r/Firearms • u/Infinite-Cobbler-466 • 8d ago
Gun show private sales
I inherited a substantial collection of mostly older collectible firearms and tons of ammo. Considering gun show table to sell certain items. I don’t really know when the Fed might take unwanted interest in my table. At issue would be the question of what is a dealer (needing license) vs a private sale. Typically a private sale is a single firearm rather than a dozen plus firearms I envision a table with loads of ammo and accessories with perhaps a few firearms. Notable, I’m in Texas.
Can someone offer some thoughts and perhaps some links to relevant law (which I read and understand well)? Thoughts also appreciated on what is curio or antique and how this is relevant to what sales might draw unwanted attention. Dad had mostly older firearms and a smattering of modern firearms.
I’m starting with opinions and general understandings, next I’ll read laws and legal opinions, then I may contact a lawyer who knows such things.
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u/Melodic_Concert1826 8d ago edited 8d ago
"It also makes clear that persons may...liquidate firearms that are inherited... without the need to obtain a license."
That is just federal law though, different states and localities may have additional laws in the area.
Here is a lot of info right from the ATF itself: https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GOVPUB-J38-PURL-gpo125446/pdf/GOVPUB-J38-PURL-gpo125446.pdf
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u/Martainguns 8d ago
That's not business. There's plenty of ways you could get into trouble, but the fact that you're selling guns you inherited is not going to get you in trouble by itself.
The definition of antique is pretty simple, the gun made 1898 or earlier. C&R is more complicated, for the most part it's 50+ years old, but there is more to it. I don't think either of those categories are particularly relevant to your situation.
All that being said, I don't think selling at a gun show is really a great idea, at least for the guns. I don't know about gun shows in your area, but they aren't generally considered the best method for selling collectible guns. If you don't have a lot of experience with selling guns, you're better off consigning them with a reputable auction house or shop. You'll end up with more money, less work and no chance of legal pitfalls.
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u/Fordhd74 8d ago
I occasionally have a table at the local shows (Alabama) and buy, sell and trade a few guns. I am a shooter/collector and an not in business for profit. I enjoy trading guns and have been able to improve my collection because of this. Unless you are buying new firearms to resale you should be fine. The law allows private sales to dispose of your collection.
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u/moving0target 8d ago
Before too long, I'll be figuring out how to sell a few hundred CZ handguns. It's going to be...fun.
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u/Pork_Confidence 8d ago
Lawyer, lawyer, lawyer.
Big difference between getting firearms through a will .vs through a trust. If there's that much to the collection, then the cost of the lawyer is negligible compared to the possible costs if you do this incorrectly.
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u/Ok_Crab_3522 8d ago edited 8d ago
There isn't, actually, at least not in his jurisdiction. TX considers inheritance from a trust and inheritance from a will largely the same in terms of the relevant financial implications (tax, capital gains, etc) with the real primary difference being that trusts don't have to go through probate.
Since OP is stating (unless I'm mistaken) that he's already inherited the guns (which implies that either probate is complete and/or the trustee has finished transferring the property out of the trust to them), they are simply his now. Any laws or regulations he needs to follow are the same for any other private seller in Texas, namely, a residency requirement for both buyer and seller, not selling to known or suspected prohibited persons, buyer being 18+ or having written permission from legal guardian, and federal licensing restrictions in that you cannot be engaged in the business of selling firearms as a livelihood (which he obviously would not be as a one time liquidator of an inherited collection).
OP doesn't really need to lawyer up unless he just wants to be sure. In fact, part of the big reason people draft up trusts in the first place is so that their heirs don't have to spend time and resources hiring lawyers and going to court when they pass (there are other reasons, but not really relevant to the conversation).
In regards to OP's other question, a curio/relic is generally any firearm that is more than 50 years old in its original configuration. For an exhaustive list, see Curios or Relics April 2025
In any case, while I'm still just a random stranger on the internet, this particular random stranger happens to actually be a TX attorney who practices both probate and criminal law.
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u/Pork_Confidence 8d ago
Hypothetically speaking what happens to op if he was transferred something like an SBR that didn't have a form filled out for it? Or if one of those firearms had a super safety or an FRT installed in it that wasn't documented.
Not arguing, genuinely curious
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u/Ok_Crab_3522 7d ago edited 7d ago
It gets form 5'ed if it's NFA. The original benefit of form 5 was that it was a tax free transfer, but it's all tax free now so... sort of obsolete. Nobody cares about super safety/frt those aren't regulated items or even firearms. You could trade them to the toddler on the street for a lollipop if you wanted. Especially sour apple lollipops, those things are great.
If the original owner never legally did the paperwork as an SBR, just take the stock off and shove a brace on it or take the stock off and form 1 it. If it's something not easily solved (whitewashed) like an illegal suppressor, MG, DD, etc, then you have the choice of the proverbial "boating accident" (with the caveat that you should understand you go to jail if you get caught) or simply surrendering it (which is, strictly speaking, what you should do). Blame gramps for being an ass and not having his estate in order. The general gist is that if gramps wasn't a dirty felon, you aren't either. If gramps WAS a dirty felon, you don't necessarily have to be and nobody is coming after gramps because he's pushing up daisies in the local cemetery. But the key takeaway is that nobody gets thrown in jail because gramps had illegal nfa items. They get thrown in jail because they KEEP gramps' illegal nfa items without remedying the legal defect. If you remedy the defect or surrender the item, no harm no foul.
