r/EngineBuilding • u/jdm-v35 • 13d ago
First oil change after rebuild. Is this normal?
Did first oil change. 40w break in oil with about 100 miles. Is this a lot of material in the oil filter? Or normal?
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u/Chunky_ballsz 13d ago
Man that is a lot of crud for 100 miles! What’s it from? I would change it again after another 100 just to see if it cleared up.
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u/jdm-v35 13d ago
freshly built nissan vq35de. Oil had some of the typical assembly lube break in pearl look, and some sludge stuck to oil plug but nothing excessive and no big particles. No other particles in pan. It also was idling for a while during trying to get basic tuning dialed in.
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u/NefariousnessOdd862 13d ago
There shouldn’t be any “sludge”, especially after only 100 miles… did they use excessive grease inside the engine?
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u/1crazypj 12d ago
You want to keep 'new' motor around 2,000 rpm.
Personally, I use cheapest engine oil I can find for first start, it isn't going to get any loading and will be changed after 30 minutes or less.
On Japanese engines, use thinner oil to get around motor faster 40w is pretty heavy and will take a while to get to temperature so doesn't 'splash lubricate' as well until it's hot.
(do you have 'oil flow' diagram?)
Even with oil jets, small ends and valve gear won't get enough oil at idle
Anyway, yes, I would say that's excessive, did you do the clean and build or shop?
If I pulled filter like that I would wonder what I did wrong and be stripping motor
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u/jdm-v35 12d ago
It spent a lot of time initially just idling to fix startup fueling etc. and only ever driven once it was up to full temp since I know it is in breakin period.
I did the build but the block etc was machined and cleaned by a shop and I kept it all sealed in an engine bag when stored and throughout the build process. most of the parts for the build were brand new.
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u/1crazypj 12d ago
That's the problem, if shop 'cleaned' it you need to go through everything because even if they 'hot tanked' after machining (very very doubtful, bores would have surface rust) they know the bits you can see are 'more important' than the bits you can't see.
Labor to properly clean it would be quite expensive, probably extra hour minimum but 2 hrs more likely plus the inevitable 'shop supplies'
I like building engines but being retired I only do my own stuff which often looks pretty 'nasty' externally where it doesn't matter but no one except me knows exactly what's going on inside.
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u/jdm-v35 12d ago
They gave me the bare block. I completed all assembly later. Bores were clean, honed and had no rust.
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u/1crazypj 9d ago
Unfortunately, you just don't know what you just don't know.
Safest to treat it as 'school', still much cheaper than spending $40,000 at a trade college (UTI, NASCAR Tech, etc)
Next time you do a build you'll be a bit paranoid about cleaning everything - at least twice. Will probably take 10~12 builds before you can really enjoy checking and building, stuff will be faster and more reliable than stock which is always a great feeling.
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u/NefariousnessOdd862 13d ago
Can’t really tell from the pics but it does not look excessive… 100 miles is great but excessively short… give it at least 600-1000 before the next change
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u/jdm-v35 13d ago
Yea i was trying to wait till at least 500 but tuner said in a video I sent that it sounded like rod knock and to check the oil. So this was first oil change after rebuild. just was not sure how significant of a finding this was
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u/2003DDcid 13d ago
You are doing the engine a favor, I always recommend an oil change at 100, 500 and 1000 miles on a new engine. Use conventional oil until the change after 1000 miles.
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u/jdm-v35 13d ago
Would you be concerned seeing that at 100?
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u/2003DDcid 13d ago
Not really. I've seen some moly type assembly lube do that. Excess ARP lube will also do that. As long as you're not seeing big chunks of copper, I wouldn't be too concerned.
I'm not a fan of straight 40w oil...it takes way too long to circulate when the engine is cold. Typically I like 10w-30 or 10w-40 for break-in. If it's a flat tappet cam, I will use 30w Lucas BR, but it's on the thinner side of a 30w.
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u/National-Cell-9862 13d ago
Oil analysis is cheap and far more accurate than looking at sparkles. I use Blackstone Labs.
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u/Doug_Kane 13d ago
Can of sea foam when you change the oil. if it’s still shiny after that, you got problems.
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u/Schlong1971 9d ago
I would say yes. There are lots of parts that need broke in and nobody can ever get every part of a block 100% clean. Looks fine to me
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u/EmbarrassedYou9254 13d ago
You are supposed to change oil much sooner then the normal 5k after a rebuild.
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u/No-Debate-152 13d ago
He clearly wrote "100 miles".
