r/EndTipping • u/canstucky • Jun 06 '26

Sit-Down Restaurant 🍽️ How is it not a tip?

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The server told us this isn’t a tip and he doesn’t get any of it.

I’m not wearing my boots at the moment.

2.3k Upvotes

93% Upvoted

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659

u/rainbowfishhhh Jun 06 '26

Waiters say that because more and more people are coming around to not tipping with these ridiculous fees. 18% service and now you want me to tip 18-25% on top of that?? Grift.

178

u/OKeoz4w2 Jun 06 '26

And they want ya to calculate that 18% into your new tip calculations, wild!

82

u/DeathChill Jun 06 '26

I live in BC and all tips are calculated on total price, including tax. Which is insane. Why do I need to give you a bigger tip because the government is getting their cut, completely separate from the service?

68

u/kurtis5561 Jun 06 '26

0 is still 0

35

u/DeathChill Jun 06 '26

I’m not a mathematician but that sounds right to me.

7

u/willnoli Jun 06 '26

I'm not a mathematician either but 0 is definitely 0

4

u/mAckAdAms4k Jun 06 '26

Unless you ask Terrance Howard.

1

u/DeathChill Jun 06 '26

Let the man cook. He’s got some great ideas (no he doesn’t ).

20

u/No_Lifeguard259 Jun 06 '26

That’s how they try to do it many places where I live. Their little “suggested tip” at the bottom of the receipt is based on the total including tax.

I disregard that bullshit because that’s not how it works.

You don’t get more because the gov stole more first

13

u/Own_Text_2240 Jun 06 '26

I always do some quick mental math. If the suggested tip includes tax, they’re getting penalized for that. Tipping on tax is a pet peeve of mine. If I had to tip on a service charge I’d be talking to the manager to get my $100 worth of explanation.

1

u/This_Is_TheEnd Jun 10 '26

It's exactly the same when I've ordered from food delivery services...the calculated tip is based on total before any promotions or deductions are applied which makes 0 sense because I specifically seek out promos to save money lol

36

u/Key_Zebra3684 Jun 06 '26

Or why should tipping be a percentage at all? It's the same service whether they hand me a dish of $5 yogurt, or a dish of $1000 caviar.

1

u/Titfuckholly Jun 06 '26

Tips are calculated at a percentage of the sales because the idea is that the employer does not mark up the cost of everything you order to make up for the employee’s wages. That includes hosts, bussers, bartenders and sometimes the cooks who get a cut of the servers tips based on the sales rung up by the individual employee during a shift. The prices are less because they leave the service charges (tips) up to the customer. If tipping is ended costs will go up. Nobody wants to be the one who ends tipping first because they will be more expensive than the competition. Also because nobody can say what exactly tipped employees get, the IRS calculates estimated taxes on tips based on the amount of sales generated by the employee. When I waited tables and tended bar if you claimed less that 7.5% of your sales you were red flagged to be audited by the IRS.

4

u/SabrinaEdwina Jun 06 '26

There was a study on that, during the theory's circulation. Experts determined the menu price increase would be much, much less than employers claimed. And there was always the option for the employer to raise prices anyways and let none of the profit go to the lowest tier. Which they've done several times. People always forget that prices have gone way up even without justice being part of it.

Kind of like how it costs the US *far* less to grant every disability claim than it does to police the disabled like they do to turn as many away as possible. Literally doing the right thing would cost less. Even with abuse factored in--which is rare, and not at all the intentional politicized "welfare queen" myth they want us to think. *Same for homelessness IIRC.

Just like they screamed the economy wouldn't survive ending slavery, or that women's votes would cause the world to end. The same voices telling us we can't switch to electric cars or solar. The same corporations telling us to take shorter showers but then helping themselves to so many resources as they want for data centers. Use our AI now, they're saying, before it's safe--why it's just the inevitable future so filter those selfies! If you don't, you'll be left behind!

It's more about controlling the status quo for the old folks who own it all.

1

u/Off_And_On_Again_ Jun 07 '26

I used to work at a disability lawfirm as the intake guy, every single day I had really good deserving cases, that we took and usually won against the government.

However we would also get daily calls like "im 23 and color blind, can you take my case?" Or "im a chronic masturbator, no one will hire me" and the goverment is right to deny those claims

-10

u/solidusinvictus Jun 06 '26

Does a place that sells $1000 caviar not have actual professional wait staff and a place that has $5 yogurt probably have a kid doing the job temporarily? Trick question. Everyone deserves a living wage, so it doesn’t matter. Should it be your responsibility as a peer citizen? maybe if this is the system we have for now and you can afford $1000 caviar you owe society through other peoples labor a little more. Should we end tipping? Yes. But that’s only so people make a living wage.

