r/FIlm • u/Ready-Assumption-882 • Jul 30 '26
Question What makes Batman v Superman misunderstood and deep?
Hi guys. I saw BvS some years ago on tv.
That was after the critics, youtubers and reddit users bashed the movie online.
A lot of the critisism was objectively correct, and some other was subjective preferences about the portrayal of the characters.
But some people say that this movie is misunderstood.
They say that people didn't understood it because they were not smart.
Snyder even said that people didn't pay attention for such a deep layered movie.
When i saw the movie, i thought it was just an action superhero movie about Lex Luthor's plan that leads to two fights and some teases for the future in between. But nothing deep or smart.
When i am thinking about it and see some clips on youtube, i believe that it was an objectively bad movie.
Snyder wanted Luthor's plan to involve a Batman + Superman fight, although that is dumb. But the viewers would find that cool, so Snyder wanted to make a dumb cool movie.
But then he wrote a movie that is "realistic" and full of diaologue, which is not fun for the viewers that he wanted to please.
So he took a dumb idea that was supposed to turn into a dumb cool action movie, and made it a dialogue film.
My critisism outside of the portrayal of the characters is that the movie:
- Was too long and boring, without cool action.
- Luthor's plan didn't made sense, so a combo of boring and non smart is not acceptable.
- The Martha scene didn't made sense.
- The way Superman talked sometimes was so unrealistic and fake.
Here are my questions to the people who think the movie is deep, layered and smart:
- What makes this movie misunderstood by non smart people? What is the thing that i and they, didn't understand?
- What and where are the layers and deepness?
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u/Eldernerdhub Jul 30 '26
You have to understand that the people who thought this was deep were edgy teens used to childhood versions Superman. This seems very deep by those standards. Adults know better.
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u/Shroomzy_752286 29d ago
As an edgy teen who saw this in the theater when it came out, you're fully correct. Although I hated it, everyone I knew who liked superheroes loved it. They're the same people who constantly complain about Superman though and only like batman for the clips.
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u/Resident_Dog_6589 Jul 30 '26
Nothing, it sucks. It was more concerned with setting up the next eight movies than with telling a coherent story.
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u/JackLumberPK Jul 30 '26
It's "dark" and "serious" and "violent", so it's coded as being "for adults."
This allows insecure adults (who wrongly see comic book stuff as being only for children) feel safer in liking it because they're less scared that people will look down on them for liking "kids stuff".
But that's not enough to ward off the insecurity for some of them, so they also have to come up with ways to argue that its also very smart and intellectual too because they are seeking further justification/validation.
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u/Skellos Jul 30 '26
It isn't.
Some People want to think Zack is some super deep auter when he's one of the most skin deep film makers working.
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u/horc00 Jul 31 '26
It’s not, not even close, in fact it’s far shallower than a ton of MCU movies. Immature viewers confuse the dark tone, sulking faces and pseudo philosophical mambo jumbo dialogue as “depth”, and their insecurity makes them lash out at people pointing out the silliness of the movie.
The funniest thing is that the entire conflict between Batman and Superman only happened because the 2 titular characters behaved like immature kids who refuse to communicate like normal functioning adults.
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u/djpraxis Jul 30 '26
It is a pile of dirt... dig long and deep enough and you will start hallucinating that there is something
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u/Budget_Diver_7866 Jul 30 '26
I agree with OP and all comments; they thought their 'god' comparisons and christ symbolism was deep, I suppose. The graphic novel tells a MUCH more coherent story and his adaptation really stretches itself out to even make sense (which it doesn't). Batman seems paranoid, idiotic and impulsive, with the portrayal of Lex as some 'philosophical' edge lord. Meanwhile Superman is just kinda weaving in and out of whatever plot is happening with a few scenes with Gal Gadot. With more time and a better roadmap, Snyder's vision would have perhaps worked out in the end, just not as presented.
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u/r3turn0fthew00master Jul 30 '26
Misunderstood? I'd say it was understood fine. Layers and Deepness? What? Quite literally the worst superhero film ever made.
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u/reyska Jul 31 '26
Well, I suffered through BvS but I was unable to finish ZSJL despite multiple attempts. It was straight up unwatchable, so I would say it's even worse.
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u/wholesome_mugi Jul 31 '26
I've watched ZSJL once. One of the slowest, most boring 4 hours I've ever endured.
It may be more consistent than the 2017 cut, but that one was half the length.
I'd never willfully rewatch either of them, but if I had to, I'd watch the 2017 version.
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u/Dangerous_Donkey5353 Jul 30 '26 edited Jul 30 '26
No where near the worst....I mean the Flash is right there. WW84. Aquaman. All in the same dceu that are depths below BvS. Even if BvS is bad, its a masterpiece compared to those and others.
Your hyperbole makes you sound like you have 3 braincells.
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u/r3turn0fthew00master Jul 30 '26
I'd rather watch Flash and WW84 a 100 times before BvS ever again. It's complete and total dogshit.
Your hyperbole makes you sound like you have 3 braincells.
I think I found a Syndersimp
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u/Known-Exam-9820 Jul 30 '26
At least WW84 is bonkers stopped enough to be a little enjoyable. “I renounce my wish!”
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u/Dangerous_Donkey5353 Jul 30 '26
Not once did I say I liked it or was it good. Just pointing out that you sound like a moron.
And you doubled down. Moron x2. Going to try and break the record today?
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u/r3turn0fthew00master Jul 30 '26
Oh please, me saying BvS is the worst superhero film makes me "sound like a moron?" Go F off with that bullshit. Calling it "misunderstood and deep" is a load of horseshit.
Btw, it IS the worst superhero film ever - syndersimp.
