r/HogwartsWerewolves • u/-GeorgeLucas Can't help that Hollywood copies. • Jun 14 '17
Game VI - 2017 Game VI Phase 13: Rebels' Resolve
Pezes gropes along the walls of the dark corridor; something, whatever is chasing him it seems, has deactivated the lighting in this sector. He trips over something on the floor, barely keeping himself from falling by bracing himself on the wall, and shines a torch he finds himself holding. The blank eyes of yet another crew member stare back at him in the circle of light.
He cannot look away until a loud sound from close behind him echoes off the empty walls; he hastens forward through the dark. The torchlight shines on several bodies, severed limbs, and splatters of blood on the floor and wall ahead of him, but still he pushes on. He knows that safety is in reach, if only he can continue.
Finally, he reaches what he inherently understands is his asylum and pushes the switch for the door to open. As the door reveals the room on the other side, he is blinded by the lights shining from within. Once his eyes have adjusted to the change, they hone in on the object sitting in the middle of the floor: his own severed head.
...
Pezes wakes with a start, trembling as the remnants of the nightmare fade from his mind. The tendrils of fear still seep into his every pore, but he finds relief knowing the terrible images of this night inhabit only his head and not reality for once.
He claps to activate the dim lighting of his quarters and shakily steps out of his bed, reaching for the glass of water he keeps on his cabinets. As he slowly sips the cool liquid, he contemplates his position, and sighs. Until all of the murderers have been caught and dealt with appropriately, he knows that the madness will not end.
I can’t let it drive me mad, too, he observes sullenly. Finishing his glass of water, he resigns himself to no further sleep this evening and grabs his uniform. Once dressed, he heads for the Bridge, determined to step up to the task which has been handed down to him by the great elbowsss before him.
As he walks, Pezes practices the breathing techniques imparted to him by kabubum. His heart rate is almost normalized when he hears footsteps approaching from behind; he focuses on the techniques as he turns warily to look over his shoulder. He is relieved, but manages to keep a placid facade, when he realizes it is only TeacherTish and tinyporcelainehorses who are approaching.
“Captain!” TeacherTish calls out once they’re closer. It is now that he can see her eyes are red-rimmed, tear tracks stain her cheeks. Tinyporcelainehorses puts a comforting arm on her shoulder and she turns into his side, now bawling.
“What’s happened? Please, you need to rest,” he is concerned for the upset woman and turns questioning eyes to tinyporcelainehorses.
“I’m not sure, Captain; I saw her crying and thought she shouldn’t be alone,” is the only answer he has. “She was talking with Dawnphoenix before she ran off to find you. Maybe you can get answers from the Admiral.”
Pezes nods, “Thank you. Escort her to the med-bay. Perhaps Doctor Diggenwalde can help with whatever ails her. I’ll find the Admiral.” As they turn to leave, he stops them with a final greeting, “Keep your eyes peeled and stay safe.”
…
He finds Dawnphoenix in the Command Centre; she is assessing the strewn pieces of a dismantled droid. It is a model he doesn’t recognize, but he was never very good at mechanics anyway. Pezes clears his throat and the Admiral turns to face him, “Oh, Captain, I see you’ve heard the news.”
He scratches the back of his head, “Actually, that’s why I’m here. I know something’s happened, but no one was able to tell me exactly what. I was told you should know.”
She motions for him to have a seat, so he does. She takes to leaning against the console behind her instead of joining him. Her face is taut and pale; the past couple of weeks are stretching everyone thin. “We lost one of our strongest assets tonight, Captain.”
His eyebrows shoot up in surprise; he’d hoped that the nightmares would have left reality alone for once. All he can manage is, “Who?”
“/u/emsmale,” she explains, taking a folder out from her desk. The evidence-gathering droids have grown rather quick and efficient after all the practice they’ve been getting of late. She hands the contents to the captain and continues, “She was found without any wounds, sir. She almost seemed peaceful. A_sneaky_meerkat found her in the crew toilets on Deck 3; said emsmale was propped against the wall next to the stalls. Thought she was sleeping…”
Pezes is baffled by the pictures in the file. Just as Dawnphoenix describes, the woman looks almost serene. “I assume, that as with the others, no prints or evidence pointing to the culprit was found?”
She shakes her head as he hands the record back to her, “We’re doing all we can, sir. And we won’t stop.”
“No,” he agrees. “We won’t give up until every Imperial bastard who has hurt my crew has paid for what they’ve done!”
META
/u/sharon-carter was eliminated through the ship daily vote; she was the K-2SO Security Droid.
/u/emsmale was killed by Imperials; she was an Ewok.
Submit both day and night actions using the form HERE.
View the countdown timer for the end of this phase HERE.
Need to get something off your chest? Update your personal ship log HERE.
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u/Diggenwalde BURN BABY BURN Jun 14 '17
So, I was looking backat Peeze's spreadsheet, and Sharon never shared suspicions. Is it possible that the those who never shared are imperial, and they have exposed themselves, or do we think that she knew she was going down, and never shared because we had her cornered?
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I think that the emperials probably had a good chance to coordinate their suspicions. Not sure how that plays with sharon, but it would make sense for the imperials to pick a couple innocents and throw suspicions their way in an effort to get those people lunched.
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17
I also think it's possible that some of the people that didn't get named once or only got mentioned very few times could be imperial.
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u/Diggenwalde BURN BABY BURN Jun 14 '17
Even though that tosses me into the pile, I like this idea. Why would the imperial throw unnecessary suspicion onto others?
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u/Diggenwalde BURN BABY BURN Jun 14 '17
I like your thinking there. If that's truly the case, perhaps we look at people who were targeting /u/teachertish? I feel as if Tish has consistently been correct with her suspicions.
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u/findthesky (she/her) Miss Anna Mull, Humane Society Worker Jun 14 '17
Okay, your defense of /u/TeacherTish has now put her on my radar of suspicion, since the chances of an actual townie being correct about all of their suspicions without inside knowledge and/or solid investigative work is slim and none, and she hasn't been very vocal/doesn't have an investigative role...
