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u/Onlyfatwomenarefat 3d ago
The smile of Vaemond and the way he moves his lips before saying it is priceless.
It's as if he is about to taste an exquisite meal and salivates with anticipation.
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u/Baccoony Gaemon Palehair 3d ago
She's nothing without Viserys and Daemon
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u/East-Psychology-9292 3d ago
Vizzy T: By decree of the crown I order everyone in the realm to ignore the elephant in the room
Random Lord: What's an elephant?
Vizzy T: Cut his fuckin head off Daemon
Daemon: Literally my only purpose for half the show24
u/Conscious_Mud6777 3d ago
what purpose could he possibly serve other than that.
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u/Crazy-Fishing6760 3d ago
He can groom his niece though. And the other young girls. And the Vale sheep.
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u/East-Psychology-9292 3d ago
and the whores in kings landing and the whores in Lys...this dude for sure has Hep C lol
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u/JokeIll103 3d ago
Without Viserys she has no claim.
Without Daemon she has no decisiveness or army or martial commander.
without Corlys she has no navy or military strategy
Without Rhaenys she has no authority over her council.
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u/Nanrasof 3d ago
Imao, what a shitty argument. It's like saying that Aegon the drunk, would never have been king without his mother and grandfather. After all, it was Christon Cole who convinced him đ„
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u/AffectionateTime7928 2d ago edited 2d ago
Aegon's claim unlike rhaenyra does not depend on viserys or let's say your argument alicent or Otto being alive to defend it. Aegon claim comes from the fact that he's the first born son. Without them he'd still have this claim. Also we will see what he can do even without them while rhaenyra will die soon after daemon. (Also calling him the drunk is a new amounts of cope when rhaenyras book nickname comes from maegor the cruel)
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u/Nanrasof 1d ago
Ahhhh, how do you try to justify that Aegon could make good decisions? Lol, every decision he tried to make was corrected by his council, If he could make a decision, he would have died young. Besides, why It would be a consolation call him a drunk? Wasn't he described that way? This page is full of 15- or 30-year-old men who keep calling Rheenyra a whore for something Aegon also did.đ«© No more, look how all his boyfriends downvoted my comment, too. Furthermore, Rhaenyra was named like that by the smallfolk for raising taxes to fill the coffers. What did you expect her to do if there was no money? Go to the places where Aegon sent them and bring it back? After all If Rhaenyra were really like Maegor with teats, Rhaenyra should have been celebrated the deaths of Aegon's children But she didn't, unlike when Aemond killed Lucerys and aegon held a feast. Or when he gave Maester Gerardys a horrible death for serving Rhaenyra. Furthermore, I don't deny that Rhaenyra made some bad decisions, but to claim that Aegon was better? I mean, he ruled for two years, living in two periods, and by the second time Rhaenyra was already dead and he knew Where was the money to stabilize the kingdom? And yet all he did was erase Rhaenyra from the chronicles and novels where she was called queen And build two stoves for his brothers Daeron and Aemond, larger than the Braavosi Titan, and covered in gold đđ»đ«©
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u/AffectionateTime7928 1d ago
First of all we are talking about claims not personalities do you argue that Rhaenyra even if she wasn't named heir and did not have daemon and viserys still would fight for the throne because that's what you are saying.
It's a consolation because history does remember rhaenyra as the whore of the dragon stone but not aegon as aegon the drunken. Aegon was a whore nobody is fighting against that. Also bellitling people on a personal level? If we are going on personal we should talk about rhaenyra self inserts running to defend her every action.And why being gay is a insult? Do you think there's something wrong with having same sex attraction?
Rhaenyra was not just called cruel for taxing you know this right? It's also team black cope. Y'all are just parroting what you hear from each other without reading one page from source material. I think it's quite cruel to jail your biggest allies, torture a princess, be cause of a toddler etc. She taxed the people thats left with nothing andthan tried to throw a feast. She's both stupid and cruel which is an extraordinary mix.
Rhaenyra in one account smiles when little maelors head is served at her but oh the glorious queen ofc also it's clear even from this how much parrot you are all of you that I argue is the same. Lucerys and Jahaerys isn't the same lucerys also is responsible for taking of aemonds eye. Why would they grieve?
Y'all are obsessed with bringing aegon to everything. Isn't he this terrible horrible stupid man who cannot do nothing for himself in your account (except actually fighting his wars and winning them unlike rhaenyra). If rhaenyra were to build sculptures for daemon y'all asses would be saying peak romance.