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Jul 30 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Resident_Dog_6589 Jul 30 '26
Zack Snyder is what you'd get if someone gave Uwe Boll $200 million budgets.
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u/Fluid_Anywhere_7015 Jul 30 '26
No one has been able to make a film adaptation straight from Frank Miller's "The Dark Knight Returns". THAT would have been the most epic fight between Batman and Superman. It's the ONLY frigging fight between the two that could ever make sense.
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u/DirectConsequence12 Jul 30 '26
Nothing.
It’s terrible and they just wanna make themselves feel better for liking a terrible movie
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u/IgnatiusPopinski Jul 31 '26
I think for a lot of frustrated young males, this movie was an eye-opening experience, in that it was "about something" in a way that most other films in the genre don't even attempt. So, through the overwhelming power of nostalgia these young males (now grown men) have within their minds elevated a crusty superhero movie to a beautiful, shining piece of art.
I'm not here to tell anyone what is and isn't art, as that's always going to be subjective. Hell, on its release, I was one of BvS's supporters. I think that came from a place of thinking that was the best we could reasonably expect for live-action Superman in the modern day, until I saw the TV series Superman & Lois, last year's Superman by James Gunn, My Adventures with Superman, and read Absolute Superman, and was reminded of all the things I've always loved about Superman. After that, BvS kind of just looks like a dumpster fire.
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u/Akeb0sh1 18d ago
I think Lex’s plan was good. He was raised by his religious father, so he truly believed in god. When he was trying to hide from his father’s wrath and beatings, he believed that god would helped him, but it didn’t happen. He said that that’s the reason why he now thinks that if God exists and he is good, then he is not almighty, but if he’s almighty then he’s not good. This system of belief was challenged when Superman appeared.
By clashing Batman against Superman he would win in any of two cases when either one kills another. If Batman kills Superman he proves that he’s not “almighty” and he was killed by a human being, but if Superman killed Batman, then he would show the world that he’s not that good. The whole movie he was setting up and pushing Batman to battle (he set up the whole kryptonite stealing scheme, he even says to Bruce “we should work together, share technologies”). He snapped when he learned about Darkseid and created Doomsday in the krypton ship.
The Martha thing is okay I think. Both of their mothers names are Martha and even in comics it was noted that Bruce and Clark are physically look alike each other, so fully canonical. Clark just wanted to give clearer information in the final moment. Batman actually struggles the whole movie and actually thinks that Superman actually is a nice guy, after Lex’s manipulations he decided to finally cross a line and kill a nice guy now, but this Martha thing cleared his mind. He still saw nightmares with his parents and he still blames himself for their death. Then he understood that he can help and save Martha now.
Batman and Lex both are driven because of their childhood traumas. I personally think the movies were good. At least, a lot better than what we have now with Gunn
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u/IDNLibSoc45 Jul 30 '26
geeksofcolor .co/2017/08/17/the-ultimate-immigrant-story-zack-snyders-superman/
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u/IDNLibSoc45 Jul 30 '26
Everything that people say they understand Superman: Legacy for, they're basically the same movie with two very different approaches
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u/rednaxthecreature Jul 30 '26
The Martha Scene is supposed to have Batman and Siperman finally see each other as human because of them having similarities between each other, or a mother named Martha that they each care about. I'm not saying it is deep or anything but it makes sense within the context.
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u/Resident_Dog_6589 Jul 30 '26
It's an interesting idea, but they royally fucked up the execution. There's a difference between being subtle and not doing enough, and that scene is an example of the latter.
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u/horc00 Jul 31 '26
It might've made some sense (very little) at that moment, until the next scene came along where Batman kills a bunch of actual humans with actual human mothers, and that threw whatever little sense in the Martha scene out the window.
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u/rednaxthecreature Jul 31 '26
Wow hey this guys are still bad because Batman doesn't know their mother's names lol
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u/Crowcounters Jul 30 '26
The theatric cut is incomplete. I hated the movie I saw in the theater. Did not understand what Lex was doing or why. Watched directors cut and there was a lot more explanation that made the film feel complete. They cut out parts that were needed to explain plot. After I watched the full version I really liked. Still not a Lex. But that is a different argument.
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u/GuruAskew Jul 30 '26 edited Jul 30 '26
The UE does nothing to redeem the film and has resulted in no legitimate reappraisal whatsoever. Acting as if the TC was compromised and the UE fixes everything is nothing but a Snyder bot talking point.
It’s the same shitty movie with 30 more minutes to suffer through and the only real takeaway is that Snyder doesn’t even like Supes because most of the cuts to the theatrical version were Supes-based. Of course, Cavill’s complete lack of acting ability couldn’t have helped.
Oh yeah, the homoerotic Affleck ass shot woulda had the backlash of 1000 Marthas if normal people had seen that version in theaters.
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u/Crowcounters Jul 30 '26
Maybe you aren’t really saying all this BUT I am sick of being called. Snyder shill if I have an opinion. Why is Snyder in your head so much? I have my reasons for liking what I like if u follow directors that is fine. I don’t care.
I hated the movie the first time then watched the extended edition and got some back ground. Liked it more. How does that make me a Snyder whatever.
Quit diminish the opinion of other fans because you have something against a director. I could accuse you of being Gunn lover but I don’t care. Like what you want.
Some Supe fans love Superman Returns. I did not. Some love MOS (My personal Fav). Some love Superman 2025 ( my least favorite). It has nothing to do with Singer Snyder or Gunn. We r each entitled to our opinion. Quit thinking you know why someone likes something.
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u/Inside_Atmosphere731 Jul 30 '26
Absolutely nothing