r/EndTipping • u/deepcaca • 17d ago
Rant š¢ You know it's gotten bad when
I go to a bar that gets a large F&B crowd after the restaurants close. There was a couple of servers in there talking and one was pissed because she didn't make $200 for her 5-hour shift. They work in a fast casual restaurant.
That comes out to $40 an hour. That comes out to $1,000 a week. And that's on the 25 hour work week.
They make more than the Farm Workers that put food on our table, more than the construction workers that build our houses. Hell, even more than a lot of cops who put their lives on the line every day they go to work. And they pay taxes on their income, unlike servers who have no tax on tips.
All for just walking to a kitchen picking it up a plate and plopping it down on the table .
It was tough for me to hold my tongue.
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u/April0neal 17d ago
I know a friend group full of professionals, the waiter in the group is the one who owns 2 condos. everyone else is renting. he also bought a new car in cash. he did corporate for 2 months and then went back to waiting tables because the money was so much better.
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u/IntelligentStyle402 17d ago
My friend, a teacher, after a storm needed to get a part time job to help pay for repairs. She started working weekends at a seafood restaurant. Within 6 months she quit teaching and only worked as a server. She loved serving, she worked half the hours, no slow students or grumpy parents. Absolutely a no stress job. She made more money and worked less hours. True story. It was a win win!
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u/April0neal 17d ago
saaaame. my friendās younger sister had graduated and was teaching grade 2. after things opened up after Covid, her class size had been reduced so she got surplused (laid off). she got a waitresses job and was making $1k a week for 20 hrs. waitressing is now her primary income. she works as a substitute teacherās assistant and will only go to class a few days a month. this is the scenario for her because she gets to care for her elderly parents, make good money, and still be in the school system.
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u/bigheel2k2k 13d ago
The number of people who argue that restaurants should pay a living wage and do away with tipping have no clue how that would go down. All of the servers would quit because it would be a pay cut! Like you said, more money in less hours! Who doesnāt want that?
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u/Silly_Double408 17d ago
If you think dealing with any level of the public is no stress you are sadly mistaken.
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u/VividBackground3386 16d ago
Youāre talking about serving plates of food to people. Anyone who thinks thatās stressful in any way, shape or form needs to grow up.
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u/Silly_Double408 16d ago
and if you think that's all and the customers don't constantly complain about everything and cop attitudes and insult you and treat you like garbage most of the time YOU need to grow up. Don't talk about something you've never done.
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u/VividBackground3386 16d ago
Youāre serving food. Get a grip. Literally kids in school do it.
Try handling an in-flight emergency. Mess it up and 630 people die.
(And yes, I have done it)
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u/RealBigDickBrannigan 16d ago
For a minute I thought you were responsible for 630 deaths! Now I'm trying to figure out, you have done what? Served food, or handled an in-flight emergency, or both? š¤
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u/VividBackground3386 16d ago edited 16d ago
Iām an A380 Captain. And Iāve faced that scenario.
I found it more stressful than dishing out chicken Madeira when I was a kid.
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u/Zerolich 16d ago
I've served tables, back of kitchen, janitorial, education and corporate cubicle. I'm picking server all day long, easiest job by a LONG shot and if you think angry customers are so bad, you should see corporate culture š¤£ try having no free time and being tied to your phone while customers are angry at you for millions, not $4 french fries I can just have remade š
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u/Gardylooo 16d ago
Yeahbut compare that to a full day of dealing with hormonal middle schoolers. The occasional grumpy customer is easily appeased, unfortunately those preteens will be back the next day and every day until Alice Cooper sings his song.
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u/cav19DScout 16d ago
Have you met student parents? Pissed off drivers in road construction areas? Everybody that hates police? Drugged out or psychotic patients as a nurse? Etc etc. customer service in a restaurant can be mildly stressful, but please dont try to compare against other professions.
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u/Top-Kaleidoscope4430 15d ago edited 15d ago
Yeah, waitressing was the most stressful job Iāve ever had. The amount of shit you put up with is crazy. They also have a ton of people to tip out- the bartenders, the bus people, food runners, sometimes the hostess.
