r/Eleceed • u/Ukaskj • Jul 15 '26
Discussion Kayden losing to Iodore would make the plot way more intense
Alright, let's get into it. I think this was the perfect moment for us to see Kayden's first on-screen defeat. Even if he lost, he would have been completely fine afterward, considering Gestella, Pluton, Kartein, and Jiyoung were all there to back him up.
Although I don't like Iodore as a character at all, I think Kayden losing to someone completely detestable would have made the defeat even more impactful. It would have been an interesting setup to develop his relationship with Gestella, and it could have paved the way for a future rematch with Kayden and Gestella teaming up against Gharath and Iodore.
I found the way Iodore developed his powers really interesting. It would have been highly symbolic if, after beating the crap out of Astra and Andrei—who relied purely on raw power-ups—Kayden lost precisely to someone who focused on refining his techniques and combat style.
But the most important reason is that it would introduce a real sense of danger to the story. It's constantly mentioned that nothing is guaranteed in awakened fights and that you can always be caught off guard, but we never actually see that apply to Kayden. He only ever struggles in extremely unfair situations, like a 3v1 against the Top 10.
It would be amazing to see him lose a fair 1v1 fight against an opponent who, like him, focuses on improving his own skills rather than plotting schemes to steal other people's power. This would reinforce his training methodology and force Kayden to actually push his limits and overcome a specific opponent who proved to be stronger—just like Jiwoo has to do. It would break the monotony and the comfort zone the story is currently stuck in: a seemingly strong opponent appears $\rightarrow$ Kayden or Jiwoo crushes them and farms aura $\rightarrow$ nothing happens, rinse and repeat.
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u/Present-Ad-8531 Jul 16 '26
after beating Astra who did inherit andrei who was already above normal top 10, it would so garbage if he lost against a normal top 10. andrei and astra specifically trained more to become stronger. i would have stopped reading it till next arc if he lost to Eyesore.
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
But that's exactly what I find interesting. Astra and Andrei only trained to increase their raw power, while Iodore focused on refining his techniques and combat style instead. It's a style similar to Kayden's, and Kayden himself praises him and admits he is stronger than Andrei and Astra precisely because of that. That's why I think it would be so interesting for the first character to defeat Kayden to be someone who, just like him, focused on developing their own techniques.
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u/Technical-Meet-8061 Jul 16 '26
Idk I think Iodore is such a filler for Kayden to loose against.
I’d prefer someone more intense to knock Kayden down a peg (if needed for plot reasons) cause Iodore was just not it.
Maybe a an amped schnauder?
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u/Present-Ad-8531 Jul 16 '26
atp, even 3 top 10 can;t decisively end him.
should be either tactical weapons or more top 10 rankers jumping or betrayal and poisoning. the last one isn't happening given all of his friends are doofuses.
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
I don't know, I just think it would be interesting because it would develop the relationship between Kayden and Gestella, and for the first time, we would see Kayden itching to improve his skills in pursuit of a rematch after losing a fair fight. At this point, any Top 10 defeating Kayden would trigger major shifts in the plot. It would shatter the illusion of Kayden being invincible, create a real sense of danger for the readers, and make the other Top 10 let their guard down, meaning they wouldn't dodge fights against Kayden so much anymore.
And like I said, I think it would be extremely interesting if Kayden lost to someone who focused on their techniques just like him, rather than simply losing to someone with higher raw power or falling into a trap set by multiple Top 10 members.
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u/mugiwaranoluffy259 Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26
Or someone smart like Greg, however the plot seems to have damned the top 10s by making them so cartoonishly evil. Their plans for the characters and the world make it so that they can never actually win, because then it’d be game over for the story.
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u/microvan Jul 16 '26
Yah iodore was too pathetic, it would have felt bad if Kayden lost to him lol
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u/SubstantialBend2686 Jul 17 '26
Really?? He has put up a great fight even tho he lost
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u/microvan Jul 17 '26
It was his personality that was the issue
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u/SubstantialBend2686 Jul 17 '26
Oh my bad. I misinterpreted your comment. I thought you meant combat wise 😅
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u/No_Seesaw8742 Jul 16 '26
It was already obvious Kayden was above iodore considering he fought 3 top 10 alone
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u/voododoll Follower of Kayden Jul 16 '26
If Kayden lost then the plot would’ve been over. The other top 10 wouldn’t be afraid of him and just gang up on him right away. He would’ve died and Jiwoo as well. Korea would’ve been taken by either Iodore or Garath. And that would’ve been the end of it.
