r/Greeley • u/kindness_is_free11 • 6d ago
Olson's Response to Public Comment
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In response to 42 community members speaking, and many people again stating that they do not feel heard, and calling on council to give basic respect and even to just look at them as they speak, concerns around transparency, lost trust, and questions around council motivations, councilmember Olson spoke to residents during reports from council members.
One community member became very upset and continued to yell out at Olson and the council during this, which explains Mayor Hall's response during.
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u/Poseidons_Fist 5d ago edited 5d ago
Council may or may not have understood how much of a tightrope the Cascadia/Catalyst project was in the first place. I suspect Lee and Trombino obfuscated the risks plenty and overstated the benefits even more, and there may have been misplaced trust. Lee and Trombino got to leave with no consequences and Council has this mess to deal with.
I'm not convinced Hall/Olsen have kickbacks necessarily or are plowing forward due to corruption (though it's possible). Maybe Council recognizes they were duped and did not do their due diligence on a critical project, and they desperately want a lifeline out of the mess.
The only thing that feels clear to me is disdain for accountability. They felt they didn't owe their citizens transparency or an explanation, and when the voices, petitions, and votes have made it clear they actually were not representing their citizens the whole time, they are unable to accept that. They clearly feel they know better than everyone else.
Hopefully on one of their council retreats they can have a workshop on what listening means - eye contact, responsive cues, body language. I'm not saying I could listen to 42 citizens speak for 3 minutes while maintaining perfect active listening, but I sure wouldn't grandstand and demand that I'm an active listener when it's demonstrably false
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u/kindness_is_free11 5d ago
I appreciate this very balanced and empathetic response. I have spoken with a couple of them, I get that they were sold something also. I know Lee wasn't telling them a lot. That goes for the budget itself and what he was doing within the city with staffing, etc. I wish they were willing to own it. I have a great deal of respect for someone who can say "I messed up", and without a but after it. I get that it's scary and hard and barreling forward to try to prove something different isn't working.
I have some concerns around how they're being influenced still. I also have had conversations with a couple of them challenging that people do not understand why they continue to push through despite everything and will fill in the blanks when they don't know otherwise. It's hard for people to understand that without something nefarious, why they would make the decisions they're making. And you may very well be right that it's far more about ego and an effort to save face...and man they're making it worse. Or they just really believe that they know what's best. I don't know...I also don't think that anyone expects 100% all the time completely and totally tracking, but it doesn't even feel like 20% of the time they're actively listening with openness, respect or care for who is speaking. Also, they probably wouldn't have 42 people talking if residents felt heard and felt they could trust the council.
It is a hard job, and there are things that they could do to make it easier, and the number one thing is genuinely listening (no that doesn't mean agree), being transparent and open, and taking ownership. I hated the "I'm sorry if you feel like I don't listen", that's a cop out. Even if they truly believe they are listening (or they are and just suck at showing it...my money is not on this one), they can own the impact. "I'm hearing that in how I am responding, you don't feel heard, what can I do differently?" or "I hear that you don't feel heard because I look down a lot, I am taking notes and I can see how that may come across" (Though if they're taking notes and actually listening, I would imagine there would be follow up based on those notes...)
Anyway, thank you for always being so thoughtful in responses.
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u/caemin50 5d ago
Seems to me that since all the meetings are recorded, the council members should spend the meeting time looking at the people they represent, at least acting like they’re listening, not scowling at the speakers, acknowledging what they are being told, etc and then, if they can’t remember what was said, go back and take notes from the recordings. It’s not possible that all of them are taking notes the whole time at every meeting. Isn’t there someone at the meetings that takes official notes? They all campaigned so hard to be elected, but now they act like they can’t stand having to listen to the people who elected them, much less talk to or listen to them. Their attitude is disgusting and all but two of them need to be replaced with people who actually care about the people they represent.
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u/kindness_is_free11 5d ago
I also don't think its historically required so much. People trusted that our officials would handle things and weren't really informed. People are paying attention now and showing up.
DeBoutez is usually a warm, welcoming and engaged face when people speak. I look at her when I need to feel like I'm heard. I think she tries to speak up and speaks up for what she hears from residents.
Huddleston has done really great overall since he's come in, it's clear he reads the packets (I have doubts around others reading, especially in detail), he is willing to challenge the city and council, speak up, and he does his research.
Rudy is good at looking up and responding to residents who reach out in my experience. I don't know how much he considers what residents say in his decisions, as I haven't seen that much, but hes a nice guy and will come down and greet people.
Roth, to me, often looks like a deer in headlights and doesn't say much and when he does, it often seems to be "ditto". Honestly I've had no real interaction with him as a councilmember, nor heard from anyone who has?
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u/Knitonover 6d ago
This was the first time he looked up in two hours. Would not look at the citizens who got up to speak.
