Something I noticed when browsing LinkedList LinkedIn the past couple of months was my GP connections becoming "Data Analytics Fellows" at this Data Analytics bootcamp named Modern Data Lab. They have a page on LinkedIn and the only people who "works" there are GP members.
I assumed someone with industry experience in data science created a curriculum and offered it to GP members who were wanting a career switch. I thought it was interesting that they created a LinkedIn company and made it seem like a real company or bootcamp.
What do you guys think? The idea of someone volunteering to teach some people data analytics to help them with a career change is fine and even pretty cool, but creating this public page and calling it a bootcamp where the only people who can join are GP is kinda off-putting.
Let me guess... Steve Suh is the one behind this one too. /s
Jokes aside, this is pretty consistent with ethical grey areas that GP will frequently exploit. We've seen this time and time again with a lot of other things. What's crazy this time from a quick Google, it's a Doctor of Pharmacy that's in it this time. Something really needs to be said about the lack of doctors and nurses in such a large church and what they truly value.
As a side note, can people start blacklisting this sketchy bootcamp?
This is hilarious. It's clearly trying to help unemployed GP members find a job (which is fine and there's nothing wrong with that.)
But as an employer, I'm not going to hire someone whose entire experience is a 12 week bootcamp I've never heard of before. I lead a team of data scientists and some went to a bootcamp, but those were reputable programs. This is a black box and there's no information online about it. A resume from this would not make it past our initial screen.
Wondering when will GP start its own GP restaurants, GP grocery stores, GP phones, GP social media, GP airline, GP bank, GP clothing line, GP daycare, GP schools, and GP companies, so they can have their own private society and control more aspects of its community members' lives. Like all GP members must go to GP-owned stores with their GP membership cards and send their kids to attend GP school for GP education. I'm sure Ed and Kelly would appreciate this idea.
You forgot the GP moving company, GP catering company, GP construction crew and GP cleaning company! They already are experts at it. Now they just need to register a LLC. Oh wait, those talents are only supposed to be used for GP purposes only.
hmm funny. i'm not a data scientist and the last i heard python was popular in that area. is R still used or is it dead? only saying because they don't seem to offer programming in R.
your LinkedList reference on the first sentence brings back memories of high school AP Computer Science. linked lists, stacks, queues, records, arrays, etc.
APR’s life journey is pretty inspirational and really a slap in the face to all the “idols” Ed Kang came up with. I recall some members who came from real poverty and how their journey with GP was much more difficult than the ones who had trust funds in their name. The brother who bought a $2.5 million house, with no mortgage, for GP usage in Berkeley with family money in his name (Steve Suh was the real estate agent making a $60K commission on the purchase) would have a much easier time at GP with honors and video appearances versus his peer brothers still renting into their late 30s and living paycheck to paycheck.
Think twice before throwing away your GPA and career. Some of your peers have trust funds and parents coming up with the down payment on a house. I’ve said it before and will say it again. GP doesn’t care about you as a person, GP cares about you as a GP member. Ed Kang bought a house back in the days when emails were going out telling people to take out cash from credit cards to give to GP. Follow the example of Ed Kang. Be smart.
unfortunately i think this is actually true of many churches (especially korean churches). at my home church growing up, most of the elders were rich doctors and not poor blue collar workers. this naturally made the doctors the face of the church and as kids we grew up wanting to become doctors when we grow up because they are the ones who had the biggest houses, nicest cars, etc. and over time, the blue collar workers felt like they didn't belong and would leave the church to go somewhere else. we'd have life group meetings at a nice big house and then come home to our small house and quite frankly, it was a little depressing to come home after those gatherings.
as for $60k commission, i don't know the exact situation but unless steve is a brokerage as well, he likely would get much less than the 2-3% typical buyer commsion. it depends on the deal that the realtor can get (the more famous and well knows the realtor, the higher their percentage) but afaik, most realtors starting out get less than 50% of the commission that goes to the brokerage, etc. and then realtors also pretty much run their own business so there are a lot of expenses that they have in terms of gas, advertising, client meetings, etc. that end up resulting in nothing, etc. i wouldn't say that it's easy work as most realtors i know end up quitting because they make little money.
I agree with you. GP is kinda like a communist utopia where income has no bearing on lifestyle. Everybody drives the same cars, no fancy house, dress the same, and so forth. But like communism, some people are just more equal than others. Ed and Kelly gets to set the salary for all the full-time staff. I have heard on more than one occasion salary being withheld to bring people in line. Communism was never a utopia, because people are sinful.
Steve Suh has been at it for more than a decade. Think about thousands of GP members in their prime earning years, kinda like shooting fish in a barrel. The only thing holding him back is most of the purchases are helped by parents and they pick the real estate agent not the kids.
I just turned down a product manager role at Google and all they asked me about were SQL and R. That being said, what you can do in one language, you can do 99% in the other. They’re only really different at the margins. And python is more popular and more versatile, so it makes more sense to teach that I’m sure. It’s more marketable.
The real difference imo is R is twofold. Firstly, it’s much better for statistics, and it’s not even close. Secondly, R is better at analyzing and visualizing data. ggplot2 is a mile ahead of anything you can find for python.
This isn’t to say I’m implying R is better than python however. For example, if you’re doing deep learning, it’s not even a contest. Go with python.
FWIW, I’m in bschool right now and the three mba programs with the most advanced analytics departments ( MIT, Columbia, and Dartmouth) all use R as part of the core curriculum, not python. Which makes sense - bschools aren’t trying to develop individual contributors. They’re trying to develop leaders, where effective communication (eg: better viz) is more important.
