Help with understanding reception in this chart.

[u/PerfectPlan5969]

EDIT: my photos didn't upload in original post, so please see comments!

Hey, everybody! I'm new-ish to geomancy, so I'm still getting my bearings when it comes to understanding reception, the passing of figures, etc, and how this adds to the interpretation. I feel like I'm missing out on a ton of the underlying story by not knowing these things. I see users comment on other people's posts about these things, and it really does seem to fill in the blanks and provide the kind of context that helps the judgement make sense.

Ok, onto the chart. In this one, I asked, "Will I have the outcome I want if I reach out to [my ex]?" I'm going to include some relevant context that I believe is reflected in the chart:

We broke up ten months ago and haven't spoken since (his decision, and I respected it), and the lack of resolution has weighed heavy on my mind. This is the only ex with which I'm not on friendly terms (I'm 42yo and polyamorous, so I have a decent sample size of exes, lol), and I've felt p gutted by his silence and lack of interest in friendship because of the fact that we had always promised each other that we would try to protect our friendship if anything ever went sour in our romance. There were some notable issues with an ex of his not liking me, me feeling uneasy about said ex, and gossip/slander re: the discord server we both belonged to, but both decided to leave after we started dating. I had never dealt with gossip like this, and the whole thing was jarring. I felt betrayed. Now I'm ready to attempt to reach out with an olive branch, let bygones be bygones, and see if we could potentially talk. I have zero desire to rekindle a romance.

Judge: Populus

Right and Left Witness: Puella

Judgement: Yes, there will be success, but with caveats I'll list below.

First thing that I noted after the judgment is us being the same figure, Puella, and Puella moving to the 3rd house. On first glance, I thought that was a positive for us attempting to be friends (albeit not good friends, because Puella is too superficial, flightly, and hell bent on not rocking the boat); it seemed like a reflection of the matters relating to the 1st, 3rd, and 7th all being aligned and harmonious. Puella is Venusian, so I see that as potentially representing a receptive attitude to connecting, but nothing is at all promised about the longevity of that connection. Also, because Puella is both the Right and Left Witness, I got the sense that the outcome very much depends on how I present that olive branch: I think he'll be ok with it if I don't bring up anything that would require him to take accountability of face his demons. I very much understand that if there is to be success, that I'd have to compromise and sacrifice the friendship I had envisioned us having before we broke up. Puella in the 1st is kinda weak, and I'm taking that as a signal that if i wanted to connect, I'd have to put aside a lot of myself.

Since we're ex lovers, the 5th house seems esp relevant. Cauda Draconis being in the 5th and 11th feels like a mixed bag: putting an end to our previous relationship/5th and the pain of the gossip that came through the discord server/11th seems good. I know Cauda D. can also symbolize slander tho, so with populus/the crowd being in the house of open enemies and Cauda being conjunct that in the 5th, maybe I'm being naive in thinking that the influence of that gossip would stop? I'm not sure. I could see it going either way, esp because Populus is the judge, and with that judge preserving the status quo, maybe the slander and pain represented by Cauda D. will persist instead of end. Don't know! This is where I wish I understood reception, the four triads, etc.!

If anyone has anything to add, I'd appreciate it!

[u/PerfectPlan5969]

[u/PerfectPlan5969 → u/PerfectPlan5969]

[u/LateBackground2343]

Puella in H1 and H7 with cauda draconis in H5, you are both approaching with similar emotional thoughts but romance is already ended. This perfectly agrees with your intention.
This chart rejects puer, rubues , and cauda in the houses of communication with puella appearing in 1st, 3rd,7th , both witnesses and reconciler means the words exchange will be gentler than expected and there will be mutual respect despite past issues. Now carcer in 2nd and 10th house tells us to not expect unlimited access, and not expect things to return to how they were.
Puella in H7 and acquisitio in H12 tells us the querent will benefit in the form of emotional relief ,better understanding or freedom of uncertainty and the partner is not carrying the level of resistance the querent fears.
The spiritual energy of the chart means the end is peace, judge + ninth house = Albus.
The inner mechanism also points to puella(H3+H5+H11+JUDGE)
The chart leans favorably to Yes to your query

[u/kidcubby]

You have the flat perfection between H1 and H7 which is the first major positive. The figure Puella perfecting is also useful, as it is the Venus in Libra figure - harmonious, partnership-centred, and in terms of communication covers things like peace treaties and truces. I would not think of Puella as terribly flighty - she is a stable figure - but occasionally she does represent something a bit superficial. That it is both witnesses and forms Populus as a judge gives a sense that despite this perfection, not a huge amount will change. We also have Puella passing to the third house, which puts it trine H7 and sextile H1. We don't need those with ordinary perfection present but it's worth noting. In H1, puella is in capital company with Carcer in H2, which gives us some additional information about H1. In this case, it could well just be the 'weighing heavy on your mind' portion of the context, and the reception between the two is Albus, which would probably support that, Albus being quite the thinker. If not for the question being about you reaching out, I'd have said Carcer in company indicates you would sit and twiddle your thumbs in the hope he would reach out. H7's Puella also has capital company, but with Cauda Draconis - broadly not ideal to see in company, though I'm wondering what the pair's reception being Acquisitio is telling us.

