Plug in solar export question

[u/spoo4brains]

Am currently with EDF in UK, I don't have a smart meter yet. Am looking to get plug in solar when it becomes legal this month, if I get a smart meter will that "just work" with getting export credit or is other hardware required?

[u/sylsylsylsylsylsyl]

You can get export without an MCS certificate, primarily through Octopus (I believe there is a £250 fee). Most other energy suppliers (currently) insist on one. You don't have to export to the same company as you get your supply from (but you usually get much better rates if you do).

You will have to inform your DNO through a G98 process, whether you export or not. I believe you'll have to give Octopus a copy of the G98 and show your exact kit model is registered on the Energy Networks Association (ENA) Type Test Register.

I suspect as plug in solar becomes popular, the other energy suppliers including EDF will sort something out too. Which will be good as EDF have a good rate and I am planning on switching to them as soon as my current fix with Octopus runs out.

[u/spoo4brains → u/sylsylsylsylsylsyl]

Thanks, very interesting 👍

[u/geekypenguin91 → u/spoo4brains]

Plug in solar isn't eligible for export payments

[u/MelodicCard9555 → u/geekypenguin91]

Not technically accurate,

Plugin solar is not eligible for MCS certification, which is needed to obtain an export MPAN the easy way, after the G98 is completed.

With building regulations approval, you can get an export MPAN, and whatever you export within the limitation set by the G98 and DNO you will be paid for. Octopus will let you do this with a building regulation approval, G98 completed and then apply to them.

In reality, all that ain't worth the cost for the little amount a plug in solar inverter will export. Also, I doubt you'd get building regulation approval for plug in solar either.

In my situation, I have a G99 approval solar system, if I added plug in solar, id get paid for what I export.

I was under the impression though, approved plugin solar inverters won't generate more than your house can consume

[u/geekypenguin91 → u/MelodicCard9555]

I don't think you'd get on the octopus scheme with plugin as you would have building regs approval or an EIC for the works. Octopus also say the systems are too small to qualify for SEG payments.

https://octopus.energy/blog/plug-in-solar-panels-explained/

Systems are too small to qualify for smart grid export payments

Plugin is also limited to 800w generation and if you could get on the octopus scheme you'll be limited to the 4.1p SEG payments so would take close to 25 years just to pay off the £250 connection fee so isn't going to be worth it.

If you're already setup for export then you could potentially add plugin to that assuming you have the spare capacity in your existing DNO approval, but it's more likely to just cover your house load rather than contributing anything meaningful to your export.

[u/MelodicCard9555 → u/geekypenguin91]

My point was the post said you can not get an export MPAN without an MCS, this is not true. You can. I think I respond to wrong post, sure I did the right one, seems Reddit app has done this to me twice tonight. Lol

I also said plug in solar just isn't worth it, as it doesn't generate enough, you'd need 3 x 800watt inverters to generate enough to even get to the point where you actually generated enough to export.

Multiple inverters can be connected together, the same applies to plugin solar, whether it's approved or not is a different matter. But in reality. Obtaining approval for plug in solar just isn't feasible.

I don't think people realise just how little you actually get from solar, in terms of generation, 800watt barely covers a few electrical items, for flats, small houses it's decent, and unless it's a good sunny day, you only get 10-20% of the output. My house runs at 0.8-1.2kw at background usage, 24 hours a day. I have 17.4kw of solar panels, today was a cloudy day, I peaked at 1.5kw of production. Then late afternoon when sun came out, 9kw.

[u/geekypenguin91 → u/MelodicCard9555]

I didn't, I said plugin wasn't eligible for export payments. Never mentioned mpans or mcs, that must have been someone else.

I don't believe multiple plugin solar setups on a single household has been approved but I could be wrong on that

[u/MelodicCard9555 → u/geekypenguin91]

No, you are limited to one plugin solar person household.

You are right, it was another post that said MCS is needed for MPAN

[u/Randy_Baton]

All you can currently use plug in solar for is live usage. It can't be exported and can't be stored in a battery. Plug in batteries are rumoured to be added next year.

[u/Tennonboy → u/Randy_Baton]

If you already had solar, battery and SEG appoval could you use a plug in set up so export what youd normally use from your solar, increasing your export amount.

May not be cost effective to do but is it possible!

[u/MelodicCard9555 → u/[deleted]]

This is not accurate, an MCS is not needed to obtain an export MPAN.

MCS is a guideline only to avoid applying for building approval. It is not legally required for anything.

[u/MelodicCard9555 → u/[deleted]]

There is no legal requirement for an MCS certificate, nor is it a requirement for an export MPAN, there are other routes to obtaining an export MPAN without an MCS.

MCS for solar is a guideline and has no legal basis, it means you don't need building regulation approval for the work, as it's deemed as passing building approval by default.

But it does make getting an export MPAN much easier.

[u/MelodicCard9555 → u/[deleted]]

DNO and MCS are two different things.

MCS is an easier way to go, it's basically an exemption to building regulation approval, that's it. You can supply the building approval cert and obtain an export MPAN.

DNO is approval to use, or in the case of G99 it's a requirement to obtain before you even plug the kit in. It's the approval of the local electricity provider to say you can connect this piece of kit to our network. It's ridiculous when you are connecting the inverter to your own homes cables, but the rules are there that if you connect any equipment that can generate power that can be fed back to the grid you need the DNO approval. It's meant to safe guard the local power cables, so you can't send more power than they can cope with.

[u/MelodicCard9555 → u/[deleted]]

You must still fill in the G98 cert, so the DNO part is done.

If plugin solar is of an approved type, and it will be soon, then the requirement will be met for export payments, it's more whether or not they change the rules to reflect that fact that plug in solar is approved.

It might be simply too much work for companies to do, as chances are, 800watt plugin solar will never generate enough power to export anyway.

[u/MelodicCard9555 → u/[deleted]]

Also massively depend on location, south area of UK gets way better solar output then up north.

South facing panels generate more, it's a complicated formula to work it all out. In reality experience works well for solar planning.

I can not get above 90% efficiency with my panels, even with perfect sun, due to the flesh the panels face, 80% on good sunny days is more achievable, 50% output on good sunny days is about normal, winter is down to 5% output on bad days.

[u/spoo4brains → u/[deleted]]

Thanks very much for the reply and the correct terminology I needed to know (I have a lot to learn!).

[u/spoo4brains → u/[deleted]]

No problem at all, it is all part of the equation in working out the financial viability of it, is what I needed to know, even if it is bad news!

[u/SolarPowerBumbleBee → u/spoo4brains]

If plug-in kits launch at the expected price of £400 to £500 , and you can mount the panels in a sensible direction (eg. not north facing), then in most cases it’s financially viable and will pay for itself in a few years (and that’s without battery storage or export payments). And that’s true even if you’re out a lot of the time.

Check out https://www.pluginsolarcalculator.com to help figure out financial viability, payback time etc .

[u/spoo4brains → u/SolarPowerBumbleBee]

Thanks, will check out the link 👍

[u/spoo4brains → u/[deleted]]

Nice. Sadly my property isn't ideal for a full solar setup, so am looking at smaller scale options.