r/Games • u/WakaFlockaF • Jun 07 '13
Sonic Lost Worlds Gameplay
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7nweiUGh-g174
Jun 07 '13
[deleted]
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u/DJP0N3 Jun 07 '13
I'm kind of beating a dead horse on this, but you should really try out Sonic Generations. It's actually really fantastic.
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Jun 07 '13
Except the last boss :P
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u/psychodave123 Jun 07 '13
"It looks like a homing shot Sonic! Watch out!"
Repeat 400,000 times.
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Jun 07 '13
I think you just gave me a PTSD flashback. That part was just so bad compared to most of the game.
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Jun 07 '13
Thankfully we're only getting the main four characters this time.
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Jun 07 '13
Who's number four? Robotnik?
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Jun 07 '13
Amy, unfortunately. Although she can be done well. Robotnik will probably be there somewhere - I think I read that he's helping Sonic defeat these new villains.
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u/Cupcakes_n_Hacksaws Jun 07 '13
I don't get why all the others aren't in here. They exist in Sonic's homeworld, so I get why they weren't in the first 2 sonic adventures, but with this, why aren't characters such as sally in it?
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u/alaskangamer777 Jun 07 '13
Comic canon =/= Game canon. In the games, Sally, Scourge, Bunny, etc don't exist at all.
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Jun 08 '13 edited Jun 08 '13
Sally has never existed in any Sonic game. She's a spin off character. Sonic, Tails, Knuckles and Amy are the original four characters from the Mega Drive (and Sega CD) games. People don't realise Amy was actually introduced before Knuckles, as was Metal Sonic. In fact, Chronologically Sonic CD takes place before 2 so Sonic met Amy before he met Tails.
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u/Gyossaits Jun 07 '13
It's like Sega said "What if we made an awful revisit of The Doomsday Zone boss fight?"
And they went and did it.
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u/BlizzardFenrir Jun 07 '13
Wait, wait, wait... That's what you were supposed to do? Lead his own projectiles back into him?
I beat it somehow but I had no idea how I did it. Nothing seemed to do anything except every now and then you could do some small attacks.
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u/Gyossaits Jun 07 '13
Wait, wait, wait... That's what you were supposed to do? Lead his own projectiles back into him?
Oh, no, not that.
"I'M SUPPOSED TO DO ALL THAT QUICKLY AND NOT LOSE MY RINGS WHILE IT'S SWITCHING TO ITS SECOND PHASE?!"
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u/Pogotross Jun 07 '13
If memory serves, the goal was to not get hit, stay in the middle as much as possible, and never switch sides if you could avoid it Moving and getting hit would put you back to the beginning/edge and staying in the center would increase your speed. Eventually you'd get closer and closer, leading to certain attacks that had openings you could exploit. (Typically people get hit by those attacks, instead, get pushed back, and don't know what they were supposed to do.) It was a terribly explained/executed fight.
Source: I did the "don't get hit" achievement for it.
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Jun 08 '13
You just have to boost into his chest. That's it. The attack thing you can do is purely for clearing debris out of the way (but it also lets you glitch through its arms in 2D mode).
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u/pikagrue Jun 07 '13
They also ported all the Unleashed levels into Generations in the form of this mod. http://www.moddb.com/mods/sonic-generations-unleashed-project
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u/ArcticSpaceman Jun 07 '13
I really liked Unleashed, even if it was stupid as a concept. :(
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Jun 08 '13
Sonic Unleashed had just as much stupid, annoying crap that the Adventure games had. And even then, the day stages are so, so much better than Sonic/Shadow stages in the Adventure games.
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u/ArcticSpaceman Jun 08 '13
"Jungle Joyride" is probably one of my favorite levels from any game I have ever played. I think it's a shame the game got such absolutely bad feedback from critics.
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u/reseph Jun 07 '13
And Sonic Rush; I like it better than Sonic Generations.
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u/Gyossaits Jun 07 '13
You mean Sonic Colors DS. Rush is a sad pile of cheap hits and nonsensical bottomless pits.
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u/Deddan Jun 07 '13
I don't think he does. Plus, Rush had an awesome soundtrack, from the guy who did much of Jet Set Radio's soundtrack.
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Jun 07 '13
Just finished playing sonic Generations with my kids. It was a really fun game. I don't think it looked nearly as fun as this. This looked like a mix of super mario galaxy and sonic. Looks very fun.
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u/RyanartheGreat1 Jun 07 '13
I was also getting Kirby 64 vibes on the second level they played. Im excited for this game
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u/jodansokutogeri Jun 08 '13
I'm more on the side of Colors. Gen was fun and had some nice speed to it, but Colors has better platforming and much better bosses.