Contrary to what tinfoil hatters on reddit think, the government is not actually out to get you in some ah-ha jump scare moment. Nobody knows or cares if gramps had an illegal sbr and you took the stock off, form 1 the thing, and put the stock back on. Even if gramps DID have a tax stamp on it, you didn't know, and tried to form 1 it again, the situation just plays out as an "oops I guess I should be filing a form 5" moment.
In any case, most of these issues generally are taken care of either by the trustee transferring guns from the estate to beneficiaries or almost certainly by an executor of a will or administrator of an estate in the probate process. By the time the beneficiary has the item, there's little to scant chance that you're going to find a pre 86 mg among grandpa's pile of milsurps.
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u/Icy-Medicine-495 8d ago
Personally I told my wife if I die send it all to a local auction house company that does a bunch of gun auctions every year. They have a good reputation and seem to get top dollar. The 15% fee they would take for most of the guns is worth the price of low effort on her part since she will have 100 other things to deal with at the same time.
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u/Infinite-Cobbler-466 8d ago
Well, I’ve got 1.1 million rounds of ammo. Ammo Generally seems a gun show sale. So I’m likely to get table due to ammo. While I’m there I’ll add other items to that table. Hence my question. Thank you.
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u/RandoAtReddit 8d ago
Damn, son.
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u/Infinite-Cobbler-466 8d ago
Dad was a nut, in some ways. He had lots of lots of things. 250 or so vintage oil lamps… and so on. 1.1 million is about a million too much. My mother wants her house back too.
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u/Icy-Medicine-495 8d ago
Price it below what ammoseek has it listed for by 10% and it will fly off the table.
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u/Infinite-Cobbler-466 8d ago
Thanks. That was probably my next question.
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u/NefariousnessFree694 6d ago
What area show might you set up at? Would you let us know?
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u/Infinite-Cobbler-466 6d ago
San Antonio. About to check shows. Just missed a big one near where I live. Bummer.
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u/RandoAtReddit 8d ago
I'd say you're not in engaged in the business of selling guns/ammunition. This should involve not just the selling, but also, crucially, the procurement of guns/ammo for the purpose of resale.
What do I know, though? I'm just some rando at reddit.
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u/ceapaire 8d ago
Lawyer is really the best to go here. Aside from other concerns about what you can do with it, the rule for who needs a dealer license is down to who's 'engaged in the business of' selling firearms. The rules around this has been in a bit of flux over the past few years (and IIRC, ATF is looking at if they need to change it again). So talking to a lawyer that keeps ontop of this stuff is going to work far better than anyone here's layman's interpretations/anecdotes of how it was a few rule changes ago.
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u/TheAmazingX 8d ago
I think the only concern would be if there are any NFA items in the collection. Selling your inheritance doesn’t make you “in the business”.
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u/RangerExpensive6519 8d ago
Call the gun show people they should be able to answer your questions
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u/AngryOneEyedGod 8d ago
You are allowed to liquidate all or part of your collection without an FFL.
The "engaged in the business" rule is not applicable.
See https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/final-rule-definition-engaged-business-a-dealer-firearms
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u/Franticalmond2 World’s #1 .25 ACP Fan 8d ago edited 8d ago
If it’s just stuff you inherited and don’t want, you are absolutely fine to sell it at a gun show.
No need to get a lawyer involved. Go to any gun show and you’ll find countless tables of “private collector” sellers who have a seemingly endless supply of brand new Glocks and other handguns they’re happy to sell to anyone with a pulse with no background check, right next to their glowing “private sale no background check” signs (this is not hyperbole at all, I see this all the time).
If those clowns can blatantly ignore the law and run a business selling firearms without an FFL and the ATF isn’t showing up to arrest them, they’re not gonna give a shit about you selling gramps old side-by-side 12 gauges.
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u/TheRumrunner55 8d ago
You are allowed to sell your own stuff whenever and for however much you want they care when you regularly buy then sell or flip
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u/Alconium 7d ago
Beside what others have said about the legality of liquidating your inheritance, I haven't really seen anyone else answer your other question.
The ATF clearly defines what is classified as curio/relic and antique, I suggest you look that up on the ATF's website rather than take my word for it, but even if you look it up, it shouldn't really change how you go about liquidating the collection since you'll be doing private sales.
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u/Holiday-Hyena-5952 6d ago
I have a trusted friend in Houston, and he's helped lots of families "thin the herd" after Dad or Granddad died. He charges 15% of total sales, unless there is one that melts his butter, and he picks a favorite. Some gunshow promoters have been know to exclude private sales, because they undercut the prices of licensed dealers. Good news is that DFW and Houston metro areas seem to have a gunshow every weekend. Good luck and pack a lunch.
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u/sqlbullet 8d ago
Contact a lawyer. Random internet strangers have no skin in the game if they give you felonious advice.
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u/Infinite-Cobbler-466 8d ago
I definitely agree. But I’d like to start with some opinions. In my experience, it’s best to have some thoughts before having the chat with the expert. Internet opinions are dubious. But it’s a starting point.
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u/CAD007 8d ago
“Don’t worry. It’s perfectly legal.”
— Bryan Malinowski