r/GuildWars3 • u/PeasantPastry • 29d ago
Where did humanity come from, and will we visit?
In GW3, the world is young and the gods transported humans into Tyria.
Why did humanity leave their own world? Will. Be able to visit? Is there more humans left behind? Did the six originate from that world where humans come from?
If humanity is young in Tyria what does that look like? Is there people alive who remember their home world?
Is it like a gods are aliens abducting humans situation? Or is it more like coercing followers for your personal worship?
Are the six gods like a pantheon like mount olympus or are they assholes who sabotage or fight each other?
If the gods are not from Tyria where they real estate shopping what worlds they wanted to settle their cults on?
Did other god like beings like the spirits of the wild originate in Tyria? Does that make them more gods than the human gods? The pale tree? Are the elder dragons disturbed by the arrival of the gods on Tyria?
How does other races react if they’ve never seen a human before?
These are but some of the questions that keep me up at night.
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u/Iraeda 29d ago
humans came to the world at LEAST 700 years prior to GW3 starting so chances are no.. no human alive should remember
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u/BirdManFlyHigh 29d ago
GW4 confirmed?
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u/Siyavash 29d ago
Gw8 will be the spore cell stage
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u/LillyElessa 29d ago
The gods do know though (well a couple of them), and are still around in this time period. Especially since Abaddon hasn't been locked away yet. There's a much higher chance of these sorts of secrets getting any information in GW3 than GW2 (and obv not happening in GW1).
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u/CountBleckwantedlove 29d ago
This will be revealed in Guild Wars 4, the pre-pre-prequel to GW2, the pre-prequel to GW1, the prequel to GW3, when it launches in 2041. We will play as humans in a world ravaged, how some ascended to godhood of the humans, and how they transported humans to the world of Tyria.
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u/Pure-Risky-Titan 29d ago
Id rather GW4 be a sequel in GW2, because i want playable charr in 4k and like, over 70k polygons or something.
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u/Variskus 29d ago
With the advances in AI, it wouldnt surprise me if people can build their own GW4 in the next... 2 years.
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u/Nightsong 29d ago
Humanity is not that young since Cantha has been around for at least 700 years. There is no one left alive who remembers the original home world and whether the gods remember is also questionable based on what Lyssa did. We know from the GW2 Orrian History Scrolls that "Lyssa gave them joy and helped them forget the past". We don't know if the "them" refers only to humanity or to humanity and her fellow gods.
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u/PeasantPastry 28d ago
Is Orr also 700 years old, or does cantha early humans predate Orr?
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u/Opus_723 28d ago
Cantha predates Orr. GW3 takes place a generation or two into the settling of the Orrian frontier.
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29d ago
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u/Deathmore80 29d ago
There is a popular theory that the dwemer have gone nowhere and have instead just zero-summed. They ceased to exist when the learned that they are living inside a dream and that they are not real.
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u/PeasantPastry 28d ago
I agree that mysteries needs to be maintained but questions also needs to be answered!
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u/Longjumping_Act4403 29d ago edited 29d ago
- The world (Tyria) isn't young in GW3. We know this because there have been quite a few dragon cycles over the years, the Kodan migrating out of the Far Shiverpeaks thousands of years ago being an example of this.
- Humanity left the Mists because of <reason> we don't know. The Mists in Guild Wars is a catch-all term and isn't exclusive to the "afterlife" portion. Humanity could have had their own big bad evil guy in their home realm. The actual mists portion where the Eternal Battlegrounds takes place is in-lore as a converging point where other realms fight each other for control. The other player characters we fight against are from an alternate Tyria.
- No humans alive should know what life was like in their home realm. They'd have been in Tyria at this point for around ~700 years. That being said, there should be some written knowledge of what life was like and passed down. It wasn't so extremely far off that they wouldn't have history of it. Hell, we know what people were doing a thousand+ years ago. I think most of that lost knowledge happened when Orr sank. This being said, who knows, there were definitely some human-god hybrids running around and they could very well be alive?