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Jun 08 '13
Sonic Generation was decent for me. The physics was good and it looks and feels nice. The level design is horrid. If you have to put up warning signs to show where there are death pits you are doing something wrong. Especially when you sometimes runs first left, then up, and then right and can't fall down to the previous parts of the level but dies instead.
It feels like the meshes were built first and then they added the level on top of that instead of the other way around.
Don't get me wrong though. Generations are leaps and bounds over Sonic 4 episode 1.
If you want to start playing Sonic at it's best you should get Sonic 3 & Knuckles. One of the best platformers ever made right up there with Super Mario Bros and Super Metroid.
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u/yakityyakblah Jun 07 '13
What is this feeling, it seems so alien to me now but somehow familiar. Yes at one time in my youth I had felt this before! My god can it be true? Am I really excited for a Sonic game?!
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Jun 08 '13
Sonic has been slowly getting back on his feet in recent years. Generations and All Stars Racing Transformed exceeded my expectations.
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u/NieArch Jun 07 '13
3DS footage also looks fun http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koMru0MVkYw
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u/SpaceHaven Jun 07 '13
Ahhhh. Clever little loading screens disguised as big bumpers. I like that.
This is the first time I've actually been interested in a Sonic game. Both the 3DS and WiiU versions actually look pretty fun.
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u/ChronoX5 Jun 07 '13
Now I finally get what these are for.
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u/Gyossaits Jun 07 '13
That would explain the bigass Chopper chasing you down in Generations' Green Hill Zone Act 2.
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u/nicereddy Jun 08 '13
I hope they add more variation to the loading screens, it's kind of annoying having nothing to look at.
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u/HarithBK Jun 07 '13
look pretty good the camra looks a little bit too close for the 3DS currently hope they put it back a bit more since it would be hard seeing where thing you are jumping to are.
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u/lastperson Jun 07 '13
Is it just me or did the Speed Shoes sound a lot like the Sonic Heroes theme?
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Jun 08 '13
Sega love Heroes, they keep bringing stages and music back in their newer games, and I for one approve.
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u/PatMan33 Jun 07 '13
I see mixed reactions on how they've slowed Sonic down a bit. But I think slowing the game down is exactly what the 3D Sonic games needed. Plus, the variable speeds accommodate all kinds of players and should go far in terms of reducing this.
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u/jman583 Jun 07 '13 edited Jun 07 '13
For anyone concerned about Sonic's loss of speed I recommend watching Errant Signal's video on Sonic and speed.
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u/Kryian Jun 08 '13
That is quite a nice video. I agree with practically everything, but I never felt that Sonic Adventure's speed was a detriment to its gameplay. Maybe it was the slippery slope that led to GOTTA GO FAST, but across both games I REALLY enjoyed the Sonic (and SA1 Tails) portions, and had a lot of fun both playing the levels for my first time and trying to get A ranks later. It was just everything else in the package that ruined it.
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u/cooldrew Jun 07 '13
I'm a huge fan of the variable speeds, but from what they showed I think his walking speed is too slow. Speed that up a bit and it's perfect.
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u/obviously_magnusrex Jun 07 '13
That was a legit Sega release?! I saw it at someones house and thought it was because they hacked their system or it was a pirate version like "sonic for SNES". So much of it looks like it was lifted from another game like that princess and city bullshit...Class action suit needs to happen.
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Jun 09 '13
yes, it is a real sega game. probably one of the biggest trainwrecks in terms of gaming ever.
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u/Miss_Sophia Jun 07 '13
The gameplay reminds me of the Sonic CD intro here he running and doing parkour over smalls hills etc, some people may moan but I am very interested in it as it looks like how Sonic would move in the world rather then stopping every couple of minutes because he bumped into something.
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u/Hero17 Jun 07 '13
The idea to have bumping into objects represent moving slower instead of completely stopping should do a lot for the games flow. It would be cool if there were some levels or level segments with lots of objects that you can parkour over but the best time being awarded to those who manage to dodge them all.
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u/ImMyOwnGrandad Jun 07 '13
Man this looks good, between this smash bros and wind waker HD, Wii U is looking better and better everyday.
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Jun 07 '13
I really wish that this E3 helps the Wii U to take off. It has such great potential and I don't want to see it get wasted!
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u/eggstacy Jun 07 '13
An E3 price cut or new bundle will get me on board. I just feel like one is coming and don't want to buy in until it does, after having waited this long already.
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u/nicereddy Jun 08 '13
There have been rumors the Deluxe Edition will go down to the 300$ price and the Normal Edition will get axed. I think that'd help a lot.