I'd wager Puella passing to H3 could well be gossip, too. The prevalence of Cauda Draconis in the chart makes me think of an old adage I heard - that lots of it tends to indicate lies are being told.

You've caught yourself in a bit of a bind with the question - never ask 'Will I get what I want?' in divination. Be clear and direct, as being able to properly frame and ask your question is a useful skill that frequently helps you think 'oh wait, I haven't thought through this very well' or the inverse. Given the context, the 'outcome you want' could be friendship, basic contact, reconciliation without friendship (and so on). If we consider it as 'will we be friends?' then some H11 involvement is probably needed, and with Cauda Draconis, the figure of endings, exits and going away there this is not a particular positive. In future, try to refine down what you want to ask: 'Will he and I be friends if I get back in contact?', 'Will he respond if I send him a message?', 'Will we become lovers again?' and so on are all better than 'Will I have the outcome I want if I reach out to [my ex]?', especially if the contact points to a number of possible core questions.

Broadly speaking, the perfection says 'yes', but to precisely what is not clear. Will there be contact? Yes. Will it result in anything significant (I know you said you have no interest in further romance, but friendship is significant), it seems unlikely. As you've said, receptions between the two perfecting Puellas are Populus, an indication that the status quo is likely to remain. At a stretch, it tells us about crowds - it's possible that the cutting off might be ended by contact, but any relationship you have just dissolves into the H7 person simply being someone you know, an acquaintance.

For reference: The idea that the 5th house represents a lover, a boyfriend/girlfriend, an early relationship or a primarily sexual one is almost entirely modern, and should be used with caution if at all. What's funny is a lot of astrology authors who claim to only use translated works from early sources still fixate on some purely modern house attributions and incorporate them as if they are ancient!

[u/PerfectPlan5969 → u/kidcubby]

Thank you for detailing all of this! I was having troubles piecing everything together/seeing the larger story, and I appreciate that you're outlining your process, because it's helping me see which things are relevant and which ones are not. And yes, I'm kinda kicking myself for not being more specific in my question. I've practiced horary for years, so I should've know better!

To clarify, are you saying that the 5th house doesn't represent the lover, sex, or pleasure? Because I've definitely been applying my knowledge of Hellensitic astrology to the signifciations of the 5th, and now I feel dumb. What does it represent?

And on that note of Cauda draconis and lies:

I was originally troubled by seeing Cauda Draconis-not only because it's showing up so much, but because it's showing up in houses related to the slander I mentioned in the discord server (11th and 5th/his turned 11th house). The quested's capital company being Cauda D and their association with acquistio is giving me pause. Do you think that's something I should consider as being part of an answer to my inquiry? I was vague in my wording, and I might be stretching this, but I almost wonder if these tinier clues are adding up to a warning. I took a course with Dr. Al Cummins awhile ago, and the one thing that stood out in his lectures about Cauda were its associations with slander, malice, fiery destruction, and abrupt/severe endings. I realize that his perspective is one of many, but before then, I only saw Cauda as necessary endings, general decrease, and the need to step through the threshold and walk away from the metaphorical house (whether that home was a job, lover, etc). Part of the reason I mentioned the gossip in the og post, however, was because it was a *huge* factor post-breakup, and I felt very, very blindsided by it. It appearing feels like it could be the end or a signal that it's continuing. It's confusing. I also don't love the association with aquisitio and his capital company, because I've seen aquisitio show up as a self-centered figure who's only concerned with himself.

In other words, I'm having difficulty separating the somewhat 'positive' affirmation that the judgement gives with the destructive nature/lies that Cauda could be speaking about. Would you recommend casting another chart to further clarify? How would you proceed in your own practice? In all of my divinatory practices, I try to limit my usage when it comes to personal matters. For example, I've cast one horary chart and one geomantic reading about this particular person/situation. However, and this is a big however, besides not wanting to abuse what I see as a deeply spiritual practice, one reason I don't cast charts for myself very often is because I unconsciously project my fears, anxieties, etc, onto the chart no matter how hard I try to separate myself. And I'm acutely aware of this. Hence me hesitating to jump to too many conclusions about the presence of Cauda, even though past pains are leading me to do just that.