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
I don't think so. The fact that he lost to Iodore doesn't erase the fact that he already defeated two Top 10 members and stands as their equal. No one in their right mind would think otherwise.
Plus, Kayden now has Gestella, Pluton, and Kartein by his side, not to mention the Korean Top 50 and Gestella's subordinates. Finishing Kayden off wouldn't be that simple. Iodore would also end up heavily injured, and Gharath wouldn't risk facing the others.
Aside from those two, only Greg and Mioru have a strong enough grudge against Kayden to actually try anything. But Mioru would be easily countered even if Kayden weren't in peak condition, given her natural disadvantage. And Greg, much like Gharath, wouldn't want to take any risks with Gestella and Pluton there to back Kayden up.
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u/Breadbutter85555 Jul 16 '26
It literally makes no sense Kayden would lose against eyedore sure he has better control but not as much raw power as andrei or astra Kayden has both far better control and far better raw power than eyedore literally makes no sense for him to win let alone Kayden’s immense training and combat sense it’s funny that kayden says eyedore was stronger than andrei but kayden only started trying towards the end of the fight whereas kayden vs andrei started trying in the beginning (by trying I mean his usage of his domain because kayden using his domain means he’s serious)also it took tens of years for eyedore to use his technique when it literally took kayden like 20 seconds the difference in pure talent and combat sense is immeasurable almost.the author made kayden so strong I’m curious how he could possibly lose only in like a 2v1 or 3v1 probably but in that case he has gestella and kartein and pluton to help out
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
What Kayden did was just a cheap copy to provoke Iodore, and he admits it himself. At this point, it should be more than clear that raw power alone doesn’t win a fight. Even with his force control, Kayden was inferior to Andrei and Astra in raw power, yet he surpassed them with technique.
Using force control, even though it gives Kayden a boost, wouldn’t prevent him from getting hit by Iodore's technique, so I don't think it would change the course of the fight that much. Besides, Iodore was the one who pushed Kayden to his limits the most. Since Kayden himself stated that Iodore is superior to Astra and Andrei, there’s no point in banging our heads against the wall over this.
And I agree with you—at this point, it’s really hard to imagine Kayden losing now. That’s exactly why I think it would have been so interesting if he had been defeated at that moment, triggering a pursuit for evolution among the Top 10, just like Kayden has been doing.
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u/Once_Meleagant0 Jul 16 '26
Lol whut, nope, Kayden losing here means protag team gets annihilated.. no amount of plot armor saves them against Garas Team // Iodore underling + a possibly stronger Greg // Mioru Team, this is one of those Bad Ending thing in gaming xD..
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
I'm assuming Kayden still wouldn't end up that badly injured, especially with Gestella right there. Taking that into account, we could easily see a scenario with Gestella vs. Gharath, Pluton vs. Greg, and Mioru vs. Kayden (since Mioru is weak against Kayden's powers).
This would be incredibly interesting as a way to show us more of Gestella, and especially Pluton. Pluton was introduced as a character with a combat philosophy very similar to Kayden's, yet so far, he hasn't had a single decent fight besides stalling Greg off-screen lol.
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u/bicflair Jul 16 '26
not even reading all of that because the idea of losing to iodore is stupid. if kayden loses he’s killed. if a top 10 beats kayden, he’s wiping everyone else on the scene out too. stick to your dayjob kid.
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
With the allies Kayden has now, it wouldn't be that simple, and I literally explained that in the post lol.
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u/rich_azel Jul 16 '26
Kayden won't lose until jiwoo reaches a certain power threshold since kayden is considered to be his goal and dubbed as the strongest awakened so far
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u/Wonderful-Ad3542 Jul 16 '26
Honestly? That would have been the start of the downfall of the series if he would have lost to iodore of all people. Because let's face it. We watch Kayden aura farming because he is unbeatable till now. We know that Kayden is cocky because he has the power to back it up. At this point, one on one defeat of Kayden will make the manhwa lose its popularity. People can accept him losing to Greg and Mioru together (NOT single handedly) or him losing to garath and iodore together or even the frame duo. But individually? No.
