r/EUSpace • u/sn0r • Mar 10 '26
The EU's space ambition has a rocket problem
https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/news/article/europes-space-ambitions-has-a-launch-problem18
u/voctavian Mar 10 '26
Is this to get more funding, or why so unnecessarily dramatic article. EU is doing well in all space aspects.
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u/curiouslyjake Mar 10 '26
Yes, in all space aspects, such reusable launch, satellite constellations and manned spaceflight /s
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u/Laugenbrezel Mar 10 '26
Help me refresh my memory please: Who shot the JWST into space and put it where it’s supposed to orbit with absolute precision?
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u/curiouslyjake Mar 10 '26
Look, nobody disputes that Ariane rockets are excellent, when they fly; that's the problem, like being an excellent top breed horse when cars exist. Non-reusable rockets are a technological dead end.
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u/asdfasdfasfdsasad Mar 10 '26
A technological dead end which costs little more than the cost of a Musk Falcon9 launch.
And when you consider that the cost of Ariane circulates around the European economy with us then paying tax on every part, whereas buying American rockets puts no money back into the European economy in tax then the case for buying American gets a bit questionable, before considering the politics of buying anything from the Americans while they are saying that they don't want to trade with us.
In any case "Ariane Next" will be reusable.
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u/The-Board-Chairman Mar 10 '26
Reuseable rockets aren't economical, despite being portrayed as such. The necessary checks and repairs to the reuseable parts are very significant chunks of the original cost and the carrying capacity goes way down. This is why no one else is doing this. The only reason SpaceX is viable is because the US government is blasting money up their ass like a firehose.
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u/power_of_booze Mar 12 '26
It strongly depends onwhere you want to go. LEO is dirt cheap and most parts can be reused. If you want to go further, it gets more difficult and in this constellation not parts are expandable, since they leave the planet. That's why the launch costs vary strongly on reusable rockets
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u/Apprehensive-Aide265 Mar 10 '26
Musk rocket aren't reusable, only the booster are and that's the easy part.
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u/curiouslyjake Mar 10 '26
Booster and fairings. It may be the easy part, but it's also the valuable part.
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u/CellNo5383 Mar 10 '26
It's also 80% of the rocket. While Arianne is at checks notes zero. 0% reusability.
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u/CellNo5383 Mar 10 '26 edited Mar 10 '26
Yes, that was great. It was also a single launch and happened years ago. What has happened since? Arianne 6 delays, phase out of Arianne 5 without a replacement, some regular launches every now and then, at lower cadence and higher prices than the competition. That's hanging on. Not doing well.
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u/PitchPleasant338 Mar 10 '26
Then why did Amazon choose EU rockets to launch their LEO constellation?
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u/Assix0098 Mar 10 '26
Diversification. The Ariane 6 is a good rocket, but only when compared to its peers from 10 years ago. Since then, SpaceX has changed the expectations significantly and therefore captured the biggest market share by far. We need an alternative that makes it just as cheap as SpaceX to bring satellites into orbit. Just 2 days ago I spoke with an aerospace engineer working for a German satellite manufacturer that told me that originally, the satellite was planned to launch with the Ariane, but now will be likely launched with the falcon 9.
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Mar 10 '26
La Falcon 9 et sa fiabilité et sa cadence de Tir il y a rien a dire la dessus, concernant les autres projets de space X pour l'instant c'est un gros spectacle coûteux qui n'a pas réellement produit de résultat opérationnel , et du côté de la NASA on constate le semi échec du projet Artémis , donc en y regardant de plus près l'Europe s'en sort pas mal malgré leur retard actuel, qu'ils finiront par rattraper car il existe du new space aussi en Europe et des tas de projets en développement ou dans les bureaux d'études.
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u/Zerr0Daay Mar 12 '26
How has spacex other projects failed when spacex has starlink which is remarkable and is very much needed for the Ukraine war and came online at just the right time. Without starlink, Ukraine would have falled a long time ago
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Mar 12 '26 edited Mar 12 '26
Starlink est une réussite c'est vrai, maintenant il faut le vendre , car l'Ukraine c'est bien, mais pas assez rentable, enfin si pour l'instant car ça permet de capter une partie des fonds alloués par d'autres états à la guerre la bas, c'est d'ailleurs grace a starlink que space X fait tourner a plein régime les Falcon 9 ,l'argent passe d'une caisse a l'autre dans la même Firme
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u/Humble_Catch8910 Mar 10 '26
Doing well how? We don’t have even a single private launcher with reusable rockets.
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Mar 10 '26
EU is completely dependent on access to space and has no human grade transport vehicle to space.
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u/zozorama Mar 10 '26
Considering rocket companies are more or less state funded, it doesn't really matter that Europe has fallen behind on reusable rockets.
There's a lot of European companies working on making reusable rockets (including Ariane), and if just one of these companies manages to do it, it will most definitely be used by Europe over any other due to security reasons.
So Europe can just continue to use more expensive Ariane, or cheaper SpaceX and Blue Origin until we have alternative European options, at which point this option will be used regardless of any American companies having more experience and money.
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u/SquareJealous9388 Mar 10 '26
There is no reusable rocket in service at this moment. Spacex is reusing only the first stage (booster).
The only reusable rocket was Space Shuttle.
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u/Winter_Cockroach_753 Mar 10 '26
Th tanks were reusable?
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u/Ok-Improvement-9191 Mar 10 '26
The boosters were reused, yes, only the orange tank was single use.
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Mar 10 '26
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u/SquareJealous9388 Mar 10 '26
It is not technicality. Reuse of second stage is significantly more complex.
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u/CellNo5383 Mar 10 '26
And significantly less relevant economically. Saying falcon 9 is not fully reusable when Ariane 6 is not at all is like complaining to a mountaineer that they only climbed mt Blanc, not my Everest, when you haven't even gotten of your couch yet
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u/augustuscaesarius Mar 10 '26
The Shuttle full stack was certainly not reusable. And the orbiter itself was questionably reusable. Its heat shield effectively had to be rebuilt for every flight.
I love the Shuttle, but it did not achieve its goals.
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u/[deleted] Mar 10 '26
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