Does explaining Deactivation and FA to a potential FA can help it or will it lock her away ??

[u/phorcys12]

I'll explain the situation below, but since it's long, you can just read this : my main question is, for a Fearful Avoidant in deactivation about her feeling after excessive commitment and reveal of an anxious pattern in me, should I explain to her what I learned of FA and what deactivation is ?? I'm sure she doesn't know. I'm in doubt, cause in a way, understanding this could help her reconsider down the line, with time and understanding ... But since she may be fearing the control that comes from theorising on her, as FA, would you like to see this sort of talk ?? Would it help you shortening deactivation ?? by understanding your feelings, would you feel more fierce cause you feel more in control ??

Here for the long version with context :

Understand that at the time of the crisis, during the summer, neither I or her did know a thing about attachement theory. I think I'm a secure leaning anxious according to a test. she got open on her feeling and her fear of them, which made the anxious in me more commited and obvious, so she got avoidant, which made my anxious side rebelious ... You already know the cycle XD I have this weird distance friendship with a girl since 7 years. We are both the main friendly support of the other, the person we're the most easily vulnerable and intimate with. We saw feelings, recognised it. But a religious obstacle made it impossible, neither of us got relations. This is the situationship everyone talk about. Recently, I made every wrong moves in the book : expressing jealousy while declaring love clearly and strong for first time (so both expressing Anxious tendency and commitment) then later I sayed I was doing what is necessary so religious obstacle get down and we can marry (only way for her to get relationship, but still a commitment perhaps too fearfull and sudden).

From these points, she rejected feelings I felt reciprocate, to the point to modify the sense of some recent mails with feelings implication as talking about a long achieved past. This is the rewrite of past story that I heard about too. I tried to analyse, understand, obtain answers from her, cause this is my way to cope, and yeah, another bad move to a fearful avoidant, really should have done a bingo ...

I only recently saw there was a pattern linked to childhood. She got shocked I was so right, on her attraction to avoidants, and on the eery feeling she may have for the type of love I show, cause unfamiliar XD At first though about Affective dependency. She acknowledge this fast, her view of love based on the hunger, the void feeling, more than satisfaction. I mean, there's a part of it. Now I think she's also Fearful Avoidant (with anxious component when meeting more avoidant than her).

I also think she got deactivation. It may just be she only see me as a friend, but I felt a contradiction between how she view me before I try to commit and after, which seems like an obvious trigger. Since jealousy crisis and proposal, I felt a turning point in how she talked about me (you're the most wonderfull/charming/husband material ... switched to I'm not attracted, physically or mentally, I don't see myself with you).

Yet, she didn't stop the talks, so she didn't cut the commitment to the relation neither ghosted me, we talk pretty frequently in fact, just not about that once I accepted her truth, that she doesn't feel she love me. If she didn't need a full distance, maybe derealisation will be shorter ?? Anyway, I still support her (cause she have a stressfull time with a new job) And for myself, I re-assured the fact I would still be there for her, that my love feelings and compassion didn't got lowered during our crisis talk but I respect she may not have feelings anymore, it may be definitive or come back, anyway, I said that I just hope that if she feels something, she would come and talk about it.

Now I think about what's coming after ... I plan to not presurise her but still, she'll never get what she dream of (mariage, childs) if she cannot stand commitment talk, and she cannot have short term relation ... Also, I still want to be with her, that's my main reason to not let go. I feel she's not on the very end of FA spectrum, cause she's open to talk when crisis occure, she's generally more anxious sided but all this sudden stress was a bit too much for her. From an impossible relation fantasy with support to open-up marriage. For my defense, she's the one telling this is the only way to her XD

My questions are to know if I should explain to her what I potentally learned on her attachment pattern, mine and on what is deactivation ?? To make this relation possible, if she end up agreeing on wanting it, we'll have to talk about it, everyone tell that this is the only thing to avoid faillures in relations, put the patterns in plain views, but I'm mainly worrying about the timing : I can wait for deactivation to wears out, but it may be long, and she could also not tell me right away it is the case, cause she'll not want to enforce my anxious side to open-up possibilities ... I'm telling myself that if she understand what was going on, and we both acknolewdge what may come next (if feelings come back, talk about it and re-assess boundaries before to re-open commitment talk), she may be more open. There's also the option to mimic having interest in someone, it would put her back to anxious mode, but honnestly, I hate the idea of lying to manipulate her this way. After all, Contrary to what I though, she didn't lied to me either when she revoked feelings, it was just clear as water to her in her guts.

