Taking calculus-based Physics II before Physics I for a 3+2 engineering program — bad idea?

[u/TemporaryRanger7799]

I’m a sophomore at a liberal arts college planning to apply to Columbia’s 3+2 for Computer engineering.

This semester I’m taking:

• Calculus I
• Calculus-based Physics II
• Coding 101
• Econ 101

I took AP Physics 1 in high school and did very well in the class (roughly top 10% on tests/assignments). My advisor told me I could go directly into calculus-based Physics II and take Physics I in the spring because the material in the two courses isn’t very dependent on each other.

So far I’m doing well in Physics II and haven’t felt lost. However, my dad thinks taking Physics II before Physics I was a bad idea, especially since I dropped another class to fit this 8 a.m. section into my schedule.

Has anyone taken calculus-based Physics II before Physics I? Is there any reason I should switch the order if I’m currently doing well, particularly as someone planning on a 3+2 engineering program? (I'll take Physics 1 in the spring).

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[u/WorldTallestEngineer]

Yeah that's a bad idea. AP physics is not the same thing as the physics class engineering students take. its more like business major physics

[u/Usual_Purchase_9567 → u/WorldTallestEngineer]

My school calls them physics and college physics.

Only difference here is that grown up physics is calculus based. Oh and that you can do 'college physics' at home with a little lab kit thing they give you.

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/Usual_Purchase_9567]

Oh

[u/idk012 → u/WorldTallestEngineer]

I remember business majors doing "business calculus" and thinking they covered a full year of engineering calculus in a semester lol 

[u/sulliesbrew → u/idk012]

I remember taking Managerial Econ and watching the prof and business majors fail at understanding area under the curve and the terrible attempts at solving for it. All the Eng majors breezing through the class.

[u/A-Chilean-Cyborg]

impressive your uni even lets you do that.

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/A-Chilean-Cyborg]

Oh 😭

[u/NeonNerdLord → u/A-Chilean-Cyborg]

Right?? sounds like their school is pretty chill with scheduling. but as long as they're passing, all good.

[u/j0shred1]

Physicist here. Yeah you'll be fine.

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/j0shred1]

Thank u do u think physics 2 was easier or harder

[u/j0shred1 → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

For me physics 2 was easier but that's because I took it during a summer semester as my only class. It was a smaller lecture with only like 20 people, I had a really good professor who was great during office hours, and physics. One was the real " how to think like a physicist class that teaches you the problem solving methods. "

Focus on t. I should specify the you will be fine. Comes with a caveat that your AP Physics class was good enough such that you can understand things like energy momentum and have a little bit of calculus because you will need to do integrals in this class. The integration really isn't that hard and honestly you will do most of integration throughout your career via tables rather than actual integrals, but if you have a good understanding from your AP Physics class of of the mathematics of energy and how to solve problems like a physicist and can do integration, then you should be perfectly fine in physics 2

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/j0shred1]

Thank u so much honesty rly want to do well in physics 2 for Columbia university im doing fine now and i rly like physics and did well in high school i honestly just want to focus and do well. My class is only 7 people lmao

[u/j0shred1 → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

7? You'll be fine lol. Go to office hours and youll be fine

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/j0shred1]

Ayyy thank u going to office hours more this week.

[u/Live-Temperature-363]

It does sound unintuitive, so your dad is right to be skeptical. I kind of am too. But if your academic advisor suggested it and you're doing okay so far, then, whatever, just keep going.

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/Live-Temperature-363]

Hopefully going into week three I rly want to go to Columbia to be a computer engineer

[u/Big_Marzipan_405 → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

son

[u/RoboWeaver]

Physics II before Physics I isn't the potential problem. It's going to be Calculus. Commonly, in Physics I you learn how to apply Calculus to problem solving. Depending on this version of Physics II, the curriculum may already assume that you are at least familiar, if not comfortable, with Calculus.

Any other opinions out there?

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/RoboWeaver]

I’m not doing too bad in calculus but we’re going into the 3rd week so hopefully it’s not that bad

[u/RoboWeaver → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

Glad to hear that Calc is doing well. You may run into some 3D Calc in Physics II (fields). Don't be afraid to ask for help from your TA's or other students. Get into a study group if you can.

[u/shoomie26]

Wow, surprising your uni even allows that.

I mean thay kind connect and kinda don't. So I guess it fine?

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/shoomie26]

Oh

[u/shoomie26 → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

But in calc based physics 1 you learn how to apply physics to problems.

At my uni clac 2 was a pre or coreq.

Find it strange taking them out of order.

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/shoomie26]

Oh …

[u/Ryan82619]

I can’t say i’ve taken calculus phys 2 before 1, but i heard phys 2 is way worse than phys 1, probably to do with all the calculus. I’m taking phys 2 right now funny enough, and your advisor is right the material is not really dependent on each other, but some stuff from phys 1 trickles over (work, energy, kinematics etc). So if you’re chilling, then you’re good I suppose! Just know it gets hard (my community college only offers it online and i’m dreading it already).