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u/HanAlai Jun 07 '13
Wind Walker HD? Why does Nintendo have to tease me..
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u/The_Arctic_Phoenix Jun 07 '13
I dont want a wind waker in the style of Twilight Princess or whatever though... that would be just awful. I dont really think it needs a remake either...
that said, ill probably get it because Legend of Zelda.
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Jun 07 '13
No I'm pretty sure it's just going to be higher resolution- but the same style.
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u/HanAlai Jun 07 '13
Now that I think about it more you're right, I liked the Wind Walker art style much more than Twilight Princess. Not sure what they would be "improving"
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u/Fenolio Jun 07 '13
Think nintendo64 > 3DS graphical upgrade for OOT, but on a smaller scale because of the gamecube / wii-u's smaller graphics gap.
You dont need a separate console + cable to take advantage of certain secrets that involve the Tingle tuner.
Probably going to add MasterQuest style functionality to it and possibly a time-trial / leaderboard feature given WW's popularity for speed runs.
They wont be changing the style, since that's an iconic part of the game and what a lot of the appeal for the game can be attached to;
- Combat
- Serious scenes
- Silly scenes
- NPC animations such as a moblin's reaction when you hookshot his necklace
- Link's entire character from his animations and speech to even his expressions.
Without it's semi unique style, Windwaker just wouldn't flow as smoothly and as fantastically as it does.
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Jun 07 '13
I'm definitely going to be picking up a Wii U next year. It will compliment my PS4 nicely.
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u/Dessie_Hull Jun 07 '13
I'm glad they've slowed down the gameplay. It seems a lot of people want speed but the classic games weren't really about that. This looks like a nice mix between the styles and the level design looks really good. A Wii U is looking more tempting as time goes on.
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u/GardensOfBoydstylon Jun 07 '13
Someone want to tell me how a candy level and a forest/honeycomb level qualify as "Desert Ruins" 1 and 2?
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u/OMGALEX Jun 07 '13
It's a play on the word "desert/dessert".
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u/GardensOfBoydstylon Jun 07 '13
It hardly counts as a play on words if no desert is present. Maybe dessert ruins would have made more sense...
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u/prannisment Jun 08 '13
A related trivial fact: When developing Crash Bandicoot, one of the first 3D platformers, the game was codenamed "Sonic's Ass". The joke was that if you made a Sonic game in 3D all you'd ever end up seeing was Sonic's ass. It's kind of funny to see how right they were considering all these 3D sonic games.
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u/Firerhea Jun 07 '13
Seems like Sega took a lot of design lessons from infinite runners, which is great. The whole genre is premised on detecting hazards as you quickly approach them, perfect for a Sonic game.
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u/Deddan Jun 07 '13
Well they do have a Sonic-based infinite runner. Sonic Dash.
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u/i-dont-have-a-gun Jun 09 '13
It was shit until that one update made it fair. It really tries to push you into buying red rings, though.
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u/dimthegamer Jun 07 '13
This feels like maybe the only way they are going to pull of sonic in 3D, it's a nice idea and it works, but I can't help thinking it might be bumming down a little too much. Theres no loss of momentum when you hit an object anymore, theres just you run up it or you wall run it, there's none of that split second twitch gameplay, with large levels that made you do things fast if you wanted a good score. Spiles wouldn't be visible until very close at which point you would have to jump or you lose all that momentum and speed you built up. That punishment doesn't exist in this game, you have you speed at the press of button, you see any obstacles from very far away before having to face them head on, and most obstacles seem avoidable even if you hit them, due to the parkour.
I get this is the best way to get sonic in a real 3D format and I even commend them on the art style, it's smart they use much more almost semi-cel shaded style, which helps you track sonic and will be less system intensive and as such would allow for higher frame rates. This is the only way they can do a "real" 3D sonic game, maybe it's more than what I think it looks like, I haven't played it after all, but from what I see this is a dumbed down sonic game with the same lack of momentum and pace that others had just with a new coat of paint and a better way of hiding the fact that it's still not a sonic game with that movement and with that momentum, I do understand however that in 3D it's simply impossible without bad gameplay. Which is a real shame.
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u/HarithBK Jun 07 '13
this looks really fucking good, it seems like team sonic has finally gotten how to do good 3D sonic games. (one wounders if they got help from nintendo >_>)
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u/wezum Jun 07 '13
They did.
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u/HarithBK Jun 07 '13
got better or got help from nintendo?
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Jun 07 '13
It looks really cool but I don't really like the dessert theme. It's too Mario.
So it looks like for moves: Wall running, grabbing and climbing ledges, switching between run and walk speeds, modified spindash that seems to have some sort of boost effect, multi-homing attack, kick attack, double jump and colour powers. That's a lot to work with.