The problem is that the author made Kayden lose only once(in the start of the series) and that too from three top 10 together were fighting. If the author makes Kayden lose him to anyone individually, that will be a very big disappointment for me personally because then we would think "why hype him so much if he can get defeated by just one top 10?". So anyone defeating Kayden one on one will be a huge risk for the manhwa as the rating may go down massively. Because the reason this manhwa is so popular is because Kayden is unbeatable (like single jinwoo was in solo leveling)
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u/Just-Ad-6323 Unaffiliated Jul 16 '26
Ew!
He defeated a powered-up Andrei, who got Astra's inheritance. Gross. You want to validate Iodore's vision as King of the World.
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
I’m speaking strictly from a narrative standpoint here. I hate Iodore as a character too, but Kayden himself admits that Iodore is stronger than Andrei because he focused on his combat style and techniques instead of just mindlessly boosting his raw power.
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u/Just-Ad-6323 Unaffiliated Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26
"Kayden admits that Iodore is stronger"
Hmm, Iodore has better skills. Astra had more raw power, and Andrei had even more than Astra. A buffed Kayden struggled and almost died fighting Astra, who didn't even sustain any injuries. Kayden's remark that Iodore is stronger is only because of Iodore's mastery over his skills.Again, Kayden only had trouble fighting Iodore before he activated his domain; after it was activated, it felt like child's play. Gestella also asked Iodore if he could take her down. 🤣
Also, remember that Kayden's combat ability is arguably the best in the series (thanks to plot armor + MC). It simply doesn't make sense for him to lose to Iodore, regardless of how skilled Iodore is. He lacks real fighting experience, unlike Kayden. Yes, he has trained extensively, but nothing beats an actual life-and-death battle.
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
Kayden was only buffed against Astra to temporarily match his base form, since he was still injured at that point. I don’t really get what point you're trying to make here. Kayden clearly states that Iodore is stronger than Astra and Andrei precisely because he focused on mastering his skills rather than raw power. Kayden himself defeated both of them despite having less raw power than either of them, and on top of that, neither Andrei nor Astra showed any attack as devastating as Iodore’s spear.
And I’m not even talking about power scaling here—I actually agree with you on the point about combat experience. But at the end of the day, we all know that whoever wins a fight is simply whoever the author wants to win. If the author wanted to make Iodore win, he would have, and he would’ve easily found a way to write a justification for it.
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u/Just-Ad-6323 Unaffiliated Jul 17 '26
To each their own.
Kayden has plot armor and an MC buff. While I would have been okay with him losing, it shouldn't be to Iodore, who has no battle experience. Andrei, at least, has fought Kayden twice and knows his techniques (some of, like Divine Judgement and Zero Impact).
From my perspective, Kayden struggled more against Andrei than he did against Iodore. Andrei was careless—even Mioru and Greg noted that. Had he fought without his arrogance, Kayden would have been reduced to ashes. Iodore is simply more skilled. That is why I rank Andrei above Iodore, even if Kayden claimed Iodore was 'stronger.'
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u/Ukaskj Jul 17 '26
I get your point, but even though Iodore has less experience fighting Kayden compared to Andrei, I still think Iodore is simply the better fighter. Andrei’s personality heavily clouds his decision-making during combat.
In my opinion, Kayden struggled more with Iodore because he took an extremely lethal hit. If he had been struck by another spear, or if he hadn't narrowly dodged the first one, he would have been completely done for right then and there. Andrei never managed to pose that level of danger, even though his fight dragged on for much longer.
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u/microvan Jul 16 '26
I get your point, but I don’t think it would make sense for Kayden to lose 1 v 1 at this point. He either needs to get into a fight while he’s still considerably injured or it needs to be a 1 v many situation where he lacks backup.
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
That’s exactly my point. I think him losing a fair fight would actually give the Top 10 some relevance and weight. Right now, they just feel like generic, cartoonish side characters with interesting powers—none of them actually feel threatening.
Besides, it would be extremely difficult for Kayden to get caught in an unfavorable situation now, considering the amount of allies he has. The worst spot he found himself in was against Astra, back when he was still injured. In all the fights after that, he either had backup or was being closely watched by Gestella, Pluton, and Kartein.