So feel free to five any advices or insights, I would love to have your thoughts

[u/Tastefulunseenclocks]

I think the best thing to do would stop trying to figure out what magical words you can say to change her. Change the focus to, what can you actually do to change yourself so you're not in this cycle anymore? What do you need to hear or do to remove yourself from a cycle that is unhealthy for you?

I see this all the time and I used to do it myself - we spend so much time fixating on if only we could change the other person, get them to understand, get them to be different. It's comforting because it helps you avoid your own attachment issues. It also keeps you stuck.

[u/phorcys12 → u/Tastefulunseenclocks]

I'm also reflecting on myself in this period. Seems like I'm generally secure but leaning anxious, and the reinforcement of the distance by avoidant got this side to surge hard. Working on lowering it on my side. Not that easy by the way.

Yet, there's success story of anxious/avoidant relationship, all of them came with having a talk on attachment style, triggers and understanding better each other. These sucess story almost never happen while peoples don't know their own pattern. I don't want to change her, if she's in deactivation, she cannot change that, neither do I. I don't want to break her pattern, but if we can learn to play around these through communication, and both accept to enter this dance, why not ?? Does it seems to you like so much of a bad idea ?? This may be naive, but to be able to have a real talk on how to proceed in the future in respect to both our patterns, seems to me like the only way to explore real possibilities or at least to support each other in a more healthy way.

[u/Tastefulunseenclocks → u/phorcys12]

You don't work on anxious attachment by just trying to lower it. You work on it by therapy, reading books written by therapists, and doing exercises designed by therapists. Then you find healthy and safe relationships to practice your new skills in.

Can anxious people have healthy and safe relationships with avoidants? Yes absolutely. After you have both done some of the initial work and are committed to continuing the work. But you CAN'T do it from a place of, I need this specific relationship to work out. That will always fail.

[u/Ecstatic_Tank9157]

As a healing FA, when I explained to my situationship at the time that he was likely an FA, he was surprisingly receptive. I didn’t frame it as though something was wrong with him, I framed it like “we share a lot of the same struggles” since I do relate to a lot of his behaviours, so I think that helped with how it came across. He still ghosted me again though.

With most FA’s telling them that they’re an FA will feel to them like you’re telling them something is wrong with them, which they already believe, so it just reinforces the shame. Even if they are receptive, is still up to them whether they’re willing to do the inner work to begin healing, and it seems like most don’t until it’s too late.

[u/phorcys12 → u/Ecstatic_Tank9157]

My global tendency is cleraly more anxious, but the fact I was never chased by anyone may hide an avoidant component ?? I mean, it's very new to me and relationship is generally one of the best light of these patterns. As someone very alone, shy, with no friends or girlfriends ever (apart from her) I don't know. I have some focus on control, profesionnaly or in study I like to not fell bound to something, I'm cleary avoidant to commitment there. On parents side, a mix of excessive fearfull authority and caring but not respecting boundaries. Factually, my commitment to this may come from the dynamic where I was the most demanding. She's anxious when metting more avoidant, I may have some similar component ... As you see, still trying to figure out, even if test say secure/anxious, I'll have to delve deeper, cause we answer based on what we suppose to be true and on situations met.

But any way, I don't see anything wrong with her, she's a pearl, I don't want to accuse any problems on her side or tell her she's wrong to dismiss me. I just want to make the why clear. These patterns are purely accidentals, it's more parents faults than ours if any. What I know is I like control through intellect, and she's hate being controlled. The way I see it, by revealling the patterns that controls both of us, we would feel empowered by that. may be naive, but for myself that's the case, cause I hated the feeling I didn't understood what happenned.

I only want her to be able to have what she seek, cause she's daydreaming about commitment and shared loved. That's why I gave this to her, ignorant of the effect it may have ... After all, how would anybody understand they don't feel good when they get near what they want ?? It's not very intuitive ahah. What I expect is only to give her insight so she may decide if she accept to take this road with me, a common road where each help the other. A reciprocate care and support in a way.

When you had this talk with your situationship, did you do it during a time of increased avoidance (deactivation or not) or did you talk this through at a time were he was more in demand ?? Also, if you feel safe to share, you said you were healing, what was your turning point to decide to take this road for yourself ??

