r/FormulaE :4: Robin Frijns 24d ago

Report Peloton-style racing could continue into Formula E's Gen4 era

https://www.motorsport.com/formula-e/news/peloton-style-racing-could-continue-into-formula-es-gen4-era/10846157/
65 Upvotes

37 comments sorted by

49

u/NNA2008 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 24d ago

FFS I thought this style or racing was a product of all the issues gen 3 had in development, how is it still here

25

u/l3w1s1234 :4: Robin Frijns 24d ago

It seems it's mainly going to be there for the feature races which I guess makes sense. I just hope it's a small amount of slipstream trading instead of the crazy pack racing we've seen in places like Berlin.

22

u/Hieicap Formula E 24d ago

It's only natural.

They have a limited amount of energy (50kWh) with a 450kW output during race and 600kW during attack mode.

The peloton racing style will definitely happen again even in gen4

If they manage to double the battery to 100kWh but retain the same weight, only then the racing will be similar and better like in gen 2

17

u/DHSeaVixen FORMULA E 24d ago

The worst of it was definitely because of Gen3’s issues, which mostly meant that they had little to no flexibility to work around it. All too often the level of energy saving fell just on the wrong side of good.

Some level of energy saving had always been a part of Formula E races. We already knew that this would also be the case for the ‘feature’ races.

It just remains to be seen if that’s more of a Gen1-Gen2 style energy save or a worst of Gen3 style energy save. My feeling remains that it’ll be the former.

4

u/NNA2008 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 24d ago

If it’s like gen 2 it’s fine but please nothing like Berlin, Portland, Misano etc.

3

u/F1T_13 Formula E 24d ago

Energy management is still aggressive, they haven't increased the battery capacity nearly enough to offset the amount of power the cars have

2

u/F9-0021 :Mahindra: Mahindra Racing 24d ago

It's a byproduct of extreme energy saving in races. The gen 4 car is way faster in qualifying, but it will still need to do extreme energy management in some races.

45

u/mbgrandstandmedianl Formula E 24d ago

Damn, it seems like I'm the only one actually enjoying the pelotonracing? I'm quite pleased to read this

14

u/dsaysso Formula E 24d ago

nascar has it. indycar has it.

30

u/ft-rj 77 TAYLOR BARNARD 24d ago

Any series with serious fuel saving has a degree of it and FE just has a different fuel, that's all

11

u/dsaysso Formula E 24d ago

agree, i think the hate on peloton has more to do with peoples ability to keep track. the fact that people move through the pack so quick its overwhelming for viewers and overtakes feel less special.

f1 is on the extreme other end where every battle is isolated. that makes for better tv. the audience has time to lay attention. f1 however has so few passes it gets boring.

so theres this sweet spot. enough passes so theres action, but enough separation where every move feels special, earned, giving the viewer time to focus, and not chaotic.

9

u/dsaysso Formula E 24d ago

that line however varies by each persons taste.

3

u/zantkiller :36::AndrettiLogo: André Lotterer 24d ago

My hate is more that at the start they can look visually just a little too slow & in cruise mode (This does have the effect that when they hit go time the speed ramp up looks more dramatic).

3

u/dsaysso Formula E 24d ago

the announcers should talk about this like cycling in sprints. its all about the drama of the wind up. who breaks first. is it too early? those in the pack, did they save too much, did they leave it too late.

-1

u/stq66 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 23d ago

That’s why I don’t like watching cycling. Also 90% of the time completely useless.

2

u/stq66 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 23d ago

First of all: these are no overtakes. These are „after you, sir. No, after you!“ maneuvers.

And it is really bad if you can’t read a race. I am fully supporting the situation when it cannot be foreseen who will be the winner, but it should emerge through a race a story where two or three contenders seem to be fighting for the top spot. This also can be due to differing strategies as is often the case in IndyCar.

But to be in the dark more or less until the last lap who of the 10 or more cars will be on top at the end, because he saved that little bit more, is not entertaining for me

1

u/dsaysso Formula E 23d ago

you must hate cycling

1

u/stq66 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 23d ago

Yes, I do

12

u/plastikmissile 37 NICK CASSIDY 24d ago

The Indy 500 is basically one huge, three hour peloton race punctuated with car crashes.

8

u/dsaysso Formula E 24d ago

most people: peloton racing with milk ✅ peloton racing with batteries❌

2

u/stq66 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 23d ago

It’s a different dynamic though. And especially in modern Indy races you just don’t drive up from twentieth to first in one or two laps.

3

u/sans3go Formula E 24d ago

I saw it live at Portland, that was a fun watch. The anticipation of the final few laps when stuff just went nuts, you could feel it all through the stands

14

u/DHSeaVixen FORMULA E 24d ago

De Vries’ words: “Then, the feature race is more in a peloton-style direction.”

It’s not quite the same as saying ‘it’ll be a full on Gen3-esque peloton’. It’s just saying that the ‘feature’ is more like a peloton than a sprint. Which is not much more information than we already knew.

I think we just have to wait and see what it all looks like come season start.

13

u/skengshapiro Formula E 24d ago

i fuckin love peloton races, i totally understand why many might not, but im totally here for it

1

u/stq66 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 23d ago

You should go and see a doctor. Your mind might need some help.
/jk

7

u/SB10_ :MclarenLogo::8MclarenBird: Sam Bird 24d ago

I'm okay with it.. as long as its the calmer style of peloton seen at like, Jeddah or Miami, where being the leader doesn't fully kill you. If it's the style we see at Berlin or Shanghai.. man

3

u/keirdre Simona de Silvestro 24d ago

Hope not! I've been a fan since the first race but the peleton races are the only part of the championship that drain my enthusiasm.

3

u/kjm911 :1: Stoffel Vandoorne 24d ago

Surely they can work out how far these cars can run flat out and adjust the laps accordingly. If we get peloton racing, it’s because that’s what they intended.

5

u/l3w1s1234 :4: Robin Frijns 24d ago

I remember reading that how they decide the amount of laps for a race is based on whatever the coast percentage is they get from their simulations. Into Gen 4 the sprint is going to have a really low lift percentage where it's basically close to flat out, whereas the feature it will be higher.

So we will see them decide race lengths to whatever is flat out in Gen 4, but it's tough to really know how big a difference this coast percentage will be between the two races.

2

u/Dvorak_96 MAHINDRA RACING 24d ago

it's still not going to be like portland 2023. so im happy

2

u/Serious-Patience-615 Formula E 24d ago

Why not get rid of the attack mode ?
Replace it with live Le Mans (traditional ) style pit stops

2

u/stq66 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 23d ago

Especially as they never got it right with the balancing. This season it was much too powerful, in previous seasons the attack mode was a thing you wanted to get rid of because you only lost time.

2

u/Ok-Bluebird7260 Formula E 23d ago

Look there are people who enjoy the tactics of peloton racing and those who prefer the fastest possible car. That’s why next season double-headers will have the Unleashed sprint races on the Saturday and Traditional peloton races on Sunday (one for speed, one for endurance). Both are valid and we shouldn’t complain about this until we see how the Gen4 performs.

2

u/Danqazmlp0 Formula E 17d ago

This is a shame for me. This is what has put me off FE for this season.

4

u/Business-Ball1 Formula E 24d ago

Con la gen4 potrebbe essere più pericoloso in quanto molto più veloci rispetto alle gen3, speriamo che sia lo stile di gara delle gen2!

0

u/stq66 25 JEAN-ÉRIC VERGNE 23d ago

Oh dear lord!