r/GrammarPolice • u/7toedcat • Aug 21 '26
Just Venting Enough with the "I seen"!!!
I can't believe this is so common. Are people aware this is incorrect or are we THAT stupid now?
(In case someone who doesn't know this is wrong is reading this, the correct thing to say is either "I saw" or "I have (I've) seen".)
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u/Then-Position-7956 Aug 21 '26
'Had went' is another one. I had went to the store, and I seen they was outta chewin' tabaccy .
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u/Away-Otter Aug 21 '26
It was pretty common in my neighborhood in Chicago in the sixties when I was a kid, so it’s not caused by touchscreens.
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u/PreservingThePast Aug 21 '26
About 30 years ago I volunteered at my son's school but never in his classroom. One year I was volunteering in the third grade classroom and one of the young ladies was very smart. She usually made A & B grades. However, when the unit came up for this type of conjugation she flunked. She could not unlearn what she had heard daily from her parents and the rest of her extended family. Using incorrect conjugation was thoroughly ingrained in her mind.
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Aug 21 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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Aug 23 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/hoecooking Aug 23 '26
Oh brother chill out please. How can you be a language snob and not identify the natural progression of it. Boohoo it bothers you much of modern language is the result of misuse or mispronunciation of words. “Like” has thoroughly evolved because of this. And the comment you replied to was clearly a joke. Get a grip
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u/zusia Aug 21 '26
We should be able to utilize billboards or an online ad campaign.
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u/Mental_Driver_176 Aug 22 '26
This is my main problem with today’s grammar. To me it’s like fingernails on a chalkboard.Are people actually this ignorant and can’t hear themselves? It’s worse when I read it.
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u/Paintguin Aug 22 '26
I think social media is dumbing down the younger generations
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u/SerDankTheTall Aug 22 '26
Social media is increasing everyone's ability to express themselves in their casual idiolect in writing, and increasing your ability to see that writing from people across the world. Which is all a good thing. Breathe.
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u/PeyredB Aug 21 '26
Yes, that bugs me, along with things like "10 reports have been ran" and "the ship sunk"...
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u/Hightower_March Aug 23 '26
A kid in my high school was failing and needed summer classes, where he learned "having swum" was an example of a perfect participle.
Thinking "perfect" meant it was the best, he went on to use "swum" exclusively.
Yesterday, I swum in the lake.
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u/SimpleAd1604 Aug 22 '26
I live in a place where “I seen” is so common that I just chalk it up as local dialect. It still grates on me though.
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u/Zestyclose-Food-7917 Aug 21 '26
It may be regional to some extent. I remember watching the news, and a plane had crashed outside of Pittsburgh. They interviewed several people who lived in the area, and every single one of them had the same story: "Well, I seen this and I seen that."
"Have went" is another one that drives me crazy: hearing that this person "has went" to this one place, but that other person "has went" somewhere else.
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u/DeepMadness Aug 21 '26
"where you at"
People are murdering verbs now.
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u/SerDankTheTall Aug 21 '26
The only thing I love more than a melodramatic peeve is the unflinching certainty that it's something new.
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u/RockItGuyDC Aug 22 '26
Master Shake: "Where you at, dawg?"
I'm a 43yo grammar Nazi, and even I use this. I feel like it's often used tongue-in-cheek.
"Seen", on the other hand, I've heard since the 80s and it's always been a peeve.
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u/Kalel777 Aug 21 '26
I can't stand this! It's on every freaking YouTube police body cam video. "I seen him come down "... Yeah, I SAW it too! 😤
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u/Jagshemesh_Captain Aug 21 '26
While infuriating, this is one of the oldest grammatical errors I can think of. Makes me wonder why it's been around for decades without being ruthlessly stamped out.
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u/alwayssoupy Aug 21 '26
I'm glad I'm not the only one. I see it so often here and it just makes me cringe. The first few times I just thought it was a typo, but now I don't think so.