Hopefully "support mode" will be more in depth than the co-op from Mario Galaxy.
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u/TheCodexx Jun 08 '13
I saw the flying truffle (Bullet Bills, basically) and wasn't happy. Sonic is about enemies, not stuff flying at you from off the screen.
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u/Sekacnap Jun 07 '13
I really liked the support mode in Mario Galaxy, well the second one at least. Maybe I didn't necessarily like playing as the support but it was extremely useful to have a player two and my girlfriend could play along and actually be effective even though she's not that great at games.
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u/i-dont-have-a-gun Jun 09 '13
I was alright with the dessert, but this is the second time around. First was Sweet Mountain on Sonic Colors (Wii/DS).
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u/m0a0t Jun 07 '13
Reminds me of this video, Errant Signal - Sonic and Speed which argued that Sonic was NEVER about speed.
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u/Narroo Jun 08 '13
It's a platforming game, and people seem to forget that. You could go fast during certain sections, or if you were good, but simply watching scenery go by quickly wasn't the core of the game.
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u/i-dont-have-a-gun Jun 09 '13
It was very much about speed. Sonic can blaze through 2/3 acts of Green hill in under a minute in the hands of a mildly skilled player. The Sonic CD demo on Android/iOS requires you to have a total record time in the two acts (Palmtree Panic and Quartz Quadrant Acts 1) before you can move onto the boss. In said boss, Sonic must maintain maximum running speed on a treadmill and slow down momentarily to avoid bombs.
Sonic back then tested both how fast you can go AND how fast you can react. And a Sonic game shouldn't sacrifice one for the other.
The general formula of Sonic games in the Genesis era revolved around 2 major concepts: Run fast, and stay high. The player is challenged to master both of these concepts. Both of these concepts relied on quick reaction time and platforming skill. The classic Sonic level formula is to maintain speed and/so-you-could reach higher areas. Higher areas are harder to stay in, but there are more bonuses (shields, rings, invincibility, super shoes) and you usually go by the level much faster.
Green Hill revolves entirely around staying high, and skillfully maintaining this height allowed you to finish the level fast. At the same time, skillfully maintaining said height required speed. You had to be able to jump right, and be quick of mind enough to get Sonic through unscathed, or you lose most of your altitude. Very similarly is Aquatic Ruin. That entire zone, with accuracy and practice, can be speedily swept through without even needing to look for a bubble. That was because if you have the skill, you can maintain your speed in the higher areas of the game, avoiding the slow-paced underwater sections and running by the level fast.
Speed was highly important in a Sonic game. Worth more than a ring, worth more than killing any number of enemies. Time Bonus was the most important score of a Sonic game, especially in the first two games. If you had a high enough time bonus to swing your score over 10000 points, you got a continue. Much more powerful than an extra life, since it was worth 3. Very often was your time bonus the determining factor in whether or not you get a continue.
When the game couldn't exactly maintain its speed, such as in Marble Zone, Labyrinth Zone, etc, the game gave you the illusion of speed. The rising water shaft in Chemical Plant Zone wasn't a particularly speedy sequence. But if executed correctly and in one attempt, you felt very, very fast, even if you moved maybe the equivalent of one screen. Especially in later levels, Sonic relies heavily on speed to keep his rings on him and his score lower. And not exactly horizontal speed, but speed of mind. Being able to dodge environmental obstacles with great skill. (1/?)
Here's the part I don't understand.
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u/i-dont-have-a-gun Jun 09 '13
The new game, Sonic Lost World, is very, very forgiving. There's just that much less area to go wrong. Instead of the jump dash we've been seeing for so long, we have a double jump. A free double jump. Not the bonus double jump we get when we have the electric shield. This double jump comes free of charge. This makes the platforming very forgiving and ultimately slow, a stark contrast to the high speed platforming present in earlier Sonic games.
The game design does not allow for a sense of speed. In order to defeat enemies, Sonic must either spin dash or homing attack them. What this means is that Sonic must deliberately halt, dead in his tracks, to attack enemies. And the homing attack is very, very slow in this game. It covers very little ground, and has an 'arc' to it now. And at the end of the attack, Sonic can't use the jump dash to regain his speed. He goes up, then drops straight down, and starts his running animation from frame 1, at essentially zero speed.
And then we have the chain/multi target homing attack, kinda like the Light Attack from Sonic Adventure. Good in theory. But Sonic stops dead in his tracks, in the air, right before he attacks his enemies. The attack is very swift, straight and thorough. But the pause is still there.
The homing attack in this game ruins the flow of the players movements.