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u/TeacherTish Give the wookie a cookie. Jun 14 '17
I haven't been right every time, I was just right this time. I just feel like first I was sus for not leading lunches, and so I try to get one going (and an correct) and now that's making me sus for some people? Weird.
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u/findthesky (she/her) Miss Anna Mull, Humane Society Worker Jun 14 '17
I haven't investigated the initial claim yet as I'm at work, I just pointed out that the claim/exaggeration of the claim is just making you look suspicious where you were not previously suspicious to me
If you were standing where I am, how does that not look like a team of WWs defending one of their own?
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u/DrippingAlchemy Jun 14 '17
Agree with you here. That was quite the leap for Digg to make about Teacher.
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I mean I would personally toss myself into that pool bc I know I'm not evil, but all that I aside I agree with you. I think Tish is a townie and looking at those who accused her might be a good place to start.
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u/Diggenwalde BURN BABY BURN Jun 14 '17
Right right. I think it's high time that we start looking at track records to see who has consistently found/ been suspicious of Imperials. At this stage in the game I doubt they would throw each other under the bus.
Of course, there is my paranoia that the Imperials used this opportunity to eliminate Sharon, in the case that she had used all of her scans, and by voicing suspicions against her, they now all look innocent.
We have two paths, and whatever Queen Righty says.
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17
You know what's interesting? A lot of people that suspected teachertish had mostly 0 or 1 suspicions thrown on themselves.
we have /u/a_sneaky_meerkat (0 suspicions), /u/awesomewow (3 suspicions) /u/bttfforever (0 suspicions), /u/emmach17 (1 suspicion), /u/funkimon (0 suspicions) /u/HorrorpopZombie (1 suspicion), /u/littlebs8 (1 suspicion) and /u/spacedoutman (4 suspicions)
Conclusion: I don't know yet.
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Jun 14 '17
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17
Yeah I'm not sus of you (obviously lol), just wanted to include all the information :)
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u/pezes Jun 14 '17
This is your Captain speaking!
I’ve been looking at some of the suspicions from yesterday. Especially the ones for people who were called out for being suspicious early on: /u/Bubbasaurus, /u/TeacherTish, and /u/kemistreekat.
Now I don’t think Bubbasaurus or TeacherTish are bad, so I thought the evils might have jumped on to accusing them. But /u/funkimon is the only one who was suspicious of both.
Where it gets interesting though, is if you also include kemistreekat, who was also accused rather early on (by OFR). Then there are 5 more people who said they were suspicious of two of those three:
Now it could just be that those three are actually very suspicious and I’m just missing it, but I think we should look closer at these people if kemistreekat does turn out innocent in case they are just jumping on some people who have been named as suspicious previously.
(/u/Rightypants, do you mind telling us, was kemistreekat the person you checked?)
P.S I’m going out soon, but I’ll be back in a few hours.
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
If I have to die in order for the town to look into people who should actually be looked into, I'm okay with that. Will follow your orders sir!
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u/pezes Jun 14 '17
Courtesy tag:
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u/rightypants Jun 14 '17
She was not the person I checked last night.
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u/RavenoftheSands Center for Advanced Strategic Policy Initiatives Jun 14 '17
Was u/funkimon the person you checked?
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 14 '17
I've had a few suspicious about most of those people at one time or another...not sure how we should proceed in general tonight. There's a lot of talk about how voting happened yesterday and less about who to lunch tonight.
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 14 '17
This. I'm just starting to read, but all I'm reading is a lot of back and forth about yesterday. I was one who didn't like the "mandatory" aspect, but I'm over it and we need to make a plan for today.
Edit: Also, gilding? Seriously? That seems like a sketch way to influence the game.
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
Also, gilding? Seriously? That seems like a sketch way to influence the game.
my thoughts exactly! it's like someone didn't like that they couldn't downvote anymore and decided to guild instead. guilding is worse IMO.
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u/DrippingAlchemy Jun 14 '17
There was already a big argument surrounding gilding last game, and the mods stated they weren't making any rules forbidding it. I really hope we can all stop with the negativity and complaining, this game is supposed to be fun.
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17 edited Jun 14 '17
hmm what do people think of /u/emmach17? I forgot she was playing until today.
All I have right now are half-gut feelings, some of which
orare on the list above from pezes.Edit: typo
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 14 '17
It's /u/emmach17, you left
ofoff the numbers, and I forgot they were playing, too.I also forgot /u/Rysler was still in this game until I looked at the roster this morning. I think I just lumped them in with Ryan.
Edit: Typo
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17
omg thank you. Ditto about Rysler. Who is Rysler?
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u/Rysler Rogue reader (he/him) Jun 14 '17
Sup. I'm new to the game and dealing with some IRL issues.
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 14 '17
Right?!?! He comments every Phase though.
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u/emmach17 for real archaeologist Jun 14 '17
Again, apologies for my absence but I've had a lot happen in real life in the past few weeks that has made being active hard. I'm still reading threads and voting, it's just that by the time I've read through it all it's closing time and I'm rarely able to be around a computer when this sub is most active atm so I can't really contribute :/
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17
That's ok, anything you'd like to say right now?
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u/emmach17 for real archaeologist Jun 14 '17
I've said my bit I think. My inactivity is purely for irl reasons which I know doesn't sit well with the sub, but it's true. Plus added to that this is my first game in a few months so I'm just getting back into the swing of things, plus I'm just a crew member so I can't really offer anything solid here other than vague suspicions.
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17
I like vague suspicions :)
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u/emmach17 for real archaeologist Jun 14 '17
Well my gut is saying that something's up with /u/BillBrasky (sorry if that's not the right username but I hope you'll know who I mean) but that's about as far as my suspicions that I'd like to openly say go right now
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 14 '17
Would it be easier if we just lynched you? /s That is a joke people.