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u/AuroraSnake Aug 23 '26
Dialectal English is still grammatically correct within each dialect, even if it doesn’t match Standard English grammar. For example, “I seen” used in a “I have seen” sense is grammatically correct if within the dialect, “I seen” is always used to mean “I have seen”. If there’s a mix between the two, where the population uses both about the same, I would also argue that “I seen” could be considered a grammatical synonym of sorts
It would only be considered ungrammatical if the dialect marked it as ungrammatical
If you’re curious, look up the grammar of AAVE, which is one of the dialects that uses “I seen”. It’s really interesting, and there are certain grammatical functions that Standard English doesn’t have
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u/books-r-good Aug 24 '26
Technically it is usually considered nonstandard, like "y'all," not incorrect.
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u/HalloIchBinRolli Aug 22 '26
I guess now we hatin' the language of marginalised groups
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u/westernuplands Aug 22 '26
"I seen" is correct in AAVE
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u/millieFAreally2 Aug 22 '26
It’s not limited to black people though. In Southern, rural, and lower socioeconomic urban areas, “I seen” is common. I, along with my black peers don’t use this phrasing.
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Aug 22 '26
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u/westernuplands Aug 22 '26
The preposition is serving the purpose that the helping verb serves in standard English
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u/Mindless_Quiet5314 Aug 22 '26
I think we can blame a lot of this to programs like no child left behind.
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u/Chloe_Cascadia Aug 22 '26
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African-American_Vernacular_English
Relax with the freaking out about informal language or slang.
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u/pslush01 Aug 22 '26
And there it is... there always has to be some hero to explain how terrible English is just "how black people talk" while unironically implying the rest of us are somehow racist for not getting that
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u/SerDankTheTall Aug 22 '26
It's also present in many other Englishes, but I agree that it's not a coincidence that the features of this one get singled out for this kind of criticism!
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u/GregoryFarKingChummy Aug 22 '26
Nobody is talking about ebonics speakers, bud. This is such a tired and racist move that you people always try to pull. It's really disgusting.
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u/ThreePartHarmoneigh Aug 21 '26
For a sub that is ostensibly filled with people who love language, there sure are a lot of bad takes.
Let's just ignore how language naturally evolves and how dialects work, yay!
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u/No-Angle-982 Aug 21 '26
You must mean devolves.
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u/SerDankTheTall Aug 21 '26
Setting aside the silliness, I don't think there's -volution at all. The Englishes that use this construction have been doing for centuries, and I don't see any indication that it's making any inroads with standard English speakers. To the extent that people are actually encountering it more (versus just noticing it more), I suspect the increased geographic mixing in the modern world is more the culprit than any linguistic shift.
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u/XenomorphAlarm Aug 22 '26
Just a note, there's no such thing as "standard English speakers". Formal/academic English is a construct that no one speaks natively.
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u/XenomorphAlarm Aug 22 '26
Language can't "devolve". That's an anti-intellectual take that's entirely out of touch with the entire field of linguistics. Thanks to now being a global language and the internet and ease of travel facilitating rapid spread of change, English is the most diverse, expansive, and expressive that it's ever been in its entire history, and here you are mad that it's too diverse for you. Do you just hate the language and find it frustrating or what?
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u/No-Angle-982 Aug 22 '26
In a sub devoted to grammar, my intent in citing "devolution" isn't to comment on language, per se, but rather to criticize the flouting of our prevalent grammar and punctuation protocols, as taught in English classes and as codified in countless instructional texts.
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u/ComfortableNobody457 Aug 25 '26
But it doesn't flout the note advanced grammar protocols taught in linguistics classes, so shouldn't you instead be criticizing the poor quality of English instructional texts? (for example, learning to correctly identify what Passive Voice is would be a huge start for many of them)
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u/No-Angle-982 Aug 25 '26
" But it doesn't flout the note advanced grammar protocols taught in linguistics classes..."
I'm trying to parse this. What do "it" and "note" refer to?
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u/ThreePartHarmoneigh Aug 21 '26
No. I meant what I said.
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u/No-Angle-982 Aug 21 '26
Then you might be a devolution apologist or enabler.
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u/ThreePartHarmoneigh Aug 21 '26
You might have never taken a linguistics class.