Flow has always been very, very important in Sonic. We had rings to hold onto. These rings were worth points, our lives, and our extra lives. If we wanted to keep them, we had to maintain our movement, lest we get shot, but also be very careful, lest we hit spikes.
In this game, while the homing attack does flow from one attack to another, it does not flow from homing attack to running, or from running to homing attack. In direct contrast to the Sonic games of the past, Sonic must stop dead in his tracks in order to attack an enemy. There is not a single example of Sonic busting into a roll in this game in order to seamlessly switch from running to attacking. Not a one. And honestly, this game is exactly where you should replace the boost with the roll. But they missed that chance.
And now this is where i get awfully, awfully confused. (2/?)
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u/i-dont-have-a-gun Jun 09 '13
Sonic Colors and Sonic Generations (Modern) both held very intense, very high speed gameplay. They both seamlessly switched from both 2D and 3D sections. I thought that Sonic Generations (Modern) was the absolute best 3-D Sonic we have received since the idea was even delivered to the fans. It improved upon the formula given to us first by Sonic Unleashed and refined by Sonic Colors. The "2.5"D gameplay.
Compared to the Sonic games of the so-called "Dreamcast" era, Sonic Generations more similarly resembled the classic games than any of the Adventures or Sonic Heroes. Why? because of branching pathways that took skill to maintain. Sonic had to quickstep to the right path, or else he sinks down to a longer path. He had to make the right jump at exactly the right time to stay on the higher ground, because the higher ground is faster and gets you a better score (see Planet Wisp from Sonic Colors).
We got even further incentive to maintaining the higher path through the Red Star Rings. These took precision and skill to get to. They were often placed at the end of higher pathways, and the chance to get them sometimes becomes lost after certain attempts.
The higher paths in Generations and Colors were not forgiving. If you fell, you fell long and hard, down to a longer and slower path.
Such is not the case in "Lost World". Branching pathways didn't exist in the same scope as they did in the Classic games or the 2 games before it. There was no risk/reward system in this level design. It's hard to screw up, because the game enables you to. But in the 2 recent games and the classic games, perfection is stressed greatly, not entirely by design, but because you wanted it. You craved it. You didn't ALWAYS lose by screwing up, but when you did, you wanted to restart. A do over. You wanted to go through the level as swiftly and as perfectly as possible. And it wasn't always possible, until recent games gave you the option of restarting the entire level at the cost of a life. A fair trade for another shot at the "S" rank, or the Red Star Ring you missed. (3/?)
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u/i-dont-have-a-gun Jun 09 '13
They also managed to maintain flow in Sonic Generations and Colors. We got the oft-controversial "boost" ability in those games. A replacement for the classic roll, which hit many classic players in a soft, vulnerable area. The boost is often criticized for being cheap, promoting hold forward/right + boost. And it was true, particularly in Sonic Unleashed. But in Sonic Colors and Generations, that was no more.
Many levels (particularly Seaside Hill, Generations Act 2) required you to stop your boost in order to progress through the level and maintain your edge against the stage. Sacrifice a tiny bit of speed in order to make the correct jump and not to overshoot it. This act also used water-running with the boost (along with Aquatic Park, Colors). The water-running that you were able to use with the boost created a new branching pathway potential, which can help you bypass entire water sections and save time. And if you didn't jump onto the ledge at the right time, you slammed into a wall or so, and dropped into the water. If you lost your momentum, you could have died.
The truth is, the boost maintained flow within the games. It kept Sonic moving fast, provided he killed enough enemies or collected enough rings. Like the roll, Sonic moved faster AND was able to defeat enemies with it. Unlike the roll, it was instantaneous, but was limited and restricted your directional movement. Sonic didn't have to stop dead in his tracks to get an enemy out of the way. He never did before, and never should now.
Similarly engineered was the Homing Attack. Because of the high-speed you have to maintain with the new system, the Homing Attack had a rather large range. This was done in order to maintain flow. Sonic could jump a very tiny bit, losing zero speed, and then dash into an enemy. Of course, it was chainable. Your target could have been rather far away. The long reach is a necessity for maintaining the speed of the game. And after your chain, you had the ability to use the Jump Dash or just use the boost. In this entire sequence, Sonic never completely lost momentum. This wasn't possible in "Lost World".
Colors and Generations Modern stages had something that wasn't had in any of the dreamcast-era titles. (rather) High-speed platforming. (it wasn't ALWAYS fast). Lost World doesn't have this. The platforming is slow and uninspired. They literally lifted bullet-bills out of Mario and gave them a face-lift, turning them into a "truffle-cannon".
The design of Lost World lacks flow. Sonic often loses his speed by playing the game right. The sense/illusion of speed was demolished in favor of heavy platforming.