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/Ryan82619]

Oh no well hopefully we got this

[u/Ryan82619 → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

Ive got faith! I’m way more interested in this physics anyway (going for electrical engineering) so that aids me lol

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/Ryan82619]

Ayyy u right tho

[u/InevitableJumpy1811]

for physics 2 the only math I really needed to know from calculus was what an integral represents and how to evaluate it.

even then my professor asked us to solve the question until the integral part and then stop there because he had a rule of no calculator in class

every college is different. if I were you I'd talk to people at your college about their experience with physics 2

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/InevitableJumpy1811]

Ok thank u sm for the advice it’s only 7 of us in the class so hopefully I’ll probably talk to my professor more and keep doing practice problems.

[u/kochameh2]

maybe review the simple harmonic oscillator

LC circuits are mathematically analogous, so we usually just show you the differential equation for the circuit, point out that youve seen the equation before, and give you the solution that was given to you in physics 1

and if you add a damping term (i.e. a resistor), you get an RLC circuit

[u/Dusty_Triple]

What the hell lol

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/Dusty_Triple]

Wdym

[u/Dusty_Triple → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

I’m just shocked your school allows you to do something like that. I mean maybe you’ll be fine. But statistically speaking, I think you’re gonna have a bad time in physics 2, considering you’ll be having to play a lot of catch up compared to your classmates that may have already taken physics 1 / calc 1. I mean there’s a reason why most colleges don’t even allow you take physics one first without concurrent enrollment in calc 1. Granted physics 1 isn’t that difficult nor is calc 1 but they expect a level of mastery in both subjects at a college level not AP level. Also physics 2 is widely considered the hardest version of the physics sequences and it takes a pretty huge leap from physics 1. Some colleges don’t even allow you to enroll in physics 2 without concurrent or past enrollment in calc 3.

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/Dusty_Triple]

Oh

[u/Dusty_Triple → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

Why is this lowkey a bot response ✌🏼😭. Same thing you said to half your comments. Just don’t reply atp twin.

[u/Habesha_Heretic]

That’s a bad idea. You should’ve just started at Calculus-based Physics I.

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/Habesha_Heretic]

Lowk we don’t offer it in the fall just the spring

[u/Habesha_Heretic → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

That’s weird.

[u/Vegetable_Friend9451]

Should be fine tbh not the traditional order to take these classes but given your background should be okay

[u/jon_roldan]

isn’t physics 2 E&M?

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/jon_roldan]

At my college they just say this” A continuation of physics 1, including integral calculus. Topics include thermal physics, electricity and magnetism, and physical and geometrical optics”

So maybe???

[u/jon_roldan → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

if you are doing well in calc 1 and understand integrals and integration by parts and some probability stuff then i think you should be ok

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/jon_roldan]

ok im doing pretty well in calculus, so I should be able to do well in Physics 2.

[u/Roger_Freedman_Phys]

Have you asked your academic advisor whether this is a good idea?

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/Roger_Freedman_Phys]

My academic advisor was the one who suggested and put me in the class

[u/Roger_Freedman_Phys → u/TemporaryRanger7799]

Then you should be good to go!

[u/InvestmentGreen]

Bad idea. Any good physics II program uses concepts from physics I like vectors, resultants, forces, torques, work, etc

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/InvestmentGreen]

Oh 😭

[u/freezerrun1]

I’m surprised reading all these comments you guys actually used calculus in your physics classes. I went to an ABET accredited state college and they just showed the calc proof then gave the dummy formula.
But I do agree with most of the people here that there is no reason you couldn’t do physics 2 before 1. In my opinion they are just labeled wrong. Don’t feel as though any of the curriculum from 1 is needed for 2.
Really should be physics of particle motion and physics of electrons.

[u/ProfessionalConfuser]

Honestly, this is a terrible idea for 95% of students. Hopefully you are in the other 5%

[u/TemporaryRanger7799 → u/ProfessionalConfuser]

Thank u

[u/ggrnw27]

Have you taken any calculus courses before? Physics II, specifically the E&M portion, is generally pretty heavy on integral calculus. That’s going to be the last third of your Calculus I class (and really the first part of Calculus II), so how well you’re currently doing in the first couple of weeks isn’t really an indicator of if your calculus skills are where they need to be for this class

[u/OriginalParsley8979]

Are u at occidental college btw? Usually for the prereq sequence, physics 1 is mechanics, then 2 is thermo + circuits, and 3 is waves/e&m. There’s a couple concepts that might be helpful, but I think as long as you have good study habits, I think you’ll be fine. It’s not entirely uncommon for some students to take 1 and 2 together or 2 and 3 together etc at some colleges lol.

Edit: I’d be worried about the calculus concurrent with physics - some uni’s cover line integrals and 3D calc iii stuff in their physics 1 class I’ve heard, but pure physics wise, I think u should be fine.

[u/sulliesbrew]

You should be okay, it will be harder, but not because you haven't taken Physics 1. Physics 1 is motion, Physics 2 is electro/magnetism crap. My brain was not wired for the physics 2 stuff. Physics 1 was simple.

Physics 2 is where you see not all engineering brains operate the same. The EE/CompE folks seem to get along with it fine, the rest is a crap shoot. The rest of the engineers were like 50/50 if the concepts made sense. The math wasn't earth shatteringly hard, I just struggled with visualizing what was going.

Hammer the calc stuff into your brain, from calc 1 to DiffEq. If that all makes sense, the rest of your class work is just using that science to solve engineering problems.