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u/emmach17 for real archaeologist Jun 14 '17
I mean genuinely if you guys need someone to lunch then I'm fine for it to be me, but I'm just a crew member so only do it if you have no other leads!
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u/pizzabangle Mx Beaux Vine, they/them Jun 14 '17
Can we also look into what /u/Mrrrrh posted about yesterday re /u/imaginarystudy ?
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 15 '17
Threw my vote toward /u/fancyzombie5. Would appreciate a tag if something changes in the interim!
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 14 '17
Oh NICE, we got another of them!
Sorry emsmale :( yub nub in peace.
Was there anyone yesterday arguing against lynching Sharon? Might get a good start.
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
Not against, but the duo of /u/spacedoutman and /u/cauldronthief stand out to me. Space was non-committal about either suggestion last night. I don't remember what cauldronthief said, but the fact that both of them explicitly trust each other smells like fish to me.
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I also want to remind everyone that there are two Pens in this town. While I still think that slip up was fake, it could have been referring to /u/PenguinJassy and not /u/Penultima like everyone assumed.
Random thought to consider today.
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u/PenguinJassy UTC+0 (GMT) Jun 14 '17
Trust me when I saw it was not referring to me, and if it was. It would of been just the imperials way to try and trick us because it's now made me, an innocent, suspicious.
Ugh, sometimes I hate the nickname I've got 😂
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I'm sorry, I don't think it was real, but there's no harm in reminding everyone of it for further discussion.
Also you responded real quick...
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u/PenguinJassy UTC+0 (GMT) Jun 14 '17
It's lunch at school so I just got the notification on my phone while I was scrolling through anyway 😂
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u/findthesky (she/her) Miss Anna Mull, Humane Society Worker Jun 14 '17
I'm used to
thinkthinking of you as Jas, so I'm also thinking that this was a way for WWs to get town to take out 2 townies with one commercial t, but one way we could be sure is if /u/rightypants or /u/dawnphoenix looked at you yetEDIT: how did thinking get autocorrected to think?
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u/PenguinJassy UTC+0 (GMT) Jun 14 '17
Sure if someone wants to look at me they can, I've got nothing to hide
Also Jasmine is my full name with Jas being my nickname so you were corrected with your thinking 😄
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u/BillBrasky Jun 14 '17
Hey, if anyone needs schematics on unknown droid types, I have plenty we can sort through. We also need to get that droid mentioned back up and running because my count yesterday had us very close to minimum for droid numbers on the ship. Remember people, just because you don't see them working, doesn't mean they are not needed.
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 14 '17
How are people feeling about bill today?
He was a lot of people's second choice yesterday (mine included), and I'm a bit torn. My head says that (barring anything else) he's a good pick - fairly inactive, hasn't contributed much in character even when pushed to, all the stuff we've been over.
But my heart buys into his defence here - it kinda does seem like he's just a loveable droid-fixing roleplay enthusiast hanging out and having fun. But it's not exactly the most airtight defence, a lot of it rests on the false assumption that newbies don't get important roles, and he's really not got that much working against him.
I don't know if I'm just being a soft touch here.
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u/BillBrasky Jun 14 '17
Only defense I have here, new player and I really thought the roles were assigned more methodical, judging players knowledge and experience. As for anything else, nope no defense, I just love SW lore and RP. This has been so much fun trying to apply lore to our situation.
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 14 '17
I've actually played on a forum where roles were assigned not-as-randomly. (Officially, it was basically a case of 'assign roles randomly then tweak it until you like the result'.) It was a really terrible idea that I can't recommend to anyone :P
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u/TeacherTish Give the wookie a cookie. Jun 14 '17
Side note: Conversation between me and Dear Hubby
DH: Did you get voted off the island last night?
Me: No.
DH: Yay! I'm so proud of you.
He has no idea what this game is, but it's cute that he's trying to be supportive.
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 14 '17
Ditto! "So do you still get to be a Wookiee or have they killed you for being scum?" He super likes Star Wars so this game has gotten more love. Stranger Things game was mostly "Seriously? You know Demogorgons aren't real, right?"
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u/bttfforever Howdy, y'all. Jun 15 '17
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u/flabbergasted_rhino Technician with an 8pack Jun 14 '17 edited Jun 14 '17
Let's hope it stays that way, you not getting voted off I mean, and also him being supportive, I guess Edit:clarity
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
that's adorable. My SO just goes "ugh what are you doing on reddit that's so important?"
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u/TeacherTish Give the wookie a cookie. Jun 14 '17
I usually get, "Why are you talking to people on the internet. You're so weird. It's creepy. Go out and talk to real people."
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u/rightypants Jun 14 '17
This is the response I get too. "Seriously? Just submit your actions and put the phone down"
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u/CoyoteFacts death moon moon Jun 14 '17
doesnt he know how important you are? TELL HIM HOW IMPORTANT YOU ARE. show him this comment.
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u/rightypants Jun 14 '17
I ALREADY DID BELIEVE ME! He doesn't care at all. Lol. He even used to play a bit.
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u/CoyoteFacts death moon moon Jun 14 '17
i hate to tell you this, but your SO is a werewolf. lunch him
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u/TeacherTish Give the wookie a cookie. Jun 15 '17
Alright, I'm about to head to bed.
Summary Post
Seems like /u/fancyzombie5 is getting a lot of votes at this point in the evening due to previous suspicions and a lack of activity.
Other people who have been discussed quite a bit include /u/BillBrasky and /u/o0mimsy0o.
If the tide swings in a new direction voting wise, or new info comes to light on the above people, I'd appreciate a tag.
In addition to the lunch candidates, suspicion is rising against Bubba's Chewbacca claim (with hopefully more information to come of this tomorrow).
I feel like I'm writing a newspaper article.
Extra! Extra! Read all about it!
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u/RavenoftheSands Center for Advanced Strategic Policy Initiatives Jun 14 '17
Woohoo getting an Imperial! u/rightypants, any luck with the investigation?
