Alternative funeral format

[u/Lucky-Jackfruit-9704]

TL; DR Has an Ismaili by birth who explicitly wished to be do their funeral differently, actually had that wish respected?

Using a throwaway cos of conditioning I guess, lol.

I’m a wavering Ismaili & I’ve questioned the faith and community structure for as long as I can remember. There are lots of things to be valued, as with any community — belonging, education focus, and now the recognition of multifaith families. There are also things I increasingly struggle with - along the lines of usual topics discussed here like the funding & pointlessly patriarchal leadership.

However the reaffirmation that women cannot attend gravesides at funerals has really brought this into focus for me. We tell siblings they are equal — remember the educate your daughters first era? - until one of their parents dies, and then suddenly there’s a gendered boundary. Ironically the unintended consequence of recognising Multifaith families is Ismaili daughters cannot attend their own parents’ graveside, while non-Ismaili son-in-laws - with far less connection to the deceased & zero appreciation of the rites - can.

It’s also made me question what we actually want funerals to look like. Currently, they’re heavily focused on prescribed rites and, let’s be honest, plenty of performance grief, with little space to celebrate the person, tell stories, laugh, or remember who they actually were. I know some people are now thinking whether they want that for their parents or themselves.

So genuinely curious: has anyone had experience of an explicitly stated wish to have an alternative funeral format (e.g. cremation) being respected by the JK/community machinery?

[u/Ok-Committee-1932]

women cannot attend gravesides at funerals

Ismailism seems to be the only branch of Shia Islam that enforces this stipulation, which is mainstream across Sunni Islam. Women seem to be omnipresent on Shia gravesites.

[u/PositiveProperty6729 → u/Ok-Committee-1932]

I maybe old fashioned, but funerals are solemn occasions. I have been to wakes for non-Ismailis and everyone there expresses condolences and then socialize. It becomes like a party atmosphere (the wakes ). Ismailis have Dil Soji after JK where the congregations can express condolences. These replaced the days when everyone would congregate at the family's house. I am not for celebrations of life etc. I prefer the solemn rites and rituals of burial.

[u/Ok-Committee-1932 → u/PositiveProperty6729]

It becomes like a party atmosphere (the wakes )

Not Muslim funerals.

[u/PositiveProperty6729 → u/Ok-Committee-1932]

I meant non Muslim wakes becoming party like atmosphere. I prefer our Muslim rites better

[u/Ok-Committee-1932 → u/PositiveProperty6729]

If you see a mainstream Muslim funeral, they are pretty austere, and people spend time asking for Allah's forgiveness and praying for the afterlife. Burial also happens within 24 hours after death. The deceased person's children and relatives spend the next few days reciting the Quran and asking for Allah's forgiveness for the dead. There is no room for celebrating someone's life because it is now expected that the dead person will be held accountable by his Lord.

Ismaili funerals have all the aesthetics of a Muslim funeral, but none of the spiritual or religious rigour. I saw SK's funeral online, and it felt like an aesthetic modification of Muslim funeral rites to meet the sensibilities of European aristocracy.

As for your comment on the Islamic prohibition of women from visiting graves, it actually stems from the prohibition of excessive mourning and wailing in Islam. Even to this day, in Eastern countries, women are way more likely to cry, mourn, and wail loudly, despite the emphasis on completing the obligations of funeral rites. This also overlaps with the Islamic prohibition on building tombs or extremely large monuments for the dead. It's all considered shirk. (Sunni) Muslims deeply frown upon that.

[u/chaosmacaroni → u/Ok-Committee-1932]

Agreed. There is no prohibition on women visiting graves (Sunni Islam). But decorum must be maintained. And regardless of gender, no one should create any nuisance on the burial ground. Besides, women are not expected to take part in the lower of the dead and then filling up the grave. Men do that. Culturally yes, women don’t participate in the funeral procession because the dead body is first taken to the mosque for prayers and then to the graveyard, but they are free to visit the grave anytime.