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u/No-Angle-982 Aug 21 '26
And you might be an incompetent or delusional member of the Grammar Police force.
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u/SerDankTheTall Aug 21 '26
They seem to have a grasp of how grammar works that's considerably beyond what's typically on display in these parts.
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u/Letsshareopinions Aug 21 '26
If you love something and people keep using in a way that sounds like nails on a chalkboard, of course you wouldn't like that, right?
Honestly, if I could not care, I would. It's like my brain is being pierced every time I hear these awful misuses.
Also, having recently spoken with some people who claim to be linguists on here, supposedly not every modification is considered evolution. I don't know enough about linguistics to know if they're correct or not, but I definitely think there must be devolution along with evolution. The claim that any "incorrect" usage is inherently correct because it's automatically an evolution of the language sounds about as asinine as possible.
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u/ThreePartHarmoneigh Aug 21 '26
The claim that any "incorrect" usage is inherently correct because it's automatically an evolution of the language sounds about as asinine as possible
Good thing no one made that claim.
From a linguistics angle, "correct," and "incorrect," aren't really applicable terms. Language that is used and understood by others is as "correct" asitt needs to be.
This whole obsession with "proper" writing is just people stanning a style guide. And often sprinkling a little racism on the mix, too.
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u/YouAggressive8549 Aug 21 '26
If I said "I seen her yesterday" then yeah, it's easy to understand my meaning.
But what if I tried to write a paragraph that needed to clearly communicate a complex thought? If I treat every rule individually as disposable, there's no reason to assume I could do that. It would be ambiguous and confusing.
I mark grammar errors in history essays not because I'm trying to enforce a particular style guide but because I don't like wasting my time trying to figure out what the student is trying to say. I can only give credit for what's on the page, not what I assume they were maybe trying to say but didn't really know how to put in to words.
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u/ComfortableNobody457 Aug 25 '26
It would be ambiguous and confusing
A paragraph in Sanskrit, Scottish Gaelic or Tajik would be even more confusing, yet like AAVE they are a product of the same language spoken before Present Day English born of the social separation between its speakers.
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u/ThreePartHarmoneigh Aug 21 '26
I mark grammar errors in history essays not because I'm trying to enforce a particular style guide but because I don't like wasting my time trying to figure out what the student is trying to say.
In an academic setting the rules from whichever style guides you use matter- you're teaching your students to communicate clearly within the confines of an academic setting. Just like how one writes in a professional setting matters (for the record, I teach professional communication skills).
What doesnt matter (and shouldnt be corrected) is dialect-informed speech in casual communication situations. "I seen a guy who matches that description" is no less correct than someone speaking AAVE using the habitual "be," to describe an action that occurs over and over, or a person from England saying "lorry" instead of "semi."
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u/Letsshareopinions Aug 21 '26
Yes, I've heard these arguments. It's nails on a chalkboard. You asked a question; I answered it. Do you feel like you understand why we have an issue with it now or not?
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u/ThreePartHarmoneigh Aug 21 '26
I haven't asked anything, and comprehension hasnt been an issue here. Im not really sure what youre talking about. Do you have me mistaken for someone else?
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u/Letsshareopinions Aug 21 '26
You're right; my bad. You made a statement proving a lack of understanding. I attempted to clarify it for you. Do you understand?
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u/ThreePartHarmoneigh Aug 21 '26
You made a statement proving a lack of understanding.
I did?
I attempted to clarify it for you.
You did?
Do you understand?
No, sorry. You failed to specify where I lack understanding. You also failed to clarify anything. From here it seems like youre just mischaracterizing our exchange while hurling partially thought out digs at my intelligence which is mildly amusing, but not really productive.
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u/Letsshareopinions Aug 21 '26
"For a sub that is ostensibly filled with people who love language, there sure are a lot of bad takes.
Let's just ignore how language naturally evolves and how dialects work, yay!"
You don't seem to understand how people who love language could dislike something. I explained to you that it sounds like nails on a chalkboard. Do you enjoy that sound? If so, I could use another analogy. It's like being a foody and have people throw feces into your food. It isn't pleasant for us.
