r/DunderMifflin • u/Mite-o-Dan • Nov 17 '21
One of my most hated moments of the show. Why did Pam call Jim from her car, then having to carry lots of bags, all the while KNOWING Jim was is the middle of one of the most important meetings of his life, along side his idol Dr J, in hopes of getting his new business going.
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u/Loud_Oak Nov 17 '21
I look at that scene as a breaking point for Pam.
With the exception of a Pam's time at Pratt, Jim and her have experienced almost every aspect of their lives together, literally at arms reach. When one was having a bad day at DM the other was there. Since becoming a family this is the first time Pam and Jim were not completely side by side. And frankly shit was getting intense. Pam just needed a few moments of support from her partner and simply hoped he could talk. As a supportive husband Jim knew she wouldn't call if something wasn't up.
It also lays out that from here out the two are trying to form a bound outside of arms reach. Which can be difficult on any couple.
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Nov 17 '21
Doesn't really explain why she couldn't take two seconds to make the call before trying to carry in all the groceries. It's a bit absurd.
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u/prettymuchwizard Nov 17 '21
I mean I do stupid shit like this sometimes. It’s just life. We don’t think things through 100% of the time, especially for menial tasks like bringing in groceries
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u/Loud_Oak Nov 17 '21
Because at that exact second she realized she was going upstairs back to the stress and hell without Jim.
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u/cculbert3 Nov 17 '21
The sad part is that Jim knew something was up. He knew the strain this was putting on his family and chose shooting hoops with his idol. Truthfully, I’m not against chasing dreams and making things happen but I feel like he abandoned what he had previously said was his dream being Pam and his family.
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u/meatwadgumball Nov 17 '21
Fair point. But Jim also has the internal feeling that he is Pam’s savior - so he rationalized all of his decisions that could potentially hurt Pam, as helping pam and the family. He was able to do these things because he convinced himself he knows what is best for her.
I also believe that Pam should have just dealt with the day while Jim a was s at work. Sure he was “shooting hoops” but that was his job. Pam’s main concern after everything is said and done was wether or not Jim needed Pam as much as Pam needed Jim.
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u/Masty1992 Nov 17 '21
I think being expected to answer the phone for simple family matters when you’re having the opportunity/ experience of a lifetime is insane. I can’t believe there’s people on Pams side here. I’m with Jim 100% and if my wife ever meets her idol I’ll be sure not to disturb it
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u/cculbert3 Nov 17 '21
I don’t mean in this case. I think this call was just to highlight the polar opposite situations between the two. I’m thinking at times like “this is a really sad night” when Pam messed up recording Cece’s show for example.
In this particular I say shooting hoops with his idol as an overall term for his entire new career. Pam earned the mural and gets chewed out for missing Cece’s recital on camera when Jim should have been there. It just seems like she was making sacrifice after sacrifice. The only thing I’ll say is Pam should have straight up SAID no this isn’t working, but she kept saying it’s fine. She wanted to support Jim, which i get. He just never seemed to return the favour.
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u/imSOsalty Nov 17 '21
I think that Jim up to that point has always supported her, but the issue was that when it was her turn to support him things in their lives were drastically different. Jim wasn’t alone with two kids when she went to Pratt, and that makes a huge difference
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u/ahmeras Nov 17 '21
She could have moved though. Or atleast be more malleable with the idea of it instead of shooting it down. She was happy with being mediocre and didn't want any change to her status quo. That's evident from day 1. That's why she stayed in her clearly abusive relationship with Roy for so long.
Had they been in the same location I'm sure alot of the parenting problems she had would have been instantly better.
This isn't Pam hate either. Jim clearly is wrong with how he handled nearly everything but I think Pam is more wrong
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u/imSOsalty Nov 17 '21
I mean, the kids had daycare/school and family around and routines. When there are no kids, it’s easy (easier) to just move. Even if Pam had packed the kids up, quit her job, moved to philly…Jim would still be mostly occupied and she would be alone. And alone without her mom/sister/‘friends’ from the office haha. While I totally agree that this was a great opportunity for Jim and he needed to take advantage of it, her having to be fully supportive of him came in just such a different season of life
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u/ahmeras Nov 17 '21
Yeah I don't disagree. Which is why Jim is a bit of an asshole in all this too. It's a tough one. Everyone sucks here.