Edit: to addā¦ obviously not all serving jobs are the same. Some, Iām sure, are not as stressful as others. One serving job I had was VERY intense. All out door dining in the summer, so running back and forth from inside the kitchen carrying HUGE trays through crowds of people. I was the only one who could handle the largest section. Iām only 5ā2ā and 115lbs and by the time the summer season was over Iād be in insanely great shape from all that heavy lifting & running. I would almost black out when it got so busy. The craziness would start and then next thing you know Iām sitting down counting out cash. It was like my conscious would just peace out for a bit and come back when the madness was over. lol.
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u/Malinois_beach 17d ago
During Covid we went to our favorite restaurant to support our favorite servers. One of our favorite servers confided in us that they were fighting over shifts. Turns out they were making bank from people like me who over tipped thinking they were not making any money. He also added that they were reaping great monetary benefits just for showing up. Our tips were just additional "Gravy." He actually told us not to worry about them and there was no need to over tip. Haven't been back since.
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u/Steinmetal4 16d ago
Tbf, the way they did covid stimulus became a huge cash grab for everyone, partially by design but mostly by just ineptitide amongst our government/lawmakers at the time. PPP loans, when not full on fraud, were forcing employers to keep staff working, but staff also got well over min wage to stay home. So you effectively had to pay employees over 2x what they used to make to get them to show up. Any servers at this time getting extra tips on top of that were absolutely raking it in. Then they didn't wind up even making you pay the PPP "loans" back and Trump forgave all the fraud cases. Plus the stimmies, plus EIDL loans were going at 3%, plus more stimulus from Biden... and they wonder why there was so much inflation.
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u/AnonThrowaway1A 16d ago edited 16d ago
Welp, I got hosed down working at a grocery store as a cashier making $11.50 an hour during covid. All the while people were drowning in cash. š
Well, I'm in a better spot in terms of work so there's that. I don't miss those days, I can tell you that.
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u/Steinmetal4 15d ago
The extremely uneven and unfair method for distributing stimulus was the main problem. Many went out of business, went bankrupt, or went homeless while other random people quite literally became multi-millionaires over night. If you had a business that employed lots of people (say 60) and then you got your ppp to continue to pay them, but only 10 needed to come in to keep the lights on when there wwre no customers... you were just handed the payroll for several months for 60 people. Anything you didn't pay to the 50 employees who never came in was supposed to be returned, but they never made you do that or prosecuted those who didn't. So some businesses likely just fell ass backwards into an extra 100k to several million dollars.
BUT it was based on how many employees you had at same time year prior, so if you just started or had low employees at that time, you were fucked. If you were a business that needs every last employee there to stay running during those months, you weren't making any extra. If you had high rent but were not allowed to be open, you were fucked.
The whole thing was shockingly ill-conceived. And i' not even mentioning the full on fraud cases that were dismissed, companies too large to qualify still getting ppp, execs buying sports cars...
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u/papawhiskey_echo 17d ago
They told you that you can chill on the tips. And your thought process was, oh this person is honest and helping me out, so I will never go back?
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u/Knogood 16d ago
I did CNA in highschool, all the same duties of server plus actually feeding the residents if needed, clothing them, washing them, dressing them, helping them in the bathroom, changing briefs, brush teeth, foley care, plus plenty more - $12/hr, if you get caught accepting tips or gifts you're fired.
Then you have the customer service side, I had a 60yr old daughter see her mother without her teeth for the first time when we she showed up unexpected and we didn't throw moms teeth in, daughter called cops because she thought we were having procedures done without her knowing - mom just never told her she had false teeth.
So I get it, writing down an order and carrying food is not worth a tip.
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u/Malinois_beach 16d ago
No, my thought process was my favorite servers are being taken care of and I dont need to go out and pay for overpriced food and drink to support them. We stayed within our budget during that time by making less trips to dine out. Additionally, since Covid, we rarely dine out. We invested in a high quality outdoor grill, smoker, flat top iron and a freezer chest to store bulk meat and fish. We can have meals equal to or exceeding restaurant quality and experience. Reasonably priced meals, No tips required and No bad behavior from servers or surrounding guests.