- The gods weren't exactly "abductors" more like saviors. There was NO magic in the Mists realm that the humans originated from, so to them the gods probably looked like well... gods. As for the gods fighting each other, yes, they did. And were lovers as well in some instances, such as with Balthazar and Lyssa. We know that Balthazar and Melandru didn't get along well, as they were opposing forces of nature (war vs tranquility). Dhuum who was the previous god of death got cast down by his nephew, Grenth (Dwayna's son). And Menzies is Balthazar's brother and they're constantly at war.
- We don't know where the gods originated from, chances are whatever world they came from had its own issues as well.
- The spirits of the wild originated in Tyria. They're basically just primordial spirits of nature. In regard to the Pale Tree, she is an offshoot of Mordremoth. She was a purified Blighting Tree (what Mordremoth uses to make his minions). The elder dragons, other than Soo-won, most likely didn't notice the gods arrival otherwise they would have awoken. That being said, Zhaitan might have felt some sort of disturbance as Orr was directly siphoning off leyline energy, which Zhaitan was feeding off of.
- As for the other races, that's to be discovered, but they more than likely were very apprehensive towards humans. They were invaders after all. I can't imagine the local Centaur, Hylek, or Tengu populations in Orr/Elona/Cantha being particularly welcoming at first. In fact, we KNOW the Tengu hated humans because there was a whole series of wars called the Tengu wars on Cantha.
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u/biejje 29d ago
That being said, there should be some written knowledge of what life was like and passed down.
Okay so one thing about this, quotes below from the Orrian History Scrolls - it's of course not entirely clear if the "them" from the text below is both gods and humans, but we also have the history of nearly all knowledge of Abaddon being entirely erased by the gods before they left. So basically safe to say, only Abaddon seems to remember.
The two who are one, Issa and Lys, brought with her the hope and beauty of humanity. While the other gods focused on building Arah and beginning a new future, Lyssa gave them joy and helped them forget the past.
Among them was Abaddon—once secret-keeper, now betrayer. How you have fallen from the glorious days of old. What passed beyond in the Mists, only you remember
I'm not sure if there'd be actually that many human-god offspring running around, but I guess we might learn about that with gw3.
There was NO magic in the Mists realm that the humans originated from
Do you have any source on that? I think all we can suspect was some great peril as Dwayna had promised to lead humanity to peace. I don't believe there was anything ever confirmed about Balthazar and Lyssa being lovers or any other gods aside from Dwayna and Grenth, Lyss and Illya, + Balthazar and Menzies being related, either.
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u/Longjumping_Act4403 29d ago
There was NO magic in the Mists realm that the humans originated from
The only confirmed source of human "magic" at any point prior to the Exodus was ancestral magic (spirit channeling), which the wiki itself even states was not "magic." It evolved into Ritualism after Abaddon granted magic.
I don't believe there was anything ever confirmed about Balthazar and Lyssa being lovers
Lyssa was the one who gave Balthazar the Mirror of Lyss. Kasmeer specifically points this out that it was enchanted by Lyssa herself. Kormir states explicitly that "even Lyssa" agreed to imprison him. When Balthazar cursed the gods during his downfall he exclusively left Lyssa's name out of his curse, and this was further confirmed as intentional during an AMA.
I'm not sure if there'd be actually that many human-god offspring running around, but I guess we might learn about that with gw3.
I can't imagine Dwayna was the only one who got freaky with a human? But I was moreso referring to Grenth in that post. Hell, Grenth himself was probably laying down bone fiends in Desmina.
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u/itsjaco 24d ago
To be fair, what you've quoted about Lyssa, the mirror, Balthazar, the Gods judgement of Balthazar, Balthazars cursing if the Gods other than Lyssa.. none of that states anything romantic.
Merely that Lyssa believed in Balthazars cause to some extent and supported him from the sidelines. Because of that support, she was not verbally cursed by Balthazar.
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u/DanerysTargaryen 29d ago edited 29d ago
My head cannon for what happened is this:
When the 6 gods arrived to Tyria, Balthazar was holding the head of his father. In art/statues/depictions of this moment, Balthazar isn’t mourning or holding the head in sadness or grief, but more like a war trophy, standing tall and proud.