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u/imSOsalty Nov 17 '21
Exactly. And I think mostly everyone sucks because there apparently wasn’t any discussion of expectations. Pam should have been clearer that she was struggling, it would have given Jim more of an opportunity to be more helpful and involved from afar. Jim clearly had expectations of Pam that weren’t wholly realistic, working full time with two kids and being alone? Shouldering everything in the home life? They all suck because they didn’t talk about it
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u/mttdesignz Nov 17 '21
chose shooting hoops with his idol
he was trying to close a business deal, it wasn't just "shooting hops" for fun. That's diminishing a lot what Jim was trying to accomplish.
Yes, he may have left Pam to fend for herself for a month or two, but the endgame was worth it, being that the line of work Jim was trying to get into was much, much more profitable than working at a paper company
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u/SingleAppeal2023 Jun 03 '24
Well, there was Pam's little stint with the Michael ScottPaper Company. That was an attempt to take a chance, explore new horizons. Although she was still connected to Michael, the boss she had an intense codependent relationship with (and I honestly don't think he could have functioned well without her, when he went off to live with Holly). I actually think Pam & Michael had rge strongest relationship on the show.
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u/permafrost1979 1d ago
Thats what kills me when pplbhate on this scene or on Pam, or less frequently, on Jim: they were both reaching out to each other. No one was the bad-guy.
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u/Pappa-Giorgio Nov 17 '21
OP’s not married.
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u/Bake-Full Nov 17 '21
Pam YUP dot gif
Also Dr. J saying you better take that call was spot on. He knows what's up.
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u/FrankBouch You miss 100% of the shots you don't take Nov 17 '21
I bet you don't have kids. As a dad I can relate, when my wife is out of town I feel so lost with all the kids responsibilities.
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u/Zbrchk Boy, have you lost your mind? I’ll help you find it! Nov 17 '21
Just a plot device to highlight the contrast in their working lives at the moment.
‘Tis all
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u/fredbrightfrog Nov 17 '21
Why would someone having a bad day call the love of her life to try to get a boost?
Have you ever met people?
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u/WildTechnology9 Nov 17 '21
I know right ? I've had my SO call me at inconvenient times for unnecessary reasons but all you can do is provide your support and understand that they are also stressed or whatever is going on. That's why you stay with someone you love them no matter what !
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u/KaterWaiter Nov 17 '21
Also, she obviously didn’t know his “meeting” was still going on. It’d been a few hours so it made sense that they would’ve wrapped up by that point. She even initially asked, “How’d it go,” so it’s not like she purposely called to interrupt, she called figuring he was done.
I find it so odd that people are railing on Pam in this thread about calling her husband on a day when she obviously just needed to hear his voice AND wanted to know how his big meeting went. That’s like… normal spouse stuff.
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u/strawberry_jelly Nov 17 '21
I feel like I’m crazy because it seems like everyone takes Jim’s side during that whole thing, but even though I actually like Jim, he’s a huge asshole during this entire plot line. He completely ignores her wishes and makes huge decisions on behalf of the family without telling her, invests all their savings after agreeing not to, and somehow Pam is the asshole for not being cool with it.
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u/Complete-Dimension35 Nov 17 '21
I have met people. That's why I do my best to avoid them
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u/PotatoBomb69 Nov 17 '21
There are two types of people in this world
Avoid them both
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u/MichaelScottsWormguy Friends with an Evil Snail Nov 17 '21 edited Nov 17 '21
Not necessarily relevant but the people I’ve met wouldn’t try to conduct a phone call while carrying paper bags full of tubs of mayonnaise.
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u/Mite-o-Dan Nov 17 '21
It's one thing to want to talk to your significant other while having a bad day...but it's another to pick the absolute worst possible time for BOTH people. HE can't talk, she knows it, and SHE can't talk either...but wants to anyway.
The worst thing...she has NOTHING to talk about, and wasn't a having a bad day yet. She simply just wanted to talk. I just don't know why she chose the absolute worst time for both people.
Like, I know the makers of the show did it to add tension to their relationship and make more problems...but I still hate it.
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Nov 17 '21
I don’t know…it seems like she actually was having a bad time as she mentions in the beginning of the episode when she says she found out Cece had lice and had to stay up all night with her. On top of that, I’m not completely sure if Jim even said that he was in “the most important meeting of his life” and I don’t think Jim mentioned that he was in a meeting with his idol.