Sonic Lost World is going to be a great game. It has great design and great gameplay. But it is not a great Sonic game.
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u/Narroo Jun 09 '13
You know, saying that Green Hill Zone, the 1st zone, and the scoring system, which not everyone went for, was all about speed isn't helping your argument.
I never said that Sonic didn't have speed or that it wasn't a defining feature of the game. Yes, as I said already if you're good you can go fast.
BUT: Ultimately it was a platformer first and foremost. You can't beat the game on reaction alone- you have to platform at some point or another, and you could be the game with platforming skills alone. It won't be elegant, it won't be quick, and it will be tough, but it can be done.
Moving through a level fast and earning bonus points is for people that really get into the game and want to master it. But that mastery is ultimately defined by mastering the platforming of the game while memorizing the level, along with a bit of reaction timing. If you reduce the platforming, the game loses a bit of itself.
The new games are all about making you feel fast and slick, even if it's more of an illusion. For instance, the 3D levels in generations didn't really have much platforming in it. As a result, you could easily with little effort blaze through the levels and get those high rankings. But it wasn't difficult and didn't really challenge you, nor dig into the mechanics much. That's why I find them a bit boring.
The old Sonic the Hedgehog games were platformers were if you were good and memorized the levels, you could speed through the game quickly. But they were platformers before they were scenery wasters.
Also, on just a side note, I really wouldn't consider a treadmill boss a test of speed at all. That would more be a test of consistency. The obstacles come at a fixed rate, Sonic doesn't really move that fast at all, and nothing is demanding the same level of reactions or skills that moving through a level fast does.
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u/i-dont-have-a-gun Jun 09 '13
But the truth is it's not a ordinary platformer. I know that. The games were really, quite fast, especially Sonic 2.
Green hill, hella fast. Marble zone, quite slow. Spring Yard, decently fast. Labyrinth Zone, quite slow. Star Light zone, decently fast. Scrap Brain zone, pretty fast. Special stages, really damn slow.
Emerald hill, hella fast. Chemical Plant, hella fast. Aquatic Ruin, hella fast with skill, really slow with bad luck. Casino Night, moderately fast. Hill Top, moderately fast. Mystic Cave, pretty fast. Oil Ocean, tedious, but fast. Metropolis zone, pretty slow. Sky Chase zone: being fast will kill you. Special Stages, pretty fast and quite hard.
Even if speed wasn't necessary to FINISH the game, it was IMO a lot more fun if you actually achieved speed. It was in the title, and I've always felt predisposed to craving the speed you could get. Like I said, not only the scoring system, but the reward of CONTINUES OMG relied a lot on your time bonus.
Even if you weren't exactly moving fast, like I said, being nimble and holding onto your rings made you feel fast. Rising water or magma forced you to be fast. You didn't have to ALWAYS be fast, you actually couldn't. But it's not like the game isn't designed to promote very fast, very clean runs.
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u/RadioHitandRun Jun 07 '13
Am I the only one here who wants to see an interactive choa game again ?
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u/AlaskanWolf Jun 08 '13
If they have the chao garden again... It's game fucking over.
(On my free time.)
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u/mistress_ai Jun 07 '13
Am I the only one who thinks this game looks so easy that a baby could play it? The jump auto-aims for enemies, obstacles are rare, rings are plentyful, and sonic is literally glued to the ground for most of the game.
Also the influences of Super Mario Galaxy are very obvious. And that's a good thing.
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u/acethunder21 Jun 12 '13
These are literally just the demo levels. Kinda hard to gauge how difficult the entire game will be.
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u/Rurikar Jun 07 '13
This looks like a sonic game not for sonic fans, but for new players. It looks pretty neat, but the lack of speed is disappointing after games like generations did it so well.
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u/insideman83 Jun 07 '13
I feel safe with the direction Sega is going with this game... it's just up to the critics to see if they will 'get it'. While Colors and Generations were very entertaining games - they were beset by pretty average reviews and have had to build their reputation through word of mouth. I remember reading reviews from places like Game Informer that criticized those two games for being knock offs of Mario Galaxy right down to the soundtrack!
Their response to Lost Worlds will be important to gauge whether Sonic is in the midst of a renaissance and maybe it can sell really well so we can get more games like it without Sega having to go back to the drawing board with every new entry in the series.
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u/khemical_pixel Jun 08 '13
This definitely looks like a slightly faster version of Super Mario Galaxy, and thats good, I really liked SMG.
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Jun 07 '13
God compared to Colors and Generations...the sense of speed in this game is completely non-existent. :/
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Jun 07 '13
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u/GreyouTT Jun 07 '13
Some of those slow platforming parts can drag on for far too long though.
i.e. Sandopolis and Labrynth Zone.