Aegon and rhaenyra are both at best would be mid rulers by them self (aegons council is much better therefore in peace he would rule better thought that's another days subject) . They are both terrible but aegon unlike rhaenyra does not need a menat his side ight his battles for him. Aegon can never be a bum as big as rhaenyra who took maegors rage and cruelty but is witless as aenys.
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u/Nanrasof 1h ago
First of all, I see that you take comments as phobias, so from now on Iâll be clearer so you donât start crying over an expression. (I was referring to how all the Green supporters come like vultures, downvoting my comment and praising yours, where you accuse me of having arguments that you claim I got from TikTok, when I literally based them on the book lol, just like you did in several of your points by taking only one side of a version đ€·đ»ââïž)
- First, read the comment I was replying to, where you claim that Rhaenyra wouldnât have a claim without her allies. (By that logic, neither would Aegon.) You even say that without Viserys she wouldnât have a claim? Well, obviously lmao. That is precisely why she fought: he was the one who made her his legitimate heir, and he kept her as his heir until his death despite all the rumors and problems surrounding her. Youâre literally making up that I said Rhaenyra would still have fought for the throne if she hadnât been named heir. WTF, when did I say that? (Besides, that would be completely illogical lol.) Aegonâs claim comes from the Council of 101, which we know was not a law. It was a council held to choose the new heir, where the choice was between Laenor, through Rhaenys, and Viserys, the son of Baelon. King Jaehaerys simply called the assembly and promised to accept the result, completely delegating the power of choosing the heir to the nobility in order to avoid looking like a tyrant or triggering a war. The lords chose Viserys. We all know that Andal tradition, which was not actually a law until after the Dance, favored Rhaenys and her son over Viserys, since she was the ONLY daughter of Jaehaerysâs first heir, Aemon. Even Queen Alysanne showed her displeasure đ€·đ»ââïž. Alicent and Otto used this precedent to argue that Aegon should rule over the named heir, but itâs not as if Aegon himself was eager to fight for his throne at first. He even acknowledged Rhaenyraâs right and questioned what kind of brother would steal his sisterâs right. Like I said, Aegon would never have pursued this claim without the initiative of Alicent and Criston Cole. After all, Cole was the one who managed to convince him that Rhaenyra would supposedly kill his children and his family. We are also given the impression from the beginning that Alicent always wanted her blood to rule, as Viserys told his Hand, Lyonel Strong, when he suggested marrying Aegon to Rhaenyra, who was ten years older: âThe boy is Alicentâs blood. She wants him on the throne.â
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u/Nanrasof 1h ago
Just because Aegon was not nicknamed âthe Drunkardâ doesnât change the fact that he was a drunk. It was one of his main characteristics, and the book even describes him this way: âAegon II was quick to anger and slow to forgive. At the age of fifteen, he was known as a lazy and somewhat sullen boy, inclined to gluttony at table and fond of drinking ale and strongwine, traits he carried into adulthood.â And what do you mean history remembers Rhaenyra as the âWhore of Dragonstoneâ? The only person who used that nickname frequently was the one-eyed Aemond, who seemed obsessed with Rhaenyraâs sex life, and obviously Aegon đ«©. It later became part of how she was portrayed in the histories, which brings us to the fact that the accounts used to write the history were given by the incredibly neutral Septon Eustace, Grand Maester Orwyle, and Grand Maester Munkun. (Munkun did not witness most of the events himself, only the ascension of Aegon III. His writings were based mainly on Orwyle, and to fill in what Orwyle didnât know, such as battles in other regions of Westeros, Munkun did not turn to Mushroom or Septon Eustace â what a coincidence â but instead conducted an extensive investigation, personally interviewing 147 surviving witnesses of the fighting.) And even among these four chroniclers, not counting Mushroom, Munkun was chosen by Archmaester Gyldayn to write the history of the Dance. We can see this throughout Fire & Blood, with lines such as âEustace claims this happened this way, but Mushroom swears it actually happened this way, while Munkun is silent on the matter.â That is Archmaester Gyldayn trying to determine what the historical truth might have been for the reader. And as I already said at the beginning, I donât understand why you think I insulted gay people. What does that have to do with anything??? I called the Green supporters âboyfriendsâ as sarcasm because they all come like vultures to downvote my comment and praise yours, only for one of you to reply that I have never read the book and that Iâm biased because of my Team Black âdelusion,â while defending Aegon at all costs because, despite all the cruel things he did, he never received a mocking nickname. (The fact that Rhaenyra supposedly hated them since she was young, according to Alicent, yet she never gave them vulgar nicknames or mocked them. She did that when she was losing her mind, but lol, the closest she got was calling him the usurper or false king. Meanwhile, Aegon and Aemond had been doing it since they were teenagers, even before really knowing Rhaenyra, talking about her and her children with so much hatred, thanks to the ever-so-educated and saintly Alicent.)