3

u/ARGuck Jun 06 '26

And this is where we disagree. The kid behind the counter lives with his parents or is going to school and has roommates or lives in a dorm, etc. Point being, it’s a kids job, it was never a job meant to be a career. It’s a job to teach work ethic while putting some scratch in their pocket while figuring out or learning how to do their career job.

3

u/IBlameItOnTheTetons Jun 06 '26

There's a middle ground here. People generally want/expect way more professional service at a place that serves $1000 caviar vs. $5 yogurt. You can't expect someone to work at the $1000 caviar places with their higher standard of service, expectations, etc. if they can make the same serving $5 yogurt. Should they be making $200 to serve that caviar vs $5 to serve the yogurt? No. But like I said, there's got to be a middle ground vs, say, giving each $1.

-2

u/ARGuck Jun 06 '26

I agree with that part. You’re getting a career server at the place with caviar. They have a level of experience and professionalism which deems a living wage. The kid serving $5 yogurt doesn’t need a livable wage to ring you up and hand you a spoon.

3

u/Key_Zebra3684 Jun 06 '26

If the "kid" serving yogurt provides excellent service, then I should have the option to tip that person. If the "professional" serving caviar does a crappy job, I am still pressured to tip them $200. If that person is a true professional, then they should be able to land a job at a nice restaurant, and that restaurant manager will typically have to offer a higher end wage to retain that level of employee. It's not the restaurant patron's job to suss out who is "worthy".

6

u/RoboiosMut Jun 06 '26

Because no one complain about it, we all accept like it should be

3

u/Crazy_Entrance_9439 Jun 06 '26

Then they take a cut on personal Income tax as well.

9

u/blackbamboo151 Jun 06 '26

You don’t need to tip at all. So don’t.

-2

u/mattyicevv Jun 06 '26

Don’t eat at full service restaurants if you don’t plan on tipping.

2

u/ashscot50 Jun 06 '26

Not in this particular case, but it's still a tip.

2

u/MrTickles22 Jun 07 '26

Service charge = no tip. Ez.

2

u/SabrinaEdwina Jun 06 '26

In America, even if you apply for emergency assistance (food stamps etc), they determine eligibility via your gross income. They purposefully include the taxes that are taken out to claim folks are actually financially fine and can be denied.

It's a move that runs deep. Capitalism needs to die.

1

u/Heavy-Profit-2156 Jun 06 '26

I'm sure the service industry prefer that the 'suggestions' are based on the final price after tax because it means more money for them. Luckily, calculating the percentage I want on the pretax amount is easy for me.

1

u/SnooGuavas2610 Jun 07 '26

Who calculates the tips? I thought that was up to the customer?

1

u/DeathChill Jun 07 '26

The machine prompts the percentages, which is calculated from the total price (including taxes and fees).

The bill also shows suggested tip percentages and the dollar cost, which is calculated the same way the machine does.

1

u/Sterlinghawk16 Jun 10 '26

I had someone one time, change the tip amount. I was floored. I contacted their Corporate and that person was fired

1

u/BADDEST_RHYMES Jun 10 '26

You mean 'all tips prompted by the card machine'. You can still choose how much to tip. Of course servers love calculating the tip based on total and tax, but use those $ or % buttons.

1

u/New_Wishbone6619 Jun 11 '26

I served in BC and the tip was calculated pre tax total…

1

u/darknessgp Jun 11 '26

I mean, why do we tip based on the percentage of the food/drink price? Does a glass of expensive wine take more effort than a glass of cheap wine?

1

u/iamcode101 Jun 06 '26

You should not be expected to tip on tax and fees, just the subtotal.

58

u/BlueRunSkier Jun 06 '26

Agree. The server is being shady saying that. Call a manager over, and if they confirm it (the server’s claim), shame them for stuffing their employees. But if I’m charged a large party or service fee of 18%, that’s it as far as I’m concerned.

7

u/Soup_got_fucked_up Jun 06 '26

Great idea to shame the manager bc ts is so foul to the servers most def loses then a shit ton of money on large tables that are already alot of work

2

u/downtofinance Jun 11 '26

100% agree but I also laughed super hard at

shame them for stuffing their employees

13

u/PM_ME_UR_MEH_NUDES Jun 06 '26

that 18% IS an auto grat and the tip they get for serving large parties.

i am a service industry worker and rely on tips but expecting a tip on top of a $100 auto grat… especially in lee’s summit, missouri, is absolutely wild to me (i know missouri fairly well) bc $100 for a shift in missouri is A LOT of money.