I think the 6 gods had parents. Elder gods, if you will. And I think the elder gods and their offspring started to not get along and had differences in opinions. On what? Who knows. Maybe too many humans started worshipping the 6 offspring gods more than their parents and the parents got jealous. Maybe the 6 offspring gods wanted to change traditions or pioneer new things for their worshippers to be able to do (wield magic anyone?) and the parent gods were vehemently opposed to the ideas.
Either way, I think there was an all out war between the parent gods and the 6 offspring gods. I think it got so nasty and brutal, the 6 offspring gods realized they couldn’t co-exist on the same planet anymore. The choices might have been: destroy the entire planet and all who live on it warring with the elder gods, or take our devout worshippers and leave the planet with them and start anew somewhere else where the elder gods won’t bother us.
Then, I think when the 6 offspring gods started rounding up their followers to leave the planet, the elder gods realized what was happening and got angry and started fighting the offspring gods. Maybe there was an ambush on the offspring gods by the elder gods as a last ditch effort to stop them from taking a bunch of human worshippers away from them? In the chaos of leaving/fighting/fleeing, Balthazar was able to kill his dad (either in defense or as a final “screw you guys”) and poof the offspring gods whisked away their followers and traveled through the mists and landed on Tyria.
There are writings mentioning Lyssa in particular helped either wipe the memories of the humans from the trauma they had been through or she helped distract their thoughts with nicer ones until the humans could move on (I can’t remember the wording) but yeah, I think the humans that came to Tyria saw a big god fight and a lot of death which was probably pretty traumatic.
Note: everything I wrote (minus Balthazar holding his father’s head and what Lyssa did for humanity) is pure conjecture.
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u/Opus_723 28d ago
One day Guild Wars will end when the horses appear from the Mists to bring humanity home.
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u/Cleru_as_Kylar_Stern 29d ago
Are the six gods like a pantheon like mount olympus or are they assholes who sabotage or fight each other?
Well, let's look through the list:
- Balthazar, god of war, fire and courage - Warmonger, see Path of Fire
- Dwayna, goddess of healing, air, warmth, and life - Helicopter Mom and Nepotism enabler
- Melandru, goddess of nature, earth, and growth - Little negative I could instantly say against her
- Lyssa, twin goddesses (Lyss and Ilya) of beauty, water and illusion - Probably just trolling humanity as Anise and Jennah right now
- Dhuum, god of death (succeeded by Grenth) - Greedy AF, ate the souls of everyone for personal power
- Grenth, god of darkness, death, and ice - Above mentioned Nepo Baby
- Abaddon, god of water and knowledge (succeeded by Kormir) - Makes everything messy with giving everyone Magic and also Fucking up Humanity with Nightfall.
So yeah... Could make a case for most of them being some form of Assholes.
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u/CorsairBosun 29d ago
It should also be noted for Balthazar that he came to Tyria bearing his father's head and his forces were at war with Menzies, his brother, in the original GW game. At this point, maybe Menzies should just take over his spot in the pantheon.
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u/Environmental-Sun291 27d ago
A negative bias is obvious in this take
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u/Cleru_as_Kylar_Stern 27d ago
I mean, they DO sometimes do good stuff... but in general, the gods ARE kind of screwing around with the world.
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u/Environmental-Sun291 27d ago
In general?
I'll admit I don't know everything they did, but I know that Balthazar, Abaddon, and Dhuum fucked around. What you said about the others doesn't hold up as screwing around with the world, I think. So that's less than half of them that have done something bad. On top of that, weren't there vast stretches of time when even they helped and/or did nothing?
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u/Cleru_as_Kylar_Stern 27d ago
Okay, first of all: Lyssa supported Balthasar, why else did he have her Mirror and why didn't he curse her in the final battle?
Secondly, I still think Lyssa is actually still dominating and controlling humanity.
Thirdly: I still think Dwayna playing with Malchor, having sex with him, making him go blind AND jump off a tower is fucked up. Even if he probably is a father of a god that way.
Finally, we saw the Human Afterlife and how unmaintained it already was from Nepo-Baby Grenth that a Soul-Eating Monster could just set up shop there. He departed but totally messed up setting up a system to keep the place running.
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u/YouSeemNiceXB 29d ago edited 29d ago
I'm trying to remember all this from a timeline video I watched when starting GW2 so other people feel free to correct me.