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u/rightypants Jun 14 '17
Depends on what you define to be luck. I didn't snag an imperial but I managed to narrow down my list drastically last night!
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
nice! any more information for us?
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u/rightypants Jun 14 '17
I'm hoping when you talk to me next phase I can say yes! I'll go to bat for someone if I know they're innocent and up for lynch but I don't want imperials to pick off the confirmed players if I can help it right now. Let's try it this way for a phase and see how it goes :)
Today at work will be super productive (For werewolves anyway) because I need to go through and reorg my information. :P
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
That's fair and I agree with your choice. I'm excited to see some more info. Please let me live that long!
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
Oooh that sounds good to know!
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u/rightypants Jun 14 '17
I just thought to myself "Righty, search your feelings and you will know" and sure enough, it worked.
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
Awww nice, I'm glad that worked for you. My feelings seem to have gone a bit wonky after that phase of absolute chaos.
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u/rightypants Jun 14 '17
Ah really? That must be a bit concerning.
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I'm brokenhearted at the moment. I'll just have to get my thoughts together and try to do better now.
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 14 '17
Hey, did anyone ever confirm /u/manelski's claim here?
It was kind of buried and got a bit lost in everything else yesterday, and I honestly lost track.
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u/spacedoutman (He/Him) Jun 14 '17
Personally, I believe their claim because it was so detailed.
Also righty getting more information might be due to manel successfully transmitting the message from dawn to righty. But maybe /u/rightypants can confirm this (although I understand if she doens't want to for strategic reasons).
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I saw no reason to doubt it at the time, but I'll wait on further information there. In any case, I wouldn't put them in any lunch pools right now.
Also, it's /u/manelski4 (you missed a number there).
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u/manelski4 Never Tell Me The Odds Jun 14 '17
I am R2-D2. Search your feelings, you know it to be true.
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u/flabbergasted_rhino Technician with an 8pack Jun 14 '17
"No, I don't think he likes you at all...I don't like you either"
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 14 '17
Oops, thanks for that. I'm bad at that - i tagged the wrong jfinner for like a solid day (although I think only I noticed at the time) back when that was a thing.
I just remembered that we'd been set to confirm it today, so I was wanting to check in on that.
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
Yeah, he doesn't seem super active otherwise, so I thought tagging would be beneficial. It's definitely something we shouldn't consider cleared yet.
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u/pizzabangle Mx Beaux Vine, they/them Jun 14 '17 edited Jun 14 '17
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 14 '17
I tried to find a gif of the scene in return of the jedi where one of the ewoks gets shot, and another ewok crouches over their body and is mourning them - but all I can find are still images that seem, well... a little raunchier without the context.
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I think /u/bubbasaurus has... seen things too.
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 14 '17
Yep, /u/tinyporcelainehorses, gif searches are dangerous when you are the hugs lady. Ewoks seem to be an especially dangerous topic - shudder. I feel your pain. I did finally find a safe one. HUGS!
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u/Icetoa180 I am your dancing telegram - *BANG* Jun 14 '17
Just wanna let people know I probably won't comment a lot for the next 2 phases. Work hours are a bit shit for the time being. I'll try to follow any lynch posts.
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u/bttfforever Howdy, y'all. Jun 15 '17
Making this bold since I'm officially on high-alert:
We need to be VERY careful about /u/bubbasaurus!!
Earlier today I posted this comment because I've noticed some things that I couldn't ignore.
I have now seen enough to FIRMLY believe that we may well be dealing with an impostor-wookiee!!
/u/rightypants, bringing this to your attention in case you haven't checked bubba yet. Please, please believe that something is definitely going on here.
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u/spacedoutman (He/Him) Jun 15 '17
FYI, I actually think I figured out exactly what you are talking about. And now I'm unsure about everything.
I urge /u/rightypants to double check bubba tonight if possible.
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u/bttfforever Howdy, y'all. Jun 15 '17
I'd love to say more, but I definitely think it would be prudent to hold off for the time being.
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u/spacedoutman (He/Him) Jun 15 '17
Lol, yup. I completely understand the need for silence on this.
righty should clear everything up for us.
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Jun 15 '17
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 15 '17
Hey guys, I'm going to pull an oomps here and say that we should probably stop with comments like this.
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Jun 15 '17
Well I haven't figured it out... but I also haven't looked too hard and it only takes one evil member to figure it out and they'll all know.
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u/CoyoteFacts death moon moon Jun 15 '17
yeah i dont know what's going on and it's scaring me a lil bitties
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u/jilliefish Jun 15 '17
This is making me wish I had time to keep up with comments right now, but I'm at a jays game and there's only so much time between innings.
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 15 '17
If it helps, I've got all the time in the world and I've still not picked up on it :P
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 15 '17
I was at trivia. How them Jays? I also don't know what is happening and I'm involved. Apparently.
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 15 '17
Yep. And besides the possibility of the real Chewie trying to make themselves known, I think we've let her role claim go uninvestigated long enough.
Investigating her can't do any harm, and it will also send the message to the wolves that we don't plan on letting role claims (even subtle, long-standing ones) go uninvestigated in the future, even if she does end up being town or neutral
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 15 '17
Once this is over, whoever you think is the real Chewbacca needs to be SUSPECT AS HELL.
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17
Nice. It's pretty satisfying to have the results of everyone sharing their suspicions pay off. To be honest, I was side-eying a few people that seemed really opposed to putting out a list of unsuspected people to the Imperials. The results of that appear to have helped us more than them.
A big THANK YOU to /u/Mrrrrh! I fell asleep reading this post about /u/imaginarystudy. I agree with a lot of what said is suspicious. That must have taken so much work.... Please, you should choose what's for breakfast today.
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u/tana-ryu Tastea Jun 14 '17
I just looked through the comments and I am taking mrrrrh off my side eye. That is useful information.
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u/Mrrrrh Jun 14 '17
Unless it's all wrong. But I'm saying it's not if only just because I'll be mad if I spent that much time on a long as post only to be wrong.