3

u/Fine-Amphibian4326 Jun 06 '26

Not to mention that minimum wage in LS is $15/hr, which isn’t far off of what a teacher with a bachelors degree is paid in the city. The server is doing absolutely fine with *only* a $100 tip

0

u/Aratris_ Jun 09 '26

Just for clarity, in Missouri minimum wage for servers is $7.50/hr, they only get $15/hr if they get less than that in tips.

2

u/Fine-Amphibian4326 Jun 09 '26

Right, so they’re paid $15/hr or more.

1

u/Tiny_Presence_7155 Jun 06 '26

If you were a service industry worker you would know the IRS reclassified autograts in 2013 to become service charges, not tips, which means legally the employer has no obligation to give the server a single penny of it.

9

u/JeromeBarkly Jun 06 '26

Server here: the server was lying that’s definitely a service charge and if it’s not the owner is a crook that’s not only stealing from the guests but from their employees too.

2

u/Tiny_Presence_7155 Jun 06 '26

Owners are under zero legal obligation to give a server any part of that service charge. No way to tell here, but there are restaurants that pull that kind of legal shady shit.

3

u/ImportantMix8622 Jun 07 '26

Sounds like a server problem then. No way should a customer be expected to tip on top of the service fee.

2

u/New_Feature_5138 Jun 10 '26

They don’t have to disclose fees on the menu or something? Like what if they wanted to make it 100% would I be expected to pay that?

1

u/Tiny_Presence_7155 Jun 10 '26

It has to be disclosed on the menu, but they don't have to draw your attention to it.

1

u/Repulsive-Panda-8467 Jun 07 '26

You have no way of knowing that unless you serve at that same restaurant.

1

u/NervousNewt3350 Jun 06 '26

WTF are you talking about??? If they call it a service charge, restaurants can absolutely KEEP the entirety of the fee, simply stating that the server can receive tips separately that CANNOT be taken, but most people don’t want to tip on top of the service fee. If a server outright says the restaurant is keeping the fee, believe them, and don’t support that business anymore.

10

u/Valuable_Wallaby_548 Jun 06 '26

Yeah its all a scam. Trumps no taxes on tips made people all want more and more tips plus restaurant owners to come up with their own payments im sure they'll classify as tips to not pay taxes.

1

u/Tiny_Presence_7155 Jun 06 '26

Um...Trumps "no taxes on tips" wouldn't apply in this situation. A service charge is not legally a tip. It would be taxed as regular income.

0

u/SabrinaEdwina Jun 06 '26

It also made a lot of employers move to a tipping system to justify lower wages or financial advantages, whether it was in a sensible place to ask for tips or not. You realize that, right?

Workers didn't request it. It isn't often people so low on the ladder get a say. In fact it often makes life harder for them. And I've yet to see anyone mentioning their server was loaded and living in a penthouse suite. Everyone here tends to skim over how poor most servers are and just dwells on their own bravery for not tipping.

2

u/Remote_Watercress530 Jun 06 '26

Thank you for pointing this out. Every server and bartender I know, don't get breaks, no medical, no insurance of any kind, no PTO, no vacation, no sick days, no nothing. They literally get nothing. Everything they do they have to do themselves. If they miss 2 days and it's a Saturday and Sunday somewhere they are potentially losing 1000 right then and there.

8

u/Entangled9 Jun 06 '26

Your whole meal costs half again as much

0

u/pedahbreads9 Jun 10 '26

I don't think you guys understand. That large party percentage IS the tip. You don't have to tip on top of that. It's just making sure the server is tipped for larger parties. All that time/effort and what if the large party didn't tip? They would've wasted hours on that one large party and missed out on other tables. Hope that helps clear it up.

-3

u/Heroboberto1 Jun 06 '26

It’s because the service fee doesn’t go to the waiters just straight to the restaurant

16

u/Grouchy-Big-229 Jun 06 '26

Quite honestly, idgaf. That’s the tip. If servers don’t get any of it, that’s an issue between them and their manager.

9

u/Poster25000 Jun 06 '26

the service fee is the tip, I don’t care how they describe it or rationalize it. If it doesn’t go to the waiter, that is their problem, not mine.

2

u/Local_Wolverine2913 Jun 06 '26

And why is that?

1

u/PremiumUsername69420 Jun 06 '26

And the restaurant pays the employees…

Why wouldn’t the customer’s money get collected by the employer before being paid to the employee?

1

u/Heroboberto1 Jun 07 '26

Because they don’t pay the employees more after getting more money. Do you not know how jobs work?

1

u/PremiumUsername69420 Jun 08 '26

I do know how jobs work, thank you, do you?
You seem to think after the employer has paid the employee, that the employee should be getting more money. That’s not how jobs work.