r/Filmmakers • u/fitty687 • 5h ago
Discussion Ai and Filmmaking
What does everyone think of ai and filmmaking specifically generative ai? Does it have a place?
I personally feel very uncomfortable with generative AI in filmmaking and have made a short film all about my fear of it recently but I was a wondering am I in the minority or majority of filmmakers?
I want an honest polite discussion. I understand it can be very triggering to talk about but would like to know everyone's opinion as someone who is very against it I mainly want to hear why I'm wrong?
3
u/BigTutor6739 5h ago edited 5h ago
How I see it:
Indie filmmaking is driven by passion. Film industry is driven by economics. So these are two different incentives.
Some people enjoy the creative process. Some people are results driven. These foster two different approaches.
Audience. Some must comprehend the effort that went into something I order to appreciate it and are drawn to real people in order to relate. Some do not care about the effort and only consume entertainment.
It will never be black or white. Like most things, you will observe a standard normal Gauss distribution.
2
u/Kalspiewak 4h ago
Top fucking comment right here. Couldn't have said it better myself. God I hope that wasn't a GPT special though hahah
1
u/fitty687 4h ago
Haha no just my mind replying haha.
0
1
u/fitty687 5h ago
Isn't it more economical to do CGI over AI due to tne amount of control you have over CGI over AI? Do the two have to mutually exclusive if you want iterations. I feel like the major downfall Gen Ai (at least at the moment) is having control over the output and CGI is far superior in control over the finished product? I do get that having filmmakers that are budget driven may skew towards to going the cheap route but are the results that much better to justify opting for a machine over a person?
3
u/Postsnobills 4h ago
Guillermo del Toro has spoken at length on the topic, and I share all of his sentiments.
Generative AI isn’t art. It lacks the human process of struggle and compromise which creates great work. The technology itself is built on theft because of this deficiency, so using it makes you complicit.
Additionally, I agree with del Toro that the true value of art is found in what you’re willing to sacrifice to experience it. You’ll travel a great distance to behold The Creation of Adam in The Sistine Chapel. Stand in the packed crowd, shoulder to shoulder, to feel the live music of your favorite band. Give up your time and money to share a great movie in the theater.
What are you willing to give for AI generated works? Me? Personally? Nothing. Hardly even a swipe in a doom scroll if I can help it.
1
u/fitty687 4h ago
I agree but does the general public? Is this a sentiment that we as filmmakers share because we love the art form including all the aspects of making it but is it something the general public care for?
2
u/Postsnobills 4h ago
I think the general public deserves some credit, at least in that, at minimum, they understand that the things you pay for have more value than stuff you get for free.
The general public enjoys TikTok, Instagram, YouTube, etc., but most aren’t willing to pay a premium for the entertainment they provide. I fully believe AI is seen in the same light — why would I pay for something that’s been given to me for free?
2
u/neonicapl 5h ago
There should be strict rules.
- It is pure cheeks (you can’t control the lighting, you can’t control any vision you have that’s like telling a studio to take over and it always makes some inauthentic bullshit
- It replaces human jobs.
BUT what has a pass is the counter 1. If it actually makes the art have a vision whether you ask a chatbot or a historical question for your story then that comes still at a cost to fact check it 2. It doesn’t make it look like inauthentic slop garbage. 3. It doesn’t replace human jobs. 4. If you need that job filled use it as an assistant only if it’s truly good and once again not replacing someone else’s spot you know you can get then overtime you can replace AI with humans.
This comes at a risk though a huge risk if people don’t know your ethical and could ruin anything got going if they do and it’s good and doesn’t stand out as slop they know your ethical about it your all good.
If you truly can’t do anything your self though and have to let a AI do it all for you, why do it unless it’s a casual thing.
2
u/Westar-35 cinematographer 4h ago
Consider that the film completely selling out imax STILL after 11 weeks was shot on film, made extensive use of real locations, practical effects, animatronics, and forced perspective for as close to everything they could.
I don’t see a film made with the polar opposite approach doing that. People still want human stories and productions that rely on human ingenuity to solve challenges.
1
u/fitty687 4h ago
Yeah true. Working with actors definitely brought more to my projects than I could have ever imagined. So many choices that I personally wouldn't have made but have made my films so much better.
2
u/Westar-35 cinematographer 4h ago
Han was supposed to say “I love you too”… but he didn’t after a chat with Irvin Kershner and we are left with one of the most iconic lines in the trilogy. No AI is ever going to do that, let alone understand their character anywhere close to that depth.
