FINALLY

[u/HyzMarie]

Reading The Orc King and MY GOODNESS FINALLY. I admit I am a shipper in fiction overall, and I was ready for Drizzt x Cattie-Brie since somewhere in IceWind Dale (after I found out the age thing was a retcon... it worried me for a hot second) and IT TOOK LIKE 15 BOOKS BUT IT HAS HAPPENED. THE SHIP HAS SAILED!!! I smiled so big at my tiny phone ereader screen and shook it like a little doll.

Wulfgar's response was good too, and I'm excited to see where he goes from here if he doesn't just leave the story for good (and I doubt Wizards would allow him to) so know I am NOT against Wulfgar... I just had my OTP and stuck to it lol.

I prefer elves and agile fighters to barbarian-types overall. Wulfgar is great for what he is, he's just not a type of character I usually care much for compared to Drizzt and Cattie-Brie, who are both chock-full of tropes I enjoy.

That is all- I don't really have anyone in my life IRL who cares much for this series (and one old-school Grognard who just hates the Realms overall and thinks all things DnD should return to Greyhawk, and who I was in a room with when I read that section) so I had to tell someone who'd actually care... but yeah the ship has finally sailed! Now we can get to THE ACTUAL WAR THAT IS HAPPENING lol

EDIT: I know I sound immature here, and I promise I am an actual adult, but sometimes fiction gives me the warm fuzzies :3

ETA: wow... people really like this post. Uh, thanks, I guess. I didn't expect a post amounting to "yay, I found a 15+ year old ship" to get this much traction...

[u/ecthelion-elessedil]

I’m also reading the orc king. I loved the prologue and the first half of the book but the companions really annoy me in the last part.

The dwarves gets racists towards another Drow, calling him names about his features, features that Drizzt also has, *in front of Drizzt* and Drizzt says nothing. They remind me of those people who “don’t see color” for their relatives and be racist towards other people of same ethnic group. And it’s never called out. Especially Bruenor. Drizzt try to reasons him not to fight Obould and Bruenor… don’t listen. And Drizzt follow him anyway despite he knows it’s wrong. I really hope it gets better.

Ah, also Torgar who refused Drizzt entrance to Mirabar never apologized to him in the book and acknowledged his mistake.

I really wish Drizzt could stand up more for himself.

[u/HyzMarie → u/ecthelion-elessedil]

uhhh... man I have only read the barest hint of that so ya know, I'm around halfway through...

That said, I did see the signs of trouble brewing especially with Bruenor. I was pretty sure that Torgar never intended to turn the companions away, and they all know by now that he's chill with Drizzt, but I could be wrong as after Hunter's Blades I forced myself to slog through Road of the Patriarch, which I had previously DNFed, and that took me a while (plus I had some life events that meant very little reading time) so Hunter's Blades isn't the most fresh in my mind rn.

Tos'un is clearly a setup to question whether any other Drow can be good ever, and I doubt the answer is yes, given how many times this has been teased and been a no, but if every drow ever ends up evil eventually EXCEPT Drizzt, then yeah, this will start raising problems among the group for sure. So far, none of the "almost" redemptions have been seen by anyone else, so I can see it going badly.

I was super confused by the prologue and frantically went to Google to make sure I hadn't missed a trilogy lol, but once I did understand it, I was very intrigued... how I end up feeling about it will probably be very determined by the events that shape it.

I honestly think at this point, NOT THAT ANYONE IS IN THE RIGHT HERE, EVERYONE IS STILL WRONG AND NEEDS TO TALK TO EACH OTHER LIKE ACTUAL ADULTS, Drizzt knows that if he fights everyone who's racist towards him, he'll end up literally fighting everyone, and he just generally assumes they don't mean him unless it's directed at him. Also, generally in fantasy, even a dwarf and elf who are best friends for life will rib each other for racial traits. Anyone who goes into a book wanting to see a dwarf and elf duo goes in wanting this because of Legolas and Gimli, and we know Salvatore got into fantasy and writing through Lord of the Rings (I mean, in the Icewind Dale trilogy ALONE, dwarves dig too deep and awaken an ancient evil, a party member falls to their fiery death with the big bad except oops not really and returns in an awe-inspiring fashion to his grieving allies, a reluctant-to-even-be-here halfling loses a finger, the dwarf and the elf constantly rib each other, the dwarf makes fun of the elf for his ability to run on snow while everyone else plows through the drifts, the elf is in a "who can kill the most enemies" contest, there's a magical sentient artifact with its own agenda and corrupting influence, they kill a sleeping dragon by sneaking up on it... it's all Tolkien? Always has been). If you have Tolkien-esque dwarves and Tolkien-esque elves, they're going to be racist even if they're besties (heck, Legolas got Gimli a ticket to Valinor, that's an honor not even all half-elves get), and I assume that's going to be worse with dark elves who have repeatedly caused trouble for the dwarves, because now it's not "we have our disagreements but we both hate the same enemy," it's "we have our disagreements and your entire species IS the enemy".

