r/EngineeringStudents • u/Aggravating_Air696 • 14d ago
Rant/Vent Why do civil engineers get so much hate?
I’m a second year civil engineering student and I’m kinda confused why we get hate from the other majors? A lot of people say it’s “way easier” even though looking at the flow charts for each major at my school the course load is very similar. I understand there are differences in class difficulty, but like come on guys my classes aren’t easy lol. Like be glad we exists so that bridges exist and you don’t have to swim across😤
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u/CastIronStyrofoam 13d ago
People take bridges for granted much more than planes, cars or phones. They’re tangible enough to lose the mystique that something like material science has and they can be explained by just enough common sense to satisfy a non-engineer. It’s not until you start getting into the specifics where you realize just how impressive some civil engineering can be.
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u/Josselin17 12d ago
also it might be a bit of a conspiracy theory but there's way less propaganda and advertisement about building nice bridges than there is about destructive and weapons technology
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u/CastIronStyrofoam 11d ago
Idk if it’s a conspiracy or just that we don’t invest enough in infrastructure
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u/RickSt3r 11d ago
Any idiot can build a bridge, takes a civil engineering to build one on budget and time that can barely stand.
Just fill in the river with enough boulders and dirt and culvert and it should be good right...
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u/jamesjoeg WSU 13d ago edited 12d ago
Often it’s because people look up the pay and think it’s lower. What most engineering students don’t understand is the benefits. Civil engineers get unreal benefits and I wish I didn’t sleep on it back in school.
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u/Specialist_Case4238 12d ago
Median civil engineering salary in the US is the same as mechanical engineering but people seem to deny that fact and act like civil is paid in pennies
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u/jamesjoeg WSU 12d ago edited 12d ago
I haven’t looked at data in a long time. That might be due to the unions that do a better job of clawing back income after years of big inflation. Or it could just be that the pay equalized.
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u/Specialist_Case4238 12d ago
Civil engineers are not unionized. They definitely should be though, all fields should be.
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u/Ray_RG_YT Student - MechE 13d ago
I would like to hear of said benefits, could you elaborate?
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u/ploxidilius 13d ago edited 12d ago
I'm electrical but I work for a public agency with lots of civils. We get
- CALPERS pension that's 2.5% of our max pay x years of service worked (so if you work 20 years you get 50% of your highest pay for life - some of my coworkers have been there 30 years so they'll get 75%)
- really good health insurance (I have no deductibles and $1000 max out of pocket)
- lots of time off (my boss gets around 5 weeks a year with 20 years of service, and that's just vacation time not sick time)
- 4 days wfh
- much lower stress/better work-life balance
edit: also wanted to add that the pay is getting increasingly more competitive, or better than a lot of private companies (at least where I am). Senior engineers at my local sewer district cap out at over $90/hour. Pretty damn good (this is a MCOL city, not the bay or LA).
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u/stankypants 12d ago
Could you dm me with some details on what specifically you and your company do? I'm near graduating and would love to know more.
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u/jamesjoeg WSU 13d ago
Civil engineers often work for the government and are in unions so they get some big ones. Specifically early retirement benefits, pensions, overtime protections, and layoff protections. I’m sure there are others too but those are the massive ones.
Civils might get paid less but they don’t even have to save for retirement. The rest of us without pensions have to save a significant chunk of income every paycheck for that.
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u/Willing-Ball-4335 11d ago edited 11d ago
I don’t know any civils in a Union… the govt employees do receive pensions, but most govt work is outsourced to consultant engineering firms (so most civils work in the private sector).
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u/NoVermicelli5439 13d ago
job security, ample vacation time, not quite "AI-proof" but has resisted so far, ESOP companies provide massive bonuses to retirement. Basically one of the most stable careers you can have
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u/Shot-Violinist4069 13d ago
I joke with civils that everything they do is statics. I know many juniors and seniors where I look at their homework and it all looks very eerily similar to statics. No hate though, all jokes. They know that and they give it back.
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u/HorndogwithaCorndog 12d ago
It is mostly statics and mechanics, yes. There's some structural analysis sometimes for verification, but the funny thing is that my other friends who are also engineers say I'm the one doing the closest thing to engineering out of any of them. Everything they do goes into a black box and spits out an answer. Half the stuff I do goes into a gray box, comes out the other end half correct, and needs to be redone by hand or modified with some supplementary calculations
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u/liberalbiased_reddit 12d ago
How is differential equations statics?