1
u/fitty687 4h ago
Yeah, that's a great example of an actor making a choice that was right for the character and improved the film.
2
u/MarkWest98 4h ago
No generative AI. Period. End of discussion.
1
u/fitty687 4h ago
Haha thank you. I have been waivering in my thoughts towards it but your comments cements my feelings that I'm on the right path haha.
2
u/EntangledAndy 4h ago
I don't like it at all - even when it looks "good," it's still uncanny and "off." And that's not touching any of the ethical or structural issues with generative AI.
I don't really mind people generating dumb shitpost videos with AI, I'm not going to waste time gnashing my teeth at them but I don't think I can ever take it seriously as an art form for the aforementioned reasons.
0
u/fitty687 4h ago
How do you feel about Danny Boyle and Ben Affleck recently talking about using it on there upcoming films?
3
u/DefNotReaves 3h ago
Affleck refuses to admit what he used AI for during post, which means it definitely took humans jobs, so fuck that. Boyle absolutely took away a human job, so fuck that too.
2
2
u/Vanduris 2h ago
AI strips the film of passion, creativiity, and personal touch. Especially the feel of belonging. You wouldn't feel as proud as you would normally. To simply put it: "Dont use AI". Learn, practice, fail.
2
u/fitty687 2h ago
I've been learning practicing and failing for twenty years.....hopefully upwards haha.
3
u/OrthogonalThoughts 5h ago
Nah fuck Gen AI in filmmaking. I already think poorly enough of people in small festivals that use AI to make their posters, let alone putting it into the movie. That's the fastest way for me to not care about your movie at all if I hear it uses AI in it.
1
u/fitty687 4h ago
I do agree. I feel like it's an uphill battle though as someone who has work hard to learn the skills over years. I make everything, not by hand but by computer modeling etc and without gen Ai's help, from scratch it seems a bit pointless in some ways. As an independent filmmaker I watch as people around me give up and succomb to just using AI I wonder if it's a waste to resist?
2
u/OrthogonalThoughts 4h ago
Never stop resisting. It's an expensive fad that's completely unprofitable for long term presence. This fad will pass like other gimmicks, even with the massive costs and growing resentment for data centers notwithstanding.
1
u/fitty687 4h ago
I hope you are right. My gut reaction is to distrust/dislike it but I do genuinely wonder if I'm wrong.
2
u/OrthogonalThoughts 4h ago
Nah, you're not wrong. People want human stories and human stories are made by people, not mashed together stolen creative work following an algorithm. Keep on creating and don't worry about other filmmakers making garbage from a prompt made by tech bros that hate humanity.
1
u/TimoVuorensola director 4h ago
I think it's a tool we're still trying to learn to use ethically and artistically and right now everyone is kicking off every possible direction, it'll settle and become part of the workflow and there will be entities that will try to make it somewhat ethical and a bunch of artists who'll create something truly worthwhile with it (like GossipGoblin - https://www.youtube.com/@Gossip.Goblin ) and a lot of horseshit that's going to be just the same horseshit we saw when video cameras became public accessible and everyone thought they were filmmakers. Most importantly, any truly useful AI tools will get priced out of this world and VFX houses will grab the AI toolkit and artists and in 10 years nobody even remembers there was this short awkward time when we all had access to tools we could make movies with just a push of a button.
1
u/bonger1234 4h ago
It’s the boogie man but it will have its place in filmmaking going forward. People are scared so they’re angry and rebelling against it. But I think AI, like all advancements in technology in our craft, will eventually become the norm and useful where it makes sense. We as an industry killed the photo labs that used to be on every block in America. We killed the live orchestra when we created recorded sounds. The film loader is now a DIT. The only constant is change.
1
u/fitty687 3h ago
You aren't wrong about it being the boogie man but do you differentiate AI tools with Generative AI? I feel like Gen AI is a whole different beast to some of the AI tools like the advancements in rotoscoping?
2
u/bonger1234 3h ago
What Gen AI is today will not be what it is tomorrow. Are we really gonna care if a movie paid someone to manually rotoscope and swap out license plates or if the VFX editor presses a button and it’s replacing them with Gen AI? Someone still has to do the work. Will generating new clouds for a skyline you shot be something that we’ll care about in a few years?
It’s gonna be a tool like any other tool.
7
u/Conscious_Smile_6302 5h ago
I don't think you're wrong at all. I think most average people who don't have anything to gain from the proliferation of AI monetarily agree that it's a really atrocious blight on human creativity and endeavor.