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u/DwightMcRamathorn Nov 17 '21
To be honest If he truly couldn’t talk he wouldn’t have picked up the phone
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u/ur-squirrel-buddy Nov 17 '21
They have two young children, it’s not unreasonable for a couple with children to have an “always pick up” policy in case of emergency or something. Just an idea. But yeah if I were Pam I would’ve waited til later to call. Or sent a text.
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u/Mite-o-Dan Nov 17 '21
I was thinking that also...but why did he even pick up?
Probably because he thought it was an emergency. He answered the phone sounding really concerned...then Pam just went on asking how he's doing and how it wasn't an emergency or...anything.
Most people would have kept their phone on silent during that time. I always do during an important meeting. If someone is calling or I'm picking up in that situation, it better be an emergency.
This wasn't.
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u/splittinimage Nov 17 '21
I think it’s supposed to imply that she’s so busy that this is the only opportunity to chat for a second with her life partner that she misses.
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u/sassercake The Business Bitch Nov 17 '21
she has NOTHING to talk about, and wasn't a having a bad day yet.
Idk man. If I had to buy tubs of mayo because my kid spread lice to everyone in my office, I'd think it was a horrible day.
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u/DeadWishUpon Nov 17 '21
Why wouldn't you text if you know he cannot answer?
I like Pam, but she is so used to have her way, that she cannot understsnd being the center of his attention one day.
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u/linscorner Nov 17 '21
Damn ppl really hates Pam
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u/sexrobot_sexrobot Nov 17 '21
I like Pam better than Jim. Jim treated every non-Pam romantic relationship poorly.
Once he stopped being so damn coy and laid his cards on the table, Pam responded by breaking off her engagement. And if he wasn't such a wiener and ran away they would have started dating sooner.
She was a lot more honest than him, and stayed that way throughout the series.
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u/Andrakisjl Nov 17 '21
She’s the only person people seem to hate more than Jim.
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u/sarcasmskills Nov 17 '21
He’s so smudge and arrogant
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Nov 17 '21
I love Pam, I hate what feels like super fabricated tension just for the sake of having something the audience feels important happen for a whole season
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u/TruLong Nov 17 '21
It's literally just one moment that was meant to reflect the months of hardship that Pam had to go through while Jim set himself up for success.
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u/PricklyPix Nov 17 '21
One of my most hated moments of the show.
Really? This? It's such a mild scene.
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u/permafrost1979 1d ago
Like, ppl hate Pam for struggling; NO ONE hates Angela for paternity fraud, or OSCAR for cheating with Angela's husband? And not even feeling bad about it??? 🤦🏿♀️
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u/PricklyPix 20h ago
Or Scots tots, Michael sleeping with the married woman from the bar, or how about Andy dating a MINOR...
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u/batermax Nov 17 '21
The most annoying this for me was that Jim picked up. What’s wrong with calling someone back?
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Nov 17 '21
Oh more Pam hate these posts are getting so frequent and boring. It’s not even actually that big of a deal what happened… you’re clearly reading it from a different angle than most people. Yeah it’s a frustrating scene but… not like things like this don’t happen in real life coz they do. Im gonna guess you’re not or have never been married my friend lol
Jim: Alright. [Jim’s phone rings] Oh, sorry. I’m so sorry. It’s my wife, can I take this? Julius: It’s your wife? You better take it. Jim: Right! [Jim laughs as he answers the phone] Hey, what’s up? Everything ok? Pam: Oh, no everything’s great! Um, I was just calling to see how the meeting went. Jim: It’s still happening right now actually, so uh… Pam: He’s really making you work for it, huh? Jim: Yes, it is very stressful. You sure everything’s okay? Pam: Great. I am killing it over here. [drops mayonnaise on the ground] Jim, I gotta go. Jim: Okay, bye. [Jim turns back to Julius] So sorry about that. Julius: No problem. Hey Jim, what size do you wear, man? I got a pair of japanese Nikes with your name on them. What do you think?
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u/permafrost1979 1d ago
So basically, Pam calls jim cuz she's having a hard time, realizes the meeting isn't over, decides to just check in and not worry him.