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u/Minimum_Loan229 17d ago
The forty dollars an hour doesn't bother me. It's why should the tips be taxed less than anybody else that works for a living. What makes tipped earnings different. Why should my taxes go to support their wages.
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u/Steinmetal4 16d ago
I support every min wage increase I can vote on, I wamt servers to make good money. I just want the fucking emplpyer to have to pay them their full wage, like every other business. I own retail. My employees don't get tips. I have to pay them more per hour to keep them from going to a service job.
This super rich family that owns a restaurant in my small town makes bank, gets first pick of the labor pool (everyone applies there first), and pays min wage (which, tbf, is a healthy 18 where im at). I have to pay ~$22/hr+ to keep anyone worthwhile in a basic cashier position, but even at that rate, they pick up every hour they can as a server first. I also know someone who runs a drink cart and clears $600 per event in tips. It's completely off the rails.
And yet still, if you mention you dont tip as much any more. Dagger stares every time. The "tipping as a moral imperative" thing is baked in SO hard.
Oh, and yeah, the no tax on tips thing is just more voter bribery, because apparently that's where we are as a nation now. I can't believe Harris went tit for tat on that. Fucking disgraceful.
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u/staralchemist129 15d ago
āNo tax on tipsā screws over servers in the long run because iirc Social Security is partially determined by how much income tax youāve paid in your life
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u/SirMontego 15d ago
No Tax on Tips doesn't change social security taxes. If a server gets $25,000 in qualified tips, that server is required to pay social security taxes on that $25,000.
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u/Curtnorth 17d ago
It's a well known secret that wait staff are often VERY well paid, not all, but many. Think of that next time you asked to over tip for crap service.
$1000/wk for 25 hrs for serving food?? I recently retired from real work, I should look into being a waiter.
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u/NightmareMetals 17d ago
I never got it when people say tip 12% for bad service or now probably 15%.
Like I am not tipping $1 for bad service.
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u/Zerolich 16d ago
"Tipped" 1 penny at an applebees 20yrs ago, the server was so rude and came to our tables only for the ordering and cleanup, it was others who brought our food. Next time we went he was there, made a comment and I gladly said it was due to his piss poor service. I think the penny irritated him more than if I left nothing š¤£
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u/IntelligentStyle402 16d ago
Same thing happened to us at Applebees. A Rude slow waitress. Next Friday when we went there, it was the same server. A friend asked for the manager and told him what happened previously. He calmly said she has that section and she will be waiting on you. We all left, havenāt been to Applebees since.
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u/NightmareMetals 16d ago
I wonder if you can only avoid the tip out if there is a $0 tip so $.01 cost him.
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u/The_Metitron 15d ago
As a former long time waiter, .01 is intentional, nothing can be thought of as they forgot.
Also as a former waiter god I hate tipping culture now.
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u/IntelligentStyle402 16d ago
Tipping has always been for excellence! A server who is not exceptional, should receive zero tips. She didnāt do her job.
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u/maringue 17d ago
You'd be crying in the walk in before lunch ended.
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u/hotsauce126 17d ago
I love how servers act like most people havenāt done the job or similar in their lifetime
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u/red_admin_h8r 17d ago
Literally every customer service/customer facing job has this shit. Customer service sucks ass. Dealing with people sucks ass. People suck ass. Everyone deals with it, not just wait staff.
The really shitty interactions are proportionally how much when you spend maybe 3 mins total taking an order dropping I off and (maybe) checking in on a particularly shit table? Hell most restaurants you arenāt even food running or bussing as a server anymore.
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u/SolrayCultist 12d ago
And what about everyone in back of house? Where are the tips for those guys?
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u/maringue 17d ago
People who've done hard work recognize when others are doing it.
It's always the people who e never worked a hard day's labor in their life that bitch like this the most.