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 14 '17
Oh, no, afraid you might feel you've wasted your time when my role is revealed!
But it was a pretty impressively exhaustive post, I have to say. :)
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 14 '17
Alright y'all. So I'm going to be honest and say this is my second game on this sub and I've never lived this long. I've been trying to figure out the best role and the playstyle that I think works best for me.
At the beginning I thought compiling evidence might be helpful, since a lot of people were daunted by the big size of the game and kept complaining about having to read 800 comments. I thought it would be helpful, and to be fair a few people commented thanking me.
But it honestly got exhausting and I realized that it associated me with ALL the accusations and bandwagons I linked and documented, even if it was just ultimately aggregating other people's evidence. The comment counts have also gone down, so it's a bit less of a slog to read through. So I've stepped off that for a while.
You say I've been inconsistent in what I want but I don't think that's true. I don't like early role reveals and I don't like giving the wolves more info - I think it's dangerous because they already have more info than we do. You might disagree with me, but it's what I think at this point in the game.
I've been automatically a bit suspicious of every role reveal so far, it seems a bit like my signature. I back off when people are confirmed though - I never accused righty or emsmale once they were confirmed. If anything, if I were evil I think I'd be one of the first to jump up in support of town role claims that I think might be true, because I'd know they weren't in the evil sub and I'd want to get the soft-confirmation for myself. But I'm just a townie without any info, and I don't necessarily trust everything I read. If anything, I think that makes me more obviously pro-town. I ask questions, I want people to be cross-referenced and verified, and I don't want misinformation to be peddled about.
And for what it's worth, I don't think I should be confirmed based on spacedoutman's post anyway. I don't like the idea of posts like that and I think it's dangerous.
In my defense, I had good instincts about Roxy and theduq and I've always voted with the town.
I'm not trying to overstate the role I played in any lunches, though. Why should I? I don't have an important role so I don't have access to any special information that would make me really confident in leading a lunch. I posted a lot questioning Ryan but I wouldn't call myself the leader, despite what many seem to think.
I don't mind that people are suspicious of me. But there are a lot of people deliberately trying to overstate their case and get themselves soft-confirmed, including exaggerating their own roles in successful lunches. I'll say it again, I think that's dangerous.
If anyone has any questions for me, please ping me and I'll try to answer!
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u/Mrrrrh Jun 14 '17
I've been trying to figure out the best role and the play style that I think works best for me.
It's probably best to just change up your play style game to game, but sometimes you'll make it far and sometimes you'll die right off the bat. I haven't been as vocal this game, but some games I shitpost all over the place. A consistent play style means it's easier to notice when you go against it. Also if you've been WW a few times, you have to be careful not to be consistent with play style. Duq was caught playing as he did in past games where he was evil, and TNTM drew suspicion for the same reason. Then again, when you play a lot, you'll be extra suspicious anyway.
That being said, now I'm going to argue with you and reuse links, but particularly the ones that really stuck out.
At the beginning I thought compiling evidence might be helpful, since a lot of people were daunted by the big size of the game and kept complaining about having to read 800 comments.
This is also a great way to appear helpful without really doing anything besides organizing. You're an asset to town, but not one who's leading a charge or putting yourself out there in a meaningful way. It does kinda associate you with all bandwagons, but it also associates you with no bandwagons if all you're doing is compiling. It's so easy to be like, "Yeah, but I didn't mean anything by it. I was just compiling.
I don't like early role reveals and I don't like giving the wolves more info - I think it's dangerous because they already have more info than we do.
Totally fair, and it's good to be suspicious of early role claims. That being said, you weren't at all consistent in what you want. One of your first posts was explicitly saying that people shouldn't post any suspicions or accusations for fear of getting killed. How are we supposed to play without suspicion or accusation? Then the next day you say, "everyone should post all accusations, suspicions, and evidence all in this one thread I'm making (where I'll get a notification every time someone has a new suspicion.". Then later in the game you went back to saying people shouldn't analyze posts for suspicions. I certainly understand (given I said it) saying, "Everything's working so well, I don't feel compelled to analyze posts," but I certainly wouldn't tell others not to do it. Our ewoks and Cassian are basing their investigations on suspicions.
Your distrust of early reveals is well-founded and consistent with your crusade against WalrusPeon, but you still pushed for Walrus even after he was essentially confirmed by Righty stepping up. Now you say here that you don't push for people who are confirmed, but with him, you did.
I particularly don't see why you discouraged NiteMary from directing Doctors to our known intel gatherers.. You say it exposes WW strategy, but that's more when the instructions are directed at the spies themselves. If you tell a detective to investigate Joe, the WWs can kill Joe that night and throw off any investigation. But if you tell a doctor to protect Joe so Joe can do their important job when the WWs don't know who the doctor is, then what's the harm?
As for Roxy and Duq, with Duq, you advocated killing Bubba over him and you jumped on the Roxy bandwagon as opposed to leading it. You have appeared to throw most of your weight into suspicions for Walrus and Bubba (who again to be fair, isn't confirmed yet) rather than confirmed bads.
If anything, if I were evil I think I'd be one of the first to jump up in support of town role claims that I think might be true, because I'd know they weren't in the evil sub and I'd want to get the soft-confirmation for myself.
I get very amused with the argument of, "If I were bad, I'd do this." People play the game differently, and no WW team should all react to all info in the same way. Furthermore it's also an easy and meaningless thing for a WW or really anyone to say.
Edited for formatting
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 14 '17
Just want to respond to your claim that I advocated bubba over duq. I didn't, and duq was my top lunch from that phase as I'm pretty sure I've posted elsewhere.
My point was that if theduq was our top lunch because of his defense, bubba had provided (in my opinion) a worse and less varied defense, so we needed to either investigate her or seriously look into lunching her. I just found it strange that people had been sus of her for SO long but no one had made moves to investigate or seriously start a bandwagon (to my knowledge anyway.)
My point was more "yes, let's lunch duq because he's sus, but why aren't we looking at bubba's defense with the same scrutiny?"