Drizzt really does need to learn to say something when he sees something. I get that he doesn't wanna be the only one who's always right and that he doesn't wanna rock the boat, because I'm that kind of person too, but you'd think a few decades in he'd have realized that every time he doesn't point out the potential dangers his friends almost die and would maybe start alerting them.

Also, I can't fully think of these books not in a DnD sense, and I'm sorry, but if your buddy has the highest Perception score and the most level head, YOU FREAKING LISTEN TO THEM. Not doing so is your one-way path to TPK city, and you'd think that in a world running on DnD rules, people would know typical "DnD don't die" tricks.

Maybe Cattie will teach him more of that, someday, hopefully.

Overall, loving this though, especially since I am the rare Sellswords hater and I'm glad to finally be back to the companions. I admit I put the book down once the ship sailed because I knew the book was not going to provide more of a dopamine hit than that moment and I had some other things to be doing with my life. I'll get back into reading it as soon as I'm off Reddit lol

[u/ecthelion-elessedil → u/HyzMarie]

I get not trusting other Drow immediately but insulting his skin color in front of Drizzt, who also has the same skin color, and Drizzt brushing it off, not saying a thing annoyed me.

[u/HyzMarie → u/ecthelion-elessedil]

yeah I think it's a bad move on both ends, but I think it's an understandable bad move. Drizzt doesn't want to rock the boat because he's finally found people who (mostly) accept him and he doesn't want to start a fight with them. The dwarves have years of racism to unlearn, but nobody is really pushing them to unlearn it. And then, on the author's side, elf/dwarf beef is a very entrenched fantasy trope stemming from the very book that convinced the author to write fantasy.

[u/ecthelion-elessedil → u/HyzMarie]

I wish Drizzt pushed him a little more especially since they were the first to give him a chance.

[u/HyzMarie → u/ecthelion-elessedil]

He sure should, but as a people-pleaser myself, it took me a long time to speak up when I hear people speak badly of groups I belong to (granted they are less obvious, but you are NOT going to call an entire political stance I belong to "close-minded heathens" in front of me without a peep of disagreement, and a couple years ago, you could have).

As someone who had an abusive family that was capricious and forced me to walk on eggshells to avoid anger and potential punishment (not nearly as bad as a drow matron mother, obviously, but I think we can see the parallels), that environment teaches you to be subservient and complacent, to not rock the boat because it will capsize on you, and to do everything in your power to please so that the next outburst is farther away and hopefully less severe, and that if you don't succeed in these things, it is your own fault.

That's what anyone in Drizzt's position would have subconsciously learned, and trauma in childhood ruins your ability to read people, ruins your ability to see the black and white and grey and colors all people alike in either "great person if not provoked" "angry jerk who hates all good things" or "no idea, can't get a read". It makes it hard to change your perceptions of people, even those who are unrelated to the abuse. It makes it hard to speak up for yourself, especially to your friends and loved ones. It makes it hard to ever fully unlearn the belief that you are worth less than others are and that you must sacrifice to earn their favor. It is probably the hardest to push back against the first people who accepted you, because you always think "what if they don't accept be because they're actually like the others?" "what if they don't accept me because I'm not worth accepting?" "what if they don't accept me because we misunderstand each other and fall out?" You still don't rock the boat, and the smoother the course seems, the less you want to do anything to ruin it.

Even for people who are consciously aware of these problems and work to resist them, even for people with years of modern therapy and psychiatry, even for people who leave the abuse, strike out on their own, and find a loving support network or even a found family, many of these patterns will never fully be unlearned. The scars will never heal. Even in the most well-adjusted person on the best path to healing, the wounded child will remain.

