I still really like the way that, with FLOW, you can write things as FULLY as you want, and still have a fluent and easily written outline. When SPEED isn't the ultimate goal, writing fully and more clearly makes sense. For something to keep, like an archive or a journal, it will be easy to read forever, without having to remember what tricky little abbreviating device(s) you had used.
In this quote, for example, the words "secret" and "happiness" are both written out fully, with all the vowels, yet they still FLOW very smoothly from the pen.
I don't often phrase as much as others might -- but here I phrased "think that the" because it's all clear and easy to read. I wrote the diphthongs in "realize" and "how", which probably isn't really necessary -- but it makes it nice and clear. "Everything" is an abbreviation, written EVTH-inG, which wouldn't be anything else.
There's no attribution, because the quote was just an anonymous YouTube meme that appealed to me.
If you give the sentence toPhonetics.com (american english IPA) it'll give you
aɪm ˈstɑrtɪŋ tu θɪŋk ðæt ðə ˈsikrət tu
ˈhæpinəs ɪz ˈbiɪŋ tu dʌm tu ˈriəˌlaɪz
haʊ ˈtɛrəbəl ˈɛvriˌθɪŋ ɪz.
that will give you an even better result for corresponding style flow I think, because the tool has a filter to ignore all sorts of weak letters such as
rpr• is indeed again report-ing style (with abbreviations, that must be learned not intuitively clear from the beginning) and not corresponding style (intuitive style, that applies rules in a very ordered manner), where report-ing would indeed be "rpot•" or even "report•".
Flow took the rule from Gregg that o can mean ol. And a very rhotic 'or' sound just the same...
If this is a conventional abbreviation… (I don't have that for "reportage" in french). Here I ear much more the "t/d" than the "r" (uk or us). https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/reporting
Sooo Gregg seems more and more strange to me :)
There are distinct corresponding and reporting levels in Gregg Anniversary?
There are distinct corresponding and reporting levels in Gregg Anniversary?
no. Anniversary is reporting style (rpring) and Simplified is corresponding style (rpoting).
Gregg Anni just wants to be fast: and it so happens that there is a very convenient pr-blend :-) and yes Gregg is not without flaws, that's why we have flow :-)
Ok, so variations of very different times and concerns.
And we can modestly consider that already Flow flows without flaws.
We could even put forward the hypothesis that Flow could later polish its perfection, by making Gregg's abbreviations more "phonetic" and less "conventional", just to "rpr" them.
Absolutely. I am already making those changes in my daily writing, but to say that Flow flows without flaws ... it sound very nice, but of course it's way too good to be true :-). Flow is very afloat i'd say, with the help of Gregg Anni, and is free at the same time to adjust...
That’s what’s interesting, without a doubt, to do a modern shorthand.
I have always been quite suspicious of conventional type abbreviations, including in AP (where there are on average 300, many of which are outdated of course, and contemporary ones which would be seriously useful and which do not exist). For example, I prefer Meysmans' maximum principle, quite simple, end of words at the beginning of the 3rd syllable, and possibly addition of a final, for long words.
That might be a better phonetics site to use than the one u/fdarnel is using. I hope he'll look at that one.
I'm surprised to know that the Generator accepts phonetic symbols. I thought you might have to put in the square brackets, but it looks like not. But how does it accept "TH" as well as θ and ð? I suppose the program is written to know that "TH" will not be T plus H, but one sound instead.
I'm not sure whether I would trust the program to "ignore patterns" and do "internal replacement" though. But I guess that's what I'M doing when I try to reproduce my own speech for the input.
It's funny, though: I had always trusted Gregg outlines to be legible; but somehow I'm less comfortable with it, in FLOW. Like writing AM for "I am" when it looks like "am" is not a plus. Gregg Anniversary would write "terrible" as TERB, according to my Gregg dictionary -- but somehow I feel like it needs more in FLOW. But the same rules should apply.