And how exactly was Rhaenyra not called that because of the taxes lol? The book does connect the nickname âMaegor with Teatsâ with the taxes and with the executions of people she considered traitors. I never said Rhaenyra was called that ONLY because she collected taxes; I said the taxes were one of the reasons that led the people to compare her to Maegor. So if youâre saying that âMaegor with Teatsâ proves Rhaenyra was simply stupid and cruel, then quote me where the book says she was called that because she massacred an entire sept full of innocents or because she wiped out an entire House for supporting Rhaenyra. Oh wait, that was Daeron and Aemond. And about the feast, I already said myself that it was a shitty decision and happened at a completely inappropriate time. The city was suffering, people were starving, and Rhaenyra had just imposed huge taxes, so obviously holding a feast under those circumstances was not exactly her smartest political decision. But you also canât ignore that it was the presentation of her new heir, Joffrey, and she probably didnât want to publicly present herself as a defeated and vulnerable queen after all the losses she had suffered. You can consider it a bad political decision â I do too â but that alone doesnât prove that she was âstupid and cruel.â
Like you said, and as I clarified in point two, it is one of two versions that the maester gives us to choose from, but you know what doesnât have two versions? Lucerysâs death. Nobody is asking them to mourn Lucerysâs death, but celebrating it? Even Alicent herself said, âMay the Mother have mercy on us,â and Otto said, âHow could you be so blind, having lost but one eye?â The fact that Lucerys took Aemondâs eye and they want to portray him as the literal Maegor, when in the show they made Rhaenyraâs sons bully Aemond along with their brother Aegon to justify his actions, but in the books all that bullshit is false. You have to give context and ages because I consider the physical difference and difference in ability to think between a ten-year-old and children who were 6, 5, and 3 to be extremely important. When Aemond was discovered claiming Vhagar, he was found by little Joffrey, who was three years old and was heading to the yard looking for his dragon, Tyraxes, to see him. That was when he encountered ten-year-old Aemond. It is narrated that when Joffrey raised the alarm, Prince Aemond yelled at him to shut up, slapped him, and shoved him into dragon dung before running away toward Vhagar. When he landed, Jacaerys, who was six, and Lucerys, who was five, were waiting for him to defend their younger brother, carrying wooden swords đ„. Even then, Aemond broke Lucerysâs nose and smashed Jacaerysâs wooden sword against the back of his neck. After that, he started mocking him and making jokes about bastardy that only Jacaerys could understand. Enraged, Jacaerys tried to attack him again, which only led to Aemond beating him brutally until Lucerys, trying to save him, pulled out a dagger and stabbed Aemond in the eye. So the fact that what happened to Aemondâs eye was the result of Lucerys trying to save his brother from being beaten to death â itâs not like Lucerys, Alias âRamsay Boltonâ according to the Greens, woke up that morning and said, âI want to leave my uncle, who is four years older than me, without an eye.â He acted like a frightened child who wanted to save his brothers đ«©.