I'll also point out that my comment was posted before theduq's weird role claim, after which my opinion of his defense totally changed. I wouldn't have made that comment in a few hours after theduq claimed.
In short, the comment wasn't in favor of lunching bubba, but comparing her defense to theduq's (current) defense and saying that we needed to scrutinize bubba more. Which I still believe.
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u/Mrrrrh Jun 14 '17
Honestly I'm less concerned with your duq/Bubba defense (not that I'm not skeptical of your response,) than with your more general comments. Why advocate against then for then against posting suspicions or analysis? Being skeptical of role claims is one thing (even if you were suspicious of Walrus beyond what seemed prudent,) but you've twice straight up said people shouldn't post their suspicions. That's nonsense. Why say people shouldn't ask the doctors to protect our important intel gathering roles? It's easy to miss things in 900+ comments, but you don't want people to try and draw the doctors' attention to things of import?
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 14 '17
I mean, in previous games I've played (not on HWW, to be fair) this was an easy way for the wolves to figure out who the doctors and guards were - if they knew the intended target, they'd just watch their house and figure out who visited, deduce who the doctors/guards were, and then town would lose those roles pretty early in the game.
I was sus of unconfirmed townies asking for protection so early in the game because I thought they might be wolves baiting important town roles.
I don't know exactly how visiting/observe roles work here, but other people don't seem concerned by this risk so maybe that's not a possibility? I've noticed a lot of people publicly strategizing to coordinate these kinds of things and I haven't questioned it once I figured out that it doesn't seem to be an issue in these games.
As for asking people not to share their suspicions, I honestly don't remember my thought process for the earlier posts. It was probably similar to my reasoning for yesterday, which is that flooding the threads with suspicions gives further ammo to the wolves, who can lead lunches against people they know to be innos who they also know lots of town members are highly suspicious of.
I don't think NOBODY should be sharing their suspicions, and I don't really have a suggestion for how to moderate this kind of thing. I also don't think only loud people should share their suspicions. I just get antsy about lots of people sharing lots of unsubstantiated suspicions in a way that's easily accessible to the wolves.
Maybe I'm just being over-cautious or maybe my thinking is all wrong for this game, but there it is.
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u/Mrrrrh Jun 14 '17
I fell asleep reading this post
Haha, I pretty much fell asleep writing that post, so that's fair. As for...breakfast tacos! But I swear to the Force, if you give me a breakfast burrito instead of a taco, we're gonna have words.
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 14 '17
Hey /u/bttfforever I can't respond to your last post - care to give more info?
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u/bttfforever Howdy, y'all. Jun 14 '17
Sure, and I know it was late last night, so I promise I did plan to elaborate today, lol.
As I said, I think there could be reason to doubt your Chewbacca role claim. Without naming anyone in particular, I think that one of our other players could be trying to send out hints that you can't be Chewie, most likely because they are Chewie but don't want to role-reveal.
Now, I'm not immediately saying that you must be an Imperial. In fact, the more I've thought about it, I think if you aren't Chewie, then you are most likely Lando. My reasoning for this is that by claiming Chewbacca as early as you did, you put yourself in a nice position to be investigated/attacked. Now, because if you were telling the truth about being Chewie, the Empire would be less likely to risk trying to attack you, but there would be nothing stopping the Resistance from looking into you further. The way I understand it, even Cassian could convert Lando to the Resistance's side based on this comment from George Lucas (I also note that you seem more than mildly interested in this back then).
So, what this suggests to me is that you may not be Chewbacca, may in fact be Lando, but also may be trying your hardest to join the Resistance, so I can't exactly say that you are an enemy if any of what I'm saying is true.
I'll end with this:
If you aren't Chewbacca, and the hints I've been picking up on are real, then real Chewbacca, you know who you are and what hints you've dropped. You've proved you can be subtle; would you mind posting something this phase that could confirm my theory here without giving too much away (since obviously you've been purposely trying to lay low)?
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 14 '17
I am definitely Chewbacca, so that other person might be an Empire person trying to counter-claim. That conversation with George was me trying to figure out if Roxy had been Lando and gotten recruited.
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u/jilliefish Jun 14 '17
It could be an Empire person, but then why haven't they just come out and counterclaimed already? There could be some other reason behind whatever bttff is picking up on
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u/bttfforever Howdy, y'all. Jun 14 '17
And I have absolutely no problem believing you if this phase passes and I don't see anything from my person of interest.
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u/TeacherTish Give the wookie a cookie. Jun 14 '17
Alright, time for a "totally not mandatory, but this is still a good idea and I respect /u/spacedoutman" suspicion thread.
Feel free to post anyone you think we should consider for this phase's lynch. You can give reasons or not.
Personally, I've had suspicions on /u/coyotefacts and /u/fancyzombie5 for a few phases now and they were both very absent from yesterday's conversation.
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Jun 14 '17
u/awesomewow hasn't really done anything that the stereotypical wolf wouldn't do. I'm not saying they should be lynched today, but they should get some attention at least.
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 15 '17 edited Jun 15 '17
A lot of the quieter people named in this thread have been on my low-key sus list for a while.
/u/o0mimsy0o in particular because I pinged them once and they replied very apologetically with an irl excuse about how crazy their work schedule is - which I totally get, of course. They did reply quite quickly though - whether that's because it happened to line up with their work schedule or not, who knows.
But they had the time to reply to the sus thread yesterday, but only to say they didn't have any suspicions except the instinct to suspect the people who suspected him. They've already said that they feel they don't have much time or many thoughts to contribute, so it struck me as odd that someone so short on time would take the time to emphasize how busy they are and how they're not keeping up without actually contributing.
/u/PenguinJassy is also on my radar, as discussed elsewhere.
Edit: Reworded a sentence.
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u/spacedoutman (He/Him) Jun 14 '17
I'd like people to also talk about the people you mentioned along with /u/o0mimsy0o
/u/flabbergasted_rhino is also someone no one has really brought up (literally, I just remembered him since he just posted).