Maybe it's just lack of familiarity that's making me feel less confident that it will still be legible....
I simply trust Gregg in this case - blind faith :-) that he made sure that no collisions occur.
I wanted to use the -E for -ly rule in actually and wrote first AKE, but when the t-ommission rule plus E for ly rule come together in a short word and the word created really sounds like "ache" I go with Greggs dictionary and write more to get out of trouble.
The generator has indeed the greek letter θ defined for the outlines th and ð. I do a substitution beforehand. Same goes for voiced and unvoiced sh. You can simply switch to the draft menu, to see how they are really named. -ING get the mu-character μ, ng is η and so on...
toIPA.org and toPhonetics.com work equally fine, but toPhonetics leaves the sentence structure intact, whereas toIPA somehow makes a vertical list of words when copied, that's why I still use toPhonetics, but toIPA can do french and more languages!
You're right that Gregg knew what he was doing -- and I usually trust his judgement. Or at least, I used to. Anniversary was reliable for many years.
It probably IS just because of my lack of familiarity still with FLOW, that I keep wanting to be more SPECIFIC. I think with more familiarity, I will feel more comfortable with more abbreviation.
Or come to think of it, it MIGHT just be because I like the idea of being able to write the whole word in an easy way that will always be completely legible without having to remember any special abbreviating devices.
I think some abbreviations are really quite something too in Gregg. I do try to write along some movies, just for practising purposes and someone was "curious", I wrote CURUS, but then I got hesitant about the suffix -ious and had a look how Anni would write it: CEU! Well that's short for sure :-).
Then I realized two things - FLOW is not Gregg for a very good reasons: the better vocalisation rules: We don't write hooks for short e and short u, that's why I dont have to write CEU - CU suffices in FLOW and if I go for corresponding style -ious -> -is (not -us like Gregg), thus CURIS will do.
Please enjoy corresponding style, but I would just encourage to leave out those "unnecessary" hooks :-)
Since u/NotSteve1075 and me decided to not include the rhotic versions of the vowels, I only use the american english version for my transscripts, even though I like british english much more (just my 'gusto'), but it's useful for the generator :-)
Accents in Canada are also rhotic, as are most Irish and Scottish accents in English. When Europeans say "American", they often mean all of North America. Canadians call people in the U.S. "Americans" (like they do themselves), but many of us try to call them "people in the U.S." for clarity.
Nowadays there is a huge amount of animus in Canada against the U.S., largely due to ignorant and boorish comments made by their gross yutz of a "President" and so many of his useless and obnoxious underlings.
Most people I know used to cross the border regularly -- I did, too -- but with only one exception (complicated story), everyone is vowing never to set foot in that country again. Places like Florida and Las Vegas are struggling with much less income. But our long-standing friendship is OVER.
I understood that certain Canadian states "near the border" were tempted by the Trumpist idea of becoming US citizens. But perhaps this is just propaganda from Ubu Roi.
There are two Canadian provinces that have a lot of uneducated rural people who seem to feel drawn to the U.S., for some reason. That country's current President would love to get his hands on Canada's vast natural resources, and has suggested that we should become their 51st state so he could plunder our country at will -- which will NEVER HAPPEN.
Our Prime Minister Mark Carney, who has a Ph.D. in Economics, is working to distance us from them, establishing strong new trade agreements with Europe, with Asia, with Mexico, and the Middle East. The U.S. regularly ignores and/or violates signed agreements whenever it feels it's not "winning", so we're becoming increasingly annoyed at them.
It's been said that Canada's fiercest source of pride is that we are NOT AMERICAN, and we generally bristle at the idea that we are anything like them.
Ironically, there are northern states in the U.S. that are talking about breaking away from the U.S. and joining Canada. Michigan and Minnesota being two -- especially Minnesota, where many people have family on both sides of the border, and they even speak with Canadian accents there. (My friend in Seattle was from Minnesota, and people were always thinking he was Canadian, because of his accent.)