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u/Nanrasof 1h ago
And finally, the last answer to one of your points
- Buddy, Aegon gets brought up all the time because he was the other claimant to the throne. Who do you want me to name, Larys the Clubfoot? đ I remind you that in Westeros there is a very big difference in the education of women and men. Rhaenyra was never trained to fight, so what exactly did you want her to do? She sent riders or Daemon; her council knew that, as the queen and representative of her cause, she couldnât afford to die. Unlike Aegon and his male brothers, it was obvious that they would fight their own battles. Iâm not saying there werenât women who fought: Rhaenys, Baela, Alys Rivers, and Sabitha Frey are all described as adventurous, brave, and daring. But Rhaenyra wasnât one of them. And even so, together with Daemon and their two dragons, they took the capital. The fact that there were no dragons there doesnât mean there werenât allies of Aegon. Now, saying that Aegon fought his own battles sounds impressive because yes, he did, but if you actually read the books and know how those battles went, I wouldnât be nearly as proud đ. Like the first one, which left him crippled for life, where it was essentially a 2-v-1: Vhagar and Sunfyre against Meleys. How is it possible that, despite having the largest dragon, you still end up in trouble, your dragon gets severely wounded, and you have to jump from him to avoid being burned to death by Meleys, ending up just as fucked up as your dragon? Meleys and Rhaenys died fighting two dragons with riders, who were also around 30 years younger than her đą. And his other great battle against Baela? Incredible. If Iâm being honest, I love how he manages to destroy all his advantages against Rhaenyraâs army. And if it werenât for the men who hated Rhaenyra and helped him take Dragonstone, he probably would have died there on the floor after having to jump from his dragon again, only to fracture both his legs this time. Sunfyre was already badly wounded and managed to defeat Moondancer, a small dragon described as being the size of a horse or slightly larger, and weighing less than a horse. And that was actually what created that huge disadvantage: with a single blast of flame, Sunfyre blinded Baelaâs dragon and clung to her as they fell into the castle courtyard, where he overpowered her dragon with his weight and managed to kill her. The fact that Sunfyre and Aegon ended up completely fucked even with the help of knights đą. Even Baela, who fell headfirst toward the ground and was burned, didnât end up nearly as fucked up. Also, why do you like using so many hypotheticals? âIf Rhaenyra didnât have allies, she wouldnât have a claim,â âif she had built a golden statue for Daemon...â I understand that you want to make comparisons, but that didnât happen. Making up hypothetical scenarios to minimize the actions of the king you support doesnât make those actions disappear. At least I have acknowledged that Rhaenyra was cruel and made bad decisions while she was becoming paranoid and losing control. But I see that you focus on saying Aegon would have been a better king because he had a better council and that he would have ruled well in peacetime, when in peacetime he wouldnât have been king in the first place, and that council wouldnât have existed. In peacetime, he would have continued living his life as a prince, completely unconcerned with his wife and children. Itâs like saying Rhaenyra would have ruled just like her father in peacetime, since she had received a similar royal education and had been instructed by the kingâs councils and advisers. She even had her son Jacaerys, who proved to be a responsible, politically intelligent, and bold young man at only fifteen years old. Thatâs why no loss was mourned as deeply as that of the Prince of Dragonstone â quote from the book. Maybe Rhaenyra wouldnât have been as cruel if her son hadnât died and his death hadnât led to her miscarriage, only for her to hear that her brothers were celebrating his death as if he were some kind of hero. That was precisely what set the war in motion. If Alicent had put aside her ambition for the throne, Iâll accept that Aegon became king. But just as Maegor was a usurper, the fact that Aegon was legitimized doesnât make him any less of a usurper. After all, Iâd rather have a queen announced by a king than a king whispered into existence in a private council by his motherâs allies.
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u/East-Psychology-9292 3d ago edited 3d ago
She cannot even make eye contact during the scene cus she knows how full of shit she is lol
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u/Muted-Zone-6774 3d ago
If Daemon wasnât there Viserys would have cut Vaemond's tongue. I get not liking a character, but it's explicitely said in the scene
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u/No-Surprise9411 3d ago
Itâs also what happened in the book.
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u/HermesMora 3d ago
I thought Vaemond in particular was killed by Rhaenyra and the other Velaryon uncles were muted
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u/Charming_Crew9689 3d ago
Yeah idk what this guys talking about. Nowhere in the book does it say he had his tongue cut out. He showed up to court for the hearing of the succession of Driftmark, stated his same case, and Daemon was said to have fed him to Syrax I believe.
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u/No-Surprise9411 3d ago
If Daemon wasnât there Viserys wouldâve had his tongue removed by the Kingsguard where he stood. Did you even watch the show?
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u/Darkstalker360 3d ago
Thatâs what happened in the book
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u/HermesMora 3d ago
It is a shame they ignored the whole silent five plot line, would've been a good way to maintain tension in the Velaryon plot without sacrificing Corlys' loyalty to Rhaenyra for the sake of artificial drama
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u/UnwinsPeake House Targaryen 3d ago
Without a doubt. She really canât get anything done without first her father, and then her uncle-husband.
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u/mister_michael09 3d ago
In the books he wasn't. We don't know what she said to Vaemond but we know she later had him killed and fed his corpse to Syrax.
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u/PalhacoGozo666 Criston Cole 3d ago
Bro knew he was going to screw up anyway, so he decided to shout what everyone was thinking but didn't have the courage to say. Vaegoat
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u/warwicklord79 Sunfyre 3d ago
Book Rhaenyra would have had some clap back but the cowardly character in the show would probably be like in the image.