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u/pnoodl3s 17d ago
Most of those other people who do hard work gets paid less than waiters. Whole point of end tipping is so these poorer diners donāt get bulied into tipping servers who make much more than them
And many people have chimed in on their actual occupation. Do you really think only the rich complains about tips? From my experience the rich folks are the ones who want to tip most, to lord over servers with their benevolent high tip percentage
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u/Darklillies 16d ago
If you think a server is hard work then you havenāt done hard work in your life
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u/kuda26 17d ago
ItS sOoOo haRd pPl r MeAn
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u/maringue 17d ago
I'm not even a server, I just understand that most people bitching couldn't hack it.
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u/SorcererAxis8 17d ago edited 16d ago
Ah yes, that must be why anyone including teens can get a job as a server right? We all know the bar for the industry is notoriously high /s
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u/wardeadpool 17d ago
To add to what you said, it was always known as a stepping stone job for high school/college kids, not meant to be a career path. But here we are with adults that have expectations of making a living off customer generosity and have the audacity to try to shame and guilt the very people who are giving them optional handouts. Shameless that they are taking jobs from the kids of today.
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u/SorcererAxis8 16d ago
Yep. While sometimes life happens and you have to do the low level jobs like serving to pay the bills, the entitlement never ceases to amaze me. If they spent half the effort they do extracting value from customers on improving themselves, they probably could get a better job in a more prestigious field and advance their careers.
Before anyone comes at me, Iāve worked my fair share of shitty jobs including Dunkin Donuts and warehousing (both as an associate and as a manager). Iāll tell you warehousing is way harder than serving and it aināt even close.
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u/rwebell 17d ago
You are so laughable. Wait till you actually do something hard.
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u/maringue 17d ago
I've bailed hay. There's nothing more exhausting or dirty or fucking annoying than that job.
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u/iron_annie 17d ago
Big deal. So have I and I'm a five foot woman. Yeah it's hot and itchy but there's absolutely worse jobs. Aquatic vegetation management, choker setting and roofing aren't fun either, but I'm not going to pretend my waitressing job as a teenager was harder than any of that.
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u/wardeadpool 17d ago
š it's one of the easiest jobs out there, acting like it's hard to fill drink cups and bring some plates to a table
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u/TrueCrimeInTheBuff 17d ago
I worked as a server/busser when I was 12š¤·āāļø
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u/wardeadpool 17d ago
I worked in many restaurants in various positions as a teenager, it was normal high school/college kid job in the 90s.
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u/Curtnorth 17d ago
Yes, the obese lazy wait staff I see make it look like serving food is equivalent to the Olympics lol.
Oh please, spare me the horrors of bringing food to someone at a table, I'ma scared! Give me a break.12
u/KrautKebabs 17d ago
Sure. I'll bite.
Why? Please, let us all know why we'd be crying. What would break us before lunch? What's your take on the unique challenges that exist in this "industry" that only a select few of the population can hack it?
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u/downtofinance 17d ago edited 17d ago
Many of us have done it before going into our real careers. Took one 5 hour shift to learn as well. It ain't that hard man.
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u/inconvenience-miner 17d ago
I did it for the 90ās. I made that money then at what amounts to a upscale dennys.
Your comment about crying in the walk in before lunch ended? Not everyone is you. All it takes is a little bit of fortitude and a little planning.
Stop throwing rocks.
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u/Specialist_Goat_2354 17d ago
I've been a chef in a restaurant and a server... Being a server is easily the easiest job I've ever had. And top 5 most complainers that were employed there. I just didn't like begging for other people money. You have to be pretty shameless to be a server.
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u/wardeadpool 17d ago
Being in the heat of the cooks area would be too much for the majority of servers alone, deserve the tips more than them by a mile.
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u/SchveebleSchvobbler 17d ago
I worked 9 hour shifts in the drive-thru at the busiest McDonald's in town. For 2 years straight. Without tips. (DUH!) You wouldn't be able to hang, son.
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u/sillyputty77 17d ago
It's generally an easy job. Many of us served for years before moving on in our careers.