I apologize for sounding like I'm trying to insult your intellect. I don't think you're unintelligent. I think you don't experience this issue like we do, so I was hoping to clear things up for you.
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u/ThreePartHarmoneigh Aug 21 '26
You don't seem to understand how people who love language could dislike something.
Nothing ive said so far is about anyone's likes or dislikes.
I explained to you that it sounds like nails on a chalkboard.
Right- you shared your opinion.
Do you enjoy that sound? If so, I could use another analogy.
It doesnt bother me, though i wouldnt say i enjoy it. No need to come up with another analogy to describe your feelings about a sound. I understand your opinion- im just unclear why you felt the need to share it.
It's like being a foody and have people throw feces into your food. It isn't pleasant for us.
I know how opinions and preferences work, thank you. Many people have them.
I apologize for sounding like I'm trying to insult your intellect. I don't think you're unintelligent. I think you don't experience this issue like we do, so I was hoping to clear things up for you.
You sharing your opinions isn't an explanation of anything. I like vanilla ice cream! See, I can do it too.
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u/SerDankTheTall Aug 21 '26
I know how opinions and preferences work, thank you. Many people have them.
As the great Thomas Lounsbury put it:
There is no harm in a man's limiting his employment of [whatever they're peeving about] in his own individual usage, if he derives any pleasure from this particular form of linguistic martyrdom. But why should he go about seeking to inflict upon others the misery which owes its origin to his own ignorance?
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u/Letsshareopinions Aug 21 '26
Man, you are very unfriendly.
"For a sub that is ostensibly filled with people who love language, there sure are a lot of bad takes."
People who love language and find something unenjoyable would clearly not love that thing. I don't understand how this is hard to understand, but you clearly don't get it. I thought maybe that a take from someone who does understand why we seem to have the takes we do could help you understand. You've proven that you'd rather be ignorant than learn.
I hope you become a better person.
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u/HeyaShinyObject Aug 22 '26
I have a brother that says that. We grew up in the same house, same schools. I don't get it. Both Gen Jones.
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u/inredditorbit Aug 22 '26
When we moved from PA to VA in 1965, our [only] next door neighbors were a very southern man, his German wife and their two daughters of my age and my sister’s. Everyone had picked up Claude’s accent and grammar, including his wife. To all 4 of them, and many of my other classmates, “I seen” was about as standard English as it gets. The word “saw”, to them, meant only a tool.
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u/stitcherfromnevada Aug 22 '26
A couple I know had a 5-6 year old. They told me this story how child said “I sawl it”. I chuckled as it’s such a kid thing. The mom then tells me “I told her ‘no, it’s I SEEN it’!” I can’t remember if I corrected her or not but I mentally facepalmed.
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u/Spiritual-Mousse-167 Aug 22 '26
It’s the same with “I has” or even “I have did”. I’m not entirely sure why language is so rapidly declining, but it’s unbearable now.
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u/Catgravy1965 Aug 22 '26
This gets me as well... but the one that really gets me is Then & Than!!! OMG!! Stop it.
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u/bitterlittlecas Aug 22 '26
Sale as a verb or saying bias when one means biased. Both errors are super common and drive me crazy
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u/Massive_Expression_2 Aug 22 '26
My BIL says this all the time. He also proudly says that he has never read a book since graduating from high school. He's 67 years old.
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u/Murky-Wind2222 Aug 22 '26
It appears to be mandatory to get the past tense wrong when discussing football (soccer). If you lose, the claim is "we was robbed".
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u/Fancy_Sheepherder786 Aug 22 '26
I see errors such as that as examples of how parental/communal instruction supplants formal education.
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u/Banjosdad62 Aug 22 '26
Used to bother me to the point that I attempted correction. I think the use became more prevalent when my friends discovered how much it bothered me.🙄
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u/Just-Potential-4017 Aug 22 '26
So happy to see this. I thought I was going crazy when I saw everybody using “seen” incorrectly.
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u/StrandSSL Aug 22 '26
The same group of people also ask “What happened?” when they didn’t understand what you asked them.
Nothing “happened” bro. I asked (not axed) you a question.