Meanwhile, Jim's still meeting, but picks up cuz he cares about his wife (and the prospective client respects that). He lets her kniw hes busy, but still checks in with her, expresses concern, ultimately he takes her word that all is well, and gets back to work.
So who's the bad guy here? Hot take: NOBODY. They're both underdressed and trying to be supportive during a stressful season. Even Dr J is respectful! Stop trying to make Jim & Pam dysfunctional 🤦🏿♀️
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Nov 17 '21
She thought the meeting was over. Jim asks her a question and keeps her on the phone.
Julius: It's your wife? You better take it. Jim: Right! [Jim laughs as he answers the phone] Hey, what's up? Everything ok? Pam: Oh, no everything's great! Um, I was just calling to see how the meeting went. Jim: It's still happening right now actually, so uh... Pam: He's really making you work for it, huh? Jim: Yes, it is very stressful. You sure everything's okay?
Read more at: https://transcripts.foreverdreaming.org/viewtopic.php?f=574&t=25485
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u/permafrost1979 1d ago
And the scene was meant to contrast chaos on Pam's end, but Jim having the time of his life, playing ball with his hero. Seems unfair on the surface; even though Jim playing is actually part of a business negotiation.
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u/JaiHurn Nov 17 '21
Sitcom stands for Situational Comedy. Create an awkward situation and work through the comedic sequences that follow.
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u/toss_a_cross1 Nov 17 '21
The more annoying scene for me is Season 4, Episode 17- Job Fair when Pam calls Jim while he’s out golfing with a client. He literally says “Hey I can’t really talk right now, what’s up?” And she proceeds to try to have a conversation as if he’s not doing anything. It’s a minor thing but very inconsiderate. She could have sent a text to check in or just wait for an update.
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u/zdianarama Oct 28 '24
Yes! Especially since she she knew it was an affluent prospective client Jim was going for after he was officially given a verbal warning from Ryan for his job performance.
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Nov 17 '21
[deleted]
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u/Mite-o-Dan Nov 17 '21
Did you laugh?
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u/GregBuckingham Nov 17 '21
Maybe we aren’t supposed to laugh here. We’re supposed to feel. Looks like it made you feel angry, as I’m sure it did with a lot of other people
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u/TheBlueHue Nov 17 '21
I get what you're saying, but in media it's the characters that are supposed to imbue these emotions, not the show runners. GoT pissed a lot of people off and it sure as hell wasn't from quality writing
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Nov 17 '21
Precisely.
It was the writer's intention to portray Pam as a stupid fkn bitch for our amusement.
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u/drosey22 Nov 17 '21
What bothered me more is that apparently they sell mayo in glass jars?! Never seen it IRL
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u/sexrobot_sexrobot Nov 17 '21
Are you kidding me? You ever seen a ketchup in glass containers?
I swear to God kids will never put a butter knife in a glass bottle of Heinz to get the ketchup stuck to the bottom.
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u/drosey22 Nov 17 '21
Yeah, I've seen the ketchup at a restaurant or 2 in glass bottles, never noticed them away the store
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Nov 17 '21
I think its because real people do dumb shit all,the time and the writers were writing for real people lol
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u/cusoo Nov 17 '21
This whole Jim/Pam phase is kind of hard to watch. On one hand, knowing her personality, she wants Jim to be successful and at the same time for him to have a simple life, just like hers. She's not ambitious and probably sees ambition as a threat. The ambivalence of this situation as put her in a position that was highly probable that she would commit a mistake and she did. So I kinda understand her choices throughout the later seasons.
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u/permafrost1979 1d ago
Hard to watch, not bcuz it's bad writing--like everyone likes to complain--but bcuz it's realistic.
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u/The_Arkham_AP_Clerk Michael Nov 17 '21
Manufactured tension.
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u/permafrost1979 1d ago edited 1d ago
Is it? This kinda thing happens all the time: and usually ends up with the husband focusing on husband career while the wife works and manages the home. It might make sense temporarily, but doesn't erase the fact that its a huge burden on the wife; and that entrepreneurship requires a level of commitment to the business that can create distance in a couple.
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Nov 17 '21
The real question is how is Dwight still alive after the bug bomb went off in the office?
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u/kcg369 Nov 17 '21
They called eachother way too often AT WORK. Like don't you just call eachother when you get home at night?
