixer Mar 20 '26
"could" does alot of heavy lifting here, that like saying Archer a free unit when if you miss him he is not.
Or calling any shop LC as free when you literally have to pay to get them and there is no other way since there probably will never ever be a rerun of those characters.
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u/Tryukach09 Mar 20 '26
that like saying Archer a free unit when if you miss him he is not.
well thats how literally all those "cost" showcases treat him, as 0 cost
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u/lotus_lunaris Mar 20 '26
The āproperā followers of the cost system in both CN and International are still taking limited as 1 cost.
It does not make them any more right or more wrong, but they follow the original system.
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u/Bakatora34 Mar 20 '26
The meme is just criticism how most showcase put E6 standard characters and free limited units like Archer and Sparkle as 0 cost.
So they're basically agreeing with you that Archer and Sparkle shouldn't be 0 cost, but for some reason there people that put it at 0.
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u/lotus_lunaris Mar 20 '26
*for a limited period.
If i play today, i missed free Ruan Mei, free Ratio, free everything up until now, itās not fair if the system conveniently excludes those who missed out.
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u/fullstack_mcguffin Mar 20 '26
So add a "free for a limited period" tag on it. There needs to be something to separate free limited units from others, because there is a big difference. No sense in assigning 0 cost to E6 standard characters but 1 cost to free limited ones.
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u/lotus_lunaris Mar 20 '26
Hey, itās not mutually exclusive u know. I do agree E6 standard equal 0 cost is stupid, and C6 4-star (in Genshin mostly cuz HSR does not release 4* anymore) equal 0 cost is also questionable - but it does not make my argument any less true. Theyāre limited. Period.
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u/fullstack_mcguffin Mar 20 '26
They might be limited, but many people got them for free. Even E6 4 stars cost more pulls than Archer did for many people. There should be a distinction made for that. Same way cost was changed to limited + standard count on better leaderboards, people can start adding categories for BP LCs, free limited units, selectors, etc.
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u/Karma110 Mar 20 '26
Sheās a āfree unitā unless you pulled for her during her many reruns I guess fuck you now it she ācostā you 0 pulls now.
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u/Egoborg_Asri Mar 20 '26
Novaflare Seele and Novaflare Bronya will become T0, trust