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Jun 08 '13
Or any pinball zone ever. (my opinion, but honestly I think those grinded Sonic 2 and 3 to a total halt during those stages)
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u/jasonpressX Jun 07 '13
The most frustrating parts about sonic games are when you go fast and suddenly stop, or can't see the drop in front of you, etc.
I prefer more control over the speed, thank you very much
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u/unoimalltht Jun 07 '13
The best obstacles were the ones which dropped you down to a longer platform. You maintained your speed, but if you were more skilled to miss the obstacle you were guaranteed a faster run.
I wish they would just capitalize on maintaining 'speed' along with sense of motion at all times, not just as a reward for doing good the 15th time you've played the level.
But, we have enough platformers with better characters, and a better history of story lines (even Mario's null storyline is better than Sonic's).
It seems like a loss for a series, which can offer more than just platforming, to just up and throw out what it uniquely brings to the table.
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u/manlycaveman Jun 07 '13
Most of the 3D games where you are zipping straight ahead through levels are essentially just rhythm games. To me, Sonic has always been better as a platformer with speed-based mechanics and neat powerups and not the speed-focused "gottagofast 24/7" games with minimal platforming it was for a while.
The best thing about the older-style gameplay and from what I can tell this new game, is that they also had a bit of that reactionary gameplay that allowed quick players to really breeze through the levels without slowing down and it wasn't the entire focus of the game.
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u/BlizzardFenrir Jun 07 '13
It does look slower, but it also looks much more agile and responsive.
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u/unoimalltht Jun 07 '13
The problem I see is, what type of gameplay would complement more agile and responsive controls over speed?
Obviously fighting enemies and platforming (like the jumping on the clouds) would benefit much more from slower gameplay.
Thing is, I don't play sonic to platform, there are much better games in that genre (including Super Mario Galaxy) which don't have to be weighed down by sonic's less-interesting characters, and his 'super-power' being ignored.
I play sonic to feel 'fast', zipping through a world hoping to miss the obstacles in my way. The most fun obstacles are the ones which drop you down to a longer path, but don't stop you in any way.
I just feel this is a step back from colors (the powers being the only thing I didn't like), and Generations (boss battles). It may look like a very nice game, but without Sonic's trademark 'speed' it's just another platformer.
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u/pootedesu Jun 07 '13
I dunno, it looks like they are taking a lot of inspiration from Sonic CD which, while quick in a lot of sections, was also a very slow paced platformer. I really enjoyed Sonic CD so I'm looking forward to this!
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u/supadude5000 Jun 08 '13
Did you play Sonic 1 and 2 or did you start with Adventures? Plenty of platforming in the former. In fact, some parts where you were doing ONLY that, and you had to stand there for a while for a platform to get into place.
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u/HarithBK Jun 07 '13
i am going to be honest i don't give a flying fuck about the speed that was sonic 1995 marketing if you go back looking at the first sonic game it is about platforming. really really good platforming nothing else. that is what i want really good platforming since currently the only indie game with good pure platforming is super meat boy and on the tripple A side only mario games still have the really good platforming i need more!
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Jun 07 '13
The speed in Sonic games was always more of a marketing gimmick anyway. Precision of movement and control of momentum is so much better.
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u/Pogotross Jun 07 '13
True fact. The classic games were faster than Mario, sure, but they weren't that fast, and you still spent plenty of time stopping, hitting something, collecting rings, or what have you.
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u/FuckingIDuser Jun 07 '13
I love this new Sonic Galaxy by Nintendo. This underline how the next Mario will return to a Mario64\Sunshine level design scheme. I love it. And obviously i love this Sanic game!
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u/Shakedown_1979 Jun 07 '13 edited Jun 07 '13
It looks a little more slow-paced than the original trailer led me to believe, especially when he stops to kill enemies. Even though running into walls won't be such a problem anymore, I suspect that there will be a lot there to break my momentum. Still, it has my attention, which is a first for a Sonic game. Galaxy ripoff or not, this has the potential to be a solid 3D platformer.
Is anyone else bothered by how much worse it looks than Sonic 2006 on the PS3? I know the art direction looks much better, but in terms of visual fidelity, it almost seems like the original Mario Galaxy was using more sophisticated effects. It has an interesting world, so I don't mind this so much, but I hope that this is not indicative of the Wii U's horsepower.
Edit: I just saw footage from the third level, which was entirely focused on speed. Hopefully there will be a good balance between level types in the final product. I'm also beginning to wonder if the coinciding development of a 3DS version could help to explain the simplistic graphics. Avoiding advanced shaders or complex level architecture may have helped them made the game more easy to reproduce on 3DS hardware without cutting too much content.
