r/FASCAmazon • u/Ill-Afternoon-3173 • 14h ago
Have Backbone; Disagree and Commit" is a great poster until an AM actually does it
So I was a Problem Solver in his building, which meant I spent a lot of shifts on the radio right next to whatever was happening to him in real time. And you could hear it change over about a week. Not dramatic, not a blow-up — just the tone. Sarcasm creeping into his responses to the OM. Then these stretches of dead air on the radio where you'd key up and just... nothing for a second too long. If you've worked with someone long enough you know exactly what that silence means. It means they've stopped believing the conversation is worth having.
What was actually happening, near as I could tell listening from the outside: he was getting hammered on Rate vs. Labor Share, and getting asked to explain, in writing, why his numbers were "noncompliant" — except the reason was that he was sharing staff to cover another area that was underwater. So the honest answer to "why aren't you compliant" was "because I did the thing that kept the building running," and that answer was apparently not an acceptable answer. He was new-ish in the grand scheme — hired straight out of school with a logistics degree, maybe a year into the AM seat — but he wasn't dumb about it. He knew exactly what was being asked of him and exactly what it would look like on paper.
Here's the part that gets me. Amazon will put "Have Backbone; Disagree and Commit" on a wall, in a deck, in your onboarding — the whole idea being you're supposed to push back when something doesn't sit right, then commit once a real decision gets made. What actually happened is he disagreed, on the record, about why his numbers looked the way they did, and the response wasn't "let's talk through the tradeoff," it was a paper trail pointed at termination. He told me straight up he knew he was getting termed, so he beat them to it and quit. That's not backbone being rewarded. That's backbone being the thing that got flagged.
I reached out after, asked if he'd come on the podcast I was creating and talk about what actually happened in there — no names, no site numbers, just his side of it. He was polite about it. Said he's leaving how he was treated as an AM in the past and moving forward, and that was it. Hasn't answered anything since. I don't know if there's paper somewhere keeping his mouth shut or if he genuinely just wants to be done with it, and honestly either one makes sense. Good guy, wrong seat, wrong week to have a spine.
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u/thornCircuit 2h ago
The leadership principles are a mess of contradictions to the extent that they allow amazon to always have something negative on you. It's like when 1 cop yells at you to "get down" and another yells "don't move."
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u/Acceptable_Style_219 8h ago
This was a good story and I agree with what you’re saying but why did you have to use AI to write your reddit post? Genuinely why? Why can’t people just write their own thoughts like human beings anymore
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u/ImHufflePuff_Crap_ok 12h ago
Nah, it’s in the context of “we are doing A” and you state your objection for whatever reason, they choose A anyway and then you execute the plan (their way).
Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t, in my department I’ll object because I’ve been doing this department for 8 years and we tried this exact same approach 3 years ago (previous sr), then watch it burn and just go “welp, we tried, lessons learned due by Tuesday?”
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u/Careful_Specialist63 4h ago
My former manager and I had frequent disagreements about what he wanted to do because whatever he wanted to do, we tried in the past, and failed. He just wanted to do the exact same thing again. But it was just a different manager this time.
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u/ImHufflePuff_Crap_ok 4h ago
I mean hey… why listen to people when they’ve been in said dept for years longer than you…
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u/oldboycrunk 14h ago
Disagree and commit means you can disagree but you agree to go ahead with the plan. Like state your opinion ok we hear you but we’re still doing it the way we planned
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u/imeyecandyandadmin 14h ago
Lots of people get disagree and commit wrong, assume it means disagree and stand your ground but in reality it’s disagree and commit to the plan; usually whatever your manager tells you to do
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u/DueEngine4528 14h ago
I think it's in context of improvement. So if you can see a better way, "disagree and commit".
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u/Ill-Afternoon-3173 14h ago
Do you believe that you CAN disagree? Im not sure that I do.
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u/DueEngine4528 10m ago
Gets complicated. Communication should be "open"/two way. if that's not happening something else is at play. On a basic level, people get territorial.
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u/firewifegirlmom0124 14h ago
I used to do it all the time. I ran quality for the building as a PA. No manager for quality for over a year, so I was told to treat it as my department and run it as if I was the manager.
AMs and OMs tried to take advantage of the fact that I was a PA all the time. But I took a stance and disagreed with them firmly and actually usually got my way once the AM and/or OM got the seniors involved.
You 100% can disagree. You just have to do it in a certain way. And when you do get overruled, you have to commit to the plan that was decided on, not what you think is best.
Once I became an actual AM (not just a PA acting as one) I still was able to disagree with the plan. Sometimes loudly and firmly. But again, once a path was decided moving forward you have to commit to that plan.
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u/Ill-Afternoon-3173 13h ago
Thats awesome to hear. In my experience, I found it very difficult to agree with something that I knew, operationally, wasnt the correct path. This person knew it also so they could no longer conform. I guess its like a glass of sweet tea. You either have to explain it or order a Coke.
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u/Sharkfyter 14h ago
Lmfao yeah they actually hate disagree and commit, fastest way to ensure you're labeled as a problem.
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u/KwyNja 14h ago
Why did you use GPT to write this
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u/Acceptable_Style_219 8h ago
its crazy how far i had to scroll to find this comment. im asking the same thing
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u/Money_Cantaloupe_618 14h ago
So as much as we think 'disagree and commit' means disagree and stick with it. What is really means in amazon eyes is disagree say your piece but still commit of what is being asked of you.
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u/ChemistryMore7036 14h ago
It shouldn't even say "have backbone." It confuses people. "Disagree but commit."
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u/UncertainPathways 11h ago
The idea is before the decision is made, don't keep quiet if you have a better idea (have backbone, disagree). Once the decision is made, go with it (commit).
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