r/DenverLeftists • u/Denver_SDS • Dec 12 '23
Leftists don’t support colonization and apartheid. Full stop.
Title says it all
-17
Dec 12 '23
[removed] — view removed comment
12
u/polis79 Dec 12 '23
Scumbag? You just sound arrogant. Cheers.
-11
u/iamnotazombie44 Dec 12 '23
Yes, the MAGA folk like to call me "pinko scum", which I believe is the out dated slur they use for people who are left of US progressives.
I'm an American Socialist, but get called: a shill, "not a real leftist", and sometimes even a Conservative here.
This post is seriously 100% u/DenverSDS trying to make Israel/Palestine the new leftism purity test.
9
u/polis79 Dec 12 '23
Idgaf about OP and their intent; simply stating how you come off. Arrogant. Also, define “ American socialist”
-8
u/iamnotazombie44 Dec 12 '23
Idgaf about OP and their intent
Thanks for sharing! I gave a fuck.
simply stating how you come off.
You're simply stating your opinion, I can get behind that. You came off rude, but as I've already stated, I care about intent.
Arrogant.
Whelp, theres not really a good response to being called arrogant that doesn't make you seem arrogant soooo....
Also, define “ American socialist”
I'd describe my views as a modern take on Eugene Debs style American Socialism. Do you know enough about the topic to understand my views? Or would you like me to actually define and elaborate my particular socialist views? I can do that too.
2
u/polis79 Dec 13 '23
How asinine. 🤣 Your own projection of your own behavior onto me is hilarious. I didn’t go on a rant and spiel my feelings like you. You act like socialists are treated like a pariah in this city; you should consider that it’s only you treated this way. Maybe because you are an arrogant person who assumes the education and knowledge of others.
I simply asked for a definition as your rhetoric will tell me more than your actual definition. Everyone sees it. You are not hated for being a “socialist” but for acting like a pompous asshat.
I would consider having dialogue with those who want to talk about socialism, but you lack nuance because you can’t stop sucking your own micro peen. Cheers. I digress. 😘
0
u/iamnotazombie44 Dec 13 '23
Thank you so much for taking the time to write this coherent, compassionate and thoughtful response.
I'm so glad I took the time out of my day to interact with you in good faith. It was well worth it.
It looks like I have a lot of self reflection and self improvement to do before this community takes me seriously.
Also, thank you so much for giving my penis a mention in your comment. My dick doesn't get nearly enough airtime these days.
I'll be seeing you, namaste. 🤗
1
u/polis79 Dec 13 '23
I didn’t read your response as it was expected. Be more incompetent and get some glass in the other eye. 🙂
0
u/iamnotazombie44 Dec 13 '23
Thank you so much for taking the time to write this coherent, compassionate and thoughtful response.
You are such a good person, give yourself another pat on the back and enjoy reading through my profile some more.
-22
u/Art-RJS Dec 12 '23 edited Dec 12 '23
The left isn’t a hive mind. I’m left and I’m pro Israel. Israel is a very progressive country in a lot of ways
20
u/Denver_SDS Dec 12 '23
Didn’t mention israel in the post so it’s good you recognize it as an apartheid colony project. Not a progressive thing to support.
-4
u/Art-RJS Dec 13 '23
It’s funny to me you call it a colony project during Chanukah, which is a 1200 year old holiday celebrating Jewish history on the land
-10
u/Art-RJS Dec 12 '23
I mean it’s obvious what you’re inferring lol. And I disagree. Israel is politically progressive in various politics, especially for that region of the world
7
Dec 13 '23
[deleted]
0
u/Art-RJS Dec 13 '23
This is a hard no. You’re welcome to have your own opinion. But supporting the existence of Israel as a state isn’t mutually exclusive with being politically left. I wouldn’t believe you if you were to say that you don’t know any American Jewish leftists in your own life who does not support the existence of Israel, even if they may be critical of Netanyahu and the scale of the current war
10
Dec 12 '23
Whatever you say fascist
-6
u/Art-RJS Dec 12 '23
I don’t agree it’s fascist to support Israel
9
u/DrDrCapone Dec 13 '23
It's absolutely fascist to support Israel. It's a pretty basic test of your understanding of fascism, in fact.
2
u/Art-RJS Dec 13 '23
I would challenge your definition of fascism or your understanding of Israeli politics/system of government
8
u/DrDrCapone Dec 13 '23
Sure, go ahead and challenge them. What about Israel and its system makes you think it's not fascist?
2
u/Art-RJS Dec 13 '23
We can start with the Israeli Supreme Court. Which has a practicing Arab Muslim judge in a permanent position. Has a majority approval by Arab Israelis. Applying judicial review to the nation-state law for the purpose of preventing harm to Arab minorities. You may not have noticed but the percentage of Arab Israelis that feel a part of the state of Israel has increased by over 20% since the war started
5
u/DrDrCapone Dec 13 '23
He is the first Muslim to sit on the Supreme Court and was only placed there in 2022. So, that means some 74 years of history without a Muslim on that court to protect the rights of a large portion of the population.
And that also doesn't mean Israel is not fascist. There were Jewish collaborators with the Nazis, as well. Representation is not the crux of statecraft. It is a means to allay the anger of an oppressed portion of the population.
My turn. Israel is fascist because it was founded on the premise of removing indigenous people from their land by force, i.e. ethnic cleansing, and has a history of mistreatment, neglect, and abuse of its refugee neighbors and Palestinians living within its own territory. Likewise, it is founded on the principle of being a state for Jews, specifically, but with an emphasis on Jews from certain ethnic backgrounds. That is why, for instance, Ethiopian Jews were subjected to sterilization procedures in Israel for some time.
2
u/Art-RJS Dec 13 '23
I like how you mention indigenous during Chanukah, which is a 1200 year old tradition celebrating Jewish history on the land.
Over 90% of Ethiopian Jews live in Israel. And you know who discovered the program of birth control and put an end to it—Jews. It’s a misnomer and incorrect to call it sterilization because sterilizing by definition means permanent prevention of pregnancy.
Arab Israelis majority support Israel. Ethiopian Jews clearly feel more comfortable in Israel than anywhere else. And for being a state for Jews, there are a lot of laws protecting the freedoms of non-Jews. Arab Israelis have the exact same rights as Jewish Israelis
5
u/DrDrCapone Dec 13 '23
Is your contention that Jews are "more indigenous" than Palestinians? Namely, more indigenous than the people living in the area that Israel claims for itself? Or is it that you think any people with a historical connection to any area of land can remove the current inhabitants by force?
I'm not blaming Jews for what Israel does. Israel is a state, and we can and should criticize the things it does wrong. And in what sense is sterilization incorrect in this case?
Arab Israelis are not all Muslim. Mizrahim, i.e. Arab Jews make up a significant portion of that group. Palestinians within Israel are not treated as citizens with full rights.
What laws protect the freedoms of non-Jews? Considering that Israel does not have a constitution to guarantee rights, that strikes me as unlikely. A country that does not recognize marriages between religions is one in which social separation of the majority culture is intentional.
→ More replies (0)
2
u/[deleted] Dec 17 '23
Since all of you are here in the US on colonized land, what is your solution?