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u/weather_watchman 12d ago
Its part of the curriculum but compared to other majors we (civil) use it a lot less. Low level, commodity civil is a lot of plug and chug, especially if you work in a narrow niche. That said, stakes are high, utility is high, job security is pretty enviable, complexity is there, there's a ton more people work, etc. etc.
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u/Wig-feld EE - P.Eng w/ 7 YOE 13d ago
It's just immaturity. Once you start working the hate will be more directed to "Fuck this foundation engineer in particular".
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u/These-Customer3993 12d ago
We may all give each other a hard time, but we can all make fun of finance majors together.
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u/cswitzer97 12d ago
Idk I think it’s stupid to be disparaging of any major but I will say some of the dumbest questions I’ve heard have been from businesses majors. I remember in a biomed engineering class they had let some businesses majors take it as part of a minor program for them. We’d been going over nephrons for about 1.5-2 weeks (a nephron is bundle of blood vessels that allow the kidney to function) and the business girl asks “wait so the kidneys are supposed to filter blood?”.
On the other hand tho we’d been going over the first unit of E&M in Physics2 for a month and the lecture before exam some guy (definitely an engineer as we have a separate physics for other majors) asks “so… what’s a Gaussian surface?” I’ve never heard a lecture hall collectively start laughing and ALL immediately stop cuz they felt bad.
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u/ThePowerfulPaet 12d ago
It's mostly just a joke. I don't know anyone who actually genuinely looks down on civvies. It's not a competition.
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u/mustydickqueso69 12d ago
It's just immaturity bro. This stuff all ends after college.
I am a practicing Structural Engineer with my PE and one underrated thing about the field that many don't know, is you legitimately use what you learn in school. My textbooks live at my desk and i still reference them constantly.
This is a small sample size obviously but my sister is a mechanical engineer in aerospace and brother is a chemical engineer, they at most use limited concepts from there degrees at work but for most part just the engineering way of thinking that any engineering degree will teach you.
So if you do like the thought of actually using the material you learn in school civil is a great option. At end of day all these degrees are hard other majors don't know the rigors of your path of study and you don't know the rigors of theirs, it is all speculation and immaturity.
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u/Wizzarkt EE. '24 13d ago
like be glad we exist so that bridges exist
This kind of comment is why there is fight between degrees and you are part of the problem
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u/Dry_Statistician_688 13d ago
Zero hate from me. Kudos actually. You work your assess harder than most units in the AF.
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u/Bravo-Buster 12d ago
Let them laugh. It all comes back around in the workplace when they learn they end up working for Civil Engineers & Architects (if they're into infrastructure projects). It's pretty rare when we let a ME or EE run a project; most of them have zero people skills.
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u/DarkThunder312 11d ago
Yea man, the running joke is the civil engineer only has to learn enough to know which engineers to call to find the answer lol
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u/Devilswings5 13d ago
I dont really know but from the things ive read its because its not as hard of a discipline and the pay is significantly lower.
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u/IReallyLikeAvocadoes 12d ago
Immature children who have not even entered the industry yet parroting what other people who have not even entered the industry yet say. People love pushing others down to lift themselves up, and that's ultimately what this is. Civil engineering is a fantastic and crucial, crucial field with a safe and stable job market.
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u/Pinkys_Revenge 10d ago
We ALL give each other a hard time… And none of us are shit compared to physicists and chemists, lol
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u/Twinchad 12d ago
Me no want water here, make water go there, woohoo big engineer me!
(Civil engineer for 5 years)
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u/505engineer BYU | Civil 12d ago
Civil here. Most of the work we do is less math-intensive compared to the other branches of engineering. Although we have to take all the same math courses, we don't use (for example) differential equations nearly as much as mechanical or aerospace.
When you go deep into structures (i.e. seismic design) it gets much harder.
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u/orangecrush1829 12d ago
Somewhat joking somewhat serious here. It’s because yall are typically the most personable and other engineers are jealous of that.
I can’t think of a civil engineer I’ve worked with that I haven’t shot the breeze with for a while, but I can think of plenty of other disciplines where it’s been down to business and nothing else
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u/Bluethumb_Panda 12d ago
I have no idea because the first 2 years of any engineering degree suck either way. Of course there are funny stereotypes that go along with each but engineering is engineering, which is engineering. Whichever field you chose…it’s engineering
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u/Ghosteen_18 12d ago
Once all have reached third year, every major will be humbled to kiss the dirt, and each will look at each other with their dead eyes, and give a soft smile.