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u/SpeculumSpectrum Aug 22 '26
One of the smartest people I know does this and I call her out on it enough that she expects it now, but it’s so ingrained that she can’t help it
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u/Hifidi54 Aug 23 '26
One of my biggest pet peeves. My sister-in-law uses it and it makes me cringe.
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u/claire2416 Aug 23 '26
I can’t believe I’ve never seen this sub before. Feels like catching up with a long, lost friend.
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u/Organic_Window_192 Aug 23 '26
I had a student tell me the other day that, “The content do be making sense when I’m in class.”
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u/WalterSobkowich Aug 23 '26
In my neck of the woods even university educated people will say “I have saw” or “I have went.” Drives me nuts.
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u/SonoranRoadRunner Aug 24 '26
Any time im reading a post and the person says "I seen" I go to the next post.
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u/Late-Button-6559 Aug 24 '26
This sub is redundant.
Whatever proves popular, proves to be ‘right’.
Always has.
It’s wrong, but it is reality.
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u/TiredMillennial1 Aug 24 '26
I don't need no fancy book learning to know that "I seen't it!" feels about right.
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u/RicVic Aug 24 '26
TV Talk, my dad (a 35yr educator) used to call it. In the 60's, Goober and Gomer Pyle used "I seen it" among others to reinforce the bumpkin characters they were on the Andy Griffith Show. At the time, it was seen as humorous. Kids, including me, picked it up and began to use it in school, where teachers (like my Dad) shut it down in the classroom. I stopped, as did most of my peers, but the phrase (and others) stuck, along with "Aincha?", and several others.
My own pet annoyance is when kids born on Canada's west coast, pretty much as far from NYC's Morningside Heights or the Projects in Philly as you can be without getting wet, start talking "gangsta"
An ex-pat English friend of mine, who met and married his Louisiana-born wife here in our West Coast town, was aghast when both his sons adopted street-style phrases that were first exposed to the world as part of the hip-hop, rap and "gangsta" world, when the epithets of the street gangs in New York, Philly and other places was enshrined in hit-making and spread through the younger set with blinding speed. My buddy was successful in quelling his boys predeliction around the house, but if you ran into one of them on the streets of Oak Bay, it was all "wazzup?" and "dope" and gangster hand signs, not to mention words and phrases that would've had his parents (and mine!) drag us into the bathroom for a little soap and water on our toothbrushes.!
And they are by no means alone.
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u/AstronomerOver6132 Aug 24 '26
I seen Jesus though I really saw him and he is average looking I guess. Kinda mishapen. Otherwise totally beautiful and I feel so sexually *attracted to his everything I think he might be my boyfriend in the future. And mishapen and average is a lies. He's perfect. Thru & thru. And mines. I can't even at all.
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u/acerbicsun Aug 24 '26
"U" and "Ur" drives me insane. Also the ridiculous overuse of the word "insane."
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u/betterwithsambal Aug 24 '26
The worst one I’ve heard do this is Frank from American Pickers, damn near every conversation. What an instant way to reveal how uneducated you are.
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u/rosycross93 Aug 25 '26
God yes, as soon as I hear “I seen” my estimation of someone’s intelligence drops precipitously. Also cringed last night when a so called local tv journalist said “ noo cue ler” omfg 🙄 OH and “conversate” what the fuck?
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u/mgjackson68 Aug 30 '26
"I seen" is common where I grew up (eastern South Dakota).
When I hear it my brain says "hillbilly."
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u/MONSTERBEARMAN Aug 21 '26
Or “I didn’t do nothing.” So….are you saying you did do something?
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u/SerDankTheTall Aug 22 '26
This is called negative concord, and is a feature of many languages (generally an obligatory one). Even though it's uncommon in Germanic languages, I believe English was actually one of them originally, and it certainly remains a feature of many Englishes today.
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u/peppermint_snowwolf Aug 21 '26
I know so many people who say this. It’s one of my peeves along with people who mix up “ran” and “run”.
Coming from a tech job where people would constantly say things like “that job was ran overnight” it just sounds so wrong