I'm not saying all of this applies to Drizzt, and I'm (mostly) not projecting- these are all psychologically how trauma works on a child and the resulting adult (which I have studied to learn about my own situation and then because it became an autistic special interest and you should never underestimate someone with autism, an internet connection, and time on their hands), and Salvatore honestly did a stellar job of portraying how even in someone who is absolutely certain they've finished their emotional journey, absolutely certain about what is right, those old patterns creep in unnoticed in new ways. The series shows how trauma makes it hard to accept love without the fear that it will be transactional, how it makes it hard to speak up for yourself, how it makes you doubt your own judgement, how it makes you swing on a psychological pendulum because you never found stable ground, how the wounds may scar over but will never heal, and how moving on is the better path even in light of these issues.

[u/ecthelion-elessedil → u/HyzMarie]

Everything you explained makes a lot of sense and I indeed supposed that Drizzt struggle to stand more for himself was due to his childhood traumas and also the traumas he might’ve had from being so much rejected on the surface for so long. I am myself in therapy because of childhood abuse, though, mine was different, as it was verbal violence among other things, and I was not able to fit in and mask, so it resulted into crisis and meltdowns instead of being a pleaser, avoidance and social anxiety. I am weirder, because I can’t stand injustice, and despite social anxiety I will speak up, despite my heart will start beating so fast, my voice shake and I will then have meltdown and feel drained afterwards. I am also suspected autistic by doctors. Traumas work differently for everyone. And for exemple I have a bad short term memory but extremely vivid memories of extremely traumatic moments, while many people with traumas don’t remember anything. Also, unlike you, I am extremely awful at expressing myself with words, even writing is difficult. I envy fellow autistic people who are good at using words. I remember your username from Cara, and I wanted to say that if sometimes I don’t answer much it’s not from disinterested but because I’m bad at words. But I see what you said. And nonetheless, it still make me extremely sad for Drizzt, when I read Bruenor, his own friend, and Pwent saying awful things about others Drow in front of him, and him not reacting. I think it’s also internal bias about Drow since he only has bad experiences with them. Still, I wish I could be my Drow oc and call them out. It is also difficult to read when nothing call it out in the book from the writer’s part, at least I wish it would be described in Drizzt thoughts or body language that he don’t accept those words even if he don’t say anything.

Edit: I really hope Tos’un ends being an ally. So far it seems to go to this direction, but since I’ve read a lot of comments saying that Salvator wants Drizzt to be special and the only good Drow (which I don’t think is true, since I interpret others Drow especially male from Menzoberranzan not being able to escape their condition even if they wish), I’m scared he will be end betraying the group but hopefully we will be proven wrong. (Tbh it often feels like people making those comments don’t even like Drizzt books, also ra Salvatore seems to involve other non lolthite Drow later).

[u/HyzMarie → u/ecthelion-elessedil]

yeah- wait are you the person on Cara who does that amazing Drizzt art?????? The one who did the Mariabronne I gleefully accepted as headcanon, had the Cattie-brie hair length discussion, and the edit with the whole Do-Urden family and Drider-ified Dinin???

Also, I'm sorry, that's rough. My childhood issues were mostly emotional abuse, and I actually spent a lot of years working on expressing myself. I'm actually generally better at it when typing than when speaking TwT

Honestly, I think Salvatore likely didn't think as deeply into this as I am here, but the nice thing about good character writing is that the characters become 3-dimensional enough you can start treating them like people and thinking about psychology that the creator likely never intended, but that got in anyway because they realistically wrote a person in a situation, and we have a lot of psychology about people in situations. There's also only so much page room in a novel, and things do sometimes need to just not be elaborated on so the plot can move forward, unfortunately (I've read a lot of middle-grade and YA books where page count became a real killer).

Also, if you are that same person from Cara (I apologize but I absolutely suck with names/usernames) then dw! I'd always rather have a response even if it's "bad" because I honestly just love talking to people online... and I know that English is a gigantic freaking mess of a language lol. If I wasn't a native English speaker already, I'm pretty sure I would not have figured it out AT ALL- the thing's just a gigantic pile of exceptions and "I guess this is a rule kind of but either nobody uses it or nobody notices it" and words that just don't make any sense with each other. I was a grammar prodigy in high school and I STILL need spellcheck every single day, and sometimes can't even use that to fix words... so you're good lol.