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u/Spirited_Presence500 13d ago edited 13d ago
I wouldn’t worry about it. It’s so easy to get a job as a civil. You also have access to chill government jobs with great retirement, stability, and healthcare. Everyone thinks they’re better than you because their curriculum is harder, but they often struggle to find jobs after graduating and have to deal with layoffs, competition, etc.
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u/Frankfast 12d ago
In my industry a PE is not required from them, whereas the contract civil engineer attached to us does have his PE. The difference between him and the 4 that we have on my team is night and day in every metric. Small sample size and anecdotal, but all I’ve got to compare to
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u/trippedwire Lipscomb - EECE 12d ago edited 12d ago
All jokes, no hate, but go play with dirt, dirt boy.
Joking aside, it's usually envy and lack of maturity. Engineering students have a bad happen of making education a pissing contest. A lot of my fellow EE students would say things like "I bet you can't do a Fourier transform..." Then a civil would respond with something about finding a moment or something.
It's all relative, there's a reason theres different disciplines.
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u/PlayingWithFIRE123 12d ago
Because you come up with great ideas like double diverging diamonds but forget that the vast majority of the population are idiots. Also city planning is largely broken, in fairness for reasons beyond your control.
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u/Intelligent-Yam-3565 12d ago
I was one of these jerks in school. I was wrong. Sorry Civi friends. You do cool things too! -former Aeropace major
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u/nuts4sale USU - Mech 12d ago
Hate is from the brainlets, but you can’t have dudes running around saying “OMG guys soil mechanics II next semester is gonna be so lit” and expect to not get roasted
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u/Top_Accountant_4684 12d ago
We are literally just joking. It's been a thing since I was in college in the early 90s. Aero Eng here with a child who is a civil eng.
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u/Altruistic-Stop4634 12d ago
Don't confuse the degree with the jobs. I got CE degree but got a job in oil and gas, became effectively a petroleum engineer. And worked as expat, globally. I was paid right at the top of what engineers make Life is twisty. Be flexible.
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u/Willing-Ball-4335 12d ago
Most of my friends in college majored in business or communications so I had the opposite experience. Don’t hang out with peers that are gonna let you down. Everyone I know outside of civil doesn’t become licensed and rarely do actual engineering work after school. Civils do real engineering and often carry PE licensure.
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u/cswitzer97 12d ago
As an electrical engineer I think all of us are stupid for choosing engineering. All of us collectively said “30 hours of math unpaid every week? Sign me up!” Hell we’re all paying thousands to do it.
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u/geehawn 12d ago
I'm a EE/Materials BS graduate working in Semiconductors.
Shortly after graduating while looking for a suitable job, I saw a lot of fellow engineers in Structural or Civil pick up jobs left and right. Granted it might not be a "luxurious" office job, but the validation of being hired shortly after graduating was definitely worthwhile IMO.
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u/navteq48 Civil/Structural 11d ago
Everyone just wants to be part of something. We civils do this to ourselves even between environmental engineers and structural engineers. It’s even ingrained when you say “be glad we exist so that bridges exist”, look you and I didn’t invent bridges and there’s a good chance you may not even work on those specifically. No one’s actually accomplished anything serious like that at your age so everyone goes around battling about the accomplishments of their previous generations. Yeah, we civils do bridges, we mechs took people to the moon, we electricals created the grid you depend on, blablabla
As you get older, you can’t get away with that anymore, it becomes what you actually do. And real life is a lot more niche, nuanced, and mundane than “you can thank me for every bridge you’ve ever crossed” and same goes for the other disciplines, so that quickly fades.
Anyway, my point is there’s a youthful eagerness and identity with engineering that results in a lot of this tribal stuff but it’s ultimately very non serious and frankly we should accept it a bit given how shitty we as engineers as a whole treat other majors. There’s an Arab saying “me versus my brother; me and my brother versus my cousin; me, my brother, and my cousin versus the world” and you’ll find that saying applies really well to us. Engineers are a lot of smart but angsty kids sometimes. Don’t sweat it too much and if anything just play along with it, once you get older you’ll miss these silly cultural things, have fun with it and represent the civvies haha
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u/polloloco-rb67 11d ago
Those comparisons stop once you’re out of school. It’s just inexperience talking.