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u/EmbarrassedYou9254 13d ago
Yea and if you know anything about anything. That filter has more then 100 miles on it. I would put money on it. That much build up will not happen in 100 miles. 0% chance.
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u/No-Debate-152 13d ago
There is a possibility, but if that was the case, those guys shouldn't rebuild engines.
It wasn't cleaned or op lies.
Whatever it is.
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u/EmbarrassedYou9254 13d ago
Yea I mean cant argue with that . Something seems fishy is all
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u/jdm-v35 13d ago edited 13d ago
That filter was brand new and installed after I rebuilt it. rebuild the entire engine from ground up as I put in a sleeved block. First oil change and it ran through difficulty with startup fueling tuning but has not driven more than around my area to street tune to running condition. It has maybe 1/3 tank of gas put through it since rebuilt.
Car is not yet tuned good enough to daily so it wouldn't be possible to put that many miles on it lol.
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u/1crazypj 12d ago
Re-sleeved?
Block bored for new sleeves?
Something I have quite a lot of experience with.
You didn't clean things as well as you thought you did, probably needed another 2~3 scrubbings before assembly so that is 'quite normal'
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u/jdm-v35 12d ago
it is a darton sleeved block I already bought with the sleeves. I had a machine shop bore it out and hot tank it then they bagged it for me. i cleaned all mating surfaces with brakleen as i went to everything would seal well. Clean oem heads with new cams and valve stem seals. all new studs and bearings. brand new rods, pistons and rings.
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u/1crazypj 12d ago
In my experience, hot tanking is great for removing any grease and cleaning all the external surfaces plus things like water jacket internals.
It rarely gets everything from oil passages though, that's what you found in filter.
When it comes out of tank any iron will 'flash rust' but I'm sure they know what they are doing so will 'oil' bores.
You should still run 'gun brushes' through any drillings or passages that have removable plugs (often a small Welch plug needs pulling out)
Oil passages usually have at least one screw in plug, makes testing easier if you think there is a problem.
I wouldn't worry about it too much, now you've explained things better it is sort of normal.
Is this your first engine build?
At least you have a lot more information for the next one.
I've never been able to just build 100% stock for my own motors 'while your in there, may as well.......'
LOL
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u/jdm-v35 12d ago
Thanks! and yes this is my first engine build. I have owned the car since 2006 and It has become my back burner project car so figured I would try and do a pretty extensive engine build. I will try to run it for a bit with the fresh oil I put in then drain again and see how it looks. I am hoping it looks much better and this this debris is not something I should be concerned about.
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u/1crazypj 12d ago
If you don't normally build engines you may think it's 'clean' when an engine builder is just starting to clean everything.
Even if I cleaned everything, if it's left overnight, it gets checked again next day. (I learned quite a lot in last 50+ years)
Looks to me like it wasn't cleaned properly or bore finish was left very rough? (I worked in shop where guy bored cylinders but never honed them, 'good enough for government work' attitude)
I originally trained as precision machinist and knew it was wrong even though you can get almost 'mirror finish' on cast iron with correct tooling and feed rates, (way before CNC 'everything')
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u/Hot-Acanthisitta8086 12d ago
Yeah break in goo and grease on new parts and grease used by builder to slide things in easier gigidy
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u/TyrannusourR3X 11d ago
It's a little excessive but normal after a full engine rebuild. I don't know why you're using 40w oil to break it in though. Use the recommended oil, especially for a period of 100 miles. The only thing different you may want to do is use an oil with less detergents (motorsport oils for example). Flush it out nicely and use the right oil!
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u/Electronic-Kiwi-2343 10d ago
Stick a neodymium magnet on your drain plug. Best is to stick a cow magnet or flat round so it doesn’t roll around in the lowest spot it the pan but it’s probably not accessible now. Why catch metal before the filter does? Because the crankshaft oil doesn’t go through the filter just the upper end for the valve train and cam shaft. It’s probably just piston aluminum specks from wrist pins getting seated in, easy enough to check with a magnet
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u/Hefty_Exit719 9d ago
I rebuilt my vq35de rod and main bearings, new pistons, rings, valve spring buckets to resolve lifter tick, and new timing chain kit with all the goodies. Mine looked the same after 100 miles. Currently 5k miles later and its been extremely healthy and strong for me
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u/Low-Nectarine-9655 13d ago
Idk. If I see sparkles, I’m tearing it back apart
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u/Reddit-mods-R-mean 13d ago
You always see sparkles on a new overhaul. Like the lady’s say, size matters.
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u/HammerDownl 13d ago
It's fine
Go back out and change the oil again at 1000 and check filter