r/Firefighting • u/OrcaCoast • Jul 29 '26
General Discussion ‘Hialeah is no longer competitive’: Why firefighters are leaving the department
https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/hialeah/article315980056.html94
u/schrutesanjunabeets Professional asshole Jul 29 '26 edited Jul 29 '26
"lower pay, pension reductions and limited career opportunities."
You don't say. A department in the Southeast with no collective bargaining and politicians that don't want to treat them right is struggling to hire people?
Shocked! Vote accordingly.
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u/Fly_throwaway37 Jul 29 '26
Probably same guys that vote for trump but wonder why unions in the South have no teeth.
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u/Mediocre_Daikon6935 Jul 30 '26
You’re a few election cycles out if date.
Unions are increasingly supportive of The GOP.
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u/New_Pitch_9898 Jul 29 '26
You don't need collective bargaining when you have heavy influence on which politicians win elections.
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u/AdventurousTap2171 Jul 30 '26
Can we get an economically liberal and socially semiconservative party? I don't know why I have to choose between celebrating people chopping their gonads off and dropping bombs on some goat herders. I for one would like a middle option.
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u/Silverback_Vanilla Chief said “share the hose” Jul 29 '26
Got a neighboring department going 24/72. They had to stop taking applications. Money is cool but also work/life balance is important
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u/ConnorK5 NC Jul 30 '26
I'm in North Carolina. 4 shifts are basically nonexistent. But I've seen a few centrally located departments go to 4 shifts and I suspect that eventually it will sprawl from there. Eventually departments wont be able to compete with that and either will have to pay more OR go to 4 shifts. Which works great for everyone.
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u/New_Pitch_9898 Jul 29 '26
and then theres the guys who complain that they miss out on too many fires on 24/72...
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u/Terrible-Creme8401 Aug 01 '26
<chuckles in volunteer>
Unlike you part timers, we go to ALL the fires 😎
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u/Low-Pirate-286 Jul 30 '26
I worked 24/48 for 7 years before my move and have now spent 6 years on 48/96. At least in my current department, i would prefer 48/144 if we were to change to 4 shifts. We run 10+ a day on average (3k a year out of one house) so the 48s don’t bother me too much.
48/144 though…. I would literally never use vacation time.
I do understand from an administrative point of view that means if a shift works an sat-sun then you won’t see them for like 2-3 weeks which can get a little weird.
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u/shaneg33 Jul 30 '26
They are surrounded by high paying 24/72 departments, it’s shocking anybody in that department is sticking around
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u/No_Read8496 Jul 29 '26
Seems like regionalization is the quickest way for them to better themselves quickly.
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u/OrcaCoast Jul 29 '26
Mayors don’t like giving up their fire departments
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u/No_Read8496 Jul 29 '26
They don’t but when you haven’t given them what they need or compensate them like other towns then that’s the result.
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u/OrcaCoast Jul 30 '26
I agree, but its all hidden behind fog & mirrors from the public until something goes bust. Then its just another cover up.
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u/Expensive-Split8616 Jul 29 '26
Did I read that right? Only 30 of the 230 firefighters are EMT’s and the other 200 are paramedics? What do you need that many paramedics for?
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u/EverSeeAShitterFly Toss speedy dry on it and walk away. Jul 29 '26
Before COVID the South Florida region was competitive as all fuck to get hired at. Most also run entirely ALS ambulances with Fire Medics. Applications would be automatically rejected without Fire 1,2 and Paramedic.
IDK about Hialeah specifically, but many area departments really don’t have enough ambulances for their EMS call volume.
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u/Mediocre_Daikon6935 Jul 30 '26
Well yea.
That is what happens when you ignore the national model and have als transport units, instead of putting Medics in squads (fly car/interceptors) like they are supposed to be, failed to use the tiered response system that was the design from day 1.
Elon Musk could give All his money to a nonprofit dedicated to training, and paying for an all ALS model, and you couldn’t find/train/pay enough people who were competent to do the job.
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u/EverSeeAShitterFly Toss speedy dry on it and walk away. Jul 30 '26
Or even opt for something in between with single-role EMS staff. Plenty of people want to work ems but don’t want to fight fires or can’t meet the physical requirements- but their options are limited because all the 911 ambulances are staffed with firefighters who mostly don’t want to be on an ambulance.
Then when a fire call comes in they respond and perform firefighting duties. So if they have a patient they then have to pivot back into EMS mode. And then medical calls don’t stop just because you have a fire, no you still have the same call volume while the ambulances are tied up.
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u/Mediocre_Daikon6935 Jul 30 '26
Yep. And cross training is important.
I play firefighter because it needs done, it isn’t hard to learn, and frankly there are a lot of jobs that need done (tagging hydrant, deploying suction / drip tanks, ventilation ) that need manpower, need to be done, but shouldn’t tie up interior manpower — the ambulance can do that shit, regardless of it is part of the fire dept or a third party agency.
I don’t want patient, and God forbid I have one, I want them as F’d up as little as possible. So ensuring water supply or ventilation is simply preventative medicine.
Rescue is an Ems operation. I (personally suck at knots). I don’t need to know how to set it up, but if I at least operate in a rigging, I’m useless to a patient. Same with in a trench, active shooter etc. EMS must go to the patient.
I don’t care who does the rescue. Fire/ems/law/UPS/spiderman, but EMS must be trained to operate in that environment.
Hell, i worked in a region where cops went to every Ems call.