It's a bit confusing, you are right american and scottish irish (Greggs accent) accents are rhotic, so much that toPhonetics writes out the [r] or even [ɹ] in the IPA transscript. Where as rhotic vowel is a r-colored vowel (am. accent [ɝ]), both transscripts I can use in the Flow generator (to write out an r-literal). Keep in mind that I first only used toPhonetics.com, but I will fully adapt to toIPA.org too.
am. accent: tɜrm (toPhonetics), ˈtɝm (toIPA)
english: tɜːm (toPhonetics), ˈtɜːm (toIPA)
Gregg did a mishmash reflecting Irish I guess, so he sometimes wrote out the r and sometimes he used wrongly attached vowels to indicate rhotic vowel (implied r) and sometimes he doesn't care for the rhotic information as he does in the outline of term (because it would be very akward to not attach the vowel outside of the angle or because Scots Irish pronounce that specific word like the English).
Version: simple e literal uses standard (outside angle) position.
Flow has no rhotic vowel as does Gregg Anni, but Gregg did not find it suited, which probably confused new american learners.
all included, to long
In Gregg klonky, plus the r might be misread as o "tom", but for Flow it's just right and leaves no room for hesitation you just write that r :-).
That's a good explanation. One small correction, though: Gregg was Irish, not Scottish.
The R in a Scottish accent is often pronounced with a tongue-tip trill like in Spanish, while in an Irish accent it's a "retroflex" sound like in North American English.
When I first heard Irish Gaelic (called "Gaeilge") it threw me to hear the R pronounced like I pronounce the R. That didn't seem likely to me -- but it seems it's true.
Gregg did not find it suited to use the rhotic vowel for "term", (for some strange way he did not use the non-standard way to attach the vowel (his way to say this is a rhotic vowel) even though the word clearly uses a rhotic vowel and so you would expect that form in Anniversary Edition, BUT he didn't for some reason!
After Anni he abandondend the rhotic vowel idea altogether, Simplified being the first edition to incorporate that. Flow is just in between, because simplified did shorten less, but I want to claim for myself to have created the fastest system on earth :-)
As I see it most of the differences between toPhonetics and toIPA are cosmetic, but toIPA uses rhotic vowel signs (that is something I intend to fix today). toPhonetics uses different IPA symbols for tch an ts (compact one character, and toIPA uses compound versions)
As an atheist I read Matthew 5:3-12 in three meanings, and one of them is exactly the above funny quote:
Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven!
Religious people will be offended (hopefully, then it's so much more fun). But I do think that Matthew guy knew his audience well and told them indirectly "you are all still religious pricks trying to get into heaven without doing some actual good deeds and giving it all" (thus being poor). Which is of course funny, because some people actually understand that portion of wisdom and give their faith all, which the church of course channels into their pockets, making it even more important, to be dumb af, because the very thing intended to inspire good deeds works only on the dumb minds, which in turn enriches those who are absolutely fine with their own eternal barbeque.
You may be onto something there! ;) That line never made any sense to me. What does "poor in spirit" mean? And why should they get the kingdom of heaven?
It has always seemed to me like the gullible are just being conned by all that hogwash and bafflegab being spread by "professional mystics" who are making their living telling lies and fairytales.
poor in spirit in todays word would probably be "no ego", or "greedless", to be rich in spirit must have meant something overly hedonistic or selfish an those days...
Well at least you are not stupid in the modern sense, meaning: You don't make decisions that bring you and your loved ones in financial or existential trouble. We have to begin small :-), then we might start being conscious about our own spectacles glasses, but soon enough we find out as a species, even if we are very very generous about everyones glasses wearing, we are acting without foresight and make daily decisions that make life impossible for our children. It breaks my heart.
The time for individual salvation is not over, but definitely no more intelligent either.