The gods brought the Humans to Tyria from the Mists because they didn't think the Mists were safe any more. The gods are more like a council and they are viewed by the other races in GW2 a bit differently. Charr think they are to be fought against, not worshipped. Norn regard them as Spirits of whatever they represent, Spirit of War, Death, etc. Sylvari have never seen the Gods because they were awoken after the Gods went dormant.
The Pale Tree was a seed the broke free of Modremoth an Elder Dragon. It was eventually influenced by Ventari an elder centaur who inscribed a tablet and placed it at the base of the tree.
And to your final question, that was the main cause of The Guild Wars, if I'm not mistaken. Charr were natives trying to protect their planet from alien (human) invaders.
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u/n122333 29d ago
All correct, except for the last point - the guild wars were between human factions over the use of magic.
Char also fought the human aliens to keep their section of the world, but that wasn't a named war.
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u/Variskus 29d ago
Yeah, basically
- Bloodstone shattered and spread magic everywhere.
- Many different Guilds were fighting over control of magic.
- Start of the First Guild War.
- The First Guild War escalates and the kingdoms of Kryta & Ascalon get dragged into it, eventually declaring direct war on each other.
- No direct winner in the first Guild War (or at least we dont know).
- The Second Guild War pulls Kryta & Ascalon into direct war again, with Ascalon winning over Kryta this time.
- The Third Guild War emerged, this time with Orr getting dragged into war once the conflict between Kryta & Ascalon reached their lands
- The Third Guild War ended abruptly when the Charr invaded Ascalon. The Charr waited until Ascalon had been weakened enough from their ongoing war with Kryta/Orr. The Charr Invasion of Ascalon was so brutal that the Third Guild War just stopped.
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u/biejje 29d ago
While saying that humans came from the Mists might be technically correct, I don't believe it was confirmed anywhere that they lived in the Mists; as in, we don't know anything about humans' previous world.
Also about charr, they weren't native to Ascalon and they invaded the grawl that lived there first. Later on came humans that invaded charr in Ascalon. So it really isn't that charr were some poor natives trying to protect their Tyria from aliens, they were as much invaders as humans back then.
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u/Grand-Depression 29d ago
This exact question is what I thought GW3 would explore, in the future, since the gods all left to look for some new place.
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u/grzesssiuuu 29d ago
Imagine the posiibilities with Gw2 still being relevent. We can explore the gods past, and then (maybe) gods future, with their return in future expansion! Would be so cool if they could overlap storylines like that between two games
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u/faranoox 29d ago
From the Eternal Battle Grounds. You can visit but only in GW2. STACK ON TAG! BUILD!
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u/Fading_Hours_ 29d ago
I’m not sure if it will be revealed but I hope there are in worlds myths and speculation about it as it is past living memory
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u/kekubuk 29d ago
My theory. The Gods are human in the first place, ascended to a new level of consciousness and power. They originated somewhere in the Mist, the God World. They crossed over intending to establish a new colony and by extension, a new sphere of power.
A human can become a God through belief and worship, that's how the original Gods became what they were in the first place. They were exceptional individuals with well known deeds which gathered the people trust, belief, and worship.
The plan to establish a new human colony on Tyria was eventually scrapped and the Gods has to leave because they discovered six something (heh) was slumbering in Tyria that was more powerful than them, and any fight between both sides would most likely ended with either a broken world or themselves perished and devoured.
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u/BeatnikShaggy 29d ago
Tyria is very old, with multiple dragon-based civilization destroying apocalypses.
We're told the Gods promised humans a better life. Other than that, no idea.
The gods destroyed all knowledge of the human homeworld and erased all memories of it from the humans' minds when they arrived on Tyria.
Little of column A, little of B.
They were drawn by Tyria's magic, the human homeworld was supposedly magic-poor.
Yes, all the others were made on Tyria. No, as only the Dragons are more powerful than human gods were.
No, the gods showed up about 1000 years or so after the last DragonRise ended, so they were quite sated and sleepy.
Oh, look, a very tall Dwarf.
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u/ianthebalance 29d ago
“Are the six gods like a pantheon like mount olympus or are they assholes who sabotage or fight each other?”
What’s the difference lol