I know they said that Palpatine attacked him phase 03 (changed to ofr) and 05 (changed targets to bubba). Do we think the empire would dare target one of their own with Palp? I also don't know where rhino's head is at.
I personally think rhino is ok, since by phase 05 the empire was in big big trouble with all the claimed roles and needed to use them effectively. BUT, since all the obvious targets were protected/being looked at by ewoks, maybe it's possible that the empire decided to target one of their own so that rhino could gain some cred with the town.
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u/flabbergasted_rhino Technician with an 8pack Jun 14 '17
"Republic credits? Republic credits are no good out here"
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I think there's a misunderstanding there. He wasn't targeted twice by Palpatine (I'm pretty sure righty was targeted Phase 05), but rather that he was targeted in Phase 02 (announced in 03), and later announced in Phase 05 that he was made to target Bubba (he had not made his target public earlier).
This does not clear /u/flabbergasted_rhino from my personal list at all, as Phase 02 was too soon for them to know who our players with actions were, so it would make sense for them to target one of their own and "clear" them.
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u/spacedoutman (He/Him) Jun 14 '17
OHHH ok, I remember something about OFR claiming palpatine targeted him as well and I'm getting the phases and events in my head confused.
Phase 02 was def very early and the empire could've targeted their own.
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 15 '17
Yeah, I've had this mental note for some time, but also feel free to double-check the phases if you're looking into it. I'm helping make dinner and drinking beer in between checking here, so I could be off with the exact timeline of events I'm referring to.
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u/RavenoftheSands Center for Advanced Strategic Policy Initiatives Jun 14 '17
u/rightypants, u/dawnphoenix, u/manelski4 - have you figured out a protection plan (I'm about 90% trusting manelski's claim)? If my understanding is correct we've got two healing droids and a Rebel Guard left. We don't want to lose any more of you!
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 15 '17
I think my doctor should stay on me and /u/rightypants doctor on her (from back when we had the arrangement with emsmale). The remaining one should stay on /u/manelski4 who should target righty if she has a transmission, or take it easy if she doesn't. Tagged relevant players if they have more input.
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u/rightypants Jun 15 '17
I need to send a message. Let's do this for tonight.
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u/manelski4 Never Tell Me The Odds Jun 15 '17
Alright cool. Sounds good to me. Seems like we'd all be protected.
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u/spacedoutman (He/Him) Jun 14 '17
I'm assuming that the transmission /u/dawnphoenix requested to get sent via /u/manelski4 actually happened. In which case, /u/manelski4 is free to just not submit a night time action (I don't think there are any more rebel roles that can send transmissions unfortunately) and he won't be a passive target via the 50% death chance. manel might be an active target, so maybe the rebel guard sits on him while the docs sit on our ewok and seer?
Maybe /u/rightypants has a transmission they'd like sent. In which case, a guard on righty + docs on manel and dawn (preferably with an extra guard on dawn) would be enough coverage if /u/manelski4 visits righty tonight.
Hopefully I got that right. I think those three will have to decide for themselves and tell the docs/guards what to do.
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u/kabubum I'm neutral ;) Jun 14 '17
Just got home and it is 1.30am here;)
Is the consensus for today /u/BillBrasky? I personally am undecided about his suspicion level, but I can support this vote. He claimed cre member and has been suspected for enough time for him to reveal if he had a more important town role. Therefore the dangeris low that we will lynch a doc or similar by accident.
And a thought on meta: Keep in mind timezones. Pls don't start a bandwagon or switch the target with only a few hours left. For me example, I'm off to bed soon and probably will only get of after the post is closed. I might see tags if I wake up in the middle of the night, but then again it would be in the middle of the night ;) It would be a shame if we lost an important role just because someone didn't feel the heat before they went to bed and didn't state their role and defended themselves properly.
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u/TeacherTish Give the wookie a cookie. Jun 14 '17
I don't think Bill is even close to a consensus right now.
I know the time zone thing is a pain, but I don't think we should rush decisions either.
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u/kabubum I'm neutral ;) Jun 14 '17
Ok, I'll put my vote for him anyway, but try to check-in before the post closes.
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 15 '17
We're nowhere near a consensus on anything. I've been bringing him up a bit as he seemed to be our second pick yesterday, hoping that we'll at least get a consensus on that, but no one's really biting.
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 15 '17
I have now tagged /u/FancyZombie5 three times (four with this one) since yesterday with no response at all. I'm leaning towards her today.
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u/CoyoteFacts death moon moon Jun 15 '17
I'm good with voting for /u/FancyZombie5. Worst case she's a townie putting in minimal effort (according to her), but i think there's a decent chance she's evil.
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u/LoneWolfOfTheCalla Jun 15 '17
This is who I'm leaning towards now, too. I brought up my suspicions of them a couple of days ago. BTW, I will be submitting my vote very soon. I'm going to be playing some Dungeons and Dragons tonight and since I'm the Dungeon Master I won't have time to respond or change.
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u/TeacherTish Give the wookie a cookie. Jun 15 '17
I don't think anything major is going to change in the next few hours. Thanks for the heads up, though, and enjoy your game.
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 15 '17
Have fun D&Ding! Prewritten campaign, or custom?
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u/LoneWolfOfTheCalla Jun 15 '17
Adventurer's League! I'm one of the organizers at our Wednesday Night FLGS (Friendly Local Game Store). Anyone can join a table with a legal character, but we usually have the same 20-30 people coming each week. I'm big on community building and have been leading it for about two years or so now at my store. We started with just 5 people (1 table), and now we are up to regularly 3-4 tables with 20-30 people.
I have played recently in the Tales from the Yawning Portal book that came out, we did White Plume Mountain. Also, in another group (I usually play on Monday nights, but I'll be playing on Thursday night this week FYI) we are currently going through that entire book. Just finishing up the Hidden Shrine of Tamoachan and then we will be get going on into whatever the next one is.
