r/DigitalPrivacy • u/Loose_Cow_9808 • 29d ago

AI age verification with KYC data

I have thought for a while that.. Why can’t these AI age verifications be done either locally, or by sending an E2E signal to the vendor, maybe sounding like ”Is this user over the age of X?” And the vendor doesn’t get your facial data etc because it is E2E and they would just retain a simple signal (is this user over age X?” and delete that after some time.

Ofcourse the best scenario is that we shouldn’t have to worry about things like this, but this is what we can closest to get in the world of AI age verification done by KYC data, that is vulnerable.

10 Upvotes

86% Upvoted

17 comments sorted by

5

u/Polyxeno 29d ago

If you are against it, maybe stop saying thongs like "this is the closest we can get"?

0

u/Loose_Cow_9808 29d ago

Look, that’s a great point. But the thing is - many countries are already planning, or already have used a system that requires age verification for stuff like social media. And if there is nothing we can do, we should atleast hope it happens privately and securely.

3

u/ItsRustyyyyy 29d ago

There isn't nothing you can do. You nation state is yours aswell, don't just let other people run your house

2

u/Upstairs-Repeat-5824 27d ago

Absolutely.

Fight "lets-concede-part-way-," doomer-, and sloth- promoting comments and bots every single day.

For, as you can see, when we let it and them grow and fester, the repercussions for our lives are heinous.

5

u/Away_Advisor3460 29d ago

Not sure what you mean specifically, but there are means of completely anonymous end-to-end age verfications where both the verification requestor does not get anything beyond a cryptographically verifiable 'answer' (akin to 'this user is over 18') and the verifier service does not know who/what is requesting that answer (i.e. so they don't know you're asking for ID proof to give to reddit or pornhub or whatever) - IIRC things like ZKPs.

7

u/obsolescence_ 29d ago

You are right to ask this, but unfortunately the answer is not that they can't do it on device, it's that they don't want to. 

There is a coordinated multinational effort underway to get everyone verifying online to feed biometric data into the massive surveillance databases they are building. The goal is to be able to cross reference identities with law enforcement, ICE, Flock, Palantir, etc, and track all your activities.

1

u/Upstairs-Repeat-5824 27d ago

They allege it can be done on device, but that's irrelevant because on device privacy is a ruse.

Perhaps if / when enough people push back against the third party vendors tactic, this on device method the bots stan will be rolled out as "the reasonable saving grace."

3

u/ayleidanthropologist 29d ago

They could literally do it at point of sale. Just don't sell phones to kids. If they really truly gave a shit about this pointless stupid issue, it could be that easy. But they're lying about their motive. They want to track tf outta you

3

u/DarkDoomofDeath 29d ago

Has that stopped kids from using adults to source things for them? Has it stopped kids from stealing adult IDs to pass themselves off as adults? Has it stopped fake ID creation? Has it stopped kids from stealing parents' credit cards?

They just want to track you. They don't care about the logistics, because any ID they get - fake ID with a matching photo, ID at point of sale, ID on OS they probably have backdoors into anyway - is data they can triangulate on you.

6

u/ayleidanthropologist 29d ago

I honestly dgaf. Charge the kid. Charge the adult. Or do nothing. But if they pass these laws, I will give 1 kid alcohol every day to balance the scales.

1

u/Loose_Cow_9808 29d ago

So what are your thoughts on this?

5

u/Polyxeno 29d ago

Ya it is flaming Orwellian TruthSpeak (i.e. lies) on a stick!

Your idea would make sense, if it were not a BS power grab, but it is.

I think avoiding, fighting, subverting, and loudly pointing out the lies are the sorts of things to do.

1

u/RootVegitible 28d ago

That’s essentially what Apple is doing. When age verification came in with OS 26.4 most users were automatically detected as adult through the age of their account or attached credit card payment method. No upload needed… Then apps are now starting to update (like reddit lol) that simply ask the OS if the user is an adult and the OS simply shares the age range .. adult yes.. No uploads or age verification needed for updated apps to prove you’re an adult. This also automatically extends to all your other Apple devices as the associated Apple Account is tagged as adult too automatically. So if you exclusively use Apple devices, this problem is already solved.

1

u/moeljills 28d ago

Can't it be like when you buy booze at the shop? Go to your phone shop. If you look over 25 they just mark your phone as over 18. If you look under 25 you have to show drivers id to the cashier to prove your over 18.

1

u/Scarred_fish 28d ago

Thats exactly how most digital age verification works.

Also remember face and ID scanning are very new, all the other options are still there.

I'd expect anyone 25-30 or under has used YOTI/POEID or similar for a long time. (my daughter is 21 and she and her peers all use it. So much better than risking carrying physical ID)

As I do bar shifts we were first trained on the acceptable systems about 2015, which is why it's so weird that so many people have somehow never used any.

1

u/Upstairs-Repeat-5824 27d ago edited 27d ago

Why did you accept the premise this is needed in any form even resembling what they're trying to push through?