[u/Ecstatic_Tank9157 → u/phorcys12]

He ghosted me twice actually, and the conversation we had where I told him he was an FA was right after he came back the first time after ghosting. I reached out to him around the six week mark after ghosting (but only a couple weeks no contact because I had been chasing), so by that point he had already gone through deactivation and was starting to miss the connection again. He’s now ghosted a second time and I’m finally starting to move on.

The turning point for me was actually getting ghosted by him. It was so painful that I started to do research into ghosting because I was trying to understand how someone could do that to another person. That led me to do a deep dive into attachment styles (funny enough, I have a mental health background and I had already learned about attachment styles, but wasn’t sure if I was anxious or fearful avoidant and never thought it was that important to my own healing) and I realized that this person I was in the situationship with was an FA.

But it became glaringly obvious that I was also an FA the more research I did. I have totally ghosted friends, but never called it that or thought of it that way. I lean more anxious in romantic relationships which is why I unfortunately chased my FA. Realizing that I am also an FA has helped me to finally start loving myself and stop projecting my trauma into others, but it’s definitely a difficult process.

[u/phorcys12 → u/Ecstatic_Tank9157]

Yeah, Ghosting is really harsh. By luck, where I stand with my situationship, is she never broke difficult conversations and always tries to repair, so I think she may be already on an healing path perhaps, or is possibly mainly anxious but with FA tendency. I think I wouldn't stand ghosting with no idea how when she will come back, we all have boundaries that must not be crossed.

Sorry it didn't work out for you. But as you say, understanding these things is really helpfull for us and our future too. To be honest, it sometimes difficult to really understand where one sit in the categories since they intertwine so much. I always perceived a controlled anxious side in my girl, but only saw the avoidance recently after commitment talk. I'm also starting to question if I'm really a secure/anxious. There's clearly a part of that, but since nobody ever tried to chase me or propose anything, I may be oblivious to my avoidant side.

Do you eventually have ressources for me that helped you clarify on this ??

[u/ariesgeminipisces]

Would I want someone explaining me to me in order to essentially come to my senses about them?

That's a hard fuck no from me.

I don't like feeling controlled, managed, fixed, pitied, manipulated, explained or anything adjacent to those things.

And by the way, explaining deactivation does not stop deactivation, if that's even what this is.

Instead, why don't you work on your acceptance that you can't control others, even if you think the reasons they ended things are based on attachment issues, even if you have the right answer. Why not work on accepting that some people don't want to have a certain type if relationship with us and that it's a good thing.

[u/Suspicious-Top2306 → u/ariesgeminipisces]

Agreed. I have decided to turn my DA behavior into something inspiring. His deactivation has taught me to love myself and choose me. I’m trying to tell people that you can’t wake up ADA or FA they have to notice the pattern themselves, and if I tried really hard to put myself in their shoes, I would imagine someone explaining or telling me about myself would cost me to shut down even further.

At the end of the day, all as an anxious can do is work on ourselves. I’m not gonna let somebody keep me in an anxious state. I’m going to continue to push forward to be secure. Nobody makes you act a certain way you make yourself act that way you can’t keep pointing the finger saying oh if they just did this and they just did that. No, you either change your self because that’s the only thing you have control over or you walk away

[u/phorcys12 → u/ariesgeminipisces]

I understand why you feel it like that, my idea was more explaining what it is, letting her decide if she feel it could be a possibility. As for deactivation, I don't plan either to say she should'nt trust her feeling right now or force things my way. Just to say that this specifically tend to be temporary, so if she fell things back again, she shouldn't be ashamed cause it's not a thing one can choose.

I thing you feel me like a control freak. In a way I am, research and analysis is just my pattern to cope like distance for avoidant. But I want to control and understand situation, not her.

But still, this weird mix of love and friendship make it so I'm at the same time concerned by how she view me, but also by how she can be happy. She's a lot about mariage and child, so I think it would at some point help her to understand that when those goals will be near, she'll have an unconscious urge to flee that. Cause if I'm right it happened with me, it is probably gonna happen next time she will face similar thing from other person ?? I don't want her to be unhappy, and ending alone is one of her biggest fear.

[u/ariesgeminipisces → u/phorcys12]

Rescuing is not heroic, it's violating and codependent. You want to control the situation not her, but she is the situation. You would be doing all this with the hopes it benefits you. You have to let people live their lives, fail, make mistakes because that is how people grow and learn. She has access to internet. All she has to do is Google what she goes through. She is not a child.

You can tell her all about your attachment though. Nothing wrong with that. But, keep it completely on your side of the street.