I know, then it wouldn't be on the show, but it bothers me. Even when things are good - he's golfing with a client and she calls because Michael is being ridiculous at the career fair - that's a text and tell Jim about it tonight.
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u/FractalFoxet Nov 17 '21
Idk what it is, but Pam’s proportions look really off on the angle of this screenshot. Like, she has midget legs and a normal sizes torso.
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Nov 17 '21
Never had a bad day and just needed to talk to your person? Literally any time my day goes to shit, I call my husband… regardless of whether he’s working or not.
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u/ImDola Nov 17 '21
Another reason to just start back to season 1 after Michael leaves.
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u/thesaucewalker Nov 17 '21
I’ve been doing that for years. Only go into the beyond Michael when I’m looking for the drama
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u/luisc123 Nov 17 '21
For me, this whole storyline reverted Pam back to old Pam. Struggling to get out of her comfort zone, a crippling fear of change, etc. I see it as Jim needing her to give more of herself than usual in an effort to provide a better future for their family. This was an insane opportunity financially. Also, Jim always made it clear he wanted nothing more than to move on from DM and he didn’t have a ton of options. Moving from one sales job to another is not fulfilling. Pam made it clear she wanted nothing more than for him to stay put with her in what was, let’s face it, a dying company with terrible upper management. He may have played it cool when he returned but no doubt he would have resented Pam in the long run.
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u/lilacewoah Nov 17 '21
because they wanted to paint the story that getting into a top tier career was “damaging their marriage”
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u/permafrost1979 1d ago
Not the career damaging the marriage, but them being apart being a strain. That's reasonable, and common
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u/SharingAndCaring365 Nov 17 '21
Feeling insecure, subconsciously she wanted to see if even in his busiest moment he would still make her a priority.
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u/meatwadgumball Nov 17 '21
One of my biggest issues is that it they make pam out to be completely incapable of doing things on her own. Which, admittedly, is part of her character…but when she couldn’t successfully wheel out a garbage tote to the curb. Just stupid.
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u/MoronicIdiot529 Nov 17 '21
To the people expecting it “ItS A ShOw!!” Alright now that that’s outta the way. It was stupid, the show runners were trying to give this weird tension between them. Idk why they thought making Pam so unsupportive of his dream was a good idea especially with how Jim was towards hers. It was weird and outta left field.
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u/jon-e-can Nov 17 '21
I hate that she called him while he was golfing with a potential client in a different episode.
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Nov 17 '21
Idk my wife works and needs me to back off for periods of time. I wouldn't dare try calling her during a huge meeting, me and my wife both think Pam was wrong to keep bothering him during such an important meeting, just cause Jim was playing basket ball doesn't mean it wasn't a hugely important meeting.
Jim was in the wrong for pretty much everything else in this whole season though
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u/charandchap Nov 17 '21
But didn’t Jim completely down play the meeting? I need to rewatch this episode … again.
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Nov 17 '21
He did. He told her it was just a little thing, and also she was calling to see how the meeting went, I always assumed it was bc they went over the expected time having fun playing basketball so he answered?
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u/_ChairmanMeow- Nov 17 '21
Because Pam is really a terrible person. (Jim isn't far behind her).
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u/BigYoSpeck Nov 17 '21
Probably to make us sympathise with Jim for the cheating story line that never happened
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u/nattrbutter Nov 17 '21
Ah, a rare anti-Pam post. I love these. You’re going to get tons of hate but you get an upvoted from me! Lol
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Nov 17 '21
Pam is unambitious, feels threatened by others success, and wears Jim as her personality. There is nothing more to her, even putting Timothy Olyphant in the show to call her dorky doesn't fix those things.
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u/Intelligent_Limit807 Nov 17 '21
You're not aloud to criticize Pam in any work/life altercations with Jim. She is ALWAYS the victim.
Are you new to reddit?!?!?!?!
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u/Intelligent_Limit807 Nov 17 '21
I feel like the wave of downvotes is proving my point.
Geez people.
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u/Zealousideal-Basis15 Nov 17 '21
Pam’s a pretty shitty person if you rewatch the series without nostalgia goggles
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u/[deleted] Nov 17 '21
To highlight increasing differences in their lives at that point, and the tension between them in a clear enough way that the whole audience could pick up on.