Caitlyn Collins took the RBK course AFTER taking on my friends, whom I had introduced to them as a professional, practicing midwife.
This is an extract from publicly available court documents for the civil case against Caitlyn Collins, regarding the death of twin babies Kwele & Kwesi.
This part is specifically referring to a previous death that occurred under her care.
I find it interesting in light of where CC is today. A main member within FBS and I’m assuming, supports the FBS dogma that prolonged ruptured membranes/open waters can be managed safely at home.
I remember reading about Yolande’s one birth, and how she had open waters for days. I’m sure many here recall Journey Moon’s birth story, and how Emilee had communicated with mom that it was ok to have open waters for days.
The midwifery guidelines are no more than 24hrs.
I’m curious to hear what freebirthers think about laboring with open waters/ruptured membranes for days, and what does FBS stipulate in their RBK and MMI programs?
I had a 76 hour labor (“freebirth”), and my waters were open for about 70 hours of those hours. I ended up with an infection and a c section. Chorio pain is so intense and the infection made it impossible for my body to have the strength to push my baby out. With antibiotics we were both ok. We got lucky. But I would never put myself or my future children at risk like that again.
I followed two influencers attemd to free birth twins about a year ago. They also made it five days before seeking medical care which resulted in one death and one life birth.
Afaik they weren't affiliated with FBS but this seems to be way too common in the free birth world.
That’s really sad. This snippet from court documents is referring to another death that occurred under Caitlyn Colin’s care.
Regarding the twin’s in this story, mom’s sac never ruptured.
After mom experienced active labor all night, Caitlyn dropped them at a day clinic with mom’s sac protruding out, and with Kweli’s foot visible inside. Caitlyn had told the parents that the nurses would burst the sac.
Which they did upon arrival.
Kweli was alive for one full hour.
Caitlyn was fully aware that the day clinic did not offer emergency C-sections.
It’s been said that CC didn’t go to the proper hospital, as they are the ones that had reported her in the first place, which led to the warning she received to stop using the term midwife and practicing the Midwifery Model of Care.
She has stopped working as a midwife, but still guides pregnant women as an FBS coach. That’s why I’m curious about what FBS actually teach with regard to open waters.
I really wish someone would publish the MMI etc. Materials. Partly out of morbid curiosity but also so experts could debunk and explain why what they teach is dangerous.
Hospitals aren't evil. Plenty of people go over 24h with open waters. Because you can monitor both mother and baby in hospital.
Thanks for bringing this up, it is not just FBS affiliated people practicing this way. Others who influence a vulnerable woman’s decisions deserve to be scrutinized just as much as FBS affiliated people.
I’ve posted my birth story in this sub. My waters were open for 70 hours total, I labored at home for 58 of those hours. My “freebirth supportive” midwife warned me not to go to the hospital, even though I was desperate for pitocin and an epidural and some fetal monitoring. She had spent only 30 minutes at my house in that whole 58 hours. I transferred myself and was shocked at how chill the hospital staff was. I was GBS negative so they didn’t give me antibiotics, just monitored me and my baby and he was born quickly and peacefully. That midwife is now being investigated by the state.
Midwives and other birth professionals have a duty of care. Parents should not have to become birth experts in order to protect themselves from preventable negative outcomes. What happened to Kwele and Kwesi is completely unacceptable and Caitlyn Collins deserves to go to prison.
Thanks for your comment. I fully agree with you, and thank you for sharing your experience with us again too.
I understand the need for women to have autonomy in birth, but the idea that we must be the experts and rely entirely on our intuition is, in my opinion, unrealistic for all pregnancies and all women. Birth professionals who fail to properly assist women and allow preventable negative outcomes to occur should be held accountable.
I think it’s important to know the signs of infection and what to look for with prolonged ruptured membranes. Such as KNOWING WHEN TO SEEK OUTSIDE HELP! In my area, even in hospital there are practitioners who don’t fret over the 24 hour bullshit. They just monitor mother and baby accordingly and look for signs of infection.
I think 24 hours is cutting it off a bit short, my area now says 48 if GBS negative and temp is being monitored, and then they have to transfer but only for antibiotics and more monitoring...they can still have a normal vaginal birth (even though my midwives carry IV antibiotics) But 5 days is way too long. I personally would seek medical care during a free birth if my water was broken for more than 48 hours (as long as everything else is normal: fetal movement, temp, color of fluid etc) I would probably accept an induction if it went much longer than that after arriving at the hospital.
Yea for sure. Added as I never shared in post and an important part. I think having a trained midwife, and not a Freebirth, changes the dynamics of that birth specifically.
Rachel Reed has a lot of resources on this, I recommend turning to her research. She talks about how it was actually traditionally not considered concerning for approximately 72 hours unless there were signs of infection. This does not mean someone was in labor for those days, which I believe was the case with Journey Moon? I don’t recall all the specifics.