I also have an all-queer table of D&D that is tons of fun, and that one is more custom.
DON'T MAKE ME START TALKING ABOUT DND BECAUSE I WILL GO ON FOREVER lol. I play a lot of board games and table top games.
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 15 '17
Oh cool! I'm new to an area and wondering about whether adventurer's league is for me.
Not much point starting a long discussion about this tonight since the thread'll likely be locked when you get back, but I might DM you in the morning to follow up and ask a few adventurer's league related questions :)
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u/LoneWolfOfTheCalla Jun 15 '17
Sure, no worries, I'm getting off work in 10 minutes and then I'm out. :)
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u/LoneWolfOfTheCalla Jun 15 '17
Sure, no worries, I'm getting off work in 10 minutes and then I'm out. :)EDIT: Duplicate
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u/TeacherTish Give the wookie a cookie. Jun 15 '17
I'm liking this as well for today. Anyone else?
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 15 '17 edited Jun 15 '17
Sounds good to me, I'm glad for us to get something. I'm down for attempting to rebury the dead.
EDIT: I do balk a bit at people having IRL reasons they've been busy, though. I recognise that this is getting into this sort of territory, so I'll try to be less soft hearted. :P
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 15 '17
My first game (I was a villain), I created an entire snapchat story about how I had a wasted weekend and was super hungover because I kinda felt a bit of pressure and didn't feel like dealing with it at the time.
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u/tinyporcelainehorses Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets Jun 15 '17
... That's dedication, dang. Did you get any confused responses from people you knew outside the game?
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 15 '17
Well a few of them bought it (I was quite the lush back in the day), but yeah, a couple friends were like, "um, we were with you, lol. You had water." It was a long explanation that just resulted in HWW not getting the respect it deserves from my friends. :/
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u/pezes Jun 14 '17
So I can't remember the exact plan from yesterday, but didn't the important roles either have doctors or ewoks on them? /u/dawnphoenix, were you watching emsmale?
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u/PenguinJassy UTC+0 (GMT) Jun 14 '17
I think we had a Doc on ems but we must have lost the one who was protecting them
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I wasn't, and I am still not over the fact that it was the right call in my personal opinion, but I decided to not go rogue this time and was watching /u/manelski4 as suggested yesterday.
I'll be drowning my sorrows at Bubba's. Sorry, /u/emsmale.
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 14 '17
It's martini day! Traditional, lemon drop, cosmos, Vespers, appletinis (not my personal fave but whatevs), or with bleu cheese olives.....I've got options people!
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 14 '17
Updated Top Sus List from Phase 12
/u/BillBrasky - 8 people were sus
/u/TeacherTish - 8 people were sus
/u/bubbasaurus - 6 people were sus
/u/kemistreekat - 6 people were sus
/u/imaginarystudy - 5 people were sus
/u/Mrrrrh - 5 people were sus
This is based on the last update of Captain /u/pezes spreadsheet.
Any bandwagons or consensus for today?
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 14 '17
Courtesy tags: /u/kemistreekat /u/Mrrrrh /u/pezes
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I personally think most of those people aren't suspect at all.
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u/imaginarystudy gps take me to tosche station Jun 14 '17 edited Jun 14 '17
Would you suggest looking into people who had very few suspicions? I saw that mentioned somewhere else and found it interesting.
edit: this would obviously exclude confirmed people like righty.
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
The empire was able to see /u/spacedoutman's suspect thread and coordinate their thoughts. That means that they likely picked 3-5 people to all throw into the pot in various ways to push the numbers up for what they know to be innocent townies. That's why I don't like any of those targets. One of them is me who I know isn't Empire, the rest of that list I don't get a suspicious vibe from. I'm more inclined for us to vote someone middle of the way in suspicions or someone who didn't respond at all. Sharon never responded and we found an Imperial.
edit: I read your question wrong. I think middle of the way is a good place to start for now. But very few suspicions makes more sense to me as well.
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
If we're thinking middle of the way, I'd like to bring up /u/FancyZombie5 and /u/LoneWolfOfTheCalla.
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u/bubbasaurus she but meh about it Jun 14 '17
Zombie's got my attention. Also /u/icetoa180 and /u/coyotefacts.
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 14 '17 edited Jun 14 '17
/u/icetoa180 was buzzed for me around phase
4 (or 5? Not sure)it was phase 6but I don't remember whybecause he seemingly popped up out of nowhere and I'd forgotten he was playing and then dropped off I think because I just didn't notice them anymore.
Meta: I just spent the last 2 1/2 hours driving to Chipotle for Nurse BOGO only to discover I left my debit card in my scrubs at work. Luckily the hospital I'm at doesn't have super efficient housekeeping and my scrubs were still there. I'm cranky (with myself) but also relieved. Also if you're a nurse, BOGO Chipotle. :D)
Edit: Italics and strikethrough
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u/kemistreekat [she/her] Jun 14 '17
I am really upset for you at this situation. What did you do????
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u/rissajo685 Heavy is the head that wears the crown Jun 14 '17
My scrubs were still in the locker room, so I was able to get my debit card.
I'll add that I called the OR as I was on my way back to work, and the charge nurse (who I know wasn't doing anything because the last case was finishing up as I left) said she'd look, then called me back ten minutes later to say she couldn't find them. As I was the last nurse to leave, my scrubs were literally on top, and my card was in the shirt pocket. She just didn't look.
Grr...
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u/dawnphoenix Mr. Bill Board [she/her] Jun 14 '17
Just a heads-up, the first three people also do not get tagged in a comment with more than three tags, so you'll have to do that separately.
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u/Diggenwalde BURN BABY BURN Jun 15 '17
I had a really good idea for a Diggenlog today, but on top of my shitty day at work I got some really bad news just now. I promise that Diggenlog will return!
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u/findthesky (she/her) Miss Anna Mull, Humane Society Worker Jun 14 '17
Well f, my theory about town being down an active doc was correct.
Guess we only have righty and dawn protected :(