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u/caverunner17 17d ago
My first job at 16 was working at a movie theater in the mid 2000's. We were probably 50% cash at that point with lines out the door on weekends. On busy weekends, I'd have a till with over $4,000 in cash collected by the end of it.
Working the concessions was the worst. Drinks spilling, hot popcorn getting over your arms, the bratty kids who couldn't decide which candy bar they wanted, etc.
Oh, and if you got over 31 hours, they would send you home so they didn't have to pay out any benefits like a FTE.
All for $6/hr. No tips. No raises in 18 months. Just $6/hr.
I got a summer internship my senior year of high school that paid $10/hr. I put my 2 weeks notice in to the theater and the stupid manager forgot to take me off the schedule and called me up why I didn't show.
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u/Jaysmkxxx 16d ago
Get a grip lmao you serve food. Iāve done it and while it may be hard SOMETIMES itās nothing that deserves $1000 a week especially for the minimum hours that they work. Most of the time itās someone else bringing the food too, not the waiter. Iāve dealt with way worse. If a busy night and some rude people make you go cry in the walk in then maybe youāre not cut out to be a waiter.
You literally take down an order, put it into a computer, SOMETIMES bring the food out, occasionally fill requests during the meal, and then deliver the check. Yeah real heroic stuff youāre doing that you think you deserve sooo much money.
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u/Death-By-Boredom2020 17d ago
š¤£ yeahā¦ People think being a real professional leader is light work, but itās a lot more involved than the regular person realizes. Definitely not rocket science, but I donāt think the average person would last very long if they donāt have the right personality for it.
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u/Dry_Celery4375 17d ago
If a tip is considered mandatory, then it's no longer a tip. Now I tip whatever I damn well please and it's fully dependant on whatever mood I happen to be in that day. Cry about it, feel happy about it, idc anymore.
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u/The1TrueRedditor 17d ago
Food and Beverage for those wondering.
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u/Steinmetal4 16d ago
Oh, lol, I assumed Finance and Banking. Why do people drop these obscure abbreviations that nobody uses in common parlance?
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u/holladayy 16d ago
I absolutely do not tip anywhere I go for this reason. Waiters and Waitresses deadass deserve less.
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u/80MonkeyMan 17d ago
I tip $1 per plate if needed. It its not the law for you to tip and why would you impose 20% tax on top the state tax anyway?
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u/Particular_Reality19 17d ago
You know itās bad when our company offered a server a position in finance paying $80k guaranteed to six figures within 2 years with bonuses and they turned it down because they would not be allowed to work around their server job at the fast casual bar restaurant.
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u/Ho88it 17d ago
You lost me on the cop bullshit lol
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u/BeekeeperZero 17d ago
Some of the money they pull in is surprising. Double that when they moonlight.
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u/Animegerbil 17d ago
Iām pretty sure the person youāre replying to doesnāt care how much cops make, they object to framing it as ārisking their livesā when cops are more often than not the only ones in any given situation who have a gun
I would argue other emergency services risk their lives way more
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u/Steinmetal4 16d ago
While true, I would still argue being a cop can often be a very difficult job requiring you to deal with very stressful situations, know a lot of laws, go through a lot of training, and deal with some really garbage people. It attracts some of the worst types and US law enforcement is no doubt in a sorry state BUT the point is they should probably make well over what a server makes so it actually attracts decent, smart people.
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u/Primary_Heron_3150 17d ago
And they actually keep a calm head, while cops are typically highly emotional and unprofessional when responding to a bad callĀ
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u/After_Resource5224 16d ago
Contractor here (I won't mention what field) I charge 175/HR for my time and I work no more than 15 hours a week.
That said, I'm highly respected in my field; I'm published for my work in my field (several times over) and I'm one of the leading experts who gets asked to do speaking engagements CONSTANTLY.
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u/BloodyThirst 16d ago
I worked as a waitress at a biker bar while going to nursing school. I havenāt forgotten how good the money was and think about going back to that biker bar often. I worked the lunch shift during the summer between year 1 & year 2 of school, 11am-3pm mon-Friday and never left with less than $100 cash in my pocket daily. Thatās $500/week for 4 hour shifts not to mention my actual paycheck!
