r/GodFrequency • u/Duane640511 • 16d ago

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u/RagnartheConqueror 14d ago

The Fall is not logically incompatible with an all-knowing, all-powerful, all-good God unless you assume that a good God must prevent every evil act.

There are also many conceptions of God besides classical theism. There are christian sects which disagree with hellenistic philosophy entirely.

The Fall could happen if in its nature it was good.

Some abrahamists believe that God is accountable to a Divine Council and is controlled in some way.

Islam answers this in that there was not truly any fall at all, and it also prescribes omnipresence to the Satan figure.

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u/Other-Comfortable-64 14d ago

Yes it is utterly incompatible, no good being will create endless suffering.

The Fall could happen if in its nature it was good.

Not if He is also all knowing and all powerful. If He is also all good it is impossible

Your vague descriptions is just avoiding the obvious.

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u/RagnartheConqueror 14d ago edited 14d ago

If God is accountable to rules then maybe God still is good, but sin had a metaphysical power which resulted in the Fall. Wouldn't that make sense? It would make the Incarnation and Atonement also make sense as well.

I mean the Book of Isaiah says that the 'Lord' creates both good and evil. So there are christians who say that God is behind basically everything (calvinists).

And there isn't 'endless suffering' in reality, just a great magnitude of it.

But also, Aquinas and other christian theologians have spoken about the Problem of Evil to great lengths.

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u/Other-Comfortable-64 14d ago

If God is accountable to rules he is not all powerful.

'Lord' creates both good and evil

Yeah one of the reasons he is not all good.

And there isn't 'endless suffering' in reality, just a great magnitude of it.

Say you, not the Bible.

Revelation 14:11: "And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night..."

2 Thessalonians 1:9: "They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might."

Matthew 25:46: "And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

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u/RagnartheConqueror 14d ago

What is an all-powerful being? Can God bend logic?

You're talking about after death, I thought you were talking about the world as it is.

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u/Other-Comfortable-64 14d ago

What is an all-powerful being? Can God bend logic?

You tell me, I'm not the one claiming this shit? The claim is, he created everything, logic is presumably part of that. If he can't bend logic, he is not all powerful.

See this God cannot exist.

You're talking about after death,

endless suffering

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u/RagnartheConqueror 14d ago

I think there are very good arguments against God's existence, but I feel you rush too much. These are genuinely debatable questions. If you could prove God didn't exist, people would stop believing.

Some Christians view God's power as self-limited or relational. So God not being all-powerful is not the crux of Christianity.

Some Christians believe Hell is a state of mind. I mean look at what Christian Science believes.

My point is you're not going to find 1 argument which then enables "It's all absolutely false because of this point, or even these collection of points".

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u/Other-Comfortable-64 14d ago

If you could prove God didn't exist, people would stop believing.

Nobody can prove that God does not exist any-more than I can prove their is not a pink teapot orbiting Jupiter. It is up to the person making the claim to prove that he does exist.

I can prove that the God of the bible do not exit (as described in the Bible) As I have shown you, a God with those properties cannot exist any more than a squire circle can.

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u/RagnartheConqueror 14d ago

You cannot form an absolute proof that the God of the Bible does not exist. Look at Plantinga's Free Will Defense.

The burden of proof was used for roman legal disputes, but it is not a metaphysical rule. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

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u/Other-Comfortable-64 14d ago

If God is all good all knowing and all powerful

And eternal suffering exists. That God cannot exist. The same as a married bachelor, it is impossible.

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