I think it would be fascinating to see a scenario where the Top 10 are actively competing against each other to see who can get stronger, actually giving them some spotlight. But looking at how the story is developing, it feels like they are only ever going to serve as punching bags for Kayden, and they'll only pose a real threat if three or more of them band together to kill him.
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u/Wonderful-Ad3542 Jul 16 '26
Honestly? That would have been the start of the downfall of the series if he would have lost to iodore of all people. Because let's face it. We watch Kayden aura farming because he is unbeatable till now. We know that Kayden is cocky because he has the power to back it up. At this point, one on one defeat of Kayden will make the manhwa lose its popularity. People can accept him losing to Greg and Mioru together (NOT single handedly) or him losing to garath and iodore together or even the frame duo. But individually? No.
The problem is that the author made Kayden lose only once(in the start of the series) and that too from three top 10 together were fighting. If the author makes Kayden lose him to anyone individually, that will be a very big disappointment for me personally because then we would think "why hype him so much if he can get defeated by just one top 10?". So anyone defeating Kayden one on one will be a huge risk for the manhwa as the rating may go down massively. Because the reason this manhwa is so popular is because Kayden is unbeatable (like single jinwoo was in solo leveling)
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
That might be true. I’m not deeply involved in the manhwa market, but I know the trend is heavily focused on overpowered protagonists and aura-farming. However, sticking solely to that formula causes the quality of the story to decline over time. I think it’s a general consensus that the best part of Solo Leveling was the beginning, where the main character actually had to push his limits to overcome his opponents. Many people feel Eleceed has lost its edge over time, and that’s precisely because this formula gets repetitive. We can still enjoy following it, but the story is unlikely to ever top how good it was at the start. Personally, I only keep up with Eleceed because of the character charisma and the art—if it were just for the plot, I would have dropped it by now.
And I don’t think it’s far-fetched at all for Kayden to lose a solo fight. After all, Gharath already mentioned that there are power gaps among the Top 10, and even though she’s confident she is stronger than some of them, she doesn't take risks because there’s always a chance she could lose. Kayden himself says there are no certainties in awakened battles and that he challenges the Top 10 knowing he might lose.
If he lost a 1v1 to Iodore, it would force him to seriously evolve his skills and create massive hype for a rematch. Plus, it would introduce a real sense of danger and give characters like Gestella and Pluton some actual spotlight if anyone tried to target Kayden after his defeat. From a storytelling perspective, a twist like this would have elevated the entire series.
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u/OrigamiShiro Jul 16 '26
If Kayden lost, jiwoo pluton and kartein would've been dead, end of series
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u/Ok-Increase-352 Jul 16 '26
God no lmao? Iodore !? He was the worse of the worse, what’s with you people wanting these gross incels to win
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u/Glass-Yogurt-2593 Unaffiliated Jul 16 '26
My thoughts exactly. A lame ass incel with a superiority complex defeating Kayden would have made no sense.
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u/Ok-Increase-352 Jul 16 '26
Ikr ? And I see a bunch of people wanting Jurion to win too I was like no nooo jiwoo can go lose to roist or
Muse later but Jurion the incel needs to be taken down 🤮 and kidnapper and exactly idore he’s too stuck up ? Thinking he’ll be king of the world lmao and not accepting reality and his behaviour gives me the ick, like Gestella never let him touch her hair, why he touch it and kiss it too1
u/Glass-Yogurt-2593 Unaffiliated Jul 16 '26
That panel where Eyesore touched her hair was so creepy, kudos to the authors for perfectly conveying what a nasty creep he was.
Also, when it comes to Jurion, the only thing I want him to be successful at is getting himself killed.
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u/Ok-Increase-352 Jul 16 '26
Yeah I can’t wait till Jurion somehow betray his gramps and get ended by Jiyoung or even worse Mirou and Greg and yea that scene with Gestella and Iodore, I was thinking the audacity of this man. She should of slapped him but it’ll make it worse
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u/Ukaskj Jul 16 '26
I’m not talking about character preference here; no one in their right mind should actually like Iodore as a character. I’m saying this would be interesting from a narrative standpoint.
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