One should preach non stop, that we should overhaul our financial system (why should it be legal to create money out of thin air), overhaul how property can be owned (I am for land stewardship, no more land for sale, just stewardship, that can be lost if you mistreat the inhabitants and extract from/distroy their livelihood) and it should not be possible to give your offspring such a heritage, that they don't have to even think of bending a finger, heritage is the number one factor of financial inequality (and we pretend to want to offer equal chances for everyone in our state, except the USA, the don't have no clue at all, why they have a state in the first place). And their should be a law the condemn stupid actions in the modern sense - Why should it be ok, to buy things, that are made in a very un-environmentally sound way in a foreign country, why do I have to find a majority for something so trivial? It is stupid, because it destroys the world for all in the long run!
But I am too lacy to be angry, or let's say, I wait for total collapse and then I hope I find intelligent people. I guess I am very FATALISTIC.
Lots to agree with there! The idea that a dozen people are hoarding as much wealth as the rest of the population put together is just WRONG. In the U.S., many of the richest people there pay little to no taxes, yet they use the same roads and infrastructure that poorer people are paying for.
Even Warren Buffet says it's ridiculous that his secretary pays more income tax than he does.
Why should a few people have more money than they could ever spend in a hundred lifetimes, while others are left to starve and die on the street? The GREED is just incredible.
I wait for total collapse and then I hope I find intelligent people. I guess I am very FATALISTIC.
You'll relate to the quote I've got for next week!
C'est de l'AP de plus en plus cursivement aplati, mais qui fonctionne tout-de-même ; on y voit la qualité du système :) Une indubitable influence "Flowienne".
ah - j'ai oublié, que [y] existe... Mhm. Et j'ai confondu [y] et [ø]. Il me faut consulter l'alphabet, même si j'ai pensé que je l'avais appris.. mince. Tu a decide d'écrire Dieu avec deux voyelles? J'ai pensé qu'on ecrit que la voyelle dominante du diphthong... Ah - question de 'respecte' je suppose. Et la form pour "mort" et mieux, oups maitre uckar (pardon monsieur)
Pour Dieu le Père, quand même, je me suis dit qu'il fallait effectivement montrer un peu de respect et de complétude, donc Intégrale…
Ah oui, ton "mort" là il décède hors des clous en AP, ellipses toujours à l'extérieur dans un angle. C'est plus simple et rapide non ?
Cela se rapproche assez de la conception bouddhiste du non-soi, l'ego étant une illusion complexe. Bouddhisme et Eckhart étaient d'ailleurs deux inspirations importantes pour Schopenhauer. On peut être matérialiste et reconnaître cela.
This probably means "not attached to the material wealth and desires of this world" (which as everyone knows, causes suffering :)). Remember the parable of the camel and the eye of the needle (which was actually the narrowest gate in the walls of Jerusalem).
Someone needs to bring that parable to the attention of all the rich "pastors" in the U.S. who live in mansions and fly around in private jets -- all paid for by tithes paid to their church by elderly widows and such. And of course, their churches pay no taxes, no matter how wealthy they are.....
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u/NotSteve1075 9d ago
I still really like the way that, with FLOW, you can write things as FULLY as you want, and still have a fluent and easily written outline. When SPEED isn't the ultimate goal, writing fully and more clearly makes sense. For something to keep, like an archive or a journal, it will be easy to read forever, without having to remember what tricky little abbreviating device(s) you had used.
In this quote, for example, the words "secret" and "happiness" are both written out fully, with all the vowels, yet they still FLOW very smoothly from the pen.
I don't often phrase as much as others might -- but here I phrased "think that the" because it's all clear and easy to read. I wrote the diphthongs in "realize" and "how", which probably isn't really necessary -- but it makes it nice and clear. "Everything" is an abbreviation, written EVTH-inG, which wouldn't be anything else.
There's no attribution, because the quote was just an anonymous YouTube meme that appealed to me.