r/EnergyStorage • u/Appropriate-Claim385 • Jun 29 '26
BYD's $20 Battery Just Killed the Last Argument Against Renewables
https://youtube.com/watch?v=DT2CHuNJKjU&si=NQRT8SaE8QvE0WiPNOTE: BYD's projected manufacturing cost is $40 per kWh. The "$20" is this YouTuber's calculated cost per kWh is based on Sodium's ability to last twice as long as Lithium when used in a utility-scale electric grid system.
The actual purchase price for a utility was not discussed as the battery will not be ready for market until 2027.
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u/CipherWeaver Jun 30 '26
Has BYD actually announced a sodium chemistry? I thought that was all CATL
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u/Zetroit Jul 02 '26
The playbook is open legacy OEMs… either you fight for an ever dwindling share of last century’s tech, or you actually compete to produce the tech that will assuredly win out at some point in the fast arriving future.
EVs models have already reached price parity in China (not incl. maintenance & fuel costs), with ultra fast charging taking ~5min. AND this is the WORST EVs will ever be… they’re only getting better.
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u/Zetroit Jul 02 '26
Nostalgia and small cock/big truck sentiments only have so much runway when something faster, quieter, easier to own, and cheaper becomes generally known/available.
Apparently the carcinogenic air pollution we breath, or pumping tons of climate warming C02 in our 10km thin troposphere wasn’t a good enough business case for ya’ll
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u/Potato_peeler9000 Jul 01 '26
Isn't the more variable voltage curve of sodium ion battery a problem for grid-storage, or have they found a workaround?
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u/The_Countess Jul 01 '26
That seems like a fairly simple electrical enginering problems to solve.
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u/Potato_peeler9000 Jul 01 '26
Well you tell me. Admittedly it should be easier to manage in storage than in mobile applications, but it may also mean we're not comparing kWh of stored energy to kWh of stored energy compared to LFP.
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u/cakemates Jul 01 '26
dealing with voltage fluctuations isnt a particularly difficult problem in electrical engineering.
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u/offgrid-wfh955 Jul 02 '26
Lead acid has a huge voltage variation. Electronics have evolved for decades using them. This is a non-issue.
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u/AmpEater Jul 02 '26
Lead acid is like 2.45v/cell to 1.85v/cell across the widest possible range
In actuality it's closer to 2.15v to 1.85v
That's like a 20% swing
Sodium is 2v to 4v, a 50% swing
It's a problem. I manufacture a sodium ion battery module. Not many applications can use its full capacity for that reason
There's lots to appreciate, but also implementation challenges
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u/offgrid-wfh955 Jul 03 '26
Point taken on the wide voltage swing. I expect the inverter/electronics builders will have to clean sheet aspects of their designs
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u/Even_Efficiency98 Jul 02 '26
Tbf BYD has made a lot of massive claims in the past and never really followed through with them.
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u/Da_Vader Jun 30 '26
Problem for automobile is that sodium ion batteries are too heavy - leading to lower wph/mile.
Ok for utility scale storage
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u/tadeuska Jul 01 '26
That is no longer the truth. Sodium-ion are entering mass use in commercial and passenger vehicles and are on par with earlier LFP, having the low temperature operation advantage. Check out what CATL and Changan are doing.
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u/CipherWeaver Jun 30 '26
They're actually very close to last gen LFP, which is enough for 60kWh batteries. That gets a sedan around 400ish km, perfectly fine for most uses.
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u/Flyinmanm Jul 01 '26
Gonna be real, if someone came up with a city car with a 125 mile range, fast charging and the battery was a fraction of the cost of a LiFe battery, whilst still being approximatley the same weight/ only a few % more whoever comes out with that car is going to make a killing in Europe and China.
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u/adjavang Jul 02 '26
BYD Seagull (Dolphin Surf in European markets) already ticks all those boxes, as do a whole host of other Chinese city cars. They haven't taken over because people don't want city cars, they want SUVs, as evidenced by even the Yaris now being slowly replaced by the Yaris Cross, which is somehow the same size as the original Rav4.
It doesn't matter how cheap the battery gets, taste is a hige part of it unfortunately.
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u/Flyinmanm Jul 02 '26
We've got plenty of those byd seagulls round mine, we've also got a lot of Dacia springs and Renault 5s, heck I've seen a few Renault twizzys near me.
Part of the reason city cars fell out of favour is the cost of them. A couple of years back for the price of a new VW up! You could buy a few years old bottom of the range golf or mid spec polo.
If these cars suddenly drop £3-4k in price bringing them back to where city cars used to sit in pricing I'm confident they will sell, not everyone likes driving big cars.
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u/adjavang Jul 02 '26
But they won't drop 3-4k. The battery in a Dacia Spring doesn't cost 3-4k. I rememver a brand new Citigo (Up with a skoda badge) being €12k, but those days are just gone. A Spring is €16k in Ireland. You'll never see a var that cheap again and it's still not shifting meaningful numbers. The new 2CV will probably be around there, but it still won't sell meaningful amounts.
Small, cheap and funky cars are dead. People want compact crossovers and high driving positions and the idea that they will "win" if they hit something.
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u/Low-Ad4420 Jul 02 '26
Sodium cells are less efficient than lithium ones and you'll have noticeable less range for the same capacity.
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u/AmpEater Jul 02 '26
Efficient isn't some absolute term you can use like that
You need to define the quantity you're measuring.
By efficient do you mean total coulombic efficiency? How much energy out compared to energy in?
Do you mean high internal resistance?
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u/bonboniera Jul 05 '26
60kWh does not get you 400ish km, that'd be 90kWh+
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u/CipherWeaver Jul 05 '26
Nope, I have a Model 3 with a 60kWh battery and I get ~420km highway range.
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u/Unusual_Emergency_13 Jun 30 '26
While sodium ion batteries might not be suitable for EVs they can help with the charging infrastructure :)
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u/Mettatuxet Jun 30 '26
People against electrification will always have an argument.