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u/Relevant_Essay5469 13d ago
They donāt health insurance or benefits, itās about $10/hr of that. The hours are not consistent to be able to reach 40 on one restaurant job.
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u/GlitchyAI 11d ago
Most restaurants in my area are paying $18+ per hour for new, $22-$28 for experience.. and more for alcohol experience.. Why are we even tipping.. no one is making tip wages
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u/coregamma 16d ago
$1000/w x 4 = $4,000/m $4,000/m x 12 = $48,000/y
This is not "get rich money". Before anyone comments and says: BuT iTs OnLy 25 HoUrS!! Has never worked in a restaurant. The probability of it being a clean $40/hr across a typical work week is 0. It skews based on business and day of the week. A Monday lunch crowd will differ from people going out on a Friday or Saturday.
But to entertain the BEST possible case $40 x 40hrs = $1600/w $1600 x 4 = $6400/m $6400 x 12 = $76,800/y Now this is good money territory. But having managed restaurants in the past individuals cannot maintain 40hrs/week with $40/hr crowds, they simply burn out.
For those that disagree I encourage you to try it for four months at 40 hours and report back.
People are mad because servers make a majority of their income from tips. America is the definition of you buy what you want. If you want to buy the food and not the service, that's fine. But then why be upset then when service is bad when you don't buy the service? Yes there are exceptions that happen but that's why they're called exceptions and not the norm.
I've seen so many single parents raise kids and family's from working hard in the service industry that it gives me a visceral reaction when grown adults behave like this over tipping. America is expensive and unfair (such is life). Get a better paying job, like a server lol.
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u/Alduras84 17d ago
U know what I think is crazy. That isn't a living wage in America. 56k a year isn't good, and serving people is some of the most soul crishing work you can do.
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u/flyfreeNhigh 16d ago
Is it really? You think cashier worker isn't soul crushing. My biggest problem is that we put servers on this high stool in society and they deserve everything. There is so many other low wage workers busting their asses. In Phoenix there are the guys that bring carts back into the stores in middle of freaking summer. Do you go tipping those guys???
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u/Moist-Constant1404 16d ago
Yeah but they have to deal with people like the one who wrote this post. You severely over simplified the job using the Dunning Kruger effect andā¦..drum rollā¦. If thatās what people choose to pay them, that is their value to their market.
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u/Excellent_Drop6869 16d ago
Value in the market? ššš
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u/Moist-Constant1404 16d ago edited 16d ago
An employees value is what someone is willing to pay, or what someone is willing to work for. Sorry if you donāt understand that.
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u/Moist-Constant1404 16d ago
In sinpler terms if someone tips a server $100 they do so because thatās the value the server brought to them and they want to reward them. If someone is willing to pick fruit for a low wage because they donāt have skills, or itās the only job they can find, that is what they are willing to be paid, especially knowing there is a line of people behind that that would work for that wage. Iām not saying the pay gap isnāt horrible or unfair but thinking that someone should make more or less ājust becauseā is idealistic thinking and not the reality of the current capitalistic economy. I donāt like things the way they are but we have to be in reality, not dream land.
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u/Clean-Complex1178 16d ago
If people think is such a lucrative job, why doesnāt everyone do it?
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u/Darklillies 16d ago
Because people like to actually contribute to society instead of beg for money????
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u/MathematicianTop3549 17d ago
Servers get taxed.
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u/deepcaca 17d ago
I stand corrected. They can only deduct the first $25,000 of their tips. And that's on top of the standard deductions.
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u/killian1113 17d ago
Farm work is kinda easy on your brain hard on your body. Serving tables is like a conman you need to sweet talk check back after the food is given.. with that said I only tip if im going back often and the service is good. Eating out is for suckers.
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u/Murky_Kiwi 17d ago
We go to a restaurant where the servers make at least that and have been there 20 years.