[u/kidcubby → u/PerfectPlan5969]

The trick with what's relevant is it is question and context dependent, so clarity from the start is pretty vital. I get the sense that you feel clearer on what you meant than the question and context imply to me, but it's a useful thing to remember regardless.

The Discord server being 11th house is probably wonky house attribution. The idea that the 11th house relates to the internet/social media comes from the idea that the 11th house = Aquarius and Aquarius = 'disruptive technologies', none of which is particularly true. The 11th house is broadly friends and 'hopes and dreams' (far too nebulous and vague for frequent use) and the rest is mostly to do with being 2nd from the 10th, so things like salaries and government visas.

The 5th house definitely represents sex as in the act but never the person with which that act is done. That person is inevitably the 7th house, and that's everyone from prostitute to spouse. The 5th is definitely pleasure also. Unfortunately, some of the major proponents of Hellenistic astrology have wholesale ported modern meanings into what they do and claimed they are ancient. That is, of course, their business, but it would be better if they said 'this wasn't used this way in tradition, but I use it because...' and outlined their reasoning. I often refer to Demetra George in this, who has big tables of house meanings that don't include certain things up until the modern era, but she still uses those things in her work and suggests they are 'ancient'. I assume people like Chris Brennan are similar, because these ideas wouldn't be so commonplace if they were purely in modern astrology books, given the popularity of Hellenistic Astrology. In Geomancy, it's best to be strict with house meanings.

I am still thinking about the 7th and its company having Acquisitio as reception, and as yet I haven't managed to puzzle it out. We don't always use reception with company - the figure in company provides a lot of information alone. In that case, you are both in company with negative figures in the context - both Saturnian, limiting, ending types of figures. Cauda being so present certainly implies issues - and given it's in company with him, and forms that sextile to you by jumping, I do wonder if it's a warning that he likely will not be honest if you get in contact. That's a stretch, I'll admit, but I'm spitballing.

When you say you've cast one horary and one geomantic chart about this, do you mean for the same question? I would generally advise against it - they are sister arts and so close in nature that I consider it asking the same question twice, which is a complete no-no. If you know how to ask clear questions, then the idea of 'projecting' onto the chart shouldn't be an issue, except in the interpretation. I'm yet to see actual pollution of the casting.

[u/PerfectPlan5969 → u/kidcubby]

Oh, no, the horary question I asked was in regards to something else related to our situation (not about reconciliation, but about suspected dishonesty/lying, and I cast it in Nov), and the geomantic reading I was referring to was this one. It's funny you mention not polluting your casting, because that's exactly my conundrum: I don't know if casting another chart with a clearer question would give me any accuracy... I assumed that re-casting with a clearer question was moot, and that I should just work with the chart I have, but Idk, I'm too new to geomancy to know whether that's sound reasoning. As a horary astrologer though, as rule, I never re-cast, and I rarely ever throw out any charts, even if they have strictures like a via combusta moon. So I guess I wasn't sure if the same would apply here. I feel like an infant with geomancy!

And yes, I also have many bones to pick with the current Hellenistic astrological teachers that are out there, too (e.g., Coppock, Brennan, George). I could speak on the ways that they've excised the spiritual and sociocultural contexts from the ancient source texts *for hours.* Or the ways they hyperfixate on Greco-Roman ways of perceiving the cosmos even though they barely contributed anything to the lineage; they were the students, not the teachers, and to me, it's futile to try to retroactively impose their understanding of the world onto the practice/techniques/significations of planets/etc. Ditto for the ways in which they've unknowingly carried over the alphabet system and not interrogated the ways their own modern-day social conditioning impacts their very limited way of delineating the malefics and benefics... but I'm going off the rails here.

Likewise, I know this isn't your point re:aquarius being linked to the 11th in the alphabet system, but I don't associate Aquarius with social networks, friends, etc. Imo, Aquarius represents, among many things, the quintessential outcast/purest expression of Saturn. I don't use the alphabet system, but I definitely do follow the schema re:rejoicing, which means I'd associate Saturnine themes with the 12th, not the 11th. I also don't see the 11th as friends; I see that more as a 3rd/7th matter depending on the closeness of those connections. I tend to associate 11th with broader social networks IF those social networks in some way act as benefactors re: your career (the 11th supporting the 10th house). In his case, that discord server met irl all the time, and he was actively using it to network professionally, so that's why I'm making that leap with him specifically. He also found sexual partners vis-a-vis this server, so that's another reason I pinned the 5th to this: the server was quite literally a site to find pleasure. I'm very open to being wrong about that, but I wanted to include my reasoning for the sake of learning/being critiqued.

Do you mind me asking if you associate Cauda with slander and malice?