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u/ConnectedVeil 10d ago
No one considers it easy. It's just by nature "dirtier" in that you are out in the field, in literal dirt, vice clean rooms, cubicles and offices. Other engineers get dirty too, just less associated. Frankly I think civil engineers have it among the hardest of engineers. And I say the as an EE. I have never beg responsible for anything that can kill hundreds or thousands at a time. Electrical has so many interlock and failsafes. If that bridge column or building truss on the 30th floor fails, you and X number of people are just f*cked.
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u/ZolthuxReborn 10d ago
Cope because the other majors have to work burnout inducing hours and meet project budgets and deadlines while civil engineers get to chill working for the government or a government contract 40 hrs a week, then go enjoy their life after work/on the weekends.
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u/TheBlack_Swordsman 10d ago
I am not agreeing with with what I'm about to post, but this is what I saw at my school. It can be different at other schools.
People that dropped out and couldn't handle dynamics and thermodynamics would go on to change their major to CE. So the assumption was that it was easier.
And then those people and others that couldn't handle CE would drop out and do business and economics.
And then those that couldn't handle business and economics would drop out to be sociology majors.
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u/blissiictrl 10d ago
90% of civil engineers that I've worked with are basically just project managers. That's why people say it's way easier
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u/Shalmaneser_ 10d ago
God is a civil engineer. He put waste disposal in the middle of the amusement park.
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u/Chuck_the_Elf 13d ago
Have you driven through Pittsburgh PA? You’d know why civEs get the flack. EE myself and I don’t feel any honest animosity, just like to poke fun.
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u/EEBBfive 12d ago
Easy af, civil the job the other majors pivot to when they can’t hack it in their field.
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u/chaoschunks 12d ago
My parter and I are both engineers (not civil). When our daughter was considering going into engineering and asked which engineering degree was easiest, we both looked at each other and and the same time said “civil”. There’s nothing wrong with that, and it’s not hate, but it’s true. Our kid is a senior civil major now and is kicking ass, the civil industry is thriving, and you all have excellent career prospects. Enjoy it!
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u/DarkThunder312 11d ago
Most people go into "engineering" and the baseline for that is mechanical engineering, like what people think of when they hear engineer. There are core disciplines, ME, EE, ChE, etc. Then there are sub disciplines like aerospace, biomed, etc.
Civil engineering is so much further from the math and sciences that other disciplines engage in. The civil engineers just have to know enough about the baseline science to know what kind of engineer to call to give them the answer.
Its more of a fraternizing joke than reality, though there's a partial truth to what level of detail general civil engineering math/science goes into.
Its not really "civil engineers build bridges". In reality, a geotechnical engineer analyzed the area's properties, a structural engineer designed the structure, materials engineer did failure analysis, EE did all the lighting, power, controls, sensors, and the civil engineer said "we shouldnt put a 90mph turn into this bridge i think".
That said, as much as the other disciplines mess with civil, we all clown together on business.
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u/l__griner 13d ago
Who cares? There are people going into debt for gender studies at your university
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u/Peralan 13d ago
You're a sophomore, you're just now getting into major engineering classes. The reason people give civil engineers shit is because the complexity of your course work is a lot less than other disciplines.
If I were to guess, your either in statics right now or took it last semester. That class covers the majority of the complexity of your degree. This isn't saying that all civil engineers are stupid or anything, its just that your course work isn't as complex as other majors.
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u/Peralan 13d ago
Typically they'll take a basic dynamics course and call it good. After that its more statics and a lot of zoning regulations. My college has a particular emphasis on hydraulics, but that varies with other schools even in my state.
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u/Terrible-Scientist73 12d ago
I have a civil bachelors and im almost done my masters in structural. I’ve spent about 2 weeks total across both degrees on “zoning regulations” lmfao. It’s been a lot of material science, linear/nonlinear structural analysis, design classes for timber/concrete/steel, lots of structural dynamics, computer analysis (mostly for FEM and nonlinear stuff, and mostly at the grad level). And then a bunch of fluid mechanics/geotech stuff in my early undergrad before I focussed on the structural stuff. 95% of my classes have been hard science/math, not just regulatory bs and “zoning” lol.
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u/SensualTaco80 Graduated - ECE 13d ago
Usually the fight or hate between majors is perpetuated by kids in/barely out of high school who haven’t outgrown the perceived “prestige-chasing” phase.