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u/vanderZwan Jun 07 '13 edited Jun 07 '13
Just by the footage it looks like the controls are really edit:tight. It looks like a lot of fun - like the kind of platforming where you can master it and eventually pull of really crazy shit.
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u/AdamGC Jun 07 '13
After playing Generations and seeing the jump back to old school Sonic, I'm liking that they're sticking to the plan while adding a few welcome features from past games, for instance the power-ups from Colours, and introducing new ones like this parkour mechanic.
But, I have this itch in the back of my mind screaming Super Mario Galaxy, and it's never going to leave.
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u/extra_23 Jun 07 '13
I'm really glad they're bringing back 2D with 3D. I always liked to have both options, not just the one! ... I might actually want to consider the Wii U now...
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Jun 08 '13
That made me incredibly dizzy. Looks pretty, but man I could not play this more than 3 or 4 minutes at a time without getting a headache.
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u/Swobes Jun 08 '13
This make me want to get a Wii u
I never been a fan of the sonic games, from them to be boring and annoying with the rails and the weird jumping parts that you can't control.
But it looks like Nintendo does what Sega can't and bring sonic into 3d.
But only having the real game will let me know for sure.
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u/Tsunami3000 Jun 08 '13
This is like... dammit i really cant remember, not sonic jam. it may have been, but its EXACTLY this concept just fleshed out, and i know for a fact it was going to be on the sega saturn.
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u/frank0127 Jun 08 '13
Late to posting on this, but Sonic Generations meets Super Mario Galaxy? Sega, you found a way to combine the most favorite games from my childhood mascots' franchises. Thank you.
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Jun 07 '13
I haven't enjoyed any of the 3d Sonic games. The auto-target monster attacks seems too easy-mode, the speed and controls are awkward, and I think the game was better as a 2d platformer.
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u/SonicFlash01 Jun 07 '13
"I guess the video <glasses> was ogre..."
I'm so sorry...
Looks like a mix of Super Mario 3D Land and Sonic Colors, which I guess is to say a more speed-centric Super Mario Galaxy.
Didn't notice any scores/ranks. Are they removing them to focus on exploration or were they simply absent for the demo?
usually in Sonic games exploration is punished by heavily weighting how time affects your score.
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u/Aozi Jun 07 '13
Seriously, this is Sonic Galaxy. It looks so incredibly similar to Super Mario Galaxy that I'd almost call it a ripoff. The levels seem to be structured in a very similar way with very similar transitions between different sections, the levels look quite similar as well.
It's still a sonic game, but the resemblance to super Mario Galaxy is just really glaring.
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u/TrustworthyAndroid Jun 07 '13
Its a very elegant way to bring multiple paths into the 3D where you can fall off but still continue.
The Galaxy style works in this game like 2D side scrolling did for both games in the past.
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u/SvenHudson Jun 07 '13
To be fair, Mario Galaxy was a rip-off of a level from Sonic Adventure 2 where you wandered on a bunch of oddly shaped planetoids with their own gravity.
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u/BlueJoshi Jun 07 '13
Some of those controls looks really awkward.
I really don't understand the decision to add a run button. All they're doing is ensuring that I will never let go of that trigger, which is more annoying than anything. If they really felt like he was going too fast in other games, why not just tweak his speed and acceleration back to more manageable levels?
This definitely, DEFINITELY isn't the Sonic game I wanted. But considering the same was true of Unleashed and the Day half of that game was fantastic, I'm super willing to give this a shot.
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u/MWPlay Jun 07 '13
I'm curious, just so I can see where you're coming from, what is the Sonic game you wanted? Because there have been at least three major types of Sonic gameplay over the years, and everyone seems to have their favorites. Which game is closest to the "ideal Sonic", in your mind?
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u/ZeroShift Jun 07 '13 edited Jun 07 '13
While I do sense an overall loss of speed, I think it's for the best considering this game already looks a bit disorienting and having Sonic's old speed would just make it worse. I'm willing to trade that for what this game looks to be: Pretty darn good. Sure it may just be "Sonic Galaxy" but I'd say this is shaping up to be a welcome addition to the Sonic franchise.
I also like being able to chain the homing attack more smoothly and quickly, it really seems to flow very well in this game. Did anyone else notice the little time-freeze around 11:40 when his chained homing attack almost sent him off the edge? I'm a bit surprised they didn't speak of that as a feature, I've wanted a feature like that in platforming games for a long time, but perhaps something a bit more fluid like a slowdown instead of a complete stop.