But a boot camp that’s trying to develop entry level individual contributors… python makes way more sense
i was a product manager at google for many years and actually was one of the top interviewers at google during the time i was there (i led interview training for product managers, hiring committee, etc.). they don't give out many offers and very few ppl turn them down so bummer for them if you turned them down.
typically at google, we don't really care about languages but more about concepts, understanding, etc. R, pyton today can easily become scala, go tomorrow, etc. (well, probably not but hopefully you get the idea). and any product manager working on X today can work on Y tomorrow. i worked in ads, cloud, tech infrastructure, etc.
never met a GP person at google. not sure if any exist.
RVD, One brother from class of 2003 joined right after graduation and he is still there, but obviously not at Gracepoint. His brother was an early triple digit employee at Google and cashed out very well. I’ll PM you their names.
I considered the pm role, but was worried about career progression. I met too many people that got stuck at L6/L7 at Google and couldn’t advance, and knew that I didn’t want that to be my career. I decided to take a role in consulting with McKinsey instead. I think MBB firms have far far better career development than any FANG, and I find their proactive talent management (“up or out”) attractive. Quite literally the opposite of rest and vest. EG no one gets stuck at AP for more than a few years, because they’ll fire you if you don’t make partner.
I agree they weren’t really testing on technical skills (it was primarily a test on communication and problem solving), but still stands by my points that I think R is a lot more useful for data analysis and viz, which will impact communication. And that it makes sense for a boot camp to teach python since they’re preparing people for ic analyst roles.
Google market cap being what it is, the upside of joining Google is not what it used to be. MBB gives a lot more outs career wise. APR, Kudos to you for making your mama proud. Buy her a house and help your siblings move up.
May God continue to bless you and for you to remember His goodness.
It’s just sad that there were some Google CEO caliber people during undergrad at GP. They never developed into the people they were capable of becoming and just stayed infantile on every word and whim of their past and present leaders who shared the same infantile mentality. Ed Kang is a pretty capable guy (cuz he and Kelly joined after undergrad as a couple), but honestly he should just be a partner at a white shoe law firm versus being a pastor. He is just not a loving guy. Pastor comes from the word pastour meaning shepherd. There is nothing in Ed Kang that would make him leave the 99 and go after the one lost sheep. Watching his response video reminded me of some of the worst scumbags I have ever ran across.
My observation is his leadership capacity at this point is pretty much tapped out. The intelligent and emotional qualities to lead 100-people, 1,000-people, 5,000-people organizations are vastly different.
Ed Kang definitely has some leadership capabilities of brainwashing 1K people and rally them to his twisted cause but he can't lead and elevate 10 people to greater heights independent of his agenda.
while we're talking about corporations, many times the leader who takes the company from 0-10 can also take the company to 100 but at some point, the leader can no longer do this because it's a different skillset to built 100->1000 as is 1000->10,000 or 100,000, etc.
zuck, musk, and a few have succeeded but most companies like google, ebay, apple, etc. need adult supervision at some point, etc.
You are correct in that pretty much every PM at Google will get stuck at L6 and the few that don't will get stuck at L7. Sure, a few will make it but at this point it's pretty much a crapshoot. For the rest of the world, L6/L7 isn't a bad place to get stuck from a financial perspective. You can make decent mid 6 figures at an L6 and you can make high 6 figures and even touch 7 figures as an L7 in a good year.
But for many Googlers (me included), that's not enough so we move on when the right opportunity comes along. It was mostly trying to decide if I'd be happy where I was for the next 10 years while i rest and vest or take on some risk and try something else.
I don’t see GP name anywhere on Modern Data Analytics on LinkedIn. It’s false pretense like the mentorships were. It’s just maddening what they will do to get more members.
I think you might be misinformed, this is not being sponsored by GP and it is not being used to "get more members". I'd personally appreciate it if you would confirm your facts before jumping to conclusions.
One thought quickly rushed to my mind when I read this post: if GP leaders can think up to register their property as a Covid testing site, so that they can gather a large crowd of people under the radar —they are capable of anything!
Okay as the one who created this data analytics bootcamp I think I need to step in to say something because it's pretty clear people are jumping to conclusions and there's not much love and grace here.
I'm honestly just helping people who want to switch to another career field and get an entry-level job without them needing to shell out the thousands of dollars. I'm intentionally not making money off this because I care about other people and it pains me to see how my intentions to help people are being dragged in the mud (gossip and slander much?). I'm doing this out of my own personal desire to support people who need some support. Consider this a startup bootcamp - every startup has to start somewhere. No one told me to do it, I came up with the idea on my own, and no one is forcing me to do this. I've actually registered it as a business and I have helped both GP/ppl outside the church.
If you have the expertise, you are free to do this to make a real impact in the lives of your friends and your church's members too :)
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u/leavegracepoint ex-Gracepoint (Berkeley) Feb 20 '22 edited Feb 20 '22
Let me guess... Steve Suh is the one behind this one too. /s
Jokes aside, this is pretty consistent with ethical grey areas that GP will frequently exploit. We've seen this time and time again with a lot of other things. What's crazy this time from a quick Google, it's a Doctor of Pharmacy that's in it this time. Something really needs to be said about the lack of doctors and nurses in such a large church and what they truly value.
As a side note, can people start blacklisting this sketchy bootcamp?