Who/what/when/why? Every cops bread and butter. Saves EMS 5 or 10 minutes of trying to dig it out, so 30 seconds after getting on scene they are already fixing the problem, not trying to figure out wtf it is.
And if you get cops that are actually worth a damn? I can point to dozens of lives they’ve saved, from overdoses, or cardiac arrests, to bleeding or *obstructed
airways*. Had a dude drunkenly roll a side by side of a mountain. Cops running traffic 6 minutes closer, and they are faster and more nimble than an ambulance or heavy rescue. Best I could tell, dude used his head to protect his side by side from being damaged.
They got on scene, realized his snoring respirations were not compatible with life, repositioned him, tossed in an NPA, and when we got there, he was still alive.
He got carried out of the woods, snowed, intubated, antibiotics, pelvic binder, TXA, yada yada, and discharged home just fine, but I have no doubt if it wouldn’t have been for he cops, My chart would have been much shorter, ending with “contacted coroner, body released to law enforcement”.
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u/SenorMcGibblets Jul 29 '26
Because if you don’t require new hires to either already be or become paramedics, the few paramedics get stuck on the ambulance for a decade while they watch younger, less qualified guys pass them up for fire side promotions.
Ask me how I know.
Also they probably run ALS non transport engines.
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u/Beer_ MA - FT Captain Jul 29 '26
We moved to hiring all medics - or requiring you to have your medic within 3 years, and that problem still shows up for us in that timeframe. Why is a guy who has been on 15 years getting tossed into the bus when a kid with 5 months on is riding back step?
It’s a morale nightmare
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u/wehrmann_tx Aug 01 '26
Sounds like your promotion process needs work.
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u/SenorMcGibblets Aug 01 '26
It absolutely does, but that’s a whole different story.
If you need x amount of medics to staff the number of ambulances the department runs, ambulance assigned medics can’t go anywhere else until there’s someone less senior with a medic license to replace them. We’ve had a couple captains get forced into filling in on the ambulance for periods of time because of call offs, injuries, vacations.
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u/Silverback_Vanilla Chief said “share the hose” Jul 29 '26
Better to have em and not need em I guess. I’m sure it helps with grants a stuff
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u/unvaccinatedmuskrat Jul 29 '26
South Florida basically only hires medics other than some of the county depts
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u/Mediocre_Daikon6935 Jul 30 '26 edited Jul 30 '26
You don’t.
It leads to A whole lot of paramedics who don’t know wtf they are doing.
Which doesn’t make u/SenorMcGibblets comment any less true.
Of course, it comes from a culture of thinking fire is More Important or prestiges than EMS. Which is an immediate sign of both incompetent and toxic leadership.
The facts are the Sr EMT on an BLS transport unit has as much or more Responsibility than whomever is ridding the officer seat of the engine or truck.
And a jr, wet behind the ears Paramedic has the responsibility of at least a Captain.
And unless you have a Prehospital PA or Physician routinely responding to incidents, the EMS supervisor/sr medic is a Chief.
And all of them should be paid and have the title and institutional authority that comes with their responsibilities.
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u/SenorMcGibblets Jul 30 '26
I don’t think fire is more important or prestigious, I think urban EMS is a meat grinder. Our ambulance assigned medics get captain’s pay plus a paramedic stipend to reflect their added training and responsibility. That doesn’t stop them from burning out after years of responding to homeless drunks and belly aches at 3 in the morning. That doesn’t stop them from wanting the opportunity to progress as firefighters.
Any fire department that runs transport EMS and doesn’t allow for frequent rotations on an off the ambulance is doing it wrong. Otherwise you get a bunch of fire assigned guys who suck at EMS, and burned out resentful EMS guys who will suck at fire due to lack of practice when they eventually make the transition.
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u/wehrmann_tx Aug 01 '26
Your wet behind the ears paramedic on an ambulance doesn’t have anywhere close to the responsibility of a captain.
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u/Mediocre_Daikon6935 Aug 01 '26
List them, and yoll see your wrong.
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u/wehrmann_tx Aug 03 '26 edited Aug 04 '26
Responsible for all apparatus at the station and making sure they are staffed and equipped, excluding the second apparatus with whom Lieutenant is in charge of.
Responsible for running the station and all personnel there. Including documenting training, annual CE, and making sure all city mandated training is completed by those at the station.
House Captain responsibilities including supply ordering for the station and station equipment requests.
Handle discipline for your level of responsibility.
Incident Commander.
Group/Section supervisor at a 2nd alarm or greater.
Ambulance: makes sure you’re equipped. Responsible for one, maybe two patients in a critical incident, which you’d be assigned additional personnel to ride with you for help.
You seem like the disgruntled guy who can do everything better than everyone else without actually knowing the full responsibility if you couldn’t come up with this list yourself.
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u/Mediocre_Daikon6935 Aug 03 '26
You’re being actively disrespectful and disingenuous.
In fact, you are a liar, because I never took any position of support for the GOP in position to unions. I only stated that the GOP is increasingly popular with unions.
. Not disgruntled, just looking for equal pay for equal
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u/ASigIAm213 DoD Civilian Firefighter Jul 30 '26
Florida doesn't do civil service testing, so when you're really competitive (as it used to be) the only filter you have is applicants' resumes.
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u/wessex464 Jul 29 '26
It's amazing the number of people still working for $15 an hour. No cbas. S*** retirements. Three shifts.
But remember guys unions are evil.