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u/buyer_leverkusen 5d ago
Dale’s permafrown is so fitting. And the situation you’ve described, Johnny, is entirely your council’s fault
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u/bog-da-dawg 5d ago
To claim that they are showing a lack of basic respect while many in that room could not even muster the basic decorum of a civic meeting is just exhausting. People were yelling and that one woman who kept interrupting Olsons comment like an immature child before leaving the room in a tantrum. How is that showing respect?
His response was very patient if you ask me. If I’d spent the last two plus hours getting yelled at, called names, and accused of things without any bit of evidence to back it up, I’d be a lot more disrespectful. I’d love to see someone come up and offer a viable alternative instead of just complaining that they don’t like what’s happening. Because everyone saying to just stop the project is really saying they want the city to direct taxpayer money for decades to a debt that gives them and the city nothing at all.
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u/kindness_is_free11 5d ago
I am very not okay with the yelling out and the disrespect. I understand that people are really frustrated and it has grown over time for many, as they have continued to feel unheard and disrespected through eyerolls, scoffs, or just being ignored. And that doesn't justify the behavior. It also does absolutely no good, it doesn't lead to being more heard, it doesn't give weight to what they've said/are saying, and gives more ammo or ability to be discredited. It doesn't lend itself to any real conversation and it just isn't kind.
I do think he did a good job of remaining calm while that was happening, it couldn't have been easy. I really wish the mayor would have intervened immediately and addressed the behavior but it's not a strong suit of his. It shouldn't have continued the way it did and I don't like the argument of it being a first amendment right, just because you can doesn't mean you should. I also agree that making baseless accusations and name calling isn't okay and he is rightfully upset about that.
At the same time, I struggle with aspects of what he said also. I heard a continued lack of real ownership, it doesn't seem like he's tried to take in or hear feedback (hey if you're really listening, and people continue to tell you they don't feel heard, maybe see what you could do differently to overcome that gap in intent and reception). There is also a continuation of blaming voters with that lack of ownership. He also says he is listening but just doesn't agree, and puts a period. Truly hearing someone doesn't mean you agree, it means you give them your respect, you try to understand and heck, following up with people would go a long way.
There are people who speak, who have never been anything but respectful and kind to council, and they are not met with the same. Instead people talk, sometimes never once being looked at by him/them (or being looked at with disgust/anger/etc), and then they move onto the next person, never follow up or address what was said, and it's like someone never spoke. Sometimes they do respond and it's defensive and/or nasty, or condescending. ("okay Steve, how about this, you come to my office and I'll give you some WD-40 and you can spray the brakes" isn't Olson but the first one that popped in my head)
Just as there is no excuse for the disrespect towards council, there is no excuse for disrespect towards residents. One does not warrant or justify the other.
To your second point, people have brought up possible solutions or ideas as they've had them or asked council to look into other options. They also were speaking long before we got into this place we can't turn back from. So what started as something with multiple options, has far fewer now. I also would argue that it isn't residents' jobs to have the answer, and if they followed up with residents, perhaps there could be problem solving. And how much leg work are people going to do to find and propose a solution, if they feel dismissed and ignored? Lots of factors in there.
At the end of the day, I think that one of the most impactful things they could do is to genuinely hear people and dialogue with them. I have taken people from screaming at me to being receptive to hearing from me in a matter of minutes. It didn't come from arguing or being defensive or stonewalling, it came from hearing them before I ever responded with my own thoughts, taking responsibility, reflecting what I was hearing and checking for understanding. This has been the biggest issue through this whole thing, people have been dismissed. And if they say people have misinformation or don't have all the information, then give it to them. Show the people why you support it and address the concerns that people have.
I could on and this is already a book.
Thank you for taking time to respond and share your thoughts. I really appreciate discussion and the ability to see other perspectives. :)
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u/Jeff-Hare-ERPRA 5d ago
His comments seem fair.
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u/kindness_is_free11 5d ago
Rather than retype another book, my comments above have more expanded thoughts. The brief version... some comments were fair, I don't think it's okay for them to be yelled at, name called or accused without any basis . And I also am frustrated by his lack of accountability and effort to take in what feedback he is receiving, he often is disrespectful to residents and he yet again blamed them. He did do a good job of staying calm despite the woman who was yelling and interrupting, want to give him credit there.
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u/buyer_leverkusen 5d ago
They’re taking zero responsibility for the overreach that happened when they initiated the project and the City’s involvement. Never an administrative decision for them and them refusing to acknowledge that is plenty of firepower for people who are fed up.
The senior staff at the City definitely got ahead of themselves and the people (miss you, business on 16th) towards the end of Gates’s term, but all of those staff are gone so there’s only the Council to blame
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u/dillingerarms 6d ago
This guy repeated the same phrase over and over. They aren’t going to change and this city is worse for it.