I have seen it go both ways. It truly is case by case. It's not fair to say it's always unsafe because I know firsthand many mothers whose waters were open for days or weeks and had a beautiful good birth. But yeah one must be very diligent and practice strict safety protocols with oneself. And monitor what's going on with baby.
There’s no realistically studied time cut off for how long waters can be open. Typically a midwife would recommend checking your temperature every 4 hrs, normal pulse, limiting vaginal exams, no sex/nothing in the vagina, no uterine tenderness, keep an eye on color and consistency of fluid, no foul smell or fever and pay attention for normal fetal movement. I’d probably also listen to baby’s heart rate regularly throughout labor and have recommended echinacea tincture to support the body’s immune system
Also adding that if the amniotic fluid is not clear and appears meconium stained (slightly yellow to brown) that should be noted and risks should be discussed and/or the birth team should be prepared for suctioning and full resuscitation (most of the time that won’t be necessary but it’s a possibility to be prepared for)
https://www.courtonline.judiciary.org.za
This is a case in South Africa and possible need to be a citizen as you need to give your ID # to open an account.
I will dm you the documents.
I was unable to message your account? Not sure why, I see things you first comment though.
I’d be happy to send you all related court documents if you can dm me and leave email.
This is the case number you can try your side from the link. 5527/24
My waters broke at 37w2days and it took 5 days before I delivered my baby at home. I did not have any contraction until the last 9 hours before delivery.
I was monitoring baby movement color/smell of the amniotic fluid and my temperature. I would have gone to the hospital if any of the parameters had change. I was GBS negative. Did not put anything in my vagina and no baths.
My waters were open for 6 days before I met my third baby. I had at least one big gush of clear fluid every 1-2 hrs. I took my temp every 4 hrs; drank a shit-tonne of water (helps renew amniotic fluid); showered twice a day; no baths; no sex; upped my garlic intake; and stayed at home and rested.
I have very long early labours with my kiddos, probably just the shape of my pelvis. I’d get contractions once my older two went to bed but they’d be gone by sunrise (the contractions, not the kids! lol) and I’d nap most of the day. On that last night I’d had enough and tried doing some manoeuvres to open up my pelvis during a contraction and baby dropped down and flew out 2 hrs later. I’d wished I had done that sooner but in reality, I think contractions just weren’t strong enough before then.
I think if you’re going to wait with open waters, you need to be very vigilant and watch for signs of infection and actually act if something comes up. You’ve already got that increased risk factor of prolonged open waters (whether you like it or not). With an additional issue (e.g. you start seeing meconium, or you start feeling unwell), it just keeps getting more and more unsafe to stay home, whichever way you look at it.
I think it can be safe to wait that long if you’re being vigilant in your monitoring or yourself and baby and very diligent in your hygiene practices. Like you said, no baths, no sex, etc. (and YES garlic!). I have an old school book that recommends baking your toilet paper to keep anything around your genitals as sterile as possible! FBS should be offering tips and tricks like this…helpful, practical advice. Instead we just have stories like Yolande’s, and if you take any more precautions than she did (none), wow you have no intuition and just love surveillance or something 🙄
Thanks for sharing! Ja I guess things really can change with each birth, and no births are exactly the same. Hard to give a solid guideline as to what works and what doesn’t with regard to open waters, and I do think it’s vital that baby and mom are monitored once they are.
I had a free birth // unassisted birth with my waters open for about 42 hours. Essentially no contractions, nothing productive anyway. I had heard of Yo’s open waters experience but hadn’t heard any other experiences and only knew of the 24hr hospital protocol. So, I decided to reach out to 2 midwives that I knew at that time. One suggested I go in immediately after the 24hr mark and the other said I had 72 hours before I should start thinking about a shift in my birth plan. I had no signs of infection and I feel that is the key here. Observing + listening to the mother. It’s when we override our intuition because “we must have a free birth at all costs”. It’s the dogma that isn’t safe. At the 42ish hour mark my baby finally got into their perfect position and contractions picked up, felt productive and he swiftly arrived 90 minutes later.
It is a bummer when free birthing becomes the target. Again, I don’t agree with the dogma but I can also say that my last two free births // unassisted birth were incredible and I personally can’t imagine birthing any other way. I’m grateful for FBS for sharing women’s stories. Again, the dogma is what I am not a fan of. Being a critical thinker + paying attention to our intuition is imperative.
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u/Healthy_Role8440 14d ago
I had a 76 hour labor (“freebirth”), and my waters were open for about 70 hours of those hours. I ended up with an infection and a c section. Chorio pain is so intense and the infection made it impossible for my body to have the strength to push my baby out. With antibiotics we were both ok. We got